sayer7

I think they're good because there's a lot more that goes into the union than just the two people involved. For instance, I know my father has worked hard to earn the money he's made-- he had three bleeding ulcers and two heart problems that required extended hospitalization from the stress from his job. And I know I'm going to inherit the product of his all hard work one day and I want to protect his honor and pride with a prenup so that someone, who may not appreciate all his hard work and dedication like I do, can't take it away if I make the wrong decision on a mate. And everybody makes wrong decisions in their life- it's human. And often we're blind to incompatibilities until its too late, and people in love can be blind to other people's faults. But a lot more than just two individuals go into a marriage... it's two whole families merging into one family and it's important to preserve both side's honor, hard-work, and dedication that is passed on to you.

My bf broke NC with an email today. It's been almost 2 weeks of NC and things have been pretty good and I've been moving on and healing slowly. I'm confused with his email today... I'll post some of his statements that confuse me: 1. "I have thought about our relationship a ton since I went to florida. I could have not met a better person to spend my life with.... I came back from florida knowing I was going to have to do things differently and change some things so you wouldn't feel some of the ways you were feeling." 2. "You say you felt taken for granted and unimportant. I understand that you did. But I don't see how my trying to involve you in every aspect of my life achieved this result.... I thought I could work things out with us gradually where our [issues] wouldn't have to be discussed. Like I said, that is my fault and I didn't go about it right." 3. "And for someone who told me they always wanted to be with me....well, if that was the case then we should be worth fighting for. I'm willing to do it if you would let me, but you won't." I'm not replying to his email, but I'm so flabbergasted I have to say something so I'm posting them here. For Quote 1. My response is: Basically he replaced me on OUR vacation to Florida and didn't tell me until the day before we were going to leave... and blames me for breaking up with him before he got the chance to begin to work things out when HE decided it was time when he got back from Florida. My question is: Why does EVERYTHING have to work on his time schedule? What about me and MY time schedule? For Quote 2: He doesn't seem to understand that it's not the fact that he DID involve me in every aspect of his life, it was his attitude towards me, what he said to me, and how he behaved while we were together doing all those things that made me feel taken for granted and unimportant. Like when you go to a restaurant with someone, you don't expect them to make a huge public scene about the presentation of the food, and then when you tell them to stop because it's ruining the date they shout at you "Don't tell me what to do! I can be angry whenever I feel like it" (with a whole bunch of curse words intermixed). It happened so often I started hating going out to dinner with him and started refusing to go unless our other friends went too to buffer things. As for what I underlined: How do you work issues out without first seriously discussing them and identifying them? 3. For 2 years, my issues about the relationship were pushed under the rug whenever I put them on the table to be discussed, and whenever we spent time together he would treat me and do things like he didn't care about me or how I felt about it, be angry with the world and everything and everybody who lived in it, and he STILL wonders why I'm not fighting for the relationship? I don't get it? Can't he see I gave up and I don't see him as being worth my time anymore? Why would I want to deal with that kind of person for the rest of my life- someone who outright tells you "If you don't like it, dump me, cause I'm never going to change." So my questions to you are: Am I totally nuts and truly doing something wrong by giving up on something that he seemed so ready not to be a serious participant in while we were together? Why would he email me now saying these things when I'm not open to reconciliation? Is it just a guilt trip to try to angle for more control over me or is he just trying to heal? The things he said that confused me I want to contest, but I'm choosing to maintain NC with him at whatever costs. Do you guys agree with my choice of action?

Wow, that's like a finacee's worst nightmare to have her fiance have sex with some complete and utter stranger during his bachelor party. I'm surprised she took you back... but Kudo's that she did. I'm glad that's she'll willing to forgive you and try to regain the trust that she might've lost that night. If she can truly moved on and the trust is restored ... you are definitely a lucky man. As for your grieving, you might just be realizing you have the capacity to be a scumbag-- a negative trait you may have never realized you had and it's hard to accept that you were actually willing and able to do that kind of thing to someone you say you love enough and say you are committed enough to marry. I once had an emotional meltdown with my ex and said awful abusive things to him and then when everything cooled down, he forgave me right away knowing the circumstances (having just gotten back from major emergency surgery, losing my ability to have children one day, him not being there for me, to come back and have him nag me about school and taking too much time off to heal- i took a week off- it was the last straw). But I had trouble forgiving myself for the horrible things I said to him, for slamming doors and screaming at the top of my lungs. I was a complete and utter monster to him. It hurts to know I have the capacity to be such a ugly person to anybody. All I can do is hope and learn to trust myself again, and consciously make sure I don't lose my cool like that again. I grieved a long time and I still scare myself to this day whenever I feel angry. Maybe this is similar to what you're feeling now...maybe you feel something of a hypocrit, or don't trust yourself anymore, or think maybe you really aren't committed to the relationship afterall. She's forgiven you and moved on-- so take her lead and know you still have the capacity to be the man she loves, you're not a monster deep down-- you're just human and everyone makes BIG mistakes. She's knows this, and you need to learn this and forgive yourself also.

That was one of the most profound and loving letters I've ever come accross here.... God bless you two, you're in my prayers.

For some reason I feel like I'm talking to myself after reading your post but here it goes. ahem. For me, it started out as his no willingness to have sex (once a month max)-- he always rejected my advances and afterwhile I felt undesireable and it lowered my self-esteem and sense of security considerably. Thought he was cheating on me it got so bad. The next came him refusing to say hello and kiss me when he got home from work-- we used to have big arguments about it. He said he just didn't feel like he "needed to" and instead would rather blow me off and ignore me for 2 hours before he even acknowledged my presense- no joke. We lived together for over 6 months before that started. Next came him beginning to constantly criticize me and others, being out right rude like telling a woman he doesn't even know at a restaurant that 'her dress made him want to vomit' and to her date, "If you don't leave now I'm going to throw-up." And then came my birthday which I had to spend in the hospital 2 days after major emergency tumor surgery by myself (the rest of my family was way on vacation) because he said he need to go out and get drunk because he was "so stressed out about my surgery and needed to be with friends" rather than be by MY side. And THEN... well I can go on but it just get's completely utterly worse and I there's a very long list of his dirty laundry. This is YOUR post, not mine afterall. But I fell out of love with him that night after surgery way back in february. I tried to make things work until July 30th, but then then gave up when he decided to go on OUR vacation to Key West with someone else ( a guy) and didn't mention it to me until the day before we were supposed to leave. I decided that day my guy was a stringer- that had no serious intention of marrying me like he said he had throughout the relationship, had no serious sense of responsibility, had no maturity and basically just strung me along like I was some pup on a string. And to think I thought he was THE ONE until February. So I kind of know how you feel. If your guy has done idiotic things like mine had... then I say take some time to re-evaluate the relationship and then sit down and try to have a serious talk with him about your issues and see how he reacts. If he does what my guy did: Tell you he doesn't want to talk about it, that he's going to bed-- and actually does leave you to go to bed," Then you need to start making some serious decisions for yourself because he's obviously just thinking about himself. But then I'm biased... I might be completely off-- but I felt like I saw echoes of my past relationship when I read your post. Sorry I'm such a pessimist...but I've been through a lot.

If you send a letter I would send the one Beec wrote-- but it was good for your own sense of closure that you wrote the longer version. It seems she has already moved on (clearly- if she's getting married and not thinking of you-- that's not love-- that's called stringing- if she truly loved you and wanted to try to have a relationship with you it would have happened already). The abbreviated version should leave things open to communication, but makes it clear she lost her chance with you. Don't get wishy washy and waver from your position... it's good to stand firm, make your peace and move on. If you're moving on, you don't have to tell her you are-- just do it. Sometimes I think letters just stall the inevitable and are only written in hopes to make the reader change their mind. I don't think stalling the inevitable or changing her mind will do any good for you or her right now. If she's going to make a mistake, let her make it... you can't control what she does even though we know it's hurting you at the same time. That's just my two cents. Keep your chin up.

1) 2 years 2) 1 month 3) Took me for granted, did irresponsible things under the influence of alcohol, refused to grow up and be mature, was incommunicative. 4. I'm 25 Female, he was 32

I agree with Ray They ARE very toxic people and I know you will feel soooooooo much better when you don't have that kind of negativity around you all the time and feel yourself standing on firm and stable ground once again. One of my ex's friends kept telling his gf of 4 years "I wish you'd just go jump off a bridge and die so I could find another gf." Of course, she's still with him-- miserable and an emotional wreck needing prescription drugs to keep her emotions relatively stable. I've put my foot down and told him what he says is completely unnecessary. Because it is. No human being should talk to another human being they claim to truly care about and love- in that negative, emotionaly abusive way. You're better off without those negative influences in your life. Switch your screenname, get a new number, and anything else that will help you cut contact with them because you deserve much better treatment than that... I hope you believe that. Anyone who tries to control you that way to make you do what they want, are verbally abusive and put you down, and seem 99.9% of the time emotionally unstable are NOT good friends to hang out with. Stand your ground. You're on the right track.

You did the best thing you could've done I think by keeping your cool. It's funny how people find all kinds of excuses and justifications to try to blow off or down-play the fact they were caught red handed. My ex used to do that all the time... I finally realized he knew he did wrong, (you said he mentioned you could email him and tell him to f' off-- so he knows he did wrong)--but his pride and ego were keeping him from fully admitting his mistake or taking full responsibility for his choices and actions. Let's face it, no one likes to feel like the bad guy when that kind of stuff hits the fan. You did a great job. I wouldn't send the picture because if you seriously care for him then you won't want to degrade yourself and play mind games. Just hope he finds happiness one day and figures things out soon.

Too many different sizes, shapes, lengths etc to judge them by some porno-flick-ideal which is usually super pumped up or fake altogether. hehe Sorry for the imagery. I hope I don't get censored.... I guess I just see it for what it is and refuse to think they should be a "certain" size or shape or whatever. It's like telling someone with brown hair they're supposed to be blonde- it's not something you can change so why bother worrying about it? If you love a person you accept them for who they are.

I don't think he was out to just use you to get over his ex, and he may not have even considered the relationship as a rebound relationship. He might've thought he was ready for something new. And he seems to respect you enough to tell you how he feels unlike some men... even though you might feel it was late in coming and you probably feel like you should've seen the writing on the wall if you'd just looked hard enough. I don't think he meant to maliciously use you and hurt you. Everyone goes through various stages of the healing process at their own speeds and perhaps in the beginning he thought he was healed enough, but then realized later he wasn't - he might be wavering between healing levels so to speak. Since my break-up I've gone from feeling that everything was all better and completely ready to move on... but then sometimes there's something that reminds me of my ex like when I drive by a Krispy Kream donut shop and see the Hot Donuts Now sign on and remembering how we used to stop and get a donuts whenever we saw the red light glowing--- and I realize I still have some more healing to do even though overall I feel I'm getting over him quickly and smoothly. He might just be going through the same kind of thing and needs time to heal still. I would say give him time and try to step back from the relationship a bit and give him some breathing room because it seems he's feeling as though he needs some time to himself. Try not to think the worst of him, he's still healing.

I think it has to do with their desire to be single again, start again with a clean slate, have some fun/ or fall in love with another women while they're dealing with the stresses of the divorce-- even though they're still technically married. I think it's natural for a person who has been rejected by their spouses with an impending divorce to want to find another person to connect with, rediscover that "new love" feeling. However I also believe marriage is sacred... that the bindings are tied until the divorce is final. To overstep those sacred vows to that other person by romantically seeing another is borderline cheating and borderline adultry (on a sacred level- not a lawful or technical level). When a separated guy romantically propositions me I always feel obligated to turn him down and offer platonic friendship instead-- mainly because I don't feel like it is morally or spiritually "right" and it bothers me. But then that's just my opinion and how I feel about it. I'm sure there's a lot of divorcees and people who are separated out there reading this who'll be shaking their head at my ignorance. And I do have an open mind to other opinions, but having had my own experience with it I've decided it just bothers me on a spiritual level and that's what I do when I am confronted with that kind of situation.

yea no one said I was, but I wasn't reading carefully... I should read carefully if I'm trying to give advice! haha Sorry about that. Yea, I'm pretty negative about bumps but then I'm the one who tolerated the bumps for 2 years. hehe I think every guy and gal should be given the benefit of the doubt for a number of times and to be forgiven a number of times. I think people should give their all in relationships and try to stick out rough spots-- afterall it's the working together through those rough spots that can bring a couple even closer together once things smooth out. When the bumps start getting serious though and they get worse over time and issues aren't being addressed and the couple isn't communicating well despite many attempts by one party to do so , then I believe they have every right to re-evaluate the relationship. But not before they give it a 100% mature effort in trying to sort things out. If someone's not willing to work through those rough spots, even from the beginning, then I think it shows fear in one or both parties to commit for the long haul. And that should be seriously considered.

I think you should back off a bit. It seems clear that he's doing his reguarly thing about not getting attached to a woman...in this case you. From what you've written, he seems to be a committment-phobe and I don't know if you plan on toughing it out, but I think if you back off a bit, take a break for yourself you might realize you don't want to be waiting around forever. He's clearly going to wait a few years before he seriously considers a committed relationship with someone, are you willing to wait that long? Only you can judge his true feelings for you and yours for him, but from what you've written it seems he's being overwhelmed with school, family, work, etc... he doesn't seem to want to get attached to you until all his issues are sorted out and he has graduated, etc. Are you truly willing to wait 3-4 years with no committment from him? Maybe it's best to back off and see what happens (not like it's a game to see if he comes chasing you) but to give both of you a break. He might come back to you in 3-4 years, but then you'll have to wait 3-4 years for this to happen. It's up to you cause you know the situation best, but personally I would back off.

Ahh... I see she's one of those people who expects perfection in a relationship. I see what y'all are talking about now. Anyway, yea, I do agree with Satch and I think you did the right thing. I used to be scared of every little bump, but then there were so many bumps (like him not showing up for my emergency tumor surgery to go drink with his friends, and him deciding to tell me he was taking another person on OUR week long vacation to Key West that we'd planned for months-- telling me the day before we were supposed to leave, among a looong list of other bumps). My bf used to tell me to chill out about the bumps, that staying with the relationship despite the bumps was important to know how we functioned together... and I did chill out for 2 years. But then the bumps became major bumps like the ones I mentioned above and I decided to leave the relationship. If y'alls relationship was virtually bumpless before she decided to break-up with you, there's a lot more "bumps" going on inside her mind that you probably don't know about and it's just overwhelming her and I agree with you and Satch- she does need to think about holding onto the relationship if the relationship was going well prior the break-up. Sorry for my unattentiveness... I had to reread your original post over and over again feeling like I was an idiot-- I think I finally got it straight in my head. LOL Must be one of those days..... Argh...

I don't think it's bad advice if you believe the relationship is completely over, it's not good to dwell on things and feeling bad about yourself. As for sending the letter, I would still suggest not sending it unless you plan on apologizing for your reaction to her breaking up with you and not ask her back. If she comes back to you, and you want her back-- then by all means try again if this is your choice. But for now you still have to respect her choice because obviously something wasn't working for her. A relationship is about respect and trust. You reaction probably hurt her and it made the break-up even more difficult. I understand you didn't and still don't want to give up on the relationship, but the fact that she broke up with you should make you realize she needs time away. And although it's very difficult, you need to accept it and for now (until she comes back to or not) improve yourself. When it comes down to it, you can't make her change her mind. And begging her to come back may only push her farther away. If you do send a letter, I would simply apologize to her for the mean things you said during the break-up because it really didn't benefit either of you because you regret saying those mean things, and also hurt her more (she may even feel more justified in leaving you). If you merely apologize for the mean things you said, then yes, she needs to hear it for her own healing. But begging her to come back or saying things that induce a feeling of guilt might back-fire and make her more remote to you and feel even more justified in leaving you. Either way, you need focus on your healing process and improving yourself-- whether she comes back to you or not. That's just another two cents.

Wouldn't you rather her give up her new man so that you don't feel insecure about if she's being with another man on the side anyway? If she's unwilling to give him up then you have your answer as to IF she's interested in trying things again with you- it means she's not willing to give you a 100% shot at getting her back. Do you want that? I simply don't feel trying to get back together with her is a good idea altogether. But it's your decision and I hope you make one that is right for you.

It seems 4 months is long enough to know if one is committed or not in my book. And even if you were just friends, a friend would call at least a day in advance to tell you that they'd be in town-- especially if they intended and wanted to hang-out with you. I agree that you need to sit down and have a talk with him about this. Don't attack him or make him on the defensive because you know you'll never get a straight answer out of him that way. Try to be an non-accusatory as possible and don't assume the worse, but know that his non-attentiveness is unusual for a person who says they're in a relationship with you-- long distance or not. It's obvious to me that he doesn't feel committed enough to even call in advance to let you know he'd be in town, and I feel committment is a big issue that needs to be addressed as soon as possible.

i agree with both... it seems the relationship wasn't stable through-out. Move on and you'll find many other women out there that are a lot more stable minded than her. I know you love her and you put 110% into the relationship, but she obviously didn't if she kept breaking up with you so many times. Don't stop opening up to people and loving them whole-heartedly. I once read something that said a 'heart with chunks missing is preferable to a heart that had never truly loved or sacrificed itself'. I'm just not very eloquent but it made some sense. lol Pain is just a part of life... you cant avoid it-- so why not love and live with all of your heart. Someday you'll find another person willing to do the same for and with you.

I was a national level gymnast for 8 years, and once I injured myself and went out of the competitive arena I had to find a way to keep myself fit while I was in a wheel chair for 4 years. I turned to weight-lifting when I was 16 because it helps maintain muscle mass if you start with a light amount of weight and take it easy, and with a higher number of repetitions per set you also increase your muscle endurance- which is very important for your heart and any kind of sport that you may do. I also believe in body-weight calisthenics... push-ups and sit-ups, hand-stand holds and other exercises that don't require weight. It helps me keep my body very toned, agile, and my joints flexible. The whole philosophy behind body-weight calisthenics is learning to use your body and it's weight to build endurance, strength, flexibility, and agility. Learning to use your body and be able to maneuver your body effectively in almost any situation is a very powerful feeling. Martial arts is an example of sports that teach you to use your body effectively- and also teaches you mind-set, concentration and focus. Martial art kata and exercises are based on body-weight calisthenic maneuvers (round-houses, kicking, punching, etc). I enjoy kick-boxing as a body-weight calisthenic type sport. As for it being unhealthy for a 16 year old to weight-lift. You are indeed growing and unless you go to the extremes (using extreme weightage, doing extreme sets and reps) I think you're pretty safe. To start, however, take it easy and don't expect to bench press 160 right off the bat. Heck, even the weight bar alone is heavy. lol But then I'm a girl. hehe Hope this helps!

You should write the letter, but don't send it. She's been hurt enough by the relationship... I think both of you have. It's time to take a few breathers away from each other so both of you can heal... her receiving a letter from you won't help her healing process. The writing of the letter may help you get everything out on the table and off of your chest, but she doesn't need to read it in order to help you heal. I understand what you mean when you say you hope she feels hurt for breaking your heart. But I'm sure she's thinking the same thing... and also thinking "I hope he learned his lesson." In your next relationship remember what she's taught you and take this time away from her to begin improving yourself. Change doesn't happen over night... it can take months to years.... but if you work on it consistently you'll change into the person you want to be. I'm in the same processes of healing, and hearing my ex telling me he doesn't respect my decision to "throw away" a 2 year relationship only has built more resolve not to be with him or ever go back to him. I take him saying those kinds of things as mind games and guilt trips trying to force me to feel bad about myself-- and doubt my decisions even though I know what I did was good for me. I still love him, but I'm not in love with him anymore because of the many things he's done to jeopardize the relationship. I finally told him I wanted No Contact and I feel much better not hearing from him. So take my perspective and apply some of it to her and you'll begin to see the whole picture. I hope this helps and I'm sorry I'm not a supporter of sending her a letter... but I AM a supporter of you writing one to get your feelings out infront of you and begin the healing process.

I agree with kitten and rich! If she says she's in love with the guy then just either try to move on or wait for awhile and see what happens between them. You must treat her and her new relationship with respect and give her and them space to make her own decisions. She not a child and you can't force her to do anything. I feel that asking her to dump the new guy will bring out a lot more resentment against you and it's not going to help you any trying to get back with her. I think it may even ruin your chances altogether. Be a friend and watch from a distance. Friends are more content with seeing their loved ones happy. Trying to make their loved ones do what you want because you haven't moved on is self-fish and one-sided. Just my two cents. Take it or leave it.

I was expecting a call from work, and not him to call. I've not been picking up the phone most of this last month just because I've been avoiding him - letting my voicemail take all my calls unless I expect someone. I'll be getting Caller ID tomorrow just for good measure now though. I've talked to him briefly on the phone only twice since I broke up with him weeks ago and I thought he'd finally figured it out that we weren't together anymore after almost two weeks of NC (not the official NC-- I just didn't contact him and he didn't either cause he never put in much effort anyways). Then he calls today just to pick a fight with me about the relationship and beat the horse to death all over again-- probably because he was sitting home alone feeling bored and lonely and wanted to spread the fun to me cause I'm the one that he blames for putting him in that miserable state of mind. The few weeks without much contact with him has been absolutely wonderful and I STILL have yet to grieve for the relationship- however I honestly think I've grieved enough in the last 6 months with him to not have to grieve now. This was the first night I've even cared enough to be absolutely furious with him for calling up just to harass me about something that's been done and over with for almost a month now. Anyway... I just wondered if anyone else out there has delt with the same issue and felt the same way I did because in some ways I feel like an insensitive 'female dog' because I've never been so rude to anyone as to scream and shout and hang up on them before... but I also feel like I was in the right for doing so. So I feel kind of weird feeling so mean-spirited and hostile, but I don't regret my decision for the break-up or the NC at all - and I know most people might. If he doesn't get it by now, cause I seriously blew a fuse over the phone telling him I wanted NC and then hung up on him, then he won't ever get it and I truly feel sorry for his next gf.

I had one more explosive argument with my ex today (whom I broke up with a few weeks ago) and basically one moment he's mad at me because he claims I never told him about the things that bothered me about him when we were together, and then the next moment he'll be mad because I'll remind him of the issues (because he asked me to) and then he says he's heard it a hundred times before and he's tired of talking about the same things- and that our major trust issues aren't real issues. So why did he ask me to bring up the issues again if he already knew what they were but still wasn't willing to do anything about them? It's just frustrating to feel like I'm being forced to beat a dead-horse when I've already killed it. When I remind him we're not together any more and that we're broken up and the issues don't matter anymore, he says we're not broken up because HE didn't break up with me. It's like Hello? I dumped you. Let's just try to be amicable with each other and not beat it to a second death from now on? He doesn't seem to accept that I was deeply hurt and truly do not trust him because of his past actions. He's unwilling to take responsibility for his immature and irresponsible actions or qualify his actions as viable reasons to dump him. So I initiated the NC rule today and told him until we healed from our toxic relationship, that I felt we needed to cease contact with each other for a few months because its clear he hasn't accepted the fact the relationship was over. I guess I just needed to vent and hear what others had to say if they've ever gone through this kind of frustration and felt this ticked off with their exs because they wouldn't accept the break-up.

He has a case history of just leaving without saying anything or inviting me to go with-- and his excuse when he gets back is usually "I can't help that I'm spontaneous." This time with this vacation i was lucky enough to find out he was taking someone else the day earlier... which meant I had time to tell my boss I wasn't going to be taking vacation the next week afterall like I'd said I was going to months ago. He's the kind of guy who would rather go out partying with friends than drive an hour to see me at the hospital to help me through major tumor surgery knowing I had no one else to drive me to the hospital or home after my 3 day hospital stay. His excuse was "I was so stressed about you I needed to go have a drink with my friends instead of being with you and getting more stressed." He's just a jerk like that.