Was I "rude" or "nasty" or "looking for a fight"?

[layla6]

I've been dating this man off and on for over 4 years. Here is a little back story and a conversation that led him to say that I was being rude and nasty in the conversation, and looking for a fight. It concerned him so much that the following day he let his mother read the conversation and then did not contact me for 5 days and cancelled the trip, without talking to me about it.  (I did not contact him during that time either.)

Backstory: I had spent last weekend at his house, before I left, he asked if we could both get on computers and research an area we were visiting in a couple of weeks for a one-day event, with the possibility of staying overnight there. I texted him when I got home at 5:53 pm, and he was already looking at things. He texted back telling me exactly how far it was from my house, that maybe we could camp, etc. I was literally carrying things in the house, taking out garbage, taking care of dogs, cats, chickens, unpacking things since I had been gone since Friday at 4:00 pm. At 6:30 he asked me to call him. So I did and he said he was having trouble finding places to only stay one night, would i be ok staying friday night too. so i agreed and he booked a place. He texted me at 7:45ish that he thought we needed to bring casual shoes, walking shoes and hiking shoes. I told him I didn’t have any hiking shoes, but I’d find some. I thought that was that. A room was booked and hiking shoes indicated walking trails, so that’s what I thought we were doing, then attending the event Sunday. At 7:53 he sent a link about kayaking, I was fixing dinner and didn’t open the link, just saw what it was. The rest of the complete conversation was:
8:45
T: Have you kayaked?
Me: No. Idk if I have the balance for that
T: lol. My sister kayaks most weekends. I’m sure you could. It looks like it would be an amazing adventure.
9:00:
T: Perhaps you’d have more fun if you plan the activities. We will be staying in mt Sterling Friday and Saturday checking out Sunday before noon then hanging at clay city till the thing at 4
Me: I’ll see what I can do
T: Thumbs up emoji

11:00
T: What you been up to this evening?
Me: Unpacked stuff and put away some laundry, watched the chickens for a little while, talked to my son when he got home from work, fixed some food & watched some funny memes & videos with him for a bit, found a tick on my back & then took a shower. Looked for deals on hiking boots. Found theres a drive-in in my sterling but haven’t found what movies they are showing that w/e. Starting watching tv about an hour ago
I’m getting sleepy now though
What have you been up to?
T: I gave up on our plan making session I thought we were gonna have this evening and started watching a movie. Goto bed if you’re tired.
Me: Sorry, didn’t know we had to plan everything out this evening when I had been gone all weekend.
        I will.
       Goodnight
T: I thought I had asked before you left off when you got home if we could take some time and get on the phone while researching stuff around there on both our computers. My bad I must have dreamed that up
Me: I didn’t catch the part where you meant we had to do it this evening. My bad
T: We don’t have to do anything. Stop saying you didn’t know we had to do it this evening. It’s two weeks away I just wanted to try and figure stuff out. I was excited about it, my bad.
Me: You’d already booked where to stay I didn’t know what else you wanted to plan
T: Goodnight
Me: Don’t tell me what to stop saying

 

[tattoobunnie]

OMG - Run.  Talk about baggage.

People who gaslight you about how you should know better, assume things like this, and disrespectful of your time, and then brings their mama into it, is not the right guy.

He sounds like a chore.

[Coily]

With what is presented here, I can't see where you did anything other than "disappoint" him by not hopping to plan the trip. It really seems like he is trying to cast his actions upon you, not a good look. Though that : "Me: Don’t tell me what to stop saying " does lend itself to his preconceived conclusion a fight was in the works.

After 4 years, is this the only time he's acted this way? Or is this routine?

Perhaps it's time to call this relationship, especially due to the on and off nature, and him being whiny.

[layla6]

Unfortunately it is a routine behavior. I feel like I'm being gaslighted often, but of course, part of that strategy is that it makes one doubt themselves. He goes on to say that I pretend I'm innocent and never do anything wrong... here he was planning a trip for me... and that I don't care about his feelings, etc. I think a mature person would have heard that I was busy doing things after being gone, and said "hey, baby, is there a time you think you can sit down and look at things with me?" And if he had done it that way, or in any way making it known to me that he wanted to plan other things that needed to be booked, I would have sat down and done that.

He heard that I wasn't excited, didn't know we HAD to plan things, and that I had been with him all weekend and needed a break from talking to him. Those were his own fears from feeling insecure. The whole "my bad" at the end of his messages made it seem like he wanted me to feel like I was doing something wrong.

When I said "Don't tell me to stop saying something" was not nice. That is the place where I did get mad. To me he was shutting down a conversation, where maybe we could have cleared things up.

 

[SooSad33]

31 minutes ago, layla6 said:

Me: Sorry, didn’t know we had to plan everything out this evening when I had been gone all weekend.
        I will.
       Goodnight
T: I thought I had asked before you left off when you got home if we could take some time and get on the phone while researching stuff around there on both our computers. My bad I must have dreamed that up

Him and his crappy sarcasm.  Shows he has NO patience?  Shheeesshhhh!

Sounds to me like he's got it planned out enough.  And YOU were quite busy all evening, did he even notice that?

Nope, should be left alone and no reason for a fight  - and he can grow up a little, eh?

 

8 minutes ago, layla6 said:

When I said "Don't tell me to stop saying something" was not nice. That is the place where I did get mad. To me he was shutting down a conversation, where maybe we could have cleared things up.

Like you said, it's routine behaviour.  IMO, with people like this, there is not much room for 'reasoning', right?

And I'd say people like this are emotionally draining 😕 .  

[Seraphim]

You weren’t rude or nasty. If he is like this all the time, time to reevaluate what this relationship brings to you. 

[smackie9]

He's so passive/aggressive......gross. Run for the hills!

[Coily]

23 minutes ago, layla6 said:

Unfortunately it is a routine behavior. I feel like I'm being gaslighted often, but of course, part of that strategy is that it makes one doubt themselves. He goes on to say that I pretend I'm innocent and never do anything wrong... here he was planning a trip for me... and that I don't care about his feelings, etc. I think a mature person would have heard that I was busy doing things after being gone, and said "hey, baby, is there a time you think you can sit down and look at things with me?" And if he had done it that way, or in any way making it known to me that he wanted to plan other things that needed to be booked, I would have sat down and done that.

He heard that I wasn't excited, didn't know we HAD to plan things, and that I had been with him all weekend and needed a break from talking to him. Those were his own fears from feeling insecure. The whole "my bad" at the end of his messages made it seem like he wanted me to feel like I was doing something wrong.

When I said "Don't tell me to stop saying something" was not nice. That is the place where I did get mad. To me he was shutting down a conversation, where maybe we could have cleared things up.

 

Wow. Hopefully this  is the straw the breaks the camels back.

[Kampuniform3]

These are my impressions of this:

- You don't seem to have as much enthusiasm for him as he has for you.

- The thought of spending time away somewhere with you was more important to him than it was for you.

- The lack of engagement gave the impression that the trip wasn't important to you. 

- Your ambivalence towards his planned activities was noted, so he hoped you'd make some suggestions about doing things you'd prefer instead. 

I really don't see too much here to get worked up about.  You don't seem that interested, and as you've stated, it's been on-and-off for four years, which says a lot  

I think if the roles were reversed, you'd have a different take on this. 

[MissCanuck]

2 hours ago, layla6 said:

I've been dating this man off and on for over 4 years

Why has it been on and off?

My strong impression is that there is deep resentment between you two, and this latest conversation is merely a symptom of the bigger problems. 

[Kwothe28]

Talk about overbearing. My dad is like that. It gives you "added pressure" and makes you feel like an idiot who cant do basic stuff. With emphasising on stuff who isnt even that important just to give you pressure and makes you feel inadequate. And how you must do everything how they say otherwise all is lost. Classic manipulation and gaslighting. That shoe stuff and him pressuring you about the whole trip reminds me on that.

And to not even talk to you by the end and just cancel the trip? That just shows how incapable he is for communicating without him dictating things. This all could be solved when you get together and plan everything in person. But that is how it is when you deal with somebody who is probably narcissistic. You are already on and off so dont commit there.Its not worthy of your time.

[Cherylyn]

Yes,  he gaslights.  He's very dramatic, too.  He's actually reminiscent of my sister,  unfortunately.  Some people are so complicated in such an ugly way. 

I will say that I've noticed with texting,  it's not as clear with communication and verbal expressions compared to in person and second best would be,  a phone chat.  In my experience,  if some people are not empathetic types on the other end,  texts have a tendency to end on a sour note.  This is exactly why I'm not a huge fan of texting especially if it's constant back 'n forth regarding something important such as planning or serious conversations.  It's easier for both sides to grow impatient and irritable.   

You were not rude,  nasty nor looking for a fight.  A gaslighter ALWAYS deflects by turning it around back to you as if you're the bad guy.  Gaslighting is manipulation and psychological warfare.  It's nothing I hadn't experienced before.  😡

I'll chime in with others.  You need to get rid of the guy.  He's a bad apple.  ☹️

[Wiseman2]

3 hours ago, layla6 said:

 he let his mother read the conversation and then did not contact me for 5 days and cancelled the trip, without talking to me about it.  

Does he live with his mother? How old is he?  Please don't have text conversations with someone who shows your conversations to his mother.

Unfortunately it seems he acts in a passive aggressive manner to sabotage things then make it look like you ruined it so he could go without you. Does he do that a lot? 

 

[Lambert]

four years on and off is a long time.  you might not be compatible, but too lonely to really cut the cord.

I would force this to be the permanent ending. Don't reach out at all. if he reaches out, thank him for the good times and all the good things, but there's no way I could continue with this.  it's nonsense. 

arguing over text, ignoring, telling his mom your problems... this is not a healthy relationship and it is holding you back from finding one. 

Sorry.  it still hurts and takes time but be strong.  you'll find better. 

[rainbowsandroses]

6 hours ago, MissCanuck said:

Why has it been on and off?

My strong impression is that there is deep resentment between you two, and this latest conversation is merely a symptom of the bigger problems. 

This^.  And what @Kampuniform3wrote. 

I sensed his resentnent pretty quickly upon reading, the below in particular. 

8 hours ago, layla6 said:

T: Have you kayaked?
Me: No. Idk if I have the balance for that.
T: lol. My sister kayaks most weekends. I’m sure you could. It looks like it would be an amazing adventure.
9:00:
T: Perhaps you’d have more fun if you plan the activities. 

What's in bold from him. That's resentment combined with a bit of sarcasm.

He wanted/needed you to be more enthusiastic about what he planned, more open to the adventure.  Instead of (in his mind) immediately launching into a negative - you don't have the balance for it.

Which he read as NO and took offense as he suggested it and thought it wouid be fun. 

You were NOT wrong but my sense is he's been feeling this way awhile, it's been stewing inside him and building.  Hence his over-the-top reaction now.

Be honest, are you into him?  Are you still excited about this relationship?   We all get busy, especially after a busy weekend away, but again in HIS mind, he may have felt you couldn't be bothered.

As for him, checking in with mom?  Stonewalling you for 5 days?   That is extremely immature. 

To answer your question, no you were not rude or nasty in the least, however sadly I do think this 4-year off/on relationship may have run its course for both of you. I'm sorry. 

[1a1a]

If I were to take this conversation in isolation I might, when you’re both calm, bring up that you felt like it didn’t go well and would he be willing to work out some better ways of communicating when one or the others needs aren’t being met? 
 

Like, you feel like you missed his excitement and enthusiasm for trip planning and in so disappointed him and you wish and hope in the future he could say up front ‘are you free to plan the trip tonight? ‘ and in turn when he got disappointed it felt like he started revising history (saying we had both agreed to plan at this time. Maybe you did but it didn’t land like that for me and I didn’t realise) and then shutting down the conversation with it being unresolved. Which, maybe that was the right thing to do to both take space and calm down but it would be much much kinder to say ‘can we put this down for now and pick it up when we’re both calm?’

[Jibralta]

18 hours ago, layla6 said:

8:45
T: Have you kayaked?
Me: No. Idk if I have the balance for that
T: lol. My sister kayaks most weekends. I’m sure you could. It looks like it would be an amazing adventure.
9:00:
T: Perhaps you’d have more fun if you plan the activities. We will be staying in mt Sterling Friday and Saturday checking out Sunday before noon then hanging at clay city till the thing at 4
Me: I’ll see what I can do
T: Thumbs up emoji

11:00
T: What you been up to this evening?
Me: Unpacked stuff and put away some laundry, watched the chickens for a little while, talked to my son when he got home from work, fixed some food & watched some funny memes & videos with him for a bit, found a tick on my back & then took a shower. Looked for deals on hiking boots. Found theres a drive-in in my sterling but haven’t found what movies they are showing that w/e. Starting watching tv about an hour ago
I’m getting sleepy now though
What have you been up to?
T: I gave up on our plan making session I thought we were gonna have this evening and started watching a movie. Goto bed if you’re tired.
Me: Sorry, didn’t know we had to plan everything out this evening when I had been gone all weekend.
        I will.
       Goodnight
T: I thought I had asked before you left off when you got home if we could take some time and get on the phone while researching stuff around there on both our computers. My bad I must have dreamed that up
Me: I didn’t catch the part where you meant we had to do it this evening. My bad
T: We don’t have to do anything. Stop saying you didn’t know we had to do it this evening. It’s two weeks away I just wanted to try and figure stuff out. I was excited about it, my bad.
Me: You’d already booked where to stay I didn’t know what else you wanted to plan
T: Goodnight
Me: Don’t tell me what to stop saying

Maybe he starts it, but you both dish it back and forth pretty readily. If you don't like this dynamic, you have to stop participating in it. If he says something snarky, like, "Perhaps you’d have more fun if you plan the activities," don't play coy with, "I'll see what I can do." Be specific and direct with what you want:

"Ok. I'll look into that tomorrow (or Thursday, or whenever)"

Or:

"Kayaking actually does sound like fun. I'll try it."

Or:

"You make the plans. I'll have fun with whatever you pick."

Yes, it was passive aggressive of him to say "I gave up on our plan making session I thought we were gonna have this evening and started watching a movie. Go to bed if you’re tired."

But your response ("Sorry, didn’t know we had to plan everything out this evening when I had been gone all weekend.") was equally so.

You could have neutralized the whole conflict (instead of feeding into it) by saying, "I'm sorry. I'm just a lot more tired than I expected. Can we pick this up tomorrow?"

The fact is, you're both looking for a fight. 

[layla6]

17 hours ago, MissCanuck said:

Why has it been on and off?

My strong impression is that there is deep resentment between you two, and this latest conversation is merely a symptom of the bigger problems. 

Your impression is correct.

I had to think long and hard about why it has been on and off. it has been on because we have so much in common and often have a really good time together. he can be incredibly generous. i felt from the beginning that we had a deep soul connection. But, why have we been "off"? He says it is because I don't communicate. I say that the times we have broken up were a result of him having had a plan in mind, and I may or may not know this plan, but if I do not go exactly along the script he has planned out, then I am being unreasonable and he generally resorts to name calling and telling me how good he is to me and how could I be so uncaring. Then it usually turns to him accusing me of cheating, which honestly is not in my character. I have plenty of flaws, but cheating is not one of them. So, yes, your impression of resentment is spot on.

[MissCanuck]

You two need to break up for good: 

This obviously is not working and you are not compatible. 

[layla6]

16 hours ago, Wiseman2 said:

Does he live with his mother? How old is he?  Please don't have text conversations with someone who shows your conversations to his mother.

Unfortunately it seems he acts in a passive aggressive manner to sabotage things then make it look like you ruined it so he could go without you. Does he do that a lot? 

 

This man is in his 50s! He doesn't live with his mother, they are close, and she and I get along very well. He said his mother always tells him if he has done something wrong. But he would had a fit if I let a friend or family member read private texts. And this forum is the first time I have shared texts with anyone, as I seek unbiased feedback.

[layla6]

1 hour ago, Jibralta said:

Maybe he starts it, but you both dish it back and forth pretty readily. If you don't like this dynamic, you have to stop participating in it. If he says something snarky, like, "Perhaps you’d have more fun if you plan the activities," don't play coy with, "I'll see what I can do." Be specific and direct with what you want:

"Ok. I'll look into that tomorrow (or Thursday, or whenever)"

Or:

"Kayaking actually does sound like fun. I'll try it."

Or:

"You make the plans. I'll have fun with whatever you pick."

Yes, it was passive aggressive of him to say "I gave up on our plan making session I thought we were gonna have this evening and started watching a movie. Go to bed if you’re tired."

But your response ("Sorry, didn’t know we had to plan everything out this evening when I had been gone all weekend.") was equally so.

You could have neutralized the whole conflict (instead of feeding into it) by saying, "I'm sorry. I'm just a lot more tired than I expected. Can we pick this up tomorrow?"

The fact is, you're both looking for a fight. 

Thank you. I can see your point that my answers were short, because I was busy and I thought he knew I was busy, but I could have worded things better.

[kehratha]

4 minutes ago, layla6 said:

This man is in his 50s! 

Wow, he sounds like an immature, manipulating and passive-aggressive man.

You don't bend quickly to his desires, he's dismissing you.

It's very hard to fit exactly in someone's profile, especially over a certain age.

I don't think you are picking up fights, but I guess is not easy for you to try to please him all the time, therefore you snap. 

[layla6]

12 hours ago, rainbowsandroses said:

This^.  And what @Kampuniform3wrote. 

I sensed his resentnent pretty quickly upon reading, the below in particular. 

What's in bold from him. That's resentment combined with a bit of sarcasm.

He wanted/needed you to be more enthusiastic about what he planned, more open to the adventure.  Instead of (in his mind) immediately launching into a negative - you don't have the balance for it.

Which he read as NO and took offense as he suggested it and thought it wouid be fun. 

You were NOT wrong but my sense is he's been feeling this way awhile, it's been stewing inside him and building.  Hence his over-the-top reaction now.

Be honest, are you into him?  Are you still excited about this relationship?   We all get busy, especially after a busy weekend away, but again in HIS mind, he may have felt you couldn't be bothered.

As for him, checking in with mom?  Stonewalling you for 5 days?   That is extremely immature. 

To answer your question, no you were not rude or nasty in the least, however sadly I do think this 4-year off/on relationship may have run its course for both of you. I'm sorry. 

Thank you. No, I am not excited about the relationship, because I am anxious that things will go badly. Which is almost the same as expecting them to go badly and that might be adding fuel to making things go badly. I am surprised when things go well, which they do still do.

[boltnrun]

Why would you want to continue in a relationship with a man who calls you names? What could he possibly do that would negate this borderline abusive type behavior? Unless you dish it right back to him and also call him names. 

[Batya33]

All well and good to tell yourself about a deep soul connection -I've never heard of two people feeling deeply connected for healthy reasons and having regularly bad communication.  Doesn't go together -neither do you two.