renaissancewoman101

Hope75, I dont want to say that I am "proud" of never dumping anyone. I just dont like to dump people because I know what it is like to be rejected by someone you cared about. That is one reason why I stuck with my ex. He has always been the one dumped by the women so he has always told me he knows what it feels like to be the dumpee that is why he always gives his relationships a lot of chances and he tries to treat the woman decently and honestly and kindly. I always thought that if he was always being dumped he would not dump in return. I unfortuanetly had to be the first person he "dumped". Me, I wont dump someone. I may pull a disappearing trick on someone and I have done that before. Before I met my ex, I was dating someone who was much older than me but who was in the Ren Faire circles and I dated him so I could meet new people. I ended up meeting my current ex through him. When I met my ex, I kind of pulled the disappearing trick on the other person. I know it wasnt a good thing to do and the other guy was kinda mad at me for a while, esp since I did see him at Ren Faire every so often. I am excited about moving on with my life. I finally sent off the lease papers and I sent the check for the rest of the month rent, and now I established electric service at the new place. I am in the midst of finding movers to move me out there, packing stuff away, and doing other things. It is exciting to move but also very scary because I have lived out here for 15 years, and worked at my job for 7. It is scary to give this all up to go out there into the unknown. ANd I dont have a job out there waiting for me. I am just going to jump and see. Right now, unless he calls me tomorrow to change plans, the ex is going to hang out with me on Sat afternoon after he gets off work. He wants to go Christmas shopping with me, which is good since it will be nice to hang with him on friendly terms. Also, he can get more done if I drive him around. I hope he really will hang with me. I have a hard time being on equal terms with a SO. I have a caretaker mentality so I like to take care of people. It also gives me a sense of control. I think a lot of this comes from my low self-esteem. I know my ex is not good for me because we are not compatible, but I do miss him a lot and it is hard to let go of something that is familiar and move onto the unknown.

Lil Punkin, if he came back to beg for me back, I would take him back in a heartbeat and I WOULD not dump him again. I would try to work it out with him with a neutral party why I lost my feelings for him and did what I did to him. I also NEVER dump anybody. That is not my style. And, yes, he did have a legit reason for dumping me. I never said he didnt. I just am craving another chance at a relationship with him. If I got him back now, I would abandon all plans of moving to CA and I would work on reestablishing this relationship But, the irony of the whole thing is, in order to maybe EVER get him back, I have to move on with my life and he has to see that I have moved on with my life. Only then will he possibly come back to me. Yes, I do have obsessive tendencies when it comes to relationships, that is why I dont like getting into a relationship for I am afraid of being dumped.

Smallworld, I know I need to move on. It is just hard for me to move on because I still do have feelings for him. Right now, part of me is still hoping he will get together with me on Sat afternoon. As of now, we are getting together unless he calls me to cancel. Moving away will help because then it will give me a new lease on life and I will have things to look forward to, etc. I just wish that my feelings for him now could be my feelings about 6 months ago. I wish I felt the way I felt then, now, because it would help me get over him. Six months ago, I couldnt stand to be around him and I ignored him and shoved him off on his friends. As a result he began to chase me more and try to work things out with me. He really wanted to work things out at that time when I just didnt care. Now that I care, he wants out. I also wished that when we were having problems I should have sought out the help of our mutual friend because I think she could have helped us men our relationship and helped me understand why I lost my feelings for him and helped me to work on regaining those feelings, for I did wonder how to regain the feelings but I didnt know how. Too many what if's floating about. I wish I did not sound like a broken record.

He was the one who brought up getting together this Sat. He brought it up last Thursday when I saw him at the bar. I just called him to confirm plans. I am always like that. I did that when I was dating him too. I was bad too. I offered to give him back the phone because I felt bad for him and sorry for him, but now he doesnt want the phone back. He says he is going to get one on his own in January. I know I am doing this wrong. I want to sound strong and like I am moving away from him, which I am in the physical sense, but this was also a bit of game playing where I am hoping he comes back to me when he sees that I am leaving. Why cant I be like the way I was the last few months of the relationship, when I didnt care to hang with him and I treated him badly, since that was the time when he really began to chase me and want me badly, but then I didnt want him and didnt care. I wish I could get back to that stage of feeling like that, because if I felt like that now, it could bring him back or else I just wouldnt care. I am very mad at myself for losing out on this whole situation. I know I constantly rehash all this. I just cant stand the fact that he dumped me considering he never dumps girls, girls always dump him. I feel like such a loser.

My move is coming along. I called the movers yesterday and set up a date for next Wed for them to come in and take a look at what needs to be moved and then write up an estimate for me. I am in the process of setting up the utilities for my new apartment, changing over insurance and all that. There is no turning back now since I have given notice both at my current job and at my apartment. I called the ex today to see what he wanted to do about Sat, since he brought up the subject of hanging out on Sat afternoon after he gets off work so we can go Christmas shopping. Now he is hemming and hawing about getting together because his gf's dad wants him to help him out with putting up Christmas decorations. My ex then went on a complaining tirade about why he has to help out with the dad, etc. I dont know why he is complaining to me about her family. He wanted to be with her, then he has to accept her family. (I am starting to get this impression that he likes to complain a lot. He complains about his own parents wanting him to do stuff, and from talking to Angel, he used to complain about me and the stuff I liked to do). I guess my ex likes to complain a lot. I told him that if he didnt want to get together, I was fine with that. He was like, "no I want to get together, I just dont know what to do". I then told him this, for now the plan is we get together on Sat after he gets off work. If anything changes, he can call me and let me know. That way the ball is in his court about what he wants to do. I dont care anymore. If he wants to get together fine! If not, fine! After I move away, the book will be closed on this subject because he doesnt really have a way to get in touch with me, and vice versa. He told me that he is getting his own cell phone sometime in Jan.

Yes, I do want my own life. It is not easy for me to move on from failed relationships, that is the reason why I am still good friends with my first ex. And, that is the reason why I dont date a lot. I am trying to get my own life, that is why I am moving out to San Diego. There I can develop a new life, a new career, and new friends, and maybe get a new bf. Today, I did one of the hardest things I have had to do in a long while. I went and gave my two week notice at my job. I have been at this job for seven years. That is a long time. I like where I work, but there is no challenge and no real chance to go anywhere. In a way, I am stagnating at my job, not learning anything new, and I am getting older. That is one of the reasons I decided to jump. I stayed there for this long because I was comfortable with working there and with the people I worked with. As for the ex, I am not sure if he wants me to let him go. On one hand he says he doesnt want a relationship with me again and doesnt want me to wait for him, etc., then on the other hand, when I say I am moving away, now he tells me that he wants to be friends with me and wishes that what had happened did not cause me to move away. I dont think he wants me to move away and he is surprised that I am doing that. I thought he thought that I would always be there waiting for him. I am afraid to move away and start over again. I have always been a fan of comfortability and I usually like to stay at places where the work environment is predictable. I have a hard time dealing with change, that is why I have stayed at my job for 7 years even though I havent learned much there or gone anywhere. Right now, I am surprised that on Thursday night he brought up the possibility of me stopping by his work on Sat since he has to work till 3 PM and then we could go Christmas shopping and out to talk. That is something I have wanted to do with him for a long time, but for the longest time he has been so adverse with me so I never brought it up. The fact that he brought it up on Thursday night surprised the hell out of me. He was a bit buzzed at the time. I would love to be able to spend an afternoon with him on Sat and am wondering if I should call him about what he said on Thursday night. He told me that I could come down on Sat if I wanted to. I never gave him a definitive answer on Thurs night about it. Right now, part of me regrets taking the phone back from him. I feel bad that he doesnt have a way to talk to people. I also dont want to sound like the a*shole to him either. I know I need to move on, but I am torn. I also have limited time out here. I am moving away by the end of Dec.

If he doesnt want to get back together with me, why wont he admit to me that he has a new gf? I told him that I would leave him alone if he had a new gf. I also want to know why he wants to hang with me next Sat? And finally, I want to know why he still has our picture still up on his bookshelf. He says he still does. I want to hang with him next Sat because I do miss him. I am going to move away to San Diego at the end of the month. I went to see the new apt today and it looks real nice. Right now I am in LA for the weekend. Part of me is hoping that since he knows I am moving away, that he might make a bid for our relationship again, because as someone once said, people dont miss things or want things until the things are gone.

Smallworld, part of me is also thinking that he might be being so nice to me because he doesnt want me to pay me back the rest of my money, hence having his friend Brian call me and talk to me about softening my resolve to get my money back. And yes, I think he is surprised about me moving away. I think he was always thinking I would be sitting there pining away for him. I am going to move on and move to San Diego. Part of me is also doing this in the hopes that he may come back to me one day, like meaning he sees that I AM moving out, then he will come back. If he did that, I would not know what to do. I am surprised that he told me that he still has our picture up on his shelf. I wonder why since he has a new gf. But, he wont tell me that she is his gf. Why wont he do that since if he doesnt want anything relationship-wise with me, he could tell me he has a gf and I will move on. As for seeing him, I am surprised that he mentioned about me coming down next Sat afternoon to hang with him. He told me that he has to work till 3 PM but that I could come down and we could hang out, talk and go Christmas shopping. I wonder if he really means it, or was he just pulling my leg. I am not sure if he really wants to be friends with me. Just last month he was saying it would take a long time before he could be friends with me. He tells me he doesnt wnat me to be friends with his friends, but then on the other hand he tells me that he didnt want me to move away because he wanted to hang out with me sometime later on as friends and then maybe I could be friends with some of his friends. I dont understand the ex. I miss him a lot. I wonder if he misses me considering he has a new gf, although he tells me he has a new love interest. He seems like he doesnt want me to move on, why? If he has a new gf, then he should be happy I am moving on, considering he thought some of my actions like me showing up at FurFest and me emailing the guy, as stalker material.

Yes, I did end up getting the phone back from the ex. He also gave me back $100. Thursday night was a weird night in regards to my ex. I called him up on Thurs afternoon to tell him that I was still coming over. He was ok with it but he wasnt sure how we were going to meet. I called him while driving down to see when we could meet and where and he still hadnt decided. He then told me he would call me when he was ready (meaning when he got off work). I ended up going over to our mutual friend's house first and on my way there, I get a call from my ex's close friend Brian (he has known my ex since they were kids and he is also an alcoholic. In fact he is a worse alcoholic than my ex and he influences my ex to drink). Brian is at a bar and he is drunk as hell. He calls me to talk to me about the ex. He told me that he had called him ranting and raving about my demanding my phone back and my money back. Apparently my ex called his friend ranting about me demanding my money back and the phone back. He then told me that he worries about his friend/my ex and that he decided to call me to talk to me and see how I am doing and to ask me to have some compassion for my ex when it comes to getting my money back since it is the holidays. He was telling me that my ex doesnt have a lot of money, it is the holidays and he needs to buy gifts for his family and relatives, and then he mentioned my ex's new gf's name. When he mentioned that, I decided to ask him later on in the conversation, if my ex had a new gf. Apparently since he is drunk, he cant remember he mentioned the new gf's name to me. When I asked him if my ex had a new gf, he was like he wasnt sure, but maybe so, not sure. He is so full of it. Brian mainly called me to chat with me and to convince me to be nicer to my ex and not demand so much money from him because of the holidays. I think he was also fishing around for my ex to see if I was really moving away (I had told my ex on Tuesday that I was moving away by the end of the month). Brian talked to me about my move and about when I decided this, since it was so sudden. He also wanted to know where and when I was moving. He wanted to know if I had a job out there, etc. He told me that he lost his new job three days after he started it. We talked for a bit but I was annoyed at him so I didnt talk long. After I got off the phone, I went over to the mutual friend's house, hung out with her and asked her to go out to dinner with me while waiting for my ex to call me back to set up a time. In the middle of dinner, my ex calls to talk to me. He seemed friendly and wanting to talk. We talked about what he had been doing, how his life was going. He basically told me that things were ok with him, he was trying to get his life together, paying off his bills, he was having problems with his boss and his job. He told me that Angel (our mutual friend) was angry with him and now wont talk to him or let her son talk to him. She is angry about his drinking and is associating his actions to me with her past life of when her bfs and family emotionally, physically and sexually abused her. In a way she has internalized his breakup with me as how her guys treated her and now she is projecting her anger for those guys onto him (even though he has been good friends with her for a long time and has always helped her out with things). My ex partly thinks I am a cause of this because I started to talk to her about our breakup and she has now taken up my cause is championing it (Problem is she is championing it and taken it upon her shoulders to protect me from my ex, which is NOT what I wanted. I had wanted her to help me get back together with my ex). He was ranting on the phone about her to me and he somewhat thinks I am the cause of this. Also he told me that she has a tendency to make friends and drop them at a drop of a hat. We talked for a bit. He was surprised that I am moving away and he told me that he never expected me to do that. He didnt want me to do that because he left me. We talked for a bit but my battery was running low so I told him that I could talk to him later. He told me that he was going over to this bar that we both know and that I could meet up with later. I finished my dinner with our mutual friend and told her what was going. She also heard part of our conversation where he was talking nasty about her and she was pissed about it. She wanted to come with me to meet up with him but I told her that I wanted to do this alone. So, I dropped her off at a local bar close by and I went to meet up with my ex. My ex was drinking at the bar and his friend Brian was there. Brian was very drunk and my ex was getting there. Brian was eggin him to drink. My ex looks different nowadays. He is growing out his hair it seems like. It makes him look older and a bit different. I always liked him with the shaved head look. My ex was ok at seeing me and we talked. I told him that I wanted my phone back and also part of my money because I needed the money to move. He was ok about it but then he told me that he didnt have a lot of money because of the holiday season and he needed to get gifts for his family. He was willing to give me back the phone. Basically we talked about why I was moving away. I told him that I wanted to start my life again and move on from him because there were too many memories around of him in the city I lived in and in my apartment. I want something new. I wanted to forget about him. He asked me if I had taken the stuff down in my apartment that he gave me. I told him that I had taken some stuff down but that I still had most of his stuff. He told me that he still had the picture of us together in Las Vegas still up on his bookshelf. (that made me sad when he said that. Why would he still have it up, unless he is lying to me) He still has most of the stuff I gave him. He told me that he didnt want him breaking up with me to cause me to move away because he wanted me in his life somewhat. He was hoping to eventually hang out with me as friends. I dont know. He did mention to me about Angel and how angry he is with her for dissing him and causing her son not to talk to him. He says she has no right to be angry at him because he has never hurt her. He tells me that he is somewhat upset that she is angry at him for his breakup with me. He ranted about the situation with her for a long time. We talked for a long time about our relationship. I told him that I wanted to close to book on it since he wanst coming back and that I wanted to move on, henc the move. He told me that he didnt want me out of his life since he still cared about me. He says he doestn understand why he lost his feelings for me, he just did and it scared him but he doesnt know what to do now. He just doesnt. I told him that why should I stick around if there is no hope for the relationship. I dont want to do that. He told me that he wasnt sure what there was since he doesnt know. He wants to be friends but he doesnt know how to create more than that. He seems like he is upset and unhappy I am moving away. I dont know. We talked for a long time. I could see that he still had some feelings for me by the way he looked at me. He was drinking enough and was getting drunk. His friend was toasted and I was bothered by all this. It all boils down to this, he is surprised that I am moving away. i dont think he wants me to move away and he didnt expect me to do this. I think he expected me stay around even though he broke up with me, and wait for him to come back to me. He would not admit to me that he has a new gf. I ended up confronting him on it and he told me that he wasnt sure yet, it was still in the beginning stages of the relationship. He wont admit that he has a new gf. We talked about why I showed up at FurFest and why I wrote the email to his new gf's dad about the Halloween Party. The last time I saw the ex, he told me he was going to a halloween party and I had an idea who was giving the party. I also knew/had an idea that he was dating the daugher of the guy who had the party and I decided to email him about something with the party and to fish around for infor. When he didnt email me back, I knew my hunch was true. Apparently from the ex, he told me that these people thought I wanted to come to the party because we were getting back together. I told him that I never planned on coming to the party, all I wanted to do was fish for information. He then got mad at me about me showing up at Fur Fest. He was like why did I show up, since it made things uncomfortable with him and he liked Fur Fest vs me who didnt like anything to do with that. He thinks Angel invited me there as a way of stirring up trouble with him. I told him that I came to talk to her because I was lonely, etc. We then had a discussion about whether it was right for me to show up at places that he was ex. He says normally people do not go to places that the ex was going to be at because of uncomfortability factor. We hash that out. I was like, why would he be afraid of me showing up because I kept out of his way. We talked for quite awhile about stuff. There were times I cried and he hugged me and held me. I miss him so much and want him back. I told him that if there was no hope for getting him back then why should I stay and wait, hence I was moving on. He told me that staying for him was not a good idea, but then he wants to be friends with me and wants me to maybe hang out with him again as friends. He was so contradictory since in part of the conversation , he seemed upset that I was beign friends with some of his friends. He also told me the first time I saw him, that he didnt want to see me for a long time or want to be friedns with me as in like hanging out. One of the last things he mentioned was that he was working till 3 PM next Sat and if I wanted to, we could hang out and help him finish his Christmas shopping and we could talk. He was drunk somewhat when he said that. He still managed to give me $100 of the moeny he owed me and he gave me back his phone. What should I do? I am moving away at the end of Dec., but I miss him so much. I have a feeling he met up with me and is being nice to me so he doesnt have to pay me back the money. I dont know. His wanting to hang out with me next Sat makes me hopeful and sad. Seeing him was good, but made me still very attached to him. Sometimes, I wish I hadnt seen him because it brings up a lot of memories and makes me want him more. I know he is surprised that I am moving away in Dec. I didnt think he thought I woudl do something like that. He probably thought I woudl sit around waiting and pining for him, since he did that with all the gfs who dumped him. He did mention that he dumped his first gf and he went after her and wanted her back, but she didnt want him back. This story was different than what he told me in the beginning. In the beginning, he told me that she dumped him and he watned her back. I dont know waht to do. I want him back so bad and am wondering if the fact I am moving away and the fact that he doesnt wnat to pay me back, is causing him to be nice to me like this??? What you guys think?

I know, I am glad to be moving away. In a way it is sad to see how this all turned out, considering in the beginning of our relationship he seemed to be so in love with me and to care about me so much, and he did for most of the relationship treat me very well. I just didnt think he could become like this to me after the relationship was over. Also, why do men act condescending to a woman in situations like this? I just want to understand the nuances of why men act the way they do. I am trying to learn so that the next relationship I get into, I am not so naieve about things.

Well, I called the ex today to get my phone back and to try to get some of my money. I called him at work. He seemed ok to hear from me. We talked for about 5 minutes. I told him that I wanted my phone back and that I wanted my money that he owes me back. I also told him that I was moving away. He seemed like he was in a good mood and wanted to talk. He didnt seem that perturbed that I was moving away. He asked me where I was moving to and all that. I told him that I was moving to San Diego and that he should be happy that I was moving away since he didnt have to then worry about dealing with me. He told me that he wasnt happy to see me move away and he wish that it didnt turn out the way it did because he didnt want me to think of him like how other men may have treated me. He said he wanted to be "different" in my eyes. In a way, we talked like old times sake and it made me miss him a bit. I miss him and talking to him a lot. It kind of made me sad that this turned out this way. He asked me where I was moving too and he told me that it would be good for me. I told him that I found a place out in San Diego, etc. He sounded happy to talk to me. He did sound surprised a bit that I was moving away. Sometimes I think he was putting on a front about things I then asked him when I could get my money back and he told me that he didnt know how much he could give me now since Christmas was coming and all that. He said he would try to give me as much as he could. I asked him if I could get my phone back on Thursday since I was going down to hang out with our mutual friend on Thurs night and then I asked him if he knew that I was hanging out with her more often. He said he knew and that he saw me at Fur Fest. I told him that I didnt follow him around Fur Fest and I stayed out of his way. He told me that he knew, but from the way his tone of voice was, it didnt seem like he was that happy to see me at Fur Fest. We then talked about our mutual friend and he told me that she was mad at him for that Sat and that she is mad at some of the girls who hang with her. He then nonchalantly told me that she has this bad habit of making friends, alienating them, and dumping them. Sometimes, I think he told me that to warn me from her. I dont know. I then asked him how was I going to get my stuff back on Thursday. I told him that I had to work and that it usually takes me a long time to get down to his area with the traffic on Thursday. He said he got off around 5:45 and if I could leave work earlier so I could meet up with him since he had stuff to do on Thursday night. I was like ok. I then told him that I would call him on Thursday to see how we could set this up. Sometimes, I feel as though he is trying to find a way to make this hard for me. I dont know. It doesnt seem like he has any animosity or anger towards me. He sounded friendly and pleasant and we talked a bit. I dont know. Talking to him has made me miss him a bit. I do get the idea that he is acting kind of like the condescending one in our conversation, like "I am sorry I caused this for you, I dont want you to think of me like every other guy who may have hurt you since I am not like that, and I am not happy to see you leave." Some of his words and tone sounded condescending, esp when he mentioned the mutual friend and her propensity to drop her friends. Why would he act condescending to me? That is something I cant understand. I have no idea if I am going to get the phone back on Thursday. He doesnt sound like he cares if I am leaving or not.

Annie24, I am going to try and get the phone back from him sometime this week. I am actually in a good mood right now. I have finally made the decision to move back to CA. I am moving to San Diego by the 16th of Dec and today I starting calling around moving companies to see how much it will cost me to move. I have started calling around to get quotes on insurance and all that. I need to start cleaning up my place and packing stuff away in boxes. I am also going to give my 30 day notice tomorrow or Wed., and next week I will give my two weeks notice at work. It is scary for me to do this and I hope I can keep up this momentum. There are times I miss the ex so much and I am afraid of going after something new. But, if I keep my hopes up and my self-image good, I can conqueor anything and I can find a new bf and start a new life over again. I am scared to see the ex this week to get my phone back. I still need to call him to get it back. He hates my guts esp after last weekend. BTW, I dont think his new gf even has a cell phone. BTW, she is only 18 years old and he is 32 going on 33. I wish things could have worked out between us, but I want to move on and not dwell anymore. It will be scary to start a new life over, but my best friend will be in the area and I am going out LA this weekend to spend some time with my best friend and get some moving stuff situated. I know that from now until I move out there, there will be times I relapse and miss the ex A LOT, esp with the holidays. It is hard to keep strong but I am trying. BTW, I dont think his new gf even has a cell phone. She is barely 18 and he is 32 going on 33.

Blueeyed99, I have done what you did, but I had every right to since the phone bills came to my house and the cell phone and plan is in my name. My ex still has the cell phone that I gave him and he shares my plan with me, although I have never asked him to pay for it. After he broke up with me, I was wondering if he was going to find a new gf, so I checked on the phone records attached to his phone. I found a number that he had called often but for long periods of time (like hours) and I did a reverse callback on the number and it belonged to someone I knew (a guy) but he has two daughters and after seeing some photos that the guy posted online about his family and his daughters at a party, I put one and one together and figured out who he was dating. I also found out for sure from our mutual friend. She gave me the low down on the whole situation.

Yes, I still do love my ex and I miss him a lot. And yes, he has been trying to make me look like the devil even though he was the one who broke up with me. At the con, he was going around saying that I was following him around and he accused our mutual friend of letting me come so that I could follow him around. I still care about him a lot and think about him a lot, that is why it is so hard for me to move away from here. There is a small part of me that hopes that when he does find out that I am moving away, that he will have some regret about what he did to me, and maybe even come back to me. I want him to know that I am moving on with my life and I am not staying here waiting for him. I do love him a lot and going through with this, although it is good for me, is extremely painful for me. Right now, I have to find a way to get the courage to talk to him because I need to get my cell phone back from him. I also need him to pay me the $1500 that he owes me, soon.

Hope75, I found out on Friday that I got the apartment in San Diego. It is going to be really nice. I am going to be living downtown in a highrise apt building next to the trendy area of town. I will be living in a studio (750 sq ft) on the 12th floor. The rent is kinda high though. I am going to be paying a bit of $1000/month for rent. I am looking forward to moving out there although taking the next step of giving my two week notice at work is scaring me. Part of me is afraid of moving back out to CA. I spent most of my adult years here in WI and I am afraid that I wont make it out in CA. People out there are more competitive and cutthroat than people here. I also hope to be able to find a new boyfriend out there. I am afraid of change that is why I have lived here for so long. Change scares me. I also am worried about moving closer to my parents, now instead of a 4 hour plane ride, they are going to be a two hour drive away from me. I do miss the ex a bit and I still cry over him at times, esp during the holidays, even though I am moving away. Part of me wishes he could have let me be there for him and make his life better, but as our mutual friend said, only he can make his own life better, I cant. It is hard to accept that because I have this rescuer mentality in me. It is also hard to see how much he has grown to hate and despise me to the point of spreading nasty rumors around. That is mean. I havent done that to him. And I feel sad for him that his drinking has gotten worse.

I spent yesterday and last night over at our mutual friend's place. She had a late Thanksgiving dinner for me and some other people that she knew. I also talked to her about my ex a bit. I am still somewhat obsessed about getting the ex back although the prospects of it are appearing dimmer and dimmer. I found out some interesting things about the ex. For one thing, my ex has always been complaining about him not having enough money to go back to school and get a better paying job and he has also been complaining about not learning how to drive and getting his license so he can get a car. I found out from our mutual friend that her husband offered to pay for my ex to go to trucking school and learn how to drive a truck so that he could get a trucking job and make some better money than he does now. My ex hemmed and hawed and declined it. I also found out that our mutual friend (since she got in a car accident and has muscular dystrophy and cannot drive anymore) offered to sell him her 1988 Mazda Protege for $5 and he declined saying that he didnt have his license. Apparently, from what our mutual friend thinks, he likes to live his life like a teenager and he situates his life so that he self-sabotages any chance he has of improving his life so that he can go and complain that everybody is against him, hates him, all the odds are against him, etc., so that he can say "poor me" and have people feel sorry and rescue him or else he can turn to the bottle again which he has been doing more and more recently (although our mutual friend says he has always drank a lot even during the times I was not with him). From what she says, and she has dealt a lot with alcoholics. Her mother was an alcoholic and she was married to one at one time. From what she says, he has not been allowed to be responsible for the choices he makes meaning everybody makes excuses for him, like he doesnt know what he is doing, he is like a kid so he is going to act like a teenager, etc, so he is like a teenager and has been acting like one because nobody makes him responsible for growing up and being an adult. His mom doesnt make him be responsible. She rescues him by allowing him to live under her roof and not pay rent. She enables his behavior by treating him like a child and not consistent in how she treats him, meaning sometimes she punishes him and denigrates him for something he does, and at other times she doesnt care. There is no sense of consistency. I found out some more things about him and his first ex. Apparently, with his first ex, she was paying most of the bills and she got tired of him being like a little kid and not wanting responsibility so she dumped him after dating him for seven years, and being engaged to him for two of the seven years. All the other ex's apparently they dumped him, but he acted weird and did things to cause them to dump him, and then he went around crying "poor me" "nobody understands me and everybody is against me, all the girls leave me". This is his excuse for being like a child and not wanting to grow up and this is also his excuse for drinking. Our mutual friend thinks he is a classic alcoholic. He also has a tendency to self-sabotage his relationships and cause them to fail. He does that with a lot of things in his life, he does nothing to improve himself and when chances are there for him to improve himself, he doesnt take it, thus keeping him the way he is. With me, she thinks that since I still stuck around after he acted weird, etc., he decided to self-sabotage this relationship by dumping me. She also pointed out to me that he likes to be the center of attention, esp negative attention, and that he does things that cause him to be the center of negative attention. He is loud and belligerent in public. He talks about weird things. He dresses weirdly that attracts negative attention from other people. She said that is the reason why she doesnt hang out with him in public anymore. She says he thinks all the world is against him, but then he does alot of the stuff to attract negative attention to him. She thinks that he is going to stay this way, in his teenage lifestyle and teenage way of thinking, as long as people keep enabling him and not letting him fall for his mistakes. He has now found a gf that is barely 18 from what I hear. She comes from a family of alcoholics and she doesnt drink herself but she is also a rescuer. Our mutual friend tells me that they dont go out a lot because they both dont drive and she lives at home, so he comes and hangs out with her and her family and drinks heavily with them. So, he has no impetus to change or to better himself. His drinking has gotten worse and he has now become belligerent and angry at times. She doesnt think this relationship will last because at the end, he is going to sabotage it himself, like he does with all his other relationships. Our mutual friend is mad at him because of what happened last Sat at Fur Fest. Apparently, that Sat night when I went to use the restroom, he went and got in her face and was yelling at her and ready to pick a fight with her about why I was there and why I was there so long. He was very angry I was there but then he was also very drunk. She wasnt happy at how angry he was with her and how he disrespected her in front of all the people we were sitting with. My ex had told her on Friday that it was ok with him if I showed up just as long as I didnt go and confront him and follow him around the con. Apparently that night, when he confronted her, he told her that I was harassing him and following him around the con, and that was a bunch of BS, and she called him on it. She told him that the whole night we had sat in the smoking corner talking to people and that the only time I got up was just to use the bathroom, and then he came to confront her. Everybody sitting there backed her up on her story because we were ALL there. He was thinking I was stalking him around the con, and I WASNT. Apparently, he has also been going around telling people that we had a nasty breakup and he isnt coming out and telling that HE dumped me. He is insinuating that I ended it with him. He did not tell his closest friend that he dumped me, all he would say is we are broken up (his close friend had to drag it out of him to find out who broke up with who) and from the way he is telling it to people, it appears I broke up with him and is now stalking him. He is playing a sob story to people, why I dont know. Our mutual friend thinks I should go and get the cell phone back from him and get him the cough up the $1500 that he owes me. I told her that he told me that he would start paying me back when he finishes paying off his last credit card bill. She then told me that he has been drinking his money away and that he has always claimed that he cant pay off his bills and cant save money to move out, for the longest time. She thinks he is spending his money on toys and drinking it all away. She doesnt think he will ever pay me back. As for the cell phone, she thinks I should get it back from him because it will teach him a lesson and that he doesnt deserve it considering he broke up with me. She thinks that he will never pay me back. As for the cell phone, she thinks I should get it back soon and he should give it back to me. As for the $1500, she thinks that I should talk to his parents about it and also talk to him and if he doesnt want to pay it back, then I should go to court over it and she says she will back me up. She was surprised that he owed me so much money. Apparently, he hasnt told that many people he owes me money. He never told her or her son (who is a good friend of his). He did tell Brian, his drinking buddy. I am not sure if I want to drag this whole thing out to get the $1500 back. If it becomes too hard, I dont want to deal with it. She also thinks that he is keeping the cell phone and owing me money so as to keep a small tie on me just so he can come back to me, when he wants to, or if he needs to. She tells me that he doesnt completely cut off ties with all his exs and he is on good terms with all of them except the first one, because in case he might want to go back to them. He wants to be the center of attention and have everybody feel soory for him and rescue him. She thinks that in order for him to get better, he has to hit rock bottom with his drinking and want to get help for it. He hasnt gotten there yet because his mom and all of us want to bail him out. She tells me that with an alcoholic, you cant help him/her by beign there for him, rescuing him, etc. That is only enabling him and his drinking problem. The only way to help him is to let go of him and watch him fall. She doesnt think that his new relationship is going to last because she is going to get tired of rescuing him, just as I got tired of rescuing him, but with me I lost my feelings for him. As for me moving away, she thinks that if I tell him, it will bother him a bit. She thinks that he is full of it and thinks that since I have been pining away for him for awhile, that I will continue pining away for him, and me begging him back the last time I talked to him, was his way of stroking his ego. She thinks that he thinks that I will come begging for him and that he enjoys not giving me what I want since it makes him feel powerful. She thinks he thinks I will always be there waiting for him and so he doesnt care. (I did find out that he told her that Friday before I showed up that the last time I saw him and talked to him, I had begged him to sleep with me and that he didnt want to because he didnt feel right about it - she thinks he told her as a way of stroking his ego in front of her like "see she wants me that bad, she is going to come chasing me around the con"). She thinks that he will be surprised that I am moving away because that will show that I dont care anymore. But then he will blame me for that and use that as a way of saying that causes him to drink more because of the way we women always "dump" him. She has given me a lot of insight into my ex. She thinks I should move away even though she will miss me, but she thinks it will be better for me to start my life over again. What do you guys think of all that????

Why is it so bad to send the ex's family a Christmas card??? It isnt as though they are involved in your breakup. I can see why he wants to send his ex's family a Christmas card to thank them for all they've done for him. Part of me is contemplating sending my ex's parent's a Christmas card to thank them for the times I was able to share with them when I was dating their son and to hope that maybe I can see them all sometime in the future. To me sending a card is not a bad thing, it isnt as though the breakup is between the parents and I. Just as long as the card is neutral, I dont see anything wrong with it.

NO, I dont like pain. I just dont really want to confront him right now and ask for the phone back. I am moving in a few weeks so I am going to have to get the phone back soon. I am moving on, that is why I am moving away from here in a few weeks. Yes, I do still have feelings for the ex. He has always been an emotional, understanding, loving, and caring person, that is why I still cant believe he could dump me like that. He has always been dumped by women and trampled on by other people (like his mom, his friends, his boss, people in general) that I felt sorry for him and wanted to be there for him to rescue him. I know towards the end of our relationship, I mistreated him badly and neglected him. Part of me wants to atone for my mistakes maybe in the hopes of being able to get him back one day in the future. Part of me also thinks he does have "some" feelings for me, otherwise, he would not have reacted the way he did this past Sat., when he saw me making out with another guy. I guess I will never understand men.

Kellbell, I see your point, because I was kind of in your "ex's" shoes concerning my own relationship. My ex bf (who dumped me), he could not stand that I was so connected with my first ex (the gay guy). I had a bad tendency to talk to him all the time on the phone, even when I was out with the current bf. Part of that has to do with the fact that I was afraid to trust the bf even though he was so nice and loving to me, and part of it was that I didnt feel that I was on the same level with the bf in terms of thought processes, likes and dislikes, and I was able to open up to my first ex better. My attachment to my ex ultimately killed my current relationship. After a while, my current bf could not handle my attachment to my ex and he dumped me. Funny thing is all the women he has dated before (both long and short term) have always had attachment issues to other people in their lives (like their exes) and all of them, except for his first ex (she left him because she didnt think he could get his life together enough to have a life with her), left him to go back to their exes. I kept in close contact with my ex, but I also continued my relationship with the current bf. It was just only into the second year when I started to lose my feelings for the current bf, that I began to drop my current bf to hang out with the ex more. I did that for a long time (5 months) before the current ex got tired of it and dumped me. I am not sure if I will ever be able to let go of my first ex (the gay guy), we have a very good friendship and he does have a bf, but he makes sure that I have a prominent place in his life. When he first found his bf, his bf hated his relationship/friendship with me and tried to force him to dump me out of his life. He stood up to him even though he was very in love with him and forced him to accept me. HIs bf and I dont get along very well and there is a lot of animosity between us.

Nataliejulie, I wonder that too a lot of times. I wonder if my ex ever thinks of me anymore, ever misses me anymore. It doesnt help that towards the end of our relationship, I really treated him badly and shoved him off onto his friends. I have no idea if my ex misses me. Probably not since he has a new gf already. Last Sat he saw me at the con but I was having a good time and he threw a fit that I was there (even though when our mutual friend first told him I was coming, he told her he was ok with it just as long as I didnt go and confront him and I didnt). It probably didnt help that he saw me making out with a guy for most of the evening. Men are jerks!!!!! My ex was a compassionate person when it came to his friends and other people, but when it came to me, at the end, he was a jerk. I hate him so fuc*ing much. I wish he would suffer what I am suffering right now, TENFOLD.

Anybody else have an opinion about this? Just want to understand what might be going through the head of the ex. Also, I want to know why an ex would get jealous and so freaking mad at you if you make out with a guy considering you and the ex are not together anymore because the ex broke up with you and moved on to find a new gf????

I know he will never come back. I just want to have some type of hope in my heart because I am very sad right now. I am also spending Thanksgiving alone because my plans fell through due to the stupidity of some of my friends. I never said that I thought my ex was sending me mixed signals. He has not done that. I was just surprised that he could move on so quickly and so cleanly considering he has always been dumped by girls and he has always been the emotional and clingy one. In the beginning I was very emotional and clingy to him, esp during the first year of our relationship. The first time he took a break from me, for a week, he came back, but then I started to put up a wall against him eventually and I lost my feelings for him a few months later. I just cant understand how he can be the way he is to me right now. He has friends who mistreat him and take advantage of him and he still clings on to them. He has always been the underdog and has been beaten upon, mistreated, kicked on, etc. all his life and he always roots for the underdog and he is kind and understanding to people who are in worse positions than him, etc. He has always been the empathic one so I never thought he could have the power in him to be so cold to me and cruel to me like the way he has been, or just be so heartless. Why? I am not saying he doesnt have any faults. There are a lot of things that I dont like about him either. I dont like his drinking (that bothered me after time). I dont like his smoking. I also dont like his childlike behaviors and likes and I dont like the fact that, a lot of times, he has a tendency to open his mouth and say things that shouldnt be said and can get him into trouble (I have seen his new gf's parents get annoyed at him for that). Basically, he is a nice and kind, and generous person. I just never saw it in him to be like the way he is to me now. IN the past few run-ins I have had with him in the last few months, the main one being the one in which I went down to his house to pick up my meds, the comments he made to me were rather rude and cold. One time he made a comment about one of my friends and his comment ran the line of "glad I dont have friends like you, how can YOu consider her your friend, only you". Second comment was "I was thinking about you the other day when I wanted to go out for Japanese food, I called my friend to see if he could go out with me, but he was no where to be found". Why the hell would he make cold, cruel comments like that to me. Sometimes I think he wants to treat me and hurt me the way I think I may have hurt him in the last few months of our relationship. I dont know. I think that I keep a hope alive that he may come back some day, that is why I still let him keep my cell phone and use it. How do you think he interprets that? That I still care about him?

Regretfulman, you say that the ex will miss your during the holidays because they will think of what the past holidays were like when they spent it with you. But, what happens in the mind of the ex if when this holiday they already have a new SO? Would they still think of you and the times they spent with you in the past during this holiday??? My ex enjoyed spending the holidays with me last year and the year before. This year he broke up with me and hooked up with a girl 2 weeks after our breakup. Will he still think of me during the holidays? He is going around telling people we had a "nasty" breakup

I do still have feelings for the ex. I was making out with the guy I met at the con because I have been so lonely these past few months for some type of male attention. Also, I was in a good mood on Sat and trying to not think about the ex and moving on. Making out with the guy helped to soothe my damaged soul and heart, but the guy wanted more and I didnt want to give it to him because part of me still wants the ex back. I was just happy that some guys found me attractive and wanted to hang with me. Part of me wants to move on and meet another guy and have another bf, becuase I want the feelings that I used to have with and for the ex. I am daily losing hope of ever getting the ex back, so in order to survive, I have to move on. MOving on to meet new guys and maybe meet a bf. How does one forget the ex and meet someone new? I am making a concerted effort to meet new people, but the ex is always in the back of my mind.

Concerning No Contact and the return of the ex, can it still work if after you have chased the guy on and off to get back together with you, but then you get your act together and do NC, but the ex still has your cell phone on which you pay for the cell plan, can it still work in getting him to come back to you? I guess what I am trying to ask in that question is confusing. My ex of two years dumped me and started going out with another girl two weeks after he broke up with me. During our relationship, I got him a cell phone which is attached to my plan, so that we could talk with ease without his parents constantly chasing him off the phone. When he broke up with me, he offered to give me the phone back. I told him to keep it for the time being becuase I still cared about him. Now, if I do NC faithfully but he still has my phone and is using it for calling his friends and the new gf (he is good about only using my free minutes), can NC still work in terms of him missing me, etc? He has been going out with this girl for about two months. I know who she is, and from what people tell me, she looks like me, with the exception that she has long hair. I still want the ex back, but want to move on too. He is going around claiming that we had a nasty breakup. So, with NC, can this situation work out? Also, one thing interesting to note, he saw me making out with a guy this past Sat at a convention. My ex was drunk and when I got up to go to the bathroom, he went and picked a fight with a mutual friend of ours because I was there (keep in mind mutual friend had told him that she invited me there and asked him if it was ok with him. He told her that he didnt care if I was there just as long as I didnt confront him or his new gf, try to start a fight, or follow him around. I didnt do any of the above. I just sat with the mutual friend, had a great time, and attracted the attention of some guys, and ended up making out with one of them. The ex blew up at the friend and created a scene, even when he was away from us. I wonder if he was jealous to see me make out with a guy. He shouldnt be, considering he has a new gf and he broke up with me.