joyce1412

She said if we can't work it through the phone, how are we going to make things work in person? is that true? Isn't it cruel to break it just through the phone? If i 're-ask' her to be considerate and wait for me to come and see her before breaking up (when we get togther, i'll try to re-live the great memories instead), will that make any difference? yeah, it sucks to be broken up with on the phone, it happened to me, as i was in an LDR as well. but what was she going to do? fly out to your country, tell you "it's over" and fly back? as harsh as a phone breakup is, that's usually how it's gotta go in an LDR. it might have been nice if you guys had made a last-ditch effort to see each other before the breakup...to see if there was anything left, and to talk. but sadly that didn't happen. i think if you asked to see her now, especially using that line of reasoning (that she should "be considerate") she'll only resent you. and she's going to sense what you're trying to do there, and instinctively want space instead. and yes, i think she's right about you needing to be able to work as a couple on the phone. that's going to be your primary method of communication for a long time, and if she dreads calling you then neither of you would be happy.

haha, good for you. i know what it's like to give a LOT to a relationship, that's for sure. i was willing to do it for this guy because i loved him so much, but let me tell you, i climbed a lot of mountains trying to make it work. i can't say i've been able to maintain that attitude consistently, but i'm trying. i asked for this meeting with my ex, so sure in my reasoning for wanting to do it, and now i keep questioning myself. i don't want to do it for the wrong reasons. i don't want to do it if i know deep down i'm using it as a tool to get closer to him, because i know i shouldn't be putting my focus there. nothing i do will make him feel for me and make him want to commit, so i shouldn't bother. i used to be sure and i'm not sure anymore. i asked for this meeting, and want to commit to it, but i'm going to think a lot more about this. we'll see.

that's good to hear, that's great that you're together and presumably happy! i don't know if i really believe in NC anymore. i don't necessarily put any more stock in another method, i just feel like in my life i've never seen NC bring a (healthy) couple back together. pretty much everyone i know stayed friends if they got back together.

first things first: you guys are right about planning what to say. it implies expectations about the meeting itself, and i should keep expectations really low at this point. like i said, i'm just trying to avoid a friggin' heart attack if he asks me difficult questions. and if he asks to be friends, i wanted a polite way to sort of evade the question, i'm not looking to outright shut him down. but if no one has any suggestions, i'll just fly by the seat of my pants. Now, in either case, expect a response from him, and one that might surprise you. So make sure of yourself and don't waver. I have been on the receiving end of one of these letters before too, and let me just say...it resulted in me flying accross the country on 12 hours notice, driving a Dodge Neon rental car through a blizzard for 5 hours in snow up to my knees, showing up at her house with the said letter and a dozen roses, and said, "You're not getting rid of me this easily. I love you, let's work this out"...lest I digress though... So yeah, I'd go the letter vs. meeting route for your "soulful cleansing" here... you seem to imply that there's something that's more effective about a letter, that it would be more emotionally engaging . is there a reason why you think this? i'd like to know. there are a couple reasons i was motivated to do the in-person meeting after initially thinking i shouldn't go there. back when we were together i once sent my ex an email about an issue that frustrated me and was really important to me. i sent it late at night because it was really bothering me, so i could get it off my chest and go to sleep. he read it and never brought it up, and didn't reply to it either. and this is coming from a guy who would talk about ANYTHING with me in person, we could talk about why i was pissed at him for something until we were both blue in the face. so not only is he prone to wanting to ignore written messages, i felt as if the only way i could FEEL like what i said was penetrating in him was to meet. hearing something in person, from someone who looks you in the eyes as it is said, is the most effective way to get a point accross. anytime i thought about writing it in a letter, it just didn't translate properly. i don't want my tone to be misunderstood, i feel like anything i write will seem weepy or dramatic. and i feel like slipping him something on a piece of paper has about half the power of just telling him. and really, it's very possible that i would get no response from him with a letter. and THAT would drive me NUTS. the idea behind the meeting was more about letting me say what i wanted to say and knowing he'd hear it, not so much about what HE had to say in return. and like i said, he broke up with me on the phone. his method made the breakup really hard to deal with in my head. the guy went into denial mode after the breakup to deal with it and to move on. and trust me kellbell, i know he's doing his darndest to move on. do i think he's picked an effective to do it, by making me the bad guy? no, because that's not who i am. at least if we meet in person i can establish myself as the mature party and allow the air to be cleared so he has a harder time turning me into the problem, and i get to feel good about myself. also, to my credit, i have never imagined this meeting playing out in ANY way that has him re-declaring his undying love for me. i know the meeting will end with him only partially registering the message (because he won't be ready to process it all) and i won't be hearing from him for a looooong while, and i'm okay with that. anyone have any arguments for me? i'd be into hearing them.

hahaha, guilty! ridiculous overanalyzing is my forte, you know. that said, i AM interested in hearing others' opinions on this stuff... even IF i wanted to get back with my ex, i've realized that it will do me no good to throw my efforts into getting him back. in fact, i realize that this meeting may have a detrimental effect on whether or not he wants to be with me. it could also have a positive effect, but point is, i'm not doing it for him. i want this meeting for me, and even if i had a hunch that it wasn't going to work in my favor for "getting him back," i would do it anyway, because i've decided it is what's best for me. like i said, i regret all the times that i told someone we couldn't remain in each other's lives anymore, friends and lovers mostly. i ended up going back on my word because i missed their company and truly valued it, and/or felt like a jerk for talking so much crap about how i didn't want them anymore. i have always, always regretted deliberately and overtly closing the door on people i once loved, so past experience tells me i shouldn't close the door on my ex, i should leave it open for possibility. i totally agree that i should disappear for a while, i know that's what is best for me and for any kind of relationship we might have. i'm going complete NC after this meeting. you have my word on that, frisco...you relationship cop, you! i guess i'm concerned with how i should respond to such queries as whether or not we can be 'friends' because i'd like to avoid the alluring "stuttering/deer in headlights" look if they come up.

i think the other methods that are suggested could work. as it's been said, total NC is more for your own healing and less about getting the ex to want you again. i suggested the aforementioned plan because it seems that some cut off their dumpers and go NC, but then panic later, thinking, "what if she thinks i don't care!? should i call her and let her know why i did it!? should i ask her out to encourage her again!?" this lets her know on NO UNCERTAIN TERMS what you want and why you are taking this extreme action. you guys are talking now, she has stayed rather close, so if she decides she wants you again, she will have no problem getting in touch with you if she decides she wants to get back together. you don't have to treat NC as if it is severing the ties between you two or that this will drive her away. plus, if she's a woman who tends toward the dramatic, she could "freak out" at you for being manipulative or inconsistent. if you're plain about what you're doing and why you're doing it, you can bow out with no regrets knowing that you didn't know anything wrong and that you made it CRYSTAL CLEAR you'd be willing to get back with her. she can't blame you, and you won't blame yourself later. win-win in my opinion. camarojoe is suggesting LC, not NC. this puts your emotions more at risk, in my opinion. try to think as realistically as possible about the breakup; put yourself in her shoes and try, just TRY, to take the hard line with yourself: does this woman REALLY want you? do you think she's really going to put a full-faith effort into rekindling the relationship with you? take your answer into account, and then you simply have to figure out what you're willing to risk/lose.

great! sounds like you are taking control of your life, and sounds like you know what action to take if getting back your things really becomes problematic. i feel so sorry for those who lived with their exes or are going through divorces, the complication of shared material possessions is just that--SO COMPLICATED, and so difficult to deal with in an already trying time. you've got a lot of powerful weapons up your sleeve. not only are you coping well and being honest with yourself (unlike your ex), but you have a lot of great people on your side. not to mention the education and life outlook you possess will definitely lend themselves to you having an awesome life. veeery helpful in at this time, during this painful and drawn-out battle with your ex.

oh, and for the record, my general plan is to be polite, my regular bubbly self, make the small talk for a little bit, and then talk about some of the current issues. i don't plan on being accusational or bitter, i am just going to explain that i knew about certain actions that he took and that i felt they were inappropriate and hurtful. my friends and some of the other members have helped me come to the conclusion that he is being mean because he needs to have a distorted version of me in his mind to get over the relationship--he is in denial. i felt that being honest and standing up for myself but NOT being angry or accusational would be key in not only getting him to hear me out, but making it harder for him to pin me down as "difficult," or the "problem" in the relationship. by getting my feelings out i'd also be able to let go of some of my bitterness, and feel like i was working to cap things off on a good note, which would help me heal.

my ex and i are meeting next week, a meeting initiated by me. we had a bad breakup and he has been acting very juvenile and even hurtful since the breakup (which is strange because he was the one who broke up with me, and when he made his final decision i did not fight him to change his mind). the way i prefaced asking to meet with him was by saying that our last conversation was "less than cordial," and that it seemed there has been "bad blood" between us since then--"and i'm not sure WHY there is bad blood between us"--so i wanted to clear the air, get some coffee with him, and just talk. he was polite on the phone and very easily agreed to meet when he came back into town. i am going into this meeting with the intent on some amount of closure. i know i will not get all the "closure" i want, but there are definitely things that need to be addressed, and since we broke up on the phone i felt as if things should be capped off in person when we both simmered down. FYI, there are a lot of other reasons that might explain why my ex is being a jerk, but some of my friends seem to think it is his jealousy that i have been dating a few people since the breakup two months ago. i am currently dating a guy, it's FAR from serious and i'm quite honestly not that into him, a big reason being that he is only in my town for the duration of the summer, but we are dating. so my first question is, if the topic comes up, would you guys recommend that i say that i am "seeing someone," that i am just "dating," or give him no information at all? i am trying to be very rational about it, i am not waiting for us to get back together because i know the odds are against me, and i'm not even sure i would get back with him even if the opportunity presented itself. still, i am not looking to drive him away, or alienate him. i just want to leave the possibilities for us being together open, because if there's one thing i've learned in all this, it's that you should never "rule anyone out" in life--friends, family, lovers, anyone (of course, provided that they haven't been abusive, etc.). in the past i have been known to try to "cut people out of my life" and i have always regretted it. and on that latter note, how would you recommend i respond if he asked if i want to be 'friends'? thanks in advance guys, i'd also welcome any other suggestions you guys have for handling this meeting.

you might try being straight with her and telling her that you're not interested in talking to her unless she is 100% certain she wants to get back together. because if she's not totally interested in being with you, then she's not worth it to begin with. and if she's not really interested, it's time for you to go complete NC and move on. i think this is a totally fair way to go, because you're making it clear to her what you want (this way she can't freak out at you for cutting her off without any warning) and that she must commit to you to stay in your life.

better karma, how did that go? did you do NC?

in my life experience, yes, i've seen women take their guys back much more than the other way around. if i had to generalize, i guess i would just say that women are more sympathetic, and also rely more heavily on emotions than rationality. ah, the curses of my gender. and as far as men my age go, i think a lot of men leave their relationships and then get caught up in being bachelors, and don't want to go back to the old ball 'n chain. women statistically prioritize relationships over their careers, whereas for men it's vice versa. so thereforeeee, having a relationship is, for women, simply more important, so that might get them to go back into relationships that a men wouldn't be up for trying again. all huge generalizations, but you get the idea.

it sounds like your husband is still kind of in the same place as he was before (i remember your past posts). but regular or semi-regular positive interactions will probably do some good. this sounds truly difficult, it sounds like it's not only the relationship he's having problems with, but the whole family-centered lifestyle...clinical depression is just so crippling. congratulations, i'm glad it went well for you.

first of all, about your stuff--do you have any friends who are lawyers? i know my roommate and i were having trouble with a voyeuristic neighbor, and her lawyer father talked about sending him some papers for a restraining order just to scare him a little. maybe, as long as this isn't very costly to you, you could have some documents prepared threatening legal action if he doesn't give your stuff back. he doesn't sound like the world's smartest man, i think any threat of legal action would not only confuse him, but scare the crap out of him! i'd be willing to bet he doesn't know the legal process and would just fork over your stuff. don't worry about whatever he's saying about you, i bet it's clear to EVERYONE what a jerk he is. and as for anyone who believes him, who CARES what they think, they obviously don't have a lot going on upstairs either. on another practical note--make sure he is keeping up with the payments for the harley and tahoe! you don't want it to affect your credit or end up having to handle the payments. now THAT would definitely make you bitter. i'd recommend investigating this in whatever way you can. i know that he probably won't make it easy for you, but your finances and thus your freedom are on the line. it's natural to feel humiliated and heartbroken, and even to miss him. this guy wasn't the spawn of satan, i'm sure he did make you feel good at least some of the time, and i'm sure you shared some good moments. he's not totally evil. but when you think of the 'good times,' try mentally counteracting it by imagining something crappy he did for every good thing. this will get your head in the right place.

this all rings very familiar to me. my traveling boyfriend first brought up breaking up with me after i had a freak-out over "hating his career." it was totally a momentary feeling, so i felt like SUCH an * * * making a big deal about it and having it bring break-up talk. but in my ex's case, he told me later that he had been thinking about breaking up for a long time already. i'd guess he was probably already thinking that it was maybe not working, and then your single freak-out kind of pushed him over the edge, like a sign it wasn't gonna work out. still, anyone who was truly into you would have gone to the ends of the earth to make sure you could stay together. again, i'd recommend very openly enjoying your life--your active and full life. maybe you two can get to a more comfortable place and then you can let him know that you would be living this life if you were with him, too. i know guilt was a big thing for my boyfriend, he didn't want to have to apologize for his lifestyle, and he shouldn't have had to. i simply did not accept his career even though i always knew it would be like that, and by the time i got to that realization it was too late. (not that that was our only problem, but it was certainly a big factor.) in this time away, i'd also recommend you reevaluate whether you DO want to make this work. i know you do now, but it's possible you could still be spending a significant amount of time away from each other, so use that time to make sure you're comfortable with a guy who's gone this much. i didn't want to admit it right after the breakup, but i finally had to conclude that i really wasn't as happy as i could be with a man who was always away.

i have to say, though, my ex was/is a very sensitive guy. what do you make of someone like that going "mean"?

ooh, best of luck! i know...it's crazy to think of all the people who are hurting. but in a way it's comforting. it's the human condition, almost everyone goes through a painful separation with a lover. it unites us all. again, my thoughts are with ya, beautiful!

i know how you feel, my ex is a musician too! strange, strange lifestyle, eh? but never be jealous of his new woman if she's a groupie. they're a dime a dozen. or a half-penny a dozen.

hahahahaha not an altogether TERRIBLE idea...but risky.

She also doesnt thrust me cause i said: i "think" i wouldn't cheat on her but deep inside i sure know i would never do it cause she is the one i loved for so long and always will be. I said to her i "think" because youre never sure what will happen and you have to stay realistic because it happens everyday. Otherwise it would be a lie. Right? sorry dude, but that's SO the wrong answer. i wouldn't stay with a guy who said that to me no matter how much i was into him. you always have control over your actions. there are really people in this world who CAN say, "no, i KNOW would never cheat on you" because they know how damaging it is and refuse to hurt the people they love. after all, you wouldn't say, "i THINK i would never strangle my neighbor's cat...but who knows? anything can happen!" you just DON'T DO IT. period.

i don't understand, did he send you a request? if so, add him, you don't want to risk offending him. but if he hasn't asked already, just leave it be and don't add him yourself. play it cool.

ladyj, i thought i'd mention one more thing. someone else said it on this board that we all fear that our exes are going to ride off into the sunset with someone new, and for some reason i think we also think/fear that somehow, they're going to work out all their own issues along the way, and live happily ever after with the next one. however, your ex immediately went to a new woman, and made two mistakes: 1. not taking any time alone to reflect on what is wrong with HIMSELF and 2. apparently blaming everything on you. he has not used the breakup as an opportunity to grow whatsoever. and--surprise, surprise--he is almost certain to have the EXACT SAME ISSUES with her as he did with you. i have personal experience to back this up. we weren't in a relationship, but i had a guy basically ditch me for another girl, the same guy i spoke about earlier who took me for granted. i was inconsolable, and thought that since he picked her she must have the magic recipe for making him happy, that she had something that i didn't. well, he broke up with her about six months later, and months after THAT he and i sort of made up. it's taken us a couple years to be true friends again. and trust me, i love the guy, but i have to say--the same problems still plague him. he's juvenile, moody, never takes responsibility for anything, and doesn't take control of his life, thus causing him to experience continual bouts of depression. not even his new woman could solve his problems and force him into growing. and believe you me, i thought this girl had it ALL: gorgeous, ambitious, kind, everything you could ask for in a girlfriend. still, she didn't do it for him, because HIS PROBLEMS WERE HIS OWN. the dumpers who go into denial and/or start to live crazy lifestyles immediately after their breakups--and i believe your ex is doing both of these things--are pretty much destined to repeat their mistakes indefinitely. believe me on this one. and once again...thank god you got out now!

ah, icemotoboy, so full of knowledge. the first thing you said rings really true to me. it has brought me to realizing yet another reason why my ex is being a jerk to me. i think he would have liked to feel like our relationship would work, but he eventually came to the realization that he didn't want to do it while he is out on the road as much as he is now. i know he WANTED it to work, but FELT like it didn't. he's a perfectionist, and i'm a reminder that he failed in something that he wanted. plus, i know he hasn't just STOPPED CARING about me, and as others pointed out, the breakup, and by extension ME, are reminders that he hurt someone he cared about, and hurt her badly. i think a lot of dumpers feel like they wished their exes didn't exist. i know i felt that about someone i dumped, felt it for years even. i hated how much i had wavered with him, been hot and cold in my interactions with him, and eventually broke his heart. ah yes, true character IS taking the hard road. right now, truth, justice, and honor aren't things that my ex is concerned with. he wants to be free of a relationship, unfettered, able to party as he wishes (maybe even hooking up with groupies, EEK). i haven't spoken to him much, i've only heard bits and pieces about his life, but it doesn't sound like a very worthwhile, deep, or virtous life to me. i have no doubt he is acting out as a result of being a free man now, but on the other hand, thank god i got out when i did, right? i can't help but feel the pangs of regret even as i gradually detach myself from him--wanting him back, and wishing none of this ever happened. but it seems like i'm on my way to leaving him behind.

hahahaha. okay, i have to admit, i was thinking that, too. but sometimes when someone says something negative about the ex you're still pining over, you only want to defend him. and i was not about to let her defend him!

indeed, great post! today i found myself telling my friend who has recently broken up with her boyfriend the same line, about how it's probably good that he's not everything she hoped. i plagiarized you!