Next steps

[katrina1980]

Metal has been happily married for 15 years and from reading her prior posts, I never sensed anything even remotely negative, including her original response to you. And if I did not know you and your story, I might have "assumed" the same thing.

 

She also apologized for misunderstanding which speaks volumes as to any so called negativity you are perceiving.

 

And frankly Batya and have mentioned this to you privately, I have often perceived you as quite negative when making assumptions about certain things I have posted without asking me to clarify first.

 

You have done this A LOT so I find your "assumptions" now towards metal (even after she apologized!) to be quite ungracious and unwarranted.

 

She made an incorrect assumption, and apologized..

 

Anyway, I am done here for awhile, take care.

[Batya33]

Metal has been happily married for 15 years and from reading her prior posts, I never sensed anything even remotely negative, including her original response to you. And if I did not know you and your story, I might have "assumed" the same thing.

 

She also apologized for misunderstanding which speaks volumes as to any so called negativity you are perceiving.

 

And frankly Batya and have mentioned this to you privately, I have often perceived you as quite negative when making assumptions about certain things I have posted without asking me to clarify first.

 

You have done this A LOT so I find your "assumptions" now towards metal (even after she apologized!) to be quite ungracious and unwarranted.

 

She made an incorrect assumption, and apologized..

 

Anyway, I am done here for awhile, take care.

 

Thanks for sharing your opinions! I do not make negative assumptions about people who are looking to marry for the right reasons or pursue careers or who are ambitious. And I have very positive views about men and relationships -for one thing because I mostly was treated with respect and like a lady when I was dating and found respect and admiration to be key to a healthful relationship on both ends which is why I initially gave the opinion I did to the OP.

 

I quoted the words I found objectionable particularly in response to what I wrote. And accepted her apologies. Thanks for sharing that in other contexts you find me negative. Maybe so -doesn't mean I am not entitled to object to someone else's negative assumptions about how I was a desperate gold digger who was pursuing "social standing" and just "weary of dating" in response to what I wrote. I appreciate her apology and voiced my opinion on why she initially reacted in that way. I certainly don't think it's negative to assume that two people cannot change and be right together after not being right after 8 years -that's a matter of opinion and her opinion wasn't negative -it was her opinion on why i wanted to be with him the second time around.

[Metaltwin70]

Wow Katrina, thank you so much for this post...

 

I sometimes feel you kind of get me like no-one else on here and that we could be mates IRL if we weren't on two different sides of the world..

 

Thanks again.. x

[deedee911]

I appreciate everyone's point of view. I dont appreciate people referring to him as a lazy looser. I think I've gathered that I need to make a choice but either way I need to sit right with it. I honestly think there is a lot weighing against him now. He is unemployed, but I know he will and I think things will change. I do love him as a person. And what I love the most is the effort he puts in to always try and try his best whether it is communication etc... I've dated a lot and I know what's out there. I could dump him and meet another guy that makes more, but it wouldn't be him. There is so much I live about him especially how we can have fun. I live his family and that is big for me. I think in time it will be clear what I want and it will be undeniable.if we choose to get married I will be all in or not at all and if I'm not and we will go our own ways.

[Batya33]

I appreciate everyone's point of view. I dont appreciate people referring to him as a lazy looser. I think I've gathered that I need to make a choice but either way I need to sit right with it. I honestly think there is a lot weighing against him now. He is unemployed, but I know he will and I think things will change. I do love him as a person. And what I love the most is the effort he puts in to always try and try his best whether it is communication etc... I've dated a lot and I know what's out there. I could dump him and meet another guy that makes more, but it wouldn't be him. There is so much I live about him especially how we can have fun. I live his family and that is big for me. I think in time it will be clear what I want and it will be undeniable.if we choose to get married I will be all in or not at all and if I'm not and we will go our own ways.

 

But is it just about salary? I thought it was about work ethic, ambition and work-related values? Yes it's about weighing the pros and cons and I would accept that he's not going to change -his core values and mindset especially -so are you ok with balancing the fun with the downside of not respecting and admiring him and are you ready to be the main or sole provider?

[boltnrun]

You wrote this in your original post:

"But I dont want to live a poor life or be the one who is a breadwinner."

 

Are you now ok with these things?

[Wiseman2]

Earning money, being ambitious, being financially responsible and a good character or not mutually exclusive. At 7 mos of dating, this this the observation and having fun getting to know each other stage, not the planning the wedding stage.

I could dump him and meet another guy that makes more, but it wouldn't be him. if we choose to get married I will be all in

[deedee911]

Hi all, I just wanted to provide an update.

 

It will be 9 months on the 7th of April. Things are still the same. He is still unemployed and trying to create this website. I get frustrated because he is still struggling with the same challenges he did months ago with his site. He is still looking for work and going for interviews but he told me yesterday it was mainly to get me off his back. His real dream is to start this business, but he is from my perspective so unorganized and it does seem far fetched. I told him to do what he wants and to pursue his dream. He doesnt need to look for a job for me, it's not doing me a favor.

 

It's not that I dont think he will be successful. It's just that it will take time for him to get to a place where he is bringing in steady income. I told him I want to start having a family by next year. But I think even that is far fetched because he isnt financial steady for us to even consider getting married or doing anything else.

 

I think he has issues with focus. He isnt working now and should have more than enough time to work on his business but all I see is he is spinning his wheels on the design of the website etc. He is still struggling with wording. He hasnt even found customers yet. I feel like he is buying time but ultimately just wasting mine. I know he loves me and doesnt want to lose me. But I feel it's almost unfair to hold on to me while he flounders with his business. Dont know what to do

[deedee911]

I'm so torn. Because I feel like I'm standing in his way. I dont want to change his plans on my accord and I also dont want to waiver on mine. I'll be 35 next year and my chances of having a child are going down by the year. He is turning 31 and doesnt have the same issues as me.

[Batya33]

I had my son when I was 42. Got pregnant naturally, a blessing!! I wish I had had the opportunity to start trying years earlier but I wasn't the right person to find the right person - that was part of it for sure! It was emotionally so stressful to have a high risk pregnancy and I had complications after birth.

 

This is not the guy who will be ready for you two to be trying to conceive/married within the year. No judgments -he's just not in that place not even close. You will thank your lucky stars if you have the strength right now to move on - no guarantees you will meet the right person within the right time period but what I do know is you're basically guaranteed of not meeting that person if you're with him. Let him find someone who wants to live on a wing and a prayer. I know of women like that -who stand by their man no matter what -and especially love that Jerry Maguire dynamic - they believe in "the man he's going to be" -and he might get his business off the ground in a couple of years -or not. You don't have that time to waste unless you can afford to freeze your eggs, I guess. It doesn't sound like you respect or admire his dream either.

[reinventmyself]

But I feel it's almost unfair to hold on to me while he flounders with his business. Dont know what to do

Noone can hold onto you without your permission.

You listed all of his actions or non actions.

What does the fact that you still remain with someone that you have pretty much decided is wasting your time say about you?

What kind of man and what kind of relationship do you believe you deserve?

[reinventmyself]

I had to come back and share a story of a friend who had a bf for 10 years. He always agreed that he wanted the same thing she did, marriage, the house, the kids (of their own) etc. She believed him.

 

But whenever it came time to reach a milestone, he had a road block. We can't until - we have this house, have this job, have this amount of money. Though he kept moving the goalposts, she jumped through each one of them. 10 years invested, he made the outrageous request to move 3 states away. Only then would they get married. It meant she moved away from her ailing mom, the only life she knew and separated or left behind 4 kids of different ages.

 

The truth was, he never intended on giving her what she wanted. She wasted 10 years until she realized it.

[Wiseman2]

You need to decide if you want biological kids. If so, this daydreamer you'll end up supporting, is not your guy. Stop babysitting grown men. If you stay with this guy, it will be just like having a baby... a middle aged baby.

I'll be 35 next year and my chances of having a child are going down by the year. He is turning 31 and doesnt have the same issues as me.

[deedee911]

I tried breaking up with him yesterday he smiled. He asked me calmly why I want to do this and I said it's because I dont think he is serious about being responsible. He said about what happened yesterday? I'm going to throw away what we have because of a misunderstanding? He said that he is still looking for a job but is doing his business on the side. He asked if he would rather have him doing things like drinking with his buddies or watching netflix instead of having a hobbie and a dream.

 

The misunderstanding he is referring to happened the night prior. I was applying for a job that pays very high and I looked at him and said wouldn't you like to be making this kind of money? I said that to put more fire under him to get a good job and to stop being distracted by his business which is supposed to be a SIDE thing. I asked him if he seriously even wants a job and he said "no I am just doing this to get you off my back" fast forward to when I tried to break up with him. He told me that he was angry because I was taunting him with the job I was applying for and basically rubbing it in his face that I can make a lot of money so he snapped back. He said he doesnt want a job who does? But he is looking for one anyway. He would rather have his own business. He was upset because he said I've seen how many jobs he has applied for and how many interviews hes went on. He has even turned down a couple offers because it doesnt pay a lot. He said we have a plan and hes not changing that.

 

My concern is that he is one of those guys who has all of these ideas that go no where because he is always distracted. He doesnt have good focus and that is a concern for me.

 

Ideally, I want a person that has he stuff together now. Not someone who I have to hold on to a wing and a prayer that he will do well in life. I have anxiety disorder. And this has really triggered my anxiety. That's why I told him I'm not the right person for him. I need more assurance.

 

The reality is there is no assurance in life. I could break up with him and find a guy with a great job but the hang up there could be that he is emotionally unavailable or works so much that he doesnt have time for me. There is always a trade off. And the only way I'll know for sure if this is all my fears or reality is time.

But my concern is I dont want to invest time if it leads to a negative outcome. But if i dont give it time i could become a serial dater which I dont want to be...

[Wiseman2]

You're dating. Stop trying to fix, change and micromanage him. That is true for any dating/relationship situation. What you see is what you get.

I looked at him and said wouldn't you like to be making this kind of money?

he said "no I am just doing this to get you off my back"

I want a person that has he stuff together now.

[deedee911]

You know I wasnt always as put together as I am today. I had people turn their back on me and break up with me in my worst times. Why cant I be there for him to see it through.

 

I think people today just give up so easy. With online dating they can just pick and chose similar to online shopping. Hes not as much as a wreck as i was but he needs support. And I'm still living my life which he is supporting me with too. Being there for me and being my rock

 

He will get a job eventually and the joke will be on me for bailing on him.

[boltnrun]

You know I wasnt always as put together as I am today. I had people turn their back on me and break up with me in my worst times. Why cant I be there for him to see it through.

 

I think people today just give up so easy. With online dating they can just pick and chose similar to online shopping. Hes not as much as a wreck as i was but he needs support. And I'm still living my life which he is supporting me with too. Being there for me and being my rock

 

He will get a job eventually and the joke will be on me for bailing on him.

 

Do you think "eventually" will be soon enough for you to have the biological children you say you want within the next year?

[Batya33]

You know I wasnt always as put together as I am today. I had people turn their back on me and break up with me in my worst times. Why cant I be there for him to see it through.

 

I think people today just give up so easy. With online dating they can just pick and chose similar to online shopping. Hes not as much as a wreck as i was but he needs support. And I'm still living my life which he is supporting me with too. Being there for me and being my rock

 

He will get a job eventually and the joke will be on me for bailing on him.

 

No, nothing to do with online dating - unless you're referring to people who date online rather than meeting in person. I think on line dating is what used to be written personal ads, what used to be going out to bars/clubs -if you're the type of person who prefers the thrill of the chase, the ego boost of dating a lot of people but you have no long term goals, that person will find a way to make that happen whether it's a website or a bar or whatever.

 

If you want to be supportive and also take care of you here is my suggestion. Tell him you two want different things since you want to start a family in the near future and he is not there yet. So you will certainly be there as a support -meaning you will facilitate his actions -you will help him with a resume he writes, help him with an interview or a networking opportunity he shows he wants to go to, or you might forward info on a networking opportunity if that works. But as his platonic friend, not his romantic partner. You will help him find a good career counselor, or a therapist, or if you meet someone who is in his line of work you'll connect them. As friends. Then you can know you are being a support to him and you are also being true to yourself and your values. And he can remain a support to you too.

 

How are you going to feel when you're 40 and you haven't frozen your eggs and he is still status quo - when your friends are telling you they are sleep deprived from their newborns and you say "yes, and I am working hard to be emotionally supportive of Boyfriend and be there for him - this is what I realized I really want rather than trying to have a child - so please call me when you are not sleeping because I might be up helping Boyfriend with one of his business ideas - I'm so glad we're both doing what we want to do!"

 

Please don't make this your standard "I stand by my man because "society" gives up too easy these days!".

[deedee911]

I see your point, but doesnt it have to be so black and white? I'm not trying to disagree but what I need is to look at all angles before I make a decision either way.

 

Other factors: he has a lot of money saved up, he treats me really well, and all he is missing is a job. He has a good family and we get along well. And he has zero debt which is a lot better off than 90% of the population.

 

He even admitted that he has been scrambling and spreading himself thin. So now he is making a plan to allow time to look for work and do his hobby which is the website so he can still do what he loves without going totally insane. I dknt know about your economy but in canada it's really bad. Some people get laid off and out of work for years. Before I got the job I have I was unemployed for 6 months and going out of my mind. A very tough time. But now 5 years later I am financially stable, successful and doing well in life. Many people thought I wouldn't amount to much because I travelled a lot and was very lost. I had so many things on the go and accomplished nothing at that time. I showed them wrong.

[deedee911]

Battya you know that he wouldn't just want me to be his friend. Either I stand by his side while he is low or exist completely. I cant cherry pick, then when he gets a job I can say oh we can be together again.

[Batya33]

Battya you know that he wouldn't just want me to be his friend. Either I stand by his side while he is low or exist completely. I cant cherry pick, then when he gets a job I can say oh we can be together again.

 

No that is not what I meant at all. You said you shouldn't bail on him. I agree. You can still be there for him should he want your input on his dream career/business. That's not cherry picking -that's parting ways romantically given your incompatible goals. In what way is he being supportive of your goal to be a married mother within the next year or so? Also how is he "low?" It sounds like he is focused on starting this business - that's not low -that's pursuing a dream.

 

How is he treating you well with respect to your life goals?

 

If you knew now he was never going to marry you, how long would you stay? If you knew now he was not going to be ready to try to conceive a child within the next two years, how long would you stay?

[boltnrun]

I see your point, but doesnt it have to be so black and white? I'm not trying to disagree but what I need is to look at all angles before I make a decision either way.

 

Other factors: he has a lot of money saved up, he treats me really well, and all he is missing is a job. He has a good family and we get along well. And he has zero debt which is a lot better off than 90% of the population.

 

He even admitted that he has been scrambling and spreading himself thin. So now he is making a plan to allow time to look for work and do his hobby which is the website so he can still do what he loves without going totally insane. I dknt know about your economy but in canada it's really bad. Some people get laid off and out of work for years. Before I got the job I have I was unemployed for 6 months and going out of my mind. A very tough time. But now 5 years later I am financially stable, successful and doing well in life. Many people thought I wouldn't amount to much because I travelled a lot and was very lost. I had so many things on the go and accomplished nothing at that time. I showed them wrong.

 

So you are fine with the way things are and you no longer have the goal of a child within a year's time?

 

So, what's the problem?

[deedee911]

What makes you think he couldn't be ready to have a child in one year?

[deedee911]

We have been together for 9 months. I would like to wait a year until we are engaged then start trying for a child which is online with when I am ready to have a child. I wouldn't want a child any sooner...

[deedee911]

I do not mean disrespect. But I am genuinely wanting to know reasons why he couldn't be ready? If he gets a job within the next few months we will be fine. If he doesnt get a job by the summer then obviously there is a serious issue.