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Batya33 last won the day on July 10

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  1. You wrote a lot about what "girls" wish for and about societal pressures. The wedding is the ceremony, the vows. The rest is the wedding reception or parties celebrating the marriage. Two very different things. Of course people want different size wedding receptions and parties -or none of the above but that's not the wedding. The wedding is the vows. Some people write their own, or have a religious officiant or not but that's the wedding. I think you were describing "girls" who wish for a big party and big dress because of societal messages as if they're passive sheep following the lead. And that a man can given them their wish. If a woman or man (girls and boys can't marry other than in specific instances where the parents allow) wants a big party or to be center of attention etc that's totally fine - not judging. I didn't' like the way you made it so gender specific and such the rule that all "girls" want big parties and a fancy bridal gown because of what they see in the media. I don't think that's true and I don't regard women in that passive way. My special feeling was based on my vows and getting married not from how we chose to celebrate. That was fun and special too but very different than and separate from the special part of getting married
  2. Also please don’t tell yourself you “don’t understand”. My son didn’t understand the concept of marriage when he was a child (for example he assumed all brides had a baby in their belly just like his mother did) and when I was child I didn’t as I wanted to marry my daddy when I was like 5. You don’t want to get married. You know that. You “understand “ what marriage is you just lack the emotional desire to commit in marriage to your girlfriend and in general you lack the emotional desire to marry in general. Now it’s possible you could meet someone who knocked your socks off so that you couldn’t imagine life without her and this feeling triggered a desire to commit in marriage but that’s not as typical as knowing in general you’d like to marry the right person then meeting the right person. even if you “understood “ how others conceptualize marriage your title question would be answered. But not your real question. Or questions. also if your parents or close friends were or are married that can influence your concept of marriage. I don’t buy the whole societal pressures to be a fancy shmancy bride as “marriage “. Certainly it’s easier to be a couple in today’s world. Easier to be a married couple in today’s world. We’re inundated with images of brides and rings and wedding receptions and honeymoons. but the vast majority of adults know exactly why they’re getting married and are not brainwashed whether it’s for love or legalities or a green card or some other reason. Or they have the big party because mom and dad are paying. But they know. I also think living together before marriage is not essential especially if kids are planned right after marriage. I’d have learned nothing relevant and had unrealistic expectations had we lived together first as 3 months later we were sharing a one bedroom with a newborn. And all his “stuff “. Please do let this woman go if she wants marriage.
  3. I changed my mind from reading the other posts. I think his apology was lame and worthless/useless.
  4. For me it was about the substance of the vows. Not the ceremony or who was there, and I was a woman when I married not a girl and I was "bombarded" but I'm no passive sheep - I make my own decisions. I know of men who want big parties, I know of several women who plan much more for the party than the marriage, who want to marry more because of the big party than the person they are marrying. Ick. We don't all wish that. I wished for a person I was reasonably sure and excited to marry and who felt the same for me. Who I was in love with and who I saw as my lifelong partner in crime. And who felt the same for me. I wore a blue dress at my wedding because I was having a boy. It was $100 on the maternity shop sale rack. My shoes were $200 and I told the salesperson no high heels as I was already waddling with the baby bump. I borrowed my veil. My in-laws opened their small home to us for our ten guests. My wish - to be happy and excited I was taking these vows. I was. It was the most magical and natural feeling I've ever had. That was my wish. Not to be the center of attention and expand the wedding to all the other activities -when my friends started getting married in the late 1980s there may have been an engagement party, shower, maybe a rehearsal dinner but not to the extent as now, not over the top, not where the bridesmaids have to spend $$$$ on dresses, party planning, activities all to be spread all over Facebook. Look it's just me. I know, some women (girls typically don't marry -they're too young) want all the fanfare -not because they're passive clueless follow the leader sheep. They really do or they want to please family. I am being judgey but only because your description make too many women (girls??) look like airheads. Most are not and I suggest that men don't marry someone like that because marriage should be a partnership with two reasonably assertive, independent, mature and intelligent people -whether academically intelligent, emotionally intelligent, both whatever.
  5. What's with this tens of thousands of dollars? Marriage is a wedding ceremony where you exchange vows. It costs some money to get a marriage license and perhaps to have a religous ceremony where you pay the officiant. The party to celebrate the marriage can range from hundreds to thousands of dollars. I've seen people spend that much on commitment ceremonies, bridal showers, engagement parties, - not just wedding receptions. Nothing to do with marriage. I advise not to get married if you think it's just a piece of paper. I don't think it's relevant for me or anyone to explain the "concept" of marriage. You are not going to see it any more than a piece of paper just because people share other perspectives. I do think the piece of paper helps a lot for purposes of having a child and buying property but only if the other person also sees it like you as a waste of money and just a legal contract. For me personally being married (12 years now) means the world to me and my husband. I love that we took marriage vows legally and religiously, I love that we have our son together in a family where we're married. He loves it too. I love that we have a marital commitment. It solidifies our commitment. My wedding including my clothing and shoes and the officiant and lunch for 10 people - our guests -cost $1,500 in a major city in 2008. It was an amazing, magical day. And I don't feel like I need to explain the "concept of marriage" to any adult -my son, yes -he's had questions including whether two men or two women can marry, why we got married, etc (and he was there, I was pregnant, he knows that too). In fact, 11 years before our wedding date we had a big wedding reception planned. I really disliked the planning but probably because we were not right for each other at that time. But still wouldn't have liked the planning, the spending all that $$ on a 5 hour party, all the artificial/shallow parts of it -not my thing. I had a traditional wedding dress for that one -that was nice but again not related to why I wanted to marry. We then broke up for almost 8 years. If you need it explained in order to convince you to tie the knot then don't marry. Marriage is hard enough without being dragged or prodded to the altar. Certainly if you meet someone who just wants the legal benefits of marriage and you're both on that exact wavelength nothing wrong with it. Certainly I like the legal benefits as well. I like the protections it gives to me, our son, our assets. Not why I got married. Do I love my engagement ring and wedding band? Heck yes. Especially since my wedding band is a family heirloom and the engagement ring is beautiful. Not why I got married. You and your girlfriend are incompatible on this major life decision. I'd let her go and find someone who is enthusiastic about marrying her and also about marriage in general (but more the former, all else equal). Good luck!
  6. Sorry. There's no trying. Just doing and not doing. Either you choose to react, or react a certain way, or you don't. For example when I feel myself getting frustrated with my son I already have an arsenal of tools in reaction choices -because I work on that in advance. For me those tools include: walking away/putting in headphones sometimes, washing my hands and noticing the bubbles, stretching out the fingers on my hand or placing them on a flat surface to redirect energy, telling my son "I am feeling frustrated and I cannot be with your right now if you continue to ____". Sometimes I do 4-7-8 breathing. I was terrified last week as we drove through a blinding rain and hail storm. But my son could see me sitting next to him in the back and I knew I had to stay calm for him. I had to. Not "trying" - I wanted to freak out, cry, shake, etc but he needed me to be his rock. So did my husband who was driving -he needed silence, calm, to focus. So I went to my arsenal of tools and chose 4-7-8 breathing and we held hands ,but calmly so he couldn't feel how terrified I was. No trying because it was the moment where I had to show him I wasn't going to freak out and give in to the terrifying situation. It worked. It was really hard but it worked. Because I had my arsenal of tools ready to choose a reaction. I don't give myself "well I tried not to yell/raise my voice but it just got too hard'. Nope. Doing or not doing. But you have to have the tools/mantras ready in advance that you go to right away.
  7. Not really - I mean that his feelings of security don't match the objective progression he sees - and this is either because he needs counseling and/or because beneath the surface what seems to be really isn't, or the progression hasn't been long enough yet since this is a new relationship.
  8. I'm glad he apologized. I think you two should stay away from each other. I hope the apology helps. He may have been concerned about coming by given your emotional state. I agree he should have tried to check on you. I'm glad though he acknowledged that he hurt you.
  9. What is the purpose of sharing living space? Do you have the same purposes? Is it to progress emotionally in the relationship or for convenience or what?
  10. Feelings aren't facts and often don't make sense. Two separate things here. Yes things are objectively progressing. But your emotions and ability to notice your feelings yet choose a reaction that permits the progression hasn't caught up yet partly because you could benefit from therapy and partly because this is a new relationship where already you two have been at odds on basic issues like trust and your live together dealbreakers. A lot for a brand new relationship to take.
  11. No, not ok at all to this extent. I mean a one off comment on a second date -okkkk - but the handsy stuff and basically treating you like an object to get his thrills - not ok at all. It reminds me of being assaulted when I was in my 20s on a subway where a stranger did that to me and at first I could not get away as it was so very crowded. He's not an actual stranger but close enough. It's gross. Please don't see him again -talking to him won't be sufficient IMHO.
  12. I really like how open and thoughtful she was with you. Yes the automatic thoughts are pesky and over the decades I've had to deal with those but in different contexts. But yes I can relate and I'm sorry you're experiencing that. I came up with tools -and still do - to make sure those thoughts stay on the periphery and do not ruin the moment or my time or whatever. I had to do that a lot the last 5 days while we were on a road trip. Mostly with great success. I wish you success. I understand her concerns but on balance it's impressive how she handled her concerns and sharing them with you.
  13. It's not ghosting -silence =lack of interest. When I dated for about 24 years on and off I preferred to hear nothing after a first date than some flowery "you are amazing but I can't pursue a relationship /didn't feel a click" - Ghosting to me is when you're dating someone for a longer period of time - more like 4 dates or more -a month or more -and the person doesn't want to see you anymore but doesn't let you know and just disappears.
  14. But you can ponder this while keeping your distance. Be firm and knowledgeable about your personal standards and values and if someone crosses the line walk away. Because then by definition it doesn’t matter what you did or didn’t do. Include in your personal standards how you treat others. That way if someone mistreats you it won’t occur to you to question if you deserved it. You didn’t deserve to have him drive away knowing you could get hurt. But if you say you never want to hurt anyone consider that it can be hurtful to be confronted in one’s own home. For example I decided to distance myself from a woman who has been trying to pressure me to invite her to my home because she says she’s very lonely. The last time she crossed the line by asking again after I explained the pandemic and logistical reasons - also pandemic related -why she couldn’t come to my home. Also it was inappropriate of her to invite herself over. I’d suggested a number of times meeting elsewhere. I am not questioning at all what I did to deserve her pushy and disrespectful behavior. And I chose to protect myself by distancing myself. Certainly I’ll consider if I was too open and giving with a person who seems unstable but I won’t consider whether i deserve to be treated disrespectfully. You may be using your temptation to analyze your “part” in receiving disrespectful treatment as a rationalization to stay in a one sided relationship. Because you’re afraid of being alone and would rather settle for scraps than be on your own. To the extent that you’d show up and keep track of text responses and go to all those lengths. I would think most people who respect themselves would have been long gone if they were treated that way long before going to those lengths.
  15. I think he was scared of being found out. Not of you.
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