I will be losing my V-card to someone I don't like soon.

[dangletsbang]

I don't think you understand.

 

It's deemed respectful if your waiting for the right person. But if you simply can't find anyone to have sex with, that's when your deemed weird.

 

I don't see how people say they can't find anyone to have sex with..I mean seriously if you're desperate, go to a local bar/night club/beer joint..specifically one that attracts a college crowd in and the place with be crawling with drunk, eager and willing females. If you're desperate there's no need to go as far as prostitution.

[Glowguy]

I don't see how people say they can't find anyone to have sex with..I mean seriously if you're desperate, go to a local bar/night club/beer joint..specifically one that attracts a college crowd in and the place with be crawling with drunk, eager and willing females. If you're desperate there's no need to go as far as prostitution.

 

For women it really is as easy as that but trust me - he wouldn't resort to prostitution if he didn't feel like he had to. Some of us have anxiety issues which interfere with our ability to randomly approach strangers at a bar (and I would say that it's far from easy for most guys). You can only improve yourself to a point. Sometimes the main obstacle to losing your virginity really is the fact that you are still a virgin.

[Blue Spiral]

Not this again.

 

If you go to a job interview and do terribly, do you refuse to bone up on your interviewing skills in the name of "just being yourself"? Of course not.

 

I'd hope that relationships are a bit less soulless and cut-and-dried than the job world.

 

You're bending over backwards trying to rationalize yourself into thinking that groveling for sex (but advanced groveling, really!) is a good thing. "It's not about living at the mercy of someone's moment-to-moment perception, and it's not about doing a lot of stuff I don't care about to impress them...it's about improving myself! Yeah, that's it!" I wish you luck with that, sir.

 

I'm obviously not the biggest romantic on these forums, but...isn't the whole point of love that you can be yourself around someone, instead of having to put on airs (old-fashioned saying time) to impress them?

 

And thank you for your insinuation that men that don't play the game are losers. Millions of entitled princesses are thrilled that you're fighting for the right to grovel at their feet, alongside countless other men that are throwing time, money, and attention at them. As long as you can match their ever-rising standards, you may have a chance. If you enjoy "pursuit" or "the chase", more power to you--I don't, and I'll gladly leave you to it. I'm one of those crazy people that thinks that everyone should be direct with each other. It was wrong when men used the "mating culture" to take advantage of women, and it's wrong that they're doing it to us now.

[camus154]

I'd hope that relationships are a bit less soulless and cut-and-dried than the job world.

 

We're not talking about relationships. We're talking about the dating scene.

 

You're bending over backwards trying to rationalize yourself into thinking that groveling for sex (but advanced groveling, really!) is a good thing. "It's not about living at the mercy of someone's moment-to-moment perception, and it's not about doing a lot of stuff I don't care about to impress them...it's about improving myself! Yeah, that's it!" I wish you luck with that, sir.

 

Lol, I'm not bending over backwards for anything. Dude, I'm in a great relationship right now and I've had plenty of past experiences with women. No groveling was necessary. It's a pity that you think upping your game equals groveling, but then...that probably explains your own situation.

 

I'm obviously not the biggest romantic on these forums, but...isn't the whole point of love that you can be yourself around someone, instead of having to put on airs (old-fashioned saying time) to impress them?

 

Once again, we have the false bifurcation here. Learning how to up your game has nothing to do with not being yourself. There's only so many ways I can say that.

 

And thank you for your insinuation that men that don't play the game are losers. Millions of entitled princesses are thrilled that you're fighting for the right to grovel at their feet, alongside countless other men that are throwing time, money, and attention at them. As long as you can match their ever-rising standards, you may have a chance. If you enjoy "pursuit" or "the chase", more power to you--I don't, and I'll gladly leave you to it. I'm one of those crazy people that thinks that everyone should be direct with each other. It was wrong when men used the "mating culture" to take advantage of women, and it's wrong that they're doing it to us now.

 

I'm not insinuating that guys who don't play the game are losers--I'm insinuating that the guys who complain about not being able to get women but refuse to change a single aspect of themselves are. And not because they're "losers" but because they're literally losing at the game of dating. Otherwise they wouldn't be complaining about it.

 

Look, if you want to live in some idealistic worldview where you're just perfect the way you are and it's all the "princesses" out there who are at fault for not recognizing what a wonderful catch you are, that's your choice. But in the end you might find the price of your idealism is your own happiness. And you can't blame the princesses for that.

[jonny15]

I don't see how people say they can't find anyone to have sex with..I mean seriously if you're desperate, go to a local bar/night club/beer joint..specifically one that attracts a college crowd in and the place with be crawling with drunk, eager and willing females. If you're desperate there's no need to go as far as prostitution.

 

I myself would never touch a drunk woman. That is disgusting.

 

When I say can't get sex, I mean can't get sex with someone who wants it when their mind is right.

 

You know, someone who is actually attracted to you.

[Fudgie]

I myself would never touch a drunk woman. That is disgusting.

 

When I say can't get sex, I mean can't get sex with someone who wants it when their mind is right.

 

You know, someone who is actually attracted to you.

 

At my college, the RAs jokingly remind guys "Hey, don't try to bone a girl if she looks like she is going to fall over or smells like vomit." Funny, sort of, but then you realize that we have had issues here with men having sex with girls who have blacked out and won't remember the encounter. Ick.

 

Plus, if you go to the bar and pick up a random girl who you don't know who is already smashed, you *could* get sex....but then you run the risk of her waking up the next morning and saying "OMG I don't remember this at all! I was raped!" Or at the very least, it's extremely awkward and embarrassing.

 

I guess if a guy really wanted sex, he could use an online service to find local women who are open to casual encounters. Of course, that's a whole other can of worms (and ick, casual sex) but hey, at least she is not drunk and out of it!

[annie24]

I don't think you can 100% compare dating to job hunting. Of course, in both scenarios, it's important to put your best foot forward, smile, and polish up what aspects of yourself that you can. When you are job hunting, there is a specific job opening, for a specific type of candidate. ie, You don't ever see ads that say, "job opening at law firm" without specifying if it is for a lawyer, a secretary or the janitor. Dating is a bit like that - just because someone is single doesn't mean that they are looking for your type - you don't really know what they are looking for at all until you start to talk to them. And even if they say they are looking to get into a relationship - sometimes they are lying!! Well, sometimes job interviews are like that too - they might have a candidate in mind but need to legally advertise it before they can hire the person they want.

 

Anyway, I do believe that we all can improve and become "the best versions of ourselves." But I guess luck plays a pretty huge role too. You can do everything right and still not get the job or the partner you want. sigh....

[jonny15]

Plus, if you go to the bar and pick up a random girl who you don't know who is already smashed, you *could* get sex....but then you run the risk of her waking up the next morning and saying "OMG I don't remember this at all! I was raped!" Or at the very least, it's extremely awkward and embarrassing.

 

That is also a risk of picking up a chick that might have been drinking.

 

Her looking at me and thinking, what if my friends found out I was with this ugly guy? I'll say he forced himself on me.

 

Some do that when their embarresed over it.

 

I guess if a guy really wanted sex, he could use an online service to find local women who are open to casual encounters. Of course, that's a whole other can of worms (and ick, casual sex) but hey, at least she is not drunk and out of it!

 

Problem is, you never know for sure if the person your talking to is actually a woman. ewwwww

[Fudgie]

That is also a risk of picking up a chick that might have been drinking.

 

Her looking at me and thinking, what if my friends found out I was with this ugly guy? I'll say he forced himself on me.

 

Some do that when their embarresed over it.

 

Problem is, you never know for sure if the person your talking to is actually a woman. ewwwww

 

Yes, it's quite sad and pathetic, and I think such women should be criminally punished for false claims like that. Those claims can ruin an innocent man's reputation forever.

Even if she didn't tell though, who wants to kiss someone who has vomited? EW EW.

 

And you're right about the online encounter too. You never really know....

[Bunney]

Haven't you written this exact same thread a while ago? Seems so deja-vu to me somehow.

[MD Geist]

Its not like I've tried to make a connection with a girl. Thats what Id like to do but if they don't want to give me that opportunity there's really nothing much I can do. After all they do all the choosing so its not like I can put a gun to thier head and make them choose me. In the end there's really no promises or garentees as much as you can improve upon yourself you still may never be able to attract a a partner. I'm thinking Its just never going to happen for me regardless. People can say I've been looking for the wrong women when the ONLY kind of girls I won't go for are those types that are bad so what give those bad girls an opportunity to? Start going out to clubs and bars with hope of finding a right one despite she's got kids or drama in her life.

 

The only other options is to declare myself an Asexual person which I wouldn't mind doing at all, that just means i can look forward in life to never having intercourse or wait with the risk of never having sex at all. I really don't like being the ONLY virgin I know. I feel like such a black sheep among everyone else and its even worse the older I get in life how much inexperienced I'am compared with most people who are a year younger and have years of sexual experiences.

 

Girls can say they'd rather date Virgins but they don't if given the choice between a manwhore or a virgin. I've been turned down before for a guy who's slept with several Prosititutes actually and he's currently in a long term relationship with one girl I tried dating and they seem fine.

 

I just wish I could live my life without a problem but everyday its just becoming annoying that 30 is around the corner and I've barley had my first kiss, felt up on a girl before let a lone have experienced a true intercourse. Most girls will freak if they know that and run away. Its simply "Not normal"

 

 

 

 

I've always wanted to wait for the right one to come along but she never showed up.

[annie24]

Well, you know, if going to a prostitute and doing these things makes you feel better about yourself afterwards then go for it. I dont think it will be a magically transformative experience but if you want to, go for it.

[OptomisticGirl]

Ah not every woman chooses a manwhore over a virgin. I would never have dated a guy who slept with women outside a relationship.

[annie24]

Do these girls even know you are a virgin? I mean, that isn't really first meet or date conversation material. And no, we can't smell it on you.

[jonny15]

Yes, it's quite sad and pathetic, and I think such women should be criminally punished for false claims like that. Those claims can ruin an innocent man's reputation forever.

Even if she didn't tell though, who wants to kiss someone who has vomited? EW EW.

 

And you're right about the online encounter too. You never really know....

 

I do think they should be punished, but that would never happen. And the vomit thing is so gross.

 

Heck, I don't even like the idea of kissing a woman that smokes. Who wants to kiss an ashtray?

 

 

I will say that if someone pays for it, how will anyone know unless they tell them?

[jonny15]

Do these girls even know you are a virgin? I mean, that isn't really first meet or date conversation material. And no, we can't smell it on you.

 

I guess if they ask about his sex life, and he acts weird, or can't think on his feet, people might think that he isn't experienced.

 

I mean, if a woman asked me, i'd try to avoid it all together.

[annie24]

I guess if they ask about his sex life, and he acts weird, or can't think on his feet, people might think that he isn't experienced.

 

I mean, if a woman asked me, i'd try to avoid it all together.

 

I've certainly met a lot of men who are awkward with women but I'd never ask if they were a virgin. At least, not until we had been dating for a while. Then again, if they were that awkward, I would not be dating them. Maybe it's just me, but I don't ask questions like that of guys I barely know. I just assume most guys my age are not virgins, and if they are, it isn't a big deal. If I really liked him and we had a connection, I would be ok with that. For sure.

[jonny15]

I've certainly met a lot of men who are awkward with women but I'd never ask if they were a virgin. At least, not until we had been dating for a while. Then again, if they were that awkward, I would not be dating them. Maybe it's just me, but I don't ask questions like that of guys I barely know. I just assume most guys my age are not virgins, and if they are, it isn't a big deal. If I really liked him and we had a connection, I would be ok with that. For sure.

 

It may not always be about sex, but if they ask about relashionships and the guy has never been in one, and he tries to side step the question, it might be a red flag for some.

 

Most probably wouldn't ask about sex partners right off the bad, atleast I wouldn't want to run into one. But eventually things will be asked.

[annie24]

It may not always be about sex, but if they ask about relashionships and the guy has never been in one, and he tries to side step the question, it might be a red flag for some.

 

Most probably wouldn't ask about sex partners right off the bad, atleast I wouldn't want to run into one. But eventually things will be asked.

 

yeah, i guess it can be a red flag for some. i would in this case advocate "stretching the truth." ie, saying that he's dated several women but he has yet to find a long term, deeply committed relationship, but was looking. then after they have been dating for a while and are together as a couple, he can confess that she is his first gf.

[AMWHOIAM]

Hey man, I just wanted to say that I feel as though you should cut yourself a little slack here. According to one of your past posts, for SEVERAL years you lived in what I would consider one of the most HORRIBLE places for "dating" in the world (in Colorado Springs is more like only date people that you went to middle and high school with). Seriously, despite what ANYONE on this board says and/or thinks, both of us know the cold / hard TRUTH regarding Colorado Springs, CO and how it is, for all intents and purposes impossible to date here. Think about that for a minute. There are TWO people here on ENA who agree that the aforementioned city is a terrible place for a single guy. Not only that, but we have shared an almost identical experience while living here. Again, despite what anyone on this board wants to believe, there is something to be said for the fact that we have had almost identical experiences while living in the same city. My point is this: I believe that, like myself, we have just had the misfortune of having lived in terrible places for single men as far as dating is concerned. Again, I wouldn't be so hard on myself if I were you. Take care and hang in there!

[galaxy71]

I have no idea why MD Geist is struggling with women whatsoever. For me the million dollar question is why women in his social circle refuse to date him. Is it his appearance? Is it his body language? Maybe it's his conversational skills? Or maybe he doesn't flirt early enough. I also wonder how he acts around women in his social circle. I wonder how women in his social circle would describe MD Geist. Would they describe him as the popular guy that they are waiting to ask them out? Maybe they would describe him as the quiet guy that people in the group tolerate? I honestly don't know.

 

I think the problem with the OP is that he had never had someone outside of an internet message board critique his appearance, behavior, and thought process around women. It's good that MD Geist lost weight. But did he lose enough weight? What sort of style does he have? I wonder what women's impressions of MD Geist are after they talk to him. Would they describe him as cool or would they view him in indifference? I have no clue why MD Geist struggles with women. With other guys you can quickly tell why they struggle with women. Some of the guys who struggled with women were both shy and overweight. You could quickly tell why they are struggling. With MD Geist, you can't make that conclusion because you don't have enough information.

[tiredofvampires]

One thing you need to keep in mind about being sexually experienced.

 

Even if you slept with 500 prostitutes, if it came to sleeping with a bonifide love interest, you'd have to start learning from scratch, and it would probably be about the same as your being a virgin.

 

Because for women, a good lover is a man who knows, above all, how to use his tongue and mouth to pleasure them, and how to read the signals. He has learned what kinds of maneuvers tend to work the best, and how individual women prefer this or this, over that and that. He knows the many "hot" spots and how to build up to the fireworks, building the tension. He knows how to tease. He knows the right balance of carnal, animalistic tempo and soft, tender touches (including passionate kisses). He knows how to touch a woman and "sense" her.

 

You will not learn ANY of this with a prostitute. You will only learn how to go bambambambambam. thankyoumaam.

 

So no woman sleeping with you for the first time as a lover will find your techniques those of an "experienced man", because, well...you WON'T be experienced.

 

You need to be very clear about your reasons for doing this, OP. Here's what your reasons should not and really cannot be: 1. to get experienced as a lover and 2. to get your "needs" met, because clearly, you desire a real relationship and don't even want to go through with this deed particularly, so that's not going be sustainable for the long haul.

 

There is only one thing that this will accomplish, as I see it: put an end to your virginity. That is ALL, and you should be clear that nothing can come from this besides that.

 

The reason I'm inclined to encourage that, though, is because then you can stop blaming your lack of luck, ability, desirability, etc. on this technicality. So if you take this off the table, you can no longer keep making it the scapegoat of your problems, and will have to search for other ways to solve your difficulties with women. As long as you're a virgin, you'll be blaming it for the way you feel. Plus, you'll end this "not knowing what you're missing" train of thought (which can have its own destructive power), on a very, very basic level.

 

Then again, you might want to consider this: if you are doing this just to rid yourself of your viginity, and you honestly believe there are no women out there for you and you're resigned to that....why do this before age 30? Why not wait? Because a prostitute will sleep with you even if you've got one foot in the grave. So there's plenty of time to actually have intercourse and see what that's like before you die.

 

So that buys you a little time, doesn't it? The prostitutes will be there for eternity...so that's always there for you, if you're right that no woman is going to sleep with you otherwise. You can't be sure though, so maybe it's worth extending the inquiry longer just in case, knowing your backup plan can wait for another 50 years. And you've lost nothing losing your virginity to a prostitute then.

[EQIQ]

Tiredofvampires,

 

I think your idea of removing "virginity" as a scapegoat is actually quite good... I am totally against it on a moral level, but on a logics one.. makes sense. Maybe then they can start trying to learn to solve the real problem.

[jonny15]

yeah, i guess it can be a red flag for some. i would in this case advocate "stretching the truth." ie, saying that he's dated several women but he has yet to find a long term, deeply committed relationship, but was looking. then after they have been dating for a while and are together as a couple, he can confess that she is his first gf.

 

That could be the way to go, unless you don't want a a relashionship like that, and you just want some relashionship experience.

[jonny15]

Alot of that is true, but a man needs experience to be able to know all these things about a woman when in bed with her. And the only way he can do that is by having sex.

 

You gotta start somewhere.

 

And if he got a high class escort, he might get one that is willing to teach him.

 

Maybe he could go to the Bunny Ranch? Alot of chicks their seem to be a fan of virgins.