Is any of this narcissistic behaviour?

[johnbarney]

25 minutes ago, MissCanuck said:

You have to let go of this notion. 

If she had any sort of romantic interest in you, another guy would not have been able to turn her head. It wasn't going to happen between you two, unfortunately. 

We'll never know what would have happened if she hadn't met him though

[johnbarney]

21 minutes ago, SooSad33 said:

Okay, so it made YOU happy.  But I don't think she is very happy.. Not with herself or anything right now.

Yes, if she has been messed around by other's then she is messed.. see it?

Your mindset is possibly a lot more stable than hers.

You cannot 'fix her' though.  She's most likely be much better on her own for a while, not seeking attention this way from anyone who will give it.

Don't feel sorry for her like this.  She will carry on and on like she is, until someday she hits bottom or realizes this isn't good for her and smartens up.  It takes that much sometimes for someone to realize their behaviour is wrong and doing them no good.

We all make our own choices in life and this is what it takes sometimes... before we realize we need to change and work on ourselves a while.

 

Well she was happy to keep staying with me.

But she's not on her own because she's clearly with this other guy even though she tried to deny it.

I would have always stuck by her and made sure she was ok though.

[MissCanuck]

10 minutes ago, johnbarney said:

We'll never know what would have happened if she hadn't met him though

You missed the point I was trying to make. 

The point is that if she had some solid romantic interest in you, it wouldn't have been possible for any other guy to turn her head. Not just this one. 

There wasn't enough genuine interest on her side to begin with. You're deluding yourself if you believe you could have changed that by continuing to behave like her lap dog. When we're not into someone, we're not into them. That can't be manufactured. 

[SooSad33]

12 minutes ago, johnbarney said:

Well she was happy to keep staying with me.

But she's not on her own because she's clearly with this other guy even though she tried to deny it.

I would have always stuck by her and made sure she was ok though.

Okay, but why?  Pitty for her?

I'm not sure if you're seeing this- but she was NOT into you that way & she told you this.  She was not ready & wanting a relationship.

What you wanted & what she wanted were 2 different things...

You wanted to keep hanging with her to try & get to change her mind, right?  Did it work?  No.

Whatever she is doing now with her life, is her choice and whatever she's doing with this other guy or any other guy is up to her... But, you were warned way back in the beginning of all of this.  She did not want anything with you.

 

 

[Batya33]

1 hour ago, johnbarney said:

Ah sorry to hear that 😞

I think if she definitely wasn't interested then she should have told me rather than letting me keep asking and getting more attached. You say she didn't want to hurt me but why would she block me if that's the case?

Isn't it normal to look at her new boyfriend's profile in that situation?

I don't know what will happen if I bump into her sometime because she may stay with one of the other friends sometime to come to one of the events that we go to.

So to me she didn't act completely above board but as an adult please know that someone who wants a relationship with you will want you to know that simply and directly lest you slip through their fingers because they hemmed and hawed or went on about their past mistakes and they "don't know". 

As the Harry Met Sally movie line goes -(you should see that movie ASAP given your experience) - “When you realize you want to spend the rest of your life with somebody, you want the rest of your life to start as soon as possible.”  And that also means if you realize you want to be with someone -you want that person to know ASAP.  

Now when I was on a date with a man who'd expressed serious interest in me and I saw no potential I didn't keep dating him because I did not want to lead him on -even if I told him "I'm not interested in you that way" -why lead the person on.

One time I did - met a guy at a wedding, he called and asked me out.  I had no attraction to him.  Then he said he had Rolling Stones tickets. Hmmmmm. So I said to him honestly "I would love to go but I am not interested in you that way so I understand if you don't want to take me".  He said he wanted me to go with him even as a friend, and I told him at my age then I couldn't afford the ticket price and he said fine. That's how it's done.  And guess what -he still seemed to be interested in seeing if I'd change my mind, while we were at the (awesome!) concert.  But I knew I didn't lead him on. 

However -I did keep dating men I was on the fence about but had serious intentions about - I took more time to figure out whether I could develop feelings, get to know (and potentially love) the person. 

To those men I never ever said I wasn't looking for a relationship -I simply went on dates and if I was asked to get serious then at that time I would say I wasn't yet ready or I would end it if I knew it was never  going to happen.  But the big difference is -since I did see potential I proceeded as if I was available for that to happen, I got to know the person with those intentions and I would have never ever said right off the bat "I'm not looking for anything serious" as opposed to "I am looking for something serious and would like to get to know you better before making a commitment".  Do you see the difference??

[johnbarney]

48 minutes ago, Batya33 said:

So to me she didn't act completely above board but as an adult please know that someone who wants a relationship with you will want you to know that simply and directly lest you slip through their fingers because they hemmed and hawed or went on about their past mistakes and they "don't know". 

As the Harry Met Sally movie line goes -(you should see that movie ASAP given your experience) - “When you realize you want to spend the rest of your life with somebody, you want the rest of your life to start as soon as possible.”  And that also means if you realize you want to be with someone -you want that person to know ASAP.  

Now when I was on a date with a man who'd expressed serious interest in me and I saw no potential I didn't keep dating him because I did not want to lead him on -even if I told him "I'm not interested in you that way" -why lead the person on.

One time I did - met a guy at a wedding, he called and asked me out.  I had no attraction to him.  Then he said he had Rolling Stones tickets. Hmmmmm. So I said to him honestly "I would love to go but I am not interested in you that way so I understand if you don't want to take me".  He said he wanted me to go with him even as a friend, and I told him at my age then I couldn't afford the ticket price and he said fine. That's how it's done.  And guess what -he still seemed to be interested in seeing if I'd change my mind, while we were at the (awesome!) concert.  But I knew I didn't lead him on. 

However -I did keep dating men I was on the fence about but had serious intentions about - I took more time to figure out whether I could develop feelings, get to know (and potentially love) the person. 

To those men I never ever said I wasn't looking for a relationship -I simply went on dates and if I was asked to get serious then at that time I would say I wasn't yet ready or I would end it if I knew it was never  going to happen.  But the big difference is -since I did see potential I proceeded as if I was available for that to happen, I got to know the person with those intentions and I would have never ever said right off the bat "I'm not looking for anything serious" as opposed to "I am looking for something serious and would like to get to know you better before making a commitment".  Do you see the difference??

Ah I get what you're saying, thanks. I have seen When Harry Met Sally and love it. I know how it all sounds looking at it objectively but for me, she seemed like such a lovely and genuine person and I thought that she meant everything that she said. So when she made excuses I tried to overcome them rather than assume that she never wants a relationship with me. Why does dating have to be so difficult? 😞

[johnbarney]

1 hour ago, SooSad33 said:

Okay, but why?  Pitty for her?

I'm not sure if you're seeing this- but she was NOT into you that way & she told you this.  She was not ready & wanting a relationship.

What you wanted & what she wanted were 2 different things...

You wanted to keep hanging with her to try & get to change her mind, right?  Did it work?  No.

Whatever she is doing now with her life, is her choice and whatever she's doing with this other guy or any other guy is up to her... But, you were warned way back in the beginning of all of this.  She did not want anything with you.

 

 

Because if I really like someone then that's not going to change and also I see a relationship as a serious commitment.

 

I valued her friendship and didn't think she'd end up cutting me off so it wasn't just about changing her mind.

 

True but on the other hand I'm feeling so depressed now because of what's happened whereas if she'd said no 8 weeks ago then I wouldn't be having to go through this. So can you see that it causes a lot of distress not to just be honest if you're not interested?

[johnbarney]

1 hour ago, MissCanuck said:

You missed the point I was trying to make. 

The point is that if she had some solid romantic interest in you, it wouldn't have been possible for any other guy to turn her head. Not just this one. 

There wasn't enough genuine interest on her side to begin with. You're deluding yourself if you believe you could have changed that by continuing to behave like her lap dog. When we're not into someone, we're not into them. That can't be manufactured. 

I see your point. Personally if someone that I really like wants to spend time with me then I'm not going to say no though.

[Wiseman2]

When you're both blinded by attraction and affected by loneliness, insight is difficult.

However I am being straight up about observing your role in this in order to not be hurt again in the future and move forward in peace without smothering anyone and them ghosting.

 

[MissCanuck]

3 minutes ago, johnbarney said:

I see your point. Personally if someone that I really like wants to spend time with me then I'm not going to say no though.

Then you're a huge part of your own problem. 

[Batya33]

24 minutes ago, johnbarney said:

I see your point. Personally if someone that I really like wants to spend time with me then I'm not going to say no though.

Even if you're settling for scraps and lying to yourself?

[johnbarney]

21 minutes ago, Wiseman2 said:

When you're both blinded by attraction and affected by loneliness, insight is difficult.

However I am being straight up about observing your role in this in order to not be hurt again in the future and move forward in peace without smothering anyone and them ghosting.

 

Isn't it worth making every effort to be in a relationship with someone that I really like though?

[Batya33]

28 minutes ago, johnbarney said:

Ah I get what you're saying, thanks. I have seen When Harry Met Sally and love it. I know how it all sounds looking at it objectively but for me, she seemed like such a lovely and genuine person and I thought that she meant everything that she said. So when she made excuses I tried to overcome them rather than assume that she never wants a relationship with me. Why does dating have to be so difficult? 😞

She did mean everything she said right in the beginning - you just preferred to stick with your self-denial approach.  Dating is very difficult when it's one sided.  

[johnbarney]

22 minutes ago, MissCanuck said:

Then you're a huge part of your own problem. 

😢

1 minute ago, Batya33 said:

Even if you're settling for scraps and lying to yourself?

It's still great to have spent all this time with such a special person

[johnbarney]

1 minute ago, Batya33 said:

She did mean everything she said right in the beginning - you just preferred to stick with your self-denial approach.  Dating is very difficult when it's one sided.  

But one time when she said it's hard to trust someone again, she said it's not me. That signalled to me that she would be interested once she is ready again.

[Batya33]

1 minute ago, johnbarney said:

Isn't it worth making every effort to be in a relationship with someone that I really like though?

No. It's not when there is no interest or insufficient interest on the other side.  It takes two. It's not about "I really like".  The other person has to be into you as you are into them, and see potential for a relationship as you do for them.  This is why my future husband sat me down after three platonic get togethers over a 4-5 week period -we had been engaged years earlier - and with a short simple direct two minute conversation we established that

(1) we wanted to get back together and be exclusive; (2) we were getting back together with marriage as our ultimate goal; and (3) I was willing to relocate if we got married.  OK maybe it took three minutes.  But questions one and two took less than one minute.  It shouldn't take longer other than to work out logistics when both people want to be in a relationship with each other. 

[Batya33]

2 minutes ago, johnbarney said:

😢

It's still great to have spent all this time with such a special person

That tells me you're not ready for a serious and healthful romantic relationship.  You're ready for crushes, unrequited love, being with someone you put on a pedestal because that person doesn't want you in return.  When you are ready you will not want to waste time with someone -especially when romance/your heart is involved where it's unrequited and one-sided as to commitment.  

[Batya33]

2 minutes ago, johnbarney said:

But one time when she said it's hard to trust someone again, she said it's not me. That signalled to me that she would be interested once she is ready again.

It's not about signals.  Don't go with signals.  It's about direct conversation. When my future husband wanted to be with me he didn't risk going with signals especially since long distance was going to be part of our lives - he was simple and direct "do you want to get back together."  Ask the question and listen to the answer "what are your intentions about us" or "do you want to be my girlfriend" "do you want to date me".  A person who wants to will use few words because it will be obvious to that person.  YES!  Not "I have trust issues even though I trust you so I'm not ready for a relationship" - once all the psychobabble comes in it's not YES.  Don't settle for less than an enthusiastic YES!

[DancingFool]

5 minutes ago, johnbarney said:

Isn't it worth making every effort to be in a relationship with someone that I really like though?

NO!  Effort is something that has to be reciprocated fully and if the other person is only using you and going along with whatever, but not actually giving/reciprocating, then no, it is not worth anything other than pain.

If you do not wrap your head around this, I'm afraid that you will become bitter and jaded soon enough. Dating is not difficult when you understand that the other person has to give as much as you are and if they are not doing so, or worse, only taking what you are giving, then you are setting yourself up for failure. To be frank, you are being too stubborn to see it. I hope that you do figure it out sooner rather than later.

Sorry to say that but you come across as extremely self centered - I want, I think, I do, I feel - zero regard for anything outside of me, myself, and I. You have to somehow step outside of that and start figuring out how to consider what others might think/feel/do that is different from you. A critical relationship skill.

[boltnrun]

31 minutes ago, johnbarney said:

But one time when she said it's hard to trust someone again, she said it's not me. That signalled to me that she would be interested once she is ready again.

You assumed that's what she meant. You chose to ignore what she had specifically said in favor of what you interpreted as a "signal". That's not her fault.

Wishful thinking and going way overboard for someone won't make them fall in love with you.

[Jibralta]

1 hour ago, johnbarney said:

Isn't it worth making every effort to be in a relationship with someone that I really like though?

You did just that. But despite your best effort, she went and got together with another guy. At least you can walk away knowing that you really tried. That's more than a lot of people can say.

[johnbarney]

9 hours ago, boltnrun said:

You assumed that's what she meant. You chose to ignore what she had specifically said in favor of what you interpreted as a "signal". That's not her fault.

Wishful thinking and going way overboard for someone won't make them fall in love with you.

I still think if she wasn't interested then she should have said this. I took what she said literally meaning that if she was ready for a relationship then she might want one with me.

[johnbarney]

9 hours ago, Jibralta said:

You did just that. But despite your best effort, she went and got together with another guy. At least you can walk away knowing that you really tried. That's more than a lot of people can say.

Yes but what I had thought is that we'd still be friends either way as I've only ever been nice to her and tried to keep things friendly and I thought she'd only ever be nice too.

[johnbarney]

10 hours ago, DancingFool said:

NO!  Effort is something that has to be reciprocated fully and if the other person is only using you and going along with whatever, but not actually giving/reciprocating, then no, it is not worth anything other than pain.

If you do not wrap your head around this, I'm afraid that you will become bitter and jaded soon enough. Dating is not difficult when you understand that the other person has to give as much as you are and if they are not doing so, or worse, only taking what you are giving, then you are setting yourself up for failure. To be frank, you are being too stubborn to see it. I hope that you do figure it out sooner rather than later.

Sorry to say that but you come across as extremely self centered - I want, I think, I do, I feel - zero regard for anything outside of me, myself, and I. You have to somehow step outside of that and start figuring out how to consider what others might think/feel/do that is different from you. A critical relationship skill.

Is it really self-centred to be upset about this?

[boltnrun]

37 minutes ago, johnbarney said:

I still think if she wasn't interested then she should have said this. I took what she said literally meaning that if she was ready for a relationship then she might want one with me.

She did say that. You just didn't want to hear it.

Regardless, whether or not you want to accept it, this is how things are.