Tinder Review Turns into Epiphany/Rant

[superfan]

I think the problems of OLD are pretty simple - and they can be equally challenging for men and women.

 

On the "looks" front. While women might be pickier when it comes to things like height (not myself personally, but that seems to be most men's experience so who am I to discount it?), men can be equally as choosy when it comes to weight.

 

God forbid if you are an overweight female online. If you are lucky, you will get the dudes messaging you who ONLY want sex (and they usually do so with overweight women because they assume they are too desperate to care how a guy treats her). Relationships though? Forget about it. If you are overweight you might as well give up on OLD sights.

 

And you know what? Like height, weight is a preference and so you can't really blame anybody for having it. The difference between online and in person is that online, ALL you have is the physical picture and a few lines of text to tell you who the person is.

 

It's enough to discount someone right away if need be because there are no other factors to consider.

 

You meet a guy or girl at a gathering however, and it might be a whole other scenario.

 

You start talking to someone, and you discover similar interests. You get talking a bit more, and you discover a chemistry there. Maybe this guy is a little shorter than you would normally consider. Maybe this girl is a little heavier than you would normally date, but that might not matter as much because you have had a chance to talk to the person and get to know them a bit and you discover you want to talk to them again - see where it goes.

 

OLD does not provide that unique window of opportunity. It's easier to say "he's too short" or "she's too big" because you aren't dealing with them on a personal one on one level. It's not really fair, but it is what it is.

 

It's a struggle for both men and women because different challenges present themselves.

 

Women sign up and are automatically inundated with sexual messages, messages containing no more than "hey how are you" and poorly spelled messages with terrible grammar that contain nothing personal about them. We have to weed through these messages looking for someone, anyone, who isn't trying to send us a pick and seems interesting enough to risk getting to know.

 

And yes, it is a risk. Every guy you go out with that you meet online also has the potential of being violent and/or unsafe. When I was on OKCupid I NEVER gave out my personal phone number or agreed to meet a guy in a private location. I only ever agreed to meet somewhere public and I made sure at least two people knew where I was going to be and when I was expected to be back, just in case.

 

For guys I know that the difficulty in getting a woman to message back can be extremely difficult on your self esteem. It starts to breed resentment towards the other gender when we see them as "having it easier". It's not easier. It's just differently challenging.

 

For me, personally, if I had any sort of height preference it would have been guys that were considered "short" because I myself am short (only 5'3") and the idea of being with someone that tall is something I always found daunting and slightly scary. I didn't like the idea of a guy so much bigger than me because that would mean he could easily overpower me and that was a concern.

 

Every guy I dated (except my husband) has been under the 5'10" mark because it was what I preferred. My husband is 6'2" and if I had met him online I might not have responded because it would have seemed too tall for me. We met in person though and I found myself feeling quite safe with him despite the height disparity.

 

Should people give up on OLD all together? Maybe. Or maybe choosing the sights more carefully and/or being very specific about your preferences and keeping expectations low is the key? I don't know.

 

It's not easy though.

[Batya33]

Also regarding rejection, I think that that happens enough in real life too but in a very subtle, barely noticeable way. For instance a guy might check out several woman while in a grocery store but maybe none of them look back or respond to him. That is the real life version of an unanswered OLD email. ..just in less concrete and therefore less harsh terms.

 

Oh that's not how I experienced it -I dated for almost 20 years pre-OLD (although I started using written personal ads in about 1986). I remember the guy who told our mutual friends we were no longer dating (I didn't know that yet!), the guy who told me he went out and got drunk because after our second date he saw me dancing with another guy (didn't know he was there, guy was just a friend ,anyway), there were the times I was told "no" or my interest wasn't reciprocated only to see the same guy dancing with another girl a little while later, etc etc. Very, very noticeable.

 

And of course rushing home to see i HE CALLED. And he didn't -that punch in the stomach feeling. Same as seeing a guy you just made out with active on OLD but in a way that was more instant - you didn't wait all day to go home and check your answering machine or ask your roommate/parents.

[Batya33]

That reminds me about an email I received about 3 times from the same guy on OLD over the years. Each time it "got me" because the first 3 paragraphs were awesome - I mean his intelligence, sense of humor, what he liked to do - (yes I figured out it was a form email). Then, the last paragraph which detailed his particular sexual fetish, stated it wasn't a dealbreaker if "I" didn't like it but it would create significant issues for us if I didn't come around. The first 2 times I replied with how sorry I was that it wasn't going to work between us. It was nothing gross just definitely not for me. Oh well.

[bluebell29]

Maybe I should have clarified - I was referring only to the initial process of sifting through profiles and the OP and others' comments that many use superficial criteria. I think such criteria is also applied in real life, though much more subtly than ignoring an email.

[ParisPaulette]

See, guys like you are awesome and yes you're out there, same as women who won't reject a guy based on height. But I have specifically been passed over based on my chest size alone, both in OLD and in real life. In my younger years yes, I did get rejected very specifically and only on my chest size. It didn't really bother me much as I got a little older, because I understood the kind of guy who wanted me to have a big chest was the kind of guy I wasn't going to get along with anyways. Or as a very well-endowed friend of mine who hated her big boobs used to say, "Big boobs, the cheapest form of bait for the lowest of men." She was pretty burned out on the rude attention it got her making me thankful I wasn't quite so um, stacked if you will.

 

I still remember the time me and a group of friends were at a party, we walk by these three guys who start shouting out numbers like 10, 10, 10, pointing at each of my friends then they got to me and were like 6, 5, 3 with one of them loudly announcing, "Honey, go get a boob job, so you can be up there with your friends. You have a nice everything else, but you're sadly lacking in that area." I tried to pretend it didn't matter, but yeah it torqued me off and hurt my feelings. Public humiliation over chest size, how not fun. And on OLD I've been asked things like, "So, I'll pay for your boob job if you go out with me" and "You look nice, but I like a girl with more meat up top." And other more rude things I will not print here. Grrr.

 

Just saying I have indeed been judged and found wanting in terms of my chest size. Of course, I've also been judged on a whole lot of other things, so in the grand scheme of things I think it's probably fairly safe to say we all get judged on something that's out of our control sooner or later in life anyways. Shrugs. Not really caring about that these days, but when I was in my teens and early 20s it was not so fun to be called Barbie without the knockers.

[Batya33]

Maybe I should have clarified - I was referring only to the initial process of sifting through profiles and the OP and others' comments that many use superficial criteria. I think such criteria is also applied in real life, though much more subtly than ignoring an email.

 

I understand your opinion. I never minded someone not responding - could have been many reasons and it was a complete stranger who didn't meet me in real life. I also had a thick skin in real life but seeing someone ignore your eye contact, approach, etc - nope, not subtle in the least. It "can" be but I disagree with your distinction.

 

I ignored many many emails when I thought I was invisible on OLD. For many months. Hope no one took it personally.

[John John]

Wow PP....those guys are real a**holes. I mean...we ALL check out members of the opposite sex, but I would never say anything like that out loud. That's...horrible. I'm really sorry that happened to you. And like I said, there ARE men out there who will reject based on a woman's chest size, but I feel like women in general are more hung up on height than men are hung up on chest size. But there are exceptions to both rules, of course. Many women have told me in real life that height is the first thing they filter with OLD because the numbers just seem more important on an online profile. A guy who is 5'6" really isn't that short in real life, and is a good height for a woman who is like 5'2/5'3", especially if he's built.

 

I'm 5'8" so not crazy short (and well built to boot), and I've never been called short except for on Tinder lol. One girl said to me on a first date "you look like Brody Jenner, only shorter." It was more the WAY she said it than the comment itself. I replied, "Without your platform shoes, you do realize I tower over you?" (she was like 5'2"). She wanted to hang out again, but I nexted her because of her prissy attitude. While no one's ever really teased me about my height in real life before, I wouldn't mind teasing here and there (because it doesn't really bother me). But nasty comments like that just show how hung up some women are perhaps not necessarily on height, but on finding their perfect Disney prince charming (and I'm sure many men out there are hung up on finding their 10/10 Barbie dolls). I mean, I'm dark and handsome...isn't two out of three enough? LOL

[Hermes]

Unbelievable, Paulette.

 

Where do these forms of low insect life spring from I ask. Some host/ess too who invited sleaze like that to the party.

 

Aside from that it is called harassment.

[JA0371]

Ok Im about to blow ALL of you away.....

 

I find a peter Dinklage from Game Of Thrones verrrry attractive...and what is he?? 3'5?? Lol...

Seriously. Maybe it's because he has that British accent thing down, but I think it's just because he seems extremely confident in his roles and with who he is. So don't think ALL women are hung up on height!! It's all in the swag!

[John John]

Peter Dinklage is the f'in MAN. I love that guy. Tremendous guy and actor.

[Ms Darcy]

I think, as it relates to men, asian men have the toughest time in dating because people have a sense of wanting mainstream. I don't really understand that one, to be honest. And it surprises me that so few actually mention that.

 

Maybe it's because I live in a big city, but most folks I know in their 20s - 40s have met their partners through online dating. I know of at least two marriages this year resulting from it. I met my husband from OK Cupid. I have always had good experiences (of course weeding out the sexual messages).

 

But I expected a lot of rejection and I never used it as my only strategy. OK Cupid gave me the opportunity to meet people I never would have otherwise - although my husband only lived 5 minutes away from me when we started dating, he soon moved accross town.

 

My advice would be to try to see online dating as strategy three or four for finding a partner. I volunteered, went to meetups, got set up by friends, etc as my primary means for finding someone. I supplemented with online dating sites. I would say to try to balance being open with realistic. For me, I prefer men who are service oriented, have a good relationship with their family, relatively fit, college educated, similar values, have a white collar job, compatible sense of humor, and relationship-oriented. I was open to dating men of different races and different locations, so my dance card was full with lovely gentlemen. And, obviously, my husband.

 

My experiences with online dating has been great - so long as I had very few expectations. Online dating is more like dessert than the main course.

[happy_snapper]

My experiences with online dating has been great - so long as I had very few expectations. Online dating is more like desert than the main course.

 

Did you intend that, or was it just a misspelling?

I agree it is a bit of a desert.

[Ms Darcy]

Did you intend that, or was it just a misspelling?

I agree it is a bit of a desert.

 

I think context clues should answer that question. LOL.

[Rosti87]

I think demographics is just as big of a problem as the micro issues of height, bust size or weight.

 

Depending on the location certain groups have more difficulty. Ms Darcy mentioned one group but there are others.

 

Also a blonde is a dime a dozen in LA and will blend in with a large sea of blondes but you can place that blonde in Miami and she probably get a lot more dates. Same with a black woman in Idaho having a worst time than a black woman in the DC area.

 

I think being aware of where you fit in within the spectrum of the location in which you live helps you have a realistic expectation of what you may get.

[Ms Darcy]

I would also add that I do think people who are "outliers" might have a bit of a harder time with online dating. I work with people who have found their partners through online means ... and very quickly. But they (tend to be): white (male or female) or asian (female), 20s-30s, making low six-figures, slim or curvy (curvy as in size six not size sixteen), college educated and often with a graduate degree of some sort ... yuppies (sp).

 

I would imagine for people who are outliers that it's a different experience. People of a different race, age, body type, class, etc ... maybe that's the negative feedback we are hearing on this site.

 

Again, my city and where I work tends to have the "yuppy" folks I was describing. And the men have NO problem with finding women online.

 

Things are somewhat different for my friends, who aren't really yuppies, but they can find people too. Just slower.

 

Interesting.

[Rosti87]

I would have to agree with this. The people I know who are successful in my area of the world are a very specific type. It is a very narrow group of people. This group represent the median demographic of my area that is mostly white, well educated, well paid, and a very narrow and specific physical appearance.

 

Anyone outside that scope all bets are off.

 

To add I fit most of that demographic except that I am a person of color. That factor narrows my prospects considerably.

[journeynow]

I'm clueless here. Was he ticking boxes or were those his words? What's so unreasonable? It sounds like a wish list of positive qualities, not deal breakers, and of course there's room for variation in all of those qualities. Maybe it's odd he mentions traditional family values and he doesn't want children, so that may take clarification. I'd say 5'0" is pretty short, 6'6" pretty tall for a guy, but it's simply not as important a characteristic as what they are like as a person.

[IAmFCA]

We often talk about the ease with which mainstream lookers (yes Annie I agree re mainstream)attract people on line... seems like a reasonable conclusion, since those folks easily attract people off line as well.

 

The point I want to make is --- it remains a challenge for everyone to attract SOMEONE WHO FITS. Lookers might attract many, but few if any whom they would seriously consider for an LTR. To that person, the many is of marginal value and may be actually detract from the value of OLD.

[Chia girl]

One of the major issues that contributes to everyone's frustrations are the fact that so many men in their late 40s/50s/60s want to date woman significantly younger by 10-30 years and won't even consider women their own age.

 

So they're bombarding the women in their 20s and 30s with messages and ignoring the women around their own age. The results are predictable:

 

Younger women get loads of messages from men who are much older and out of their preferred age range. So they ignore them because it is frankly pretty rude for a 50 year old man to be trying to date a 28 year old who has specifically stated in her profile that her upper age limit is 35 (for example). It shows a lack of respect for her, and makes her feel that all he wants is some arm candy. Besides, why would she want to date a dude in his 50s when she can date 30-something guys?

 

These guys get very little to no response from the young women and then complain that women never answer men on dating sites, and the deck is stacked against men. Meanwhile there are plenty of women in their own age range who are fit and attractive, and would love to date them.

 

So a lot of women in their late 40s/50s/60s feel ignored by men their own age and frustrated by online dating. A lot of younger women feel repulsed and irritated by the older men who think they 'look and act much younger than their age' contacting them. It also makes it harder for the younger men who are trying to be noticed amongst all the messages in the inboxes of younger women. A lot of older men feel frustrated and ignored by women because they are constantly aiming out of their league and wondering why they never get replies.

 

Result: everyone starts to feel like there is no one decent online. Older men need to start aiming to date within their own age range and at least one of the major OLD issues would be solved for everyone.

 

Of course I know that isn't going to happen....

 

I also know these generalisations don't apply to everyone. But they apply in significant enough numbers to cause a lot of issues in online dating.

[Helpexpressme]

Comments I've heard from old geezers, is that they believe woman let themselves go when they are older.

 

ie - They let their hair go grey, they get overweight, slow, sluggish, given up on their looks, moan, set in their ways - the list goes on. They want young, sprightly, fun young girls. So I guess everyone is going to try and get a young lass over a mature woman.

[Chia girl]

Yes there is a degree of truth to that, in that some women do let themselves go when they get older. As do some men.

 

I can understand an older man who is in good shape not wanting someone who has let themselves go.

 

But there are plenty of older women who are fit and attractive, and keep themselves in good shape, and have things together financially and emotionally. So I don't understand why they get ignored.

[Dougie_D]

Well for me, I'm 34, and trying to go out with someone close to my age is going to be hard. I'm a virgin and never kissed. And I only make 20k a year. I have tons of red flags in my age group. Personally, I'd love to date a girl close to my age because we can talk about the same music , movies, growing up. But majority of these women know exactly what they want from a man. I'm just learning how to date in general. My life experience as a whole too, (didn't start working until I was 24) is pretty much a 22 yr old. So what I'm saying is, maybe these older guys than me 40/50 are guys just like me in a way. Or maybe they go after younger women because they feel more powerful. An older woman won't be flattered by "gifts" and stuff. I used to live with a girl that "dated" men in their 40/50's. She claimed she never slept with them but they would take her out to concerts, ball games, fancy restaurants, etc... Plus it's something to "brag about" to guy friends.

[Rosti87]

Comments I've heard from old geezers, is that they believe woman let themselves go when they are older.

 

ie - They let their hair go grey, they get overweight, slow, sluggish, given up on their looks, moan, set in their ways - the list goes on. They want young, sprightly, fun young girls. So I guess everyone is going to try and get a young lass over a mature woman.

I haven't gotten out there yet (as in dating) and I'm on the fence in regards to using OLD so i cant comment on OLD specifically on the above.

 

As a 50 plus woman who is fit and active I find in RL that most 40 to 60 year old men are just as neglectful of their health/fitness and have 'parked the bus' as the women. This may depend on location but where I live women in this age range are more likely to be fit and active and adventurous than their male counterparts.

 

So I'm a bit confused my this statement.

[IAmFCA]

I agree with Rosti's point - women are fit and are expecting fitness in their men.

 

IRL and in OLD, some men date younger, some don't. I have dated younger by a few years but not by a decade (by choice). The OLD currently in my sights does not date younger.

 

Anytime we feel a victim, we need to flip our thinking and find our power.

[IAmFCA]

DD,

 

Adding a nuance because I know you have been growing and working hard at learning as much as you can -

 

A woman of any age may - or may not - be flattered by gifts. I never was, not by the skateboard in 6th grade, nor the expensive dinners in high school and college, nor the car from my then-husband. Gifts are always meaningful, but never successful as a tool to win my respect and affection.

 

Share something of yourself with me - THAT is the most flattering gift of all.

 

 

- ITIC