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The Decline of Enotalone?


WaywardKiwi
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Hey everyone,

 

Not sure if this is an exercise in futility, but I just wanted to comment that as a recent returnee after around a year, I have noticed a significant uptick in what appears to be biased and unwarranted attacks in some of the replies here, including from some longer serving members. This is across several threads as well directed at a variety of OPs and members.

 

I just want to express my disappointment, as when I first discovered this forum I got a lot of positive and constructive feedback, which I really feel helped me. However, I am now reluctant to continue posting or replying as I feel I may open myself to being the recipient of someone else issues (when i definitely have enough of my own to deal with).

 

As I said, this may be futile, but I just wanted to note this in the hope that all contributors will try to remain civil, and try to approach others with both empathy and objectivity (while of course lending the benefit of experience).

 

Much love,

 

T

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Hey everyone,

 

Not sure if this is an exercise in futility, but I just wanted to comment that as a recent returnee after around a year, I have noticed a significant uptick in what appears to be biased and unwarranted attacks in some of the replies here, including from some longer serving members. This is across several threads as well directed at a variety of OPs and members.

 

I just want to express my disappointment, as when I first discovered this forum I got a lot of positive and constructive feedback, which I really feel helped me. However, I am now reluctant to continue posting or replying as I feel I may open myself to being the recipient of someone else issues (when i definitely have enough of my own to deal with).

 

As I said, this may be futile, but I just wanted to note this in the hope that all contributors will try to remain civil, and try to approach others with both empathy and objectivity (while of course lending the benefit of experience).

 

Much love,

 

T

 

Agree whole heartedly... Used t be fun, supportive, people would IM and help one get through the day...

 

Now, it seems to be just attacks on everything you say, how you word it , and personal issues seem to dominate the "help"

 

Sad, sad indeed...

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Way too much debating back and forth too.

 

Thinking it's more important to "prove" they're right rather than trying to help the OP. Getting offended when someone disagrees or presents a different point of view. Debates that go on for PAGES, then posts wondering where the OP went!

 

I'm here because I put myself through not one, not two, but THREE awful relationships and I would like to think that maybe I could help someone else avoid the mistakes I made. Not here for debates or petty arguing.

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So it looks like you joined maybe a month or two after I did...

 

I cant say its all that different to me.

 

Look at my original post, I got ate up. That was 2017.

 

Also I think your anxiety and self esteem and other issues may make you fear criticism, and ironically you're combating that with your own criticism...

 

Am I going to sit here and say that I dont see overly critical posts? Am I going to say I dont see posters who dont 'defend' themselves get kinda bullied, no because I'd be lying, but i will say its the same as its been since Ive been here, honestly I joined because this board was one of the least critical I've seen, while also not coddling, I liked that, I felt the responders were real people and not trolls.

 

So not only do I think youre projecting feelings of maybe wanting to be coddled, but I think you're being unfair to many people who do come here to give advice.

 

OPer, I hope you choose to remain open to see the responses to the thread you recently wrote, you may be surprised.

 

I havent read it but I'll go take a look and I'll try to keep in mind your mindset.

 

ETA:

 

So I just read your post and you got some really kind responses. Why do you think you'll be attacked?

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So I just read your post and you got some really kind responses. Why do you think you'll be attacked?

 

Hi figureitout23,

 

Perhaps you are right, my own issues make me particularly sensitive to criticism, however I would disagree that I am seeking 'coddling'. If you were to peruse my posts prior to most recent you will see that there is some pretty direct response there and as I said, I found them constructive and helpful. If you really want to go this road, I will happily link particular threads, as well as my own defense of this forum along much the same lines as you here.

 

I am not going to 'name names' as to people I feel have been unfairly prejudicial or overly critical in recent posts, as that in-of-itself is counter-intuitive to my original sentiment. I always attempt to be judicious in my responses, and attempt to only offer advice where I truly feel I have something relevant and worthwhile to say. I also try to approach people where they are, and inject as little assumption as possible, while still attempting to calculate the other side. I do, however, read most new threads (when I am active, as I have recently become again) and my observation is based primarily on what I have seen across the board generally, not in relation to my own post in particular.

 

In any case, I take your point, and I don't want to sound like I am completely trashing this forum. In fact, if I thought it has completely devolved into the troll infested, flaming pit that most forums are, I would never have bothered with this post. I just made an observation from my own perspective.

 

T

 

EDIT: Additionally, I repped and thanked several respondees to my last post, as I felt they were very helpful to me. Its not a matter of there being nothing good here, its simply an observation, from my perspective, across multiple threads, of a higher incidence of responses I would consider less constructive, objective, and empathetic. Take it for what you will.

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I do agree that I appreciate being able to actually give advice and perspectives here. Another forum I used to frequent only allowed posters to say "Hugs to you! I'm so sorry you're hurting!" If anyone gave actual advice they were given infractions. So ridiculous!

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I do agree that I appreciate being able to actually give advice and perspectives here. Another forum I used to frequent only allowed posters to say "Hugs to you! I'm so sorry you're hurting!" If anyone gave actual advice they were given infractions. So ridiculous!

 

Really? Wow...

 

I used to read a forum (never joined) where they not only allowed a poster to troll advice seekers but actually encouraged and defended it. I wish I could remember what it was called, I kinda want to see if they're still operating that way.

 

ENA is not without its flaws, but I value what it has to offer, dont get me started on Quora...

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Hey everyone,

 

Not sure if this is an exercise in futility, but I just wanted to comment that as a recent returnee after around a year, I have noticed a significant uptick in what appears to be biased and unwarranted attacks in some of the replies here, including from some longer serving members.

 

It's funny you should say mention this. I find some of the longer serving members act like logging onto ENA and responding to someone's question a chore they're begrudgingly forced to do. They're so cantankerous. I've noticed a trend that some off-topic threads have just become places for people to moan about and mock other people's posts. It just gives this forum a horrible tone. This place is definitely slipping.

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It's funny you should say mention this. I find some of the longer serving members act like logging onto ENA and responding to someone's question a chore they're begrudgingly forced to do. They're so cantankerous. I've noticed a trend that some off-topic threads have just become places for people to moan about and mock other people's posts. It just gives this forum a horrible tone. This place is definitely slipping.

 

Pot meet kettle.

 

Im sorry, maybe Im over protective of this place, maybe I just dont like hypocrisy, but I dont see how this is helpful, its literally complaining about complaining. Being cantankerous over other people being cantankerous, its mean spirited, disguised as concern.

Edited by figureitout23
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Hey everyone,

 

Not sure if this is an exercise in futility, but I just wanted to comment that as a recent returnee after around a year, I have noticed a significant uptick in what appears to be biased and unwarranted attacks in some of the replies here, including from some longer serving members. This is across several threads as well directed at a variety of OPs and members.

 

I just want to express my disappointment, as when I first discovered this forum I got a lot of positive and constructive feedback, which I really feel helped me. However, I am now reluctant to continue posting or replying as I feel I may open myself to being the recipient of someone else issues (when i definitely have enough of my own to deal with).

 

As I said, this may be futile, but I just wanted to note this in the hope that all contributors will try to remain civil, and try to approach others with both empathy and objectivity (while of course lending the benefit of experience).

 

Much love,

 

T

 

I'm glad you posted this, Waywardkiwi. Actually, I'm kinda surprised I haven't seen more threads like this.

 

This a great reminder to all of us to think before we reply.

 

I haven't really noticed much of a decline since I joined, but am clearly not a fan of some of the replies that seem angry and mean in nature. Although, whenever I do see these types of replies, I tend to think that the responder is speaking from a bad personal experience and/or having a rough day, so I try not to give it too much weight. I'm not looking to justify snarly responses, but have to come to accept that, like with everything in life, with the good comes the bad, and I try to focus more so on the helpful and constructive posts. Easier said than done, I know, because I've found myself going into defense mode plenty of times on here.

 

FWIW, if by chance you're a highly sensitive person (and I'm speaking as a sensitive person myself), I think it's easier to maybe misconstrue some advice and take it to heart, especially since we can't hear tone on this advice forum, even though the responder has good intentions and is providing some useful advice. And let's face it, sometimes the truth hurts.

 

I think we just have to find that balance between not being overly sensitive as the OP when we're looking for advice, and the responders being mindful of the advice they're providing (constructive, yes! mean and angry, no!). (Aaaaand, what one person might construe as mean and angry, another might interpret as constructive and vice-versa, so we just have to do our best to keep it in perspective, I guess)

 

Thanks for posting this though, Wayward. It's food for thought!

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I do agree that I appreciate being able to actually give advice and perspectives here. Another forum I used to frequent only allowed posters to say "Hugs to you! I'm so sorry you're hurting!" If anyone gave actual advice they were given infractions. So ridiculous!

 

I can vouch that!

 

One "Christian" forum has only two mods who blindly delete posts flagged one of their fav advisors.

How do you get on the wrong side of one of these Mods? Try to directly help the OP vs. sloughing it off on a religious leader or the fireproof movie.

 

Considering how hard it must be, I think the Owner and Mods here are very respectful and do the best they can.

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Thanks for the reminder.

 

I find my responses are flavored by my own mood of the day. And that's not at all o.k.

I have to remind myself often to be compassionate and more empathetic.

 

But nothing corrects me more than the times I have posted things for advise and the view from other side is incredibly harsh. Responders, myself included, are guilty of not reading or comprehending what the OP is actually saying and they begin to fire off irresponsibly. `Hang em high!' is the common theme here.

 

Luckily, I've been here long enough, that coupled with not being thin skinned, I can shrug a lot of it off. For the most part some of it makes me sad.

 

But the balance comes with those who are always gracious and generous. My admiration for their patience is something I wish I had more of. That and when someone is able to turn something around and walk away with a better understanding of themselves.

 

But I often wonder, long after I've logged off, what happens to those that have come here, made themselves vulnerable and not having articulated their dilemma in the best way possible. In turn they've been shredded and never returned.

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Imo, it is true that people in this forum respond based on their personal life experiences and that can lead to a variety of responses and yes, accidentally projecting at times. However, this is usually counterbalanced by the other people's opinions (imo, there is quite a variety of life outlooks among people's opinions in this forum). Thus, hopefully things eventually balance out and the person originally posting can put things into perspective and decide for themselves which opinions feel right and which opinions are off base/unjust.

 

The thing is that people respond based on their personal standards and sometimes these can differ drastically among different people/cultures. It is difficult to empathise with people describing situations that seem to violate one's version of the golden rule. In general, I think one should aim to develop a thick skin when it comes to virtual strangers' opinions in the internet. At the end of the day, each OP is the real expert on their personal circumstances and have the most data available to judge what is true and what is off base regarding their case.

 

In my personal experience, what tends to hurt is usually some hidden fear that could actually be useful to bring into the light and deconstruct. Criticism is a form of feedback that can be used constructively provided that one has the maturity to put it in its right frame/perspective. When someone throws you a ball you have the option not to pick it up i.e. you can disregard off base criticism. Even more so, when it's a complete stranger who at the end of the day doesn't know you and what you've been through. If on the other hand it's some truth that hurts, then it's not particularity useful to blame the messenger for failing to sugarcoat it.

 

Finally, it's useful to have in mind that English is not everyone's mother tongue in here. That and different cultural backgrounds can sometimes distort the tone of one's reply. Imo, people whose first language is not English can sometimes unintentionally come off as more harsh/abrupt than native speakers.

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Go check out TAM for a bit. I've not been here long, but this place is surprisingly nice. On TAM, if you don't follow the status quo, you get ganged up on. You can't voice your opinion unless it agrees with the longstanding population.

 

Here, you can.

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Honestly, there are some positive outcomes - where things might seem "cantakerous" is when a poster comes to hear only what they want to hear (ie, "my parents don't approve of my boyfriend who punched me in the face and whose family i never meant even after 7 years together"-- help me explain to my mom that she's controlling/prejudiced).

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I don't know. I love these boards because the posters here share genuine, honest, straightforward advice. It's advice that you might not want to hear, but it's what you need to hear. I think for the most part, posters are genuinely caring and respectful and advice comes from both, life experience and a good place at heart. Sure, there are times when people get triggered, due to their own past, but you can certainly take their posts with a grain of salt. Even in those posts, there is wisdom and life experience even if not currently relevant to you. You never know, it might become relevant later.

 

As a very good trainer of mine used to say, take everything you hear and file it away. Just because it's not relevant today, it may be the best solution to a problem tomorrow. Golden words, golden advice.

 

Btw, sensitivity to constructive criticism simply means that you aren't quite there emotionally to address the problems and accept the advice given constructively. That's OK. Recognize that, take a deep breath and give yourself some time to digest your problems.....then come back and read your thread again.....and you might need to do so a few more times until one day....you see the advice clearly and it suddenly makes sense to you. That's when you've arrived at a place of acceptance and ability to take in what's said constructively instead of reactively.

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It's one thing to be gruff or harsh. It's another to behave in a way that alienates others and makes them feel stupid or unwelcome.

 

I do think that some of the replies I see on here are outrageously judgmental and often mean.

 

When OPs defend themselves and/or say the feedback is not helpful, they are told by some that their feelings are a symptom of a defect: the OP is too sensitive or they need to be coddled--as if there's no middle ground between the harsh treatment they are receiving and coddling.

 

This outright dismissal of the OP's input is amazingly condescending.

 

Not everyone does this, but the ones who do tend to reinforce each other and gang up, there by validating themselves among themselves. And it seems like they are the majority because most regular people who see it tune it out as pointless nonsense.

 

Of course, the poor OP is stuck fending for his/her self. Poor soul.

 

Anyway, I don't think the haters/angermongers represent the majority of the people here. Just the most vocal and critical segment.

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I agree with you, Jibralta.

 

Lately the criticism and spiteful fighting against the OP or another poster has gotten bad. It's why my posts have dropped off.

I don't enjoy being attacked for my opinion or having to explain why I said what I did or and for someone else to tell me it's wrong or bad, etc.

 

It's happened far too many times and my post count dropping is exactly in relation to this.

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The hypocrisy is making my skin itch...I cant...

 

Being an a** about other people being a**** means were all a****.

 

Theres always a kind and constructive way to voice opinion of course, but its not coming off that way... which again makes this whole thing complaining about complaining.

 

Im not saying there are worse boards to dismiss if someone is being bullied, but Ive seen multiple times, those who complain about bullies, bully themselves, its simply someone one day got mean about something you agreed about and made you feel some type of way, lets be real here, at the end of the day the only posters I could think would even kinda have a leg to stand on haven't touched this post ironically, myself included, Im not innocent, but I own that, I always say I would never say something on here that I wouldn't say to your face.

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Pot meet kettle.

 

Im sorry, maybe Im over protective of this place, maybe I just dont like hypocrisy, but I dont see how this is helpful, its literally complaining about complaining. Being cantankerous over other people being cantankerous, its mean spirited, disguised as concern.

 

I think you are overly protective about this place because you've managed to take my general comment and take it quite personally.

 

What makes you think my motives are mean spirited and disguised as concern? I don't even know who you are. I don't think we've even spoken before. Yet you seem to know what is going on in my head? Don't ignorantly assume what place I'm coming from. Your response to me is pretty much my experience with dealing with some of the longer serving members.

 

If you look at some of the off topic threads it is just people repeatedly mocking people's posts. Feel free to point out a time that I've done that. That's a fairly new phenomena. How exactly is that helpful? How does that foster a spirit of "you are not alone"? That's mean spirited, whether you think it is deserved that these people's posts should be mocked or not. It certainly makes me less willing to post up a thread in the future when I see that.

Edited by ApocalypseDreams
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Oh. Now I see why you took my post so personally.

 

"04-29-2019, 10:13 PM #787

figureitout23

Apr 2017

Posts 3,928

Posters with 6 posts from 12 years ago posting their happy updates on the heartbreak board...

 

Not only are there more appropriate boards like personal growth but no ones invested in your story homeboy! Know your audience! self centered narcissistic butheads..."

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I don't know. I love these boards because the posters here share genuine, honest, straightforward advice. It's advice that you might not want to hear, but it's what you need to hear. I think for the most part, posters are genuinely caring and respectful and advice comes from both, life experience and a good place at heart. Sure, there are times when people get triggered, due to their own past, but you can certainly take their posts with a grain of salt. Even in those posts, there is wisdom and life experience even if not currently relevant to you. You never know, it might become relevant later.

 

As a very good trainer of mine used to say, take everything you hear and file it away. Just because it's not relevant today, it may be the best solution to a problem tomorrow. Golden words, golden advice.

 

Btw, sensitivity to constructive criticism simply means that you aren't quite there emotionally to address the problems and accept the advice given constructively. That's OK. Recognize that, take a deep breath and give yourself some time to digest your problems.....then come back and read your thread again.....and you might need to do so a few more times until one day....you see the advice clearly and it suddenly makes sense to you. That's when you've arrived at a place of acceptance and ability to take in what's said constructively instead of reactively.

 

I concur. I have learned more here than I can articulate, I have gained a deeper and broader appreciation of humanity, I have learned to be more thoughtful.

 

There is extraordinary value in the act of showing up, the way that many show up here.

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Way too much debating back and forth too.

 

Thinking it's more important to "prove" they're right rather than trying to help the OP. Getting offended when someone disagrees or presents a different point of view. Debates that go on for PAGES, then posts wondering where the OP went!

 

Actually, I’ve noticed this too. After I posted my first response to this thread, I clicked onto another thread that was pages long. The OP had bailed after the first post, and it was just pages of people debating and extrapolating simple interactions into human rights issues.

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Oh. Now I see why you took my post so personally.

 

"04-29-2019, 10:13 PM #787

figureitout23

Apr 2017

Posts 3,928

Posters with 6 posts from 12 years ago posting their happy updates on the heartbreak board...

 

Not only are there more appropriate boards like personal growth but no ones invested in your story homeboy! Know your audience! self centered narcissistic butheads..."

 

 

Not about you. Dont think Ive seen any of your posts till now... I took a quick glance, I didn't see any post that could even be construed as me talking about you... you write about your health scares it looks like, where did I reference that? Thats some hardcore reaching to victimize yourself.

 

You are calling people names saying they're cantankerous and being all around negative. Which in itself is the exact same thing you're complaining about. Its the pot calling the kettle black.

 

You're right I don't know what its disguised as...you can enlighten me though.

 

I'm not sitting here acting like my sh*t don't stink so you can quote me, I proudly stand by what I say. I'm not a sinner on Saturday saint on Sunday type of girl, I respect cantankerous people who are who they are more than people who think they're holier than thou...its not my things its never been my thing.

 

I have made myself a pariah before by not going along with school yard, were better than them attitudes and I'm not going to start now.

 

This may not be the best board, but these people were here for me when I needed them, and I appreciate that, these regular posters are here for many people, the message isnt always dressed pretty, but if your goal is to heal to move on to be better and stronger, youre gonna get what you need. Being coddled, told what you want to hear, asking 'am I crazy' and expecting everyone to say 'no of course not' this may not be the place, but theres some d*mn good advice givers here, are they perfect no, do we butt heads like a dysfunctional family? Often...But I have been privately thanked many times for my words, I had someone tell me my advice helped them breathe another day, that to me is invaluable, knowing I make a difference...so youre right I am taking it personal, but not because I feel personally attacked but because I feel you are attacking people who were here for me and are here for others every day. There words have saved people, including me. Period.

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