It's About The Journey...

[notalady]

Hey Faraday, thanks for checking in! Things have been going well as usual so I haven't been updating

 

Lately J's friend who's been together for 10 years just got engaged, we're really excited for them. My friend who's having a LDR is also going well, they take turn to visit each other every month and have been together for about 6 months now. One of my good friends who's husband was caught being on tinder and used the excuse that he was only looking to make new friends, they seem to be rebuilding the relationship nicely as well (though I don't know the ins and outs of that one), another one of my acquaintances, who was completely gushing about her new bf on Facebook and I was very sceptical about it going the distance, they seem to be going well too (though only been together for a few months). Sometimes I wonder if I'm being too cynical or judgemental when I see other relationships that I think wouldn't have worked for me or that I would've walked away from. I think it's useful to remember that I don't know others' relationships other than what I see from the outside and that relationships come in different shapes and forms and what doesn't work for me, can work for others.

 

J and I are going well. Sometimes we are like a couple of big kids together, it makes me laugh. It's weird how similar we are in so many ways, including the way we think. I've never met someone so similar to myself before, in a good way. We're still yet to have a fight or argument. It seems like we just happen to agree on most things, or even if we don't agree, it's not something that we feel like we need to argue about. I'm not bothered about it, I'm sure if something big comes up, we'll work it out calmly. After seeing so many couples around me and my own relationship, I think I'm a firm believer of compatibility more so than ever. Some people just seem to get on each other's nerves you know, and others just somehow get along no matter what, and of course there's 50 shades in between. It's funny how that works!

[Batya33]

I think part of compatibility is being able to get angry at/frustrated with each other and resolve it without needless escalation (and if it does, yes, that happens too -just matters on which of the 50 shades of gray!). I think it's good to experience a fight/argument/anger/frustration so you have the challenge of the skills required. I definitely wouldn't pick a fight or argument! Reminds me a little of the song from Most Happy Fella (I think) called "I made a fist!"

[Fudgie]

I think that every couple fights, it's just about fighting "well" when it happens. You two agree on a lot so it hasn't happened yet but I'm sure it well but I bet you will work it out quickly and effectively. I tend to get angry and walk off and shut down emotionally and K doesn't let me do that. He gives me space and then we resolve quickly when I'm chill again.

 

I'm a big believer in compatibility too.

[notalady]

I've had a few moments of frustration, mostly related to hunger (yep being "hangry" is real lol), maybe once or twice in stressful situations, it was always brief and never resulted in conflict.

 

We are both slow to frustrate, him more so than me, we're also both problem solvers and remain calm under stress/frustration, so we both tend to seek solution straight away when problems arise while rarely act or speak out of frustration (which may result in escalation). We also both like to talk and laugh about it after.

 

It's not just with J, I've had different colleagues from previous and current job expressing surprise the once or twice they saw me react in frustration about something at work, because I just never do. If something need to be solved, I'll work on solving it. I rarely comment on it, even if I do feel a passing moment of frustration. In comparison a lot of my past and current colleagues like to go on and on about things that frustrate them at work and in personal lives, it's like it's never ending, like they are seeking out things to feel frustrated by.

 

It's interesting to hear other people's stories about how they resolve conflicts at home, one in particular told me she wouldn't be surprised if they get divorced at some point and that they both tend to deal with stress / frustration by lashing out at each other. Another woman, when I told her a story about J and that it makes me laugh when he does this, she said the same thing would've driven her nuts. There's a lot more of how I see others interact and describe to me that makes me think that J and I just happen to be two peas in a pos, that's all.

 

While it would be good to know how we resolve conflicts, I agree, I wouldn't pick a fight or argument when there is none. And maybe this IS the way we handle conflicts - resolving it before it even began.

[faraday]

Oh...you guys will fight at some point lol. Right now there shouldn't be much to fight about- you're still new(ish), not living together, sharing finances, or kids...this is the easy part. So it's good that you guys don't fight- it means you guys are compatible and when life gets hard, you won't be fighting with each other, but be fighting on the same side (for the most part anyway). When you have a relationship like this...it really does make it apparent why it never worked out with anyone else, hey? And it makes you wonder why you fought so hard for relationships that, in hindsight, seemed doomed from the beginning.

 

I get hAngry too. I hate it. Jay brings me food when I get hAngry

[Ms Darcy]

I think it's great that you're getting along so well with J!

 

I agree with Faraday, the dating tome time should mostly be drama free. It helps you understand how compatible you are and gives you both "positive chips" between you that you can cash in with each other when serious stressors (like wedding planning and kids and family deaths) come about.

 

Best wishes going forward.

[notalady]

Thanks Faraday and Ms Darcy! I 100% agree with both of you. This should be the easy part, since there are no serious stressors. Although, some couples I know who are both relatively even tempered also rarely have arguments, even after marriage, but it might be different when they have kids.

 

I like what Faraday said about fighting on the same side, that's what I feel like with J, that he's on my team. I'm sure there will be times when we disagree or feel annoyed but I'm also sure we will work it out in a productive way. Yes in hindsight I need not have worked so hard to make things work with ex's who were clearly incompatible, I think I just never expected to meet someone so compatible, in fact I expected that relationships require work and that arguments do happen etc, after all that's what people always tell you, I mean it is true but not to the extent required when you are incompatible. And a lot of people who are in fact incompatible choose to stay in the relationship so they do have more fights and it does require more work.

 

A couple of ladies my age at work (the two mentioned in my last post, both kind of fiery and quick tempered), when I said we never had a fight, they said you HAVE to have a fight, so you know the relationship will survive it, and that we're still new and in honeymoon phase. I told them all my past serious relationships, there had been arguments or disagreements or annoyances (mostly value or personality based, or both) within the first 3-4 months, and even more so later on. So I'm definitely not new to this. It's just not happening with J. I disagreed with them in that it's not like it's a pre-requisite that you have to have had a fight to really know if the relationship will last.

[faraday]

Relationships are hard, and they are work. But what people don't really clarify (or maybe I'm just a dumbie) is that it shouldn't be hard in the beginning. That's the easy time. And I didn't know that when I was younger, so I stuck it out with Tines dad for WAY longer than I should have because I thought it was supposed to be difficult. It worked out, I stuck around long enough to have her...but him and I should have never lasted as long as we did- if I had been smart, I would have walked away a few months into dating him. But I liked him, and I've always been told relationships are hard and you have to work on it.

 

Man, so much stuff doesn't make sense until later. Until it's right.

 

Anyway, I'm really glad that things are going so well for you two That's awesome: )

[notalady]

I stuck it out with Tines dad for WAY longer than I should have because I thought it was supposed to be difficult.

 

But I liked him, and I've always been told relationships are hard and you have to work on it.

 

That's what I always thought too! It wasn't until after my 2.5 year relationship I really start to think about compatibility and perhaps it shouldn't be this hard. Being on ENA and reading others' stories and advice also helped cement that

 

Thanks faraday, you're awesome

[Ms Darcy]

I think it might be a semantic issue. People often interchange fight and disagreement. I am equally skeptical of those who say that fighting a lot is normal as I am of those who say they never fight.

 

And I think the point about fair fighting or constructive fighting is key. It's a balance. To me, I think a couple who has several fair fights might actually be healthier than ones who never do. There ARE couples who never fight because one simply swallows resentments.

 

So I think it's a lot more nuanced than frequency of arguments, but also must consider quality and content of them as well.

[Batya33]

But don't you think the couples who swallow resentments might never fight but the results come out in even more insidious ways? Less closeness ,for one thing.

[notalady]

To Batya and Ms Darcy's point, I'm equally sceptical about people who never fight. The couples I was talking about that rarely fought, seems like their relationship is going well rather than either party holding in resentment just to keep peace.

 

And yes people often use fight and disagreement interchangeably. I like to use disagreement or even annoyance rather than fight or argument, because that's not the way I want to resolve disagreements. I want to be able to discuss rather than argue or fight, and that's always been the way I approached disagreements with ex's. My longest relationship (the 2.5 year one), we definitely fought fair, it was always a discussion rather than argument. But because of the incompatibility, the same disagreement keep happening over different things, so it didn't matter how well we fought, it just couldn't be worked out in a permanent way.

[Ms Darcy]

Yeah having the same argument over and over can be a strong sign of incompatibility.

[thejigsup]

My late fiance and I NEVER fought. We did have 3 disagreements in 12 years. We were just very, very, much alike. We liked the same food, style in clothes, we had the same friends (his became mine and vice versa), and thought the same politically. We were upper middle class, he was an attorney I was a teacher, so there weren't any money fights. BUT, we both lost several family members and pets during those years and only got closer. It can be done without anyone getting resentful. Just find someone who is almost your clone. It works and you will have a very peaceful existence.

[faraday]

It makes for boring journals when things are going well, hey? I feel obsolete on here lately...but I guess that's a good thing.

[Ms Darcy]

Use your journal to talk about personal growth! I started a thread on that, particularly around academic pursuits.

[notalady]

It makes for boring journals when things are going well, hey? I feel obsolete on here lately...but I guess that's a good thing.

 

Haha yes indeed I think it's a good thing!

[notalady]

Use your journal to talk about personal growth! I started a thread on that, particularly around academic pursuits.

 

If something compels me I will certainly write about it

[Ms Darcy]

If something compels me I will certainly write about it

 

Oops, sorry! I was replying to Faraday's comment.

[notalady]

Read this article today about what differentiates a happy lasting relationship to an unhappy one / one that ends in divorce.

 

 

 

I thought a lot of the observations are interesting and worth remembering for my own benefit, especially the ones about when one partner makes a "bid" to connect. It reminds me that every little interaction counts and to not get lazy and keep exercising those "kindness muscles".

[Batya33]

Interesting! So, the author assumes that the "that's a cool bird" is a "bid to connect" but on the other hand tells the "wife" not to assume, "that when her husband left the toilet seat up, he was deliberately trying to annoy her. But he may have just absent-mindedly forgotten to put the seat down".

 

So, I think it's an individual thing -know your partner. If your partner talks to you but you know from past experience he is really mostly talking to himself and doesn't expect a response, then there's no need to see it as a bid to connect, and stop what you're doing and respond/talk about it. Or, if you've told your partner "I have to focus on ___ right now" and he insists on chatting with you about non-essential stuff, then I think often the best response is to give a short or no response and show self-care through your actions - rather than whining "I told you not to interrupt me!!". Responding with silence and focusing on the work or whatever shows that you cannot talk right then (as you explained) and also works if it was a mistake "oh sorry I forgot you didn't want to be interrupted".

 

Focus on the positives/avoid criticizing -great advice. And sit on your hands if you need to. A few days ago my husband lost sleep while out of town staying at his late parents' house because he was convinced he'd lost a family album that is irreplaceable. He tends to be absentminded and misplaces/loses things often - it can be very frustrating and time-wasting for the family. I never, ever mentioned that - that is the kindness.

 

First, he knows, second, it would be awful to mention that when he was stressed about the album and third it wouldn't help anyone to find it. He found it (whew) and later I still never raised it as a general issue - I simply suggested with the disclaimer that the advice was "cliche" that I'd come up with another way of making sure I remembered where I put something -and I made it about me, and how I misplace things. He took it 100% the right way (no I didn't want him to read into it a "lesson" for him -it was about me and trying to help him without a general criticism) And I celebrated that he found it.

 

I give this example because honestly, I did see this as an opportunity to talk generally about how often he misplaces/loses things -and wondered whether I missed it (no one else is around really to talk to him about it). But I realized that the slight risk of missing the opportunity was overshadowed by being kind and supportive (and thrilled that it turned out ok).

That's the kind of balancing I do.

 

I do not agree that every interaction counts - every meaningful one, yes. If i say to my husband "oops I forgot to buy toilet paper and there was a sale yesterday!" and he says "uh huh" while staring at his Ipad - well yes, he should "turn away" from me at that moment -and I should remember that if I see he is focusing on something, there's no need to share every little thing. That's an interaction that counts in a different way - the "chatty" spouse learns how to curb the chattiness in favor of respecting the other spouse's need for space or focus.

[notalady]

Author made up the bird scenario (also remembering the guy in the scenario is also a bird enthusiast) as an example to explain what a bid is, in context of the study results of 130 newlyweds being in a relaxing retreat together, I don't think any of the couples would be busy working or doing something else important in that setting where it's set up for the partners to connect. Anyway I thought it was a helpful example, otherwise I wouldn't have known what he meant by bids to connect.

 

To me, meaningful interactions ARE often small, mixed in with unimportant ones like the toilet paper situation, they are often undistinguished to me at the time they occur, only later when I think about it I realise that it was their "bids for connection" as the author (or the study rather) call it. And sometimes what would've been an unimportant moment only became a meaningful interaction (and a shared memory) because I responded and engaged. Like the toilet paper example you gave, I don't see it as a bid for connection. But at the same time it can also become a shared memory depending on how the partner responds. I can think of many interactions that I didn't see as important at the time that later became "remember that time".

 

So I think of every interaction as an opportunity to make a new memory, and rather "turn toward" whenever I can rather than turn away assuming it's not a meaningful interaction. It's what I've been doing subconsciously, without knowing this theory / study. So I like that the article actually brought it to my attention and helps remind me that ignoring enough of these small interactions because you're always busy or tired or lazy to engage or just disinterested (which occasionally do apply to me, especially as I get more comfortable in the relationship), that connection may be lost over time. My take away is only from the perspective of the responder, I'm not using it as "I made a bid to connect and you didn't respond, so I'm disappointed" in situations like the toilet paper example.

 

The example you gave about appreciation rather than criticism is a good one and one that I'm certainly mindful of as well.

[Batya33]

Thanks and I agree! And I agree that the topic can be one's favorite pop tart (a toaster pastry popular in the U.S.!) and that can be more meaningful than a talk about The Relationship.

[notalady]

Thanks and I agree! And I agree that the topic can be one's favorite pop tart (a toaster pastry popular in the U.S.!) and that can be more meaningful than a talk about The Relationship.

 

Exactly

[reinventmyself]

Great article!