Another online daing journal

[WithLove]

I don't think he got better at it. I think he got better at hiding it.

[reinventmyself]

I don't think he got better at it. I think he got better at hiding it.

 

Yah. . we had a conversation about that.

I had to give him credit for getting better (reinforcement) but at the same time I told him I often wondered if he was just better at hiding it and cautioned him it would spill out eventually.

And it did.

[WithLove]

It did indeed. I'm sorry, Reinvent. It's good that you took stock and understood that while you're still hurting, you're still slightly better than last week. That's a good thing. Continue keeping your friends and family close. Keep updating your journal. (((hugs)))

[reinventmyself]

It did indeed. I'm sorry, Reinvent. It's good that you took stock and understood that while you're still hurting, you're still slightly better than last week. That's a good thing. Continue keeping your friends and family close. Keep updating your journal. (((hugs)))

Thanks WL.

Bare with me as I spew all these things down. As the dust settles I am able to see things more objectively. It just helps so much to purge them all.

It concerns me that I still miss him sooo much. I am afraid if he reached out right now I am still in a place to be tempted.

[reinventmyself]

I told him once of an online journal and a forum where people exchange advise. Only because I was playing with my phone more than once around him and responding on here.

He always needed to know what I was doing while I was on my phone or who called or text. I was very transparent with him thinking it would help.

 

Mistake! I could tell that threatened him. He asked too many questions and I squashed the conversation after I told him that the journal was private. OK. . so I lied.

He asked if I exchanged advise with men and I told him yes and that wound him up.

I quickly stopped the conversation because he has no say so on whether or not I do this and I could tell he might think otherwise.

 

For all I know he has found this. . Ask me if I care.

And. . .my user name is the same I used for my OLD profile so it wouldn't be hard to find me. If he really wanted to.

[Ms Darcy]

Yah. . we had a conversation about that.

I had to give him credit for getting better (reinforcement) but at the same time I told him I often wondered if he was just better at hiding it and cautioned him it would spill out eventually.

And it did.

 

I think that he wanted to avoid some of the drama by bottling it up. But in turn that just ate at him and he had to end it.

 

That's another sign of incompatibility. I certainly wouldn't want to be with someone who couldn't even stand to see my old house because I lived there with an ex.

[reinventmyself]

I think that he wanted to avoid some pf the drama by bottling it up. But in turn that just ate at him and he had to end it.

 

When we are left behind it takes such a hit to our self esteem.

But I am choosing to go with this (what you just wrote). Even if it's not true it helps me feel better.

 

There is no doubt S had admitted insecurities. It's almost the tool he used to try to keep me in line at times.

Seeing I couldn't/wouldn't acquiesce to all of his requests and left him to deal with his insecurities as he should. . he just couldn't do it any longer.

 

I remember a conversation with him about a certain insecurity. I don't recall which one, there were so many.

I was empathetic and listened. But it didn't have anything to do with me or anything I did. At some point he said `I wasn't giving him what he needed'

He was correct.

I can't imagine what the right woman for him would look like. I guess I don't want to.

[Fudgie]

I think it's actually very likely that it's true, reinvent. He never actually dealt with his insecurities. He bottled them up and sat and scowled. It just festered and at some point, it just bubbled over for him and he had to end it. That's it really. No, I'm not saying that as a white lie to make you feel better, that's what I think happened.

 

I think I know what kind of woman would be "right" for him (in the sense of him not needing to change or address his insecurities) and trust me, it's not a good picture. I could see her as being not only childless, but unmarried (not divorced/widowed), most likely without any real LTRs in her past. Virgin would be best but it's hard to find that with older women unless you want to date an ex-nun fresh out of the nunnery. But it would be someone who has very little past whatsoever with men and he could be absolutely sure that he wouldn't have to be near that little past at all, because she would never talk about (out of shame?) and maybe the past lover is dead or halfway across the earth so he doesn't have to worry about that.

 

She wouldn't have any male friends or associates. She would dress modestly (flats, long sleeves, no cleavage) wherever she went, reserving her sexy things (high heels, etc) for him only. As in, to wear at home or exclusively on dates with him, no one else. If other men came near her, she would avert her eyes and avoid all contact so S wouldn't be wondering if she looked at him in a flirting way or if she "invited" contact. She would answer calls/texts from S promptly at all times. When he requested a "report" from her, she would oblige.

 

Of course, she would have no problem with him going out to dinner with female friends until late in the night. Maybe at some point she asks him why, and he says something to the effect of "Well, no sweetie, I trust YOU, it's just that I don't trust THEM. I also have insecurity problems that stem from meanie ol' women screwing me over in the past. I appreciate you doing all of this to assuage my fears" And then he goes back out again while she sits at home and waits.

 

Of course, it doesn't matter what she does or what she says, because deep down (DUE TO NO FAULT OF HERS OR ANYTHING ABOUT HER), he still assumes the worst. Her Facebook is probably filled with pictures of her hanging off of exes. Her guy friends all want to bone her and she probably thinks about them in that way sometimes too.

 

That's his "ideal" woman would look like and that is no way to live at all. My ex N likely wanted something like that as well. Towards the end of our relationship, he told me that he was upset that I didn't feel more "shame" at my past, why couldn't I just hide it away and never bring it up EVER, how dare I dress up like a wench in a corset at the Renaissance fair with him - I looked like w__e and I was probably doing it for male attention, and "how was your day" turned into a hour-by-hour "daily report" of my doings and who I talked to, etc.

 

At the end of the day, still I wonder:

How broken is someone who, in order to feel secure, needs someone who is not really whole themselves...?

 

I'm here for you, reinvent. You are not his ideal woman and I am happy that you are not his ideal woman, someone who lacks a past, many meaningful relationships, meek in demeanor, and tied to him through a digital leash (cell phone).

[reinventmyself]

I think it's actually very likely that it's true, reinvent. He never actually dealt with his insecurities. He bottled them up and sat and scowled. It just festered and at some point, it just bubbled over for him and he had to end it. That's it really. No, I'm not saying that as a white lie to make you feel better, that's what I think happened.

 

 

At the end of the day, still I wonder:

How broken is someone who, in order to feel secure, needs someone who is not really whole themselves...?

 

I'm here for you, reinvent. You are not his ideal woman and I am happy that you are not his ideal woman, someone who lacks a past, many meaningful relationships, meek in demeanor, and tied to him through a digital leash (cell phone).

 

Thanks Fudgie. Your response means a lot.

Processing. . .

[Ms Darcy]

I think that he wanted to avoid some of the drama by bottling it up. But in turn that just ate at him and he had to end it.

 

That's another sign of incompatibility. I certainly wouldn't want to be with someone who couldn't even stand to see my old house because I lived there with an ex.

 

When we are left behind it takes such a hit to our self esteem.

But I am choosing to go with this (what you just wrote). Even if it's not true it helps me feel better.

 

Actually, I think that's what happened. That's why I said it I think he bottled it up until he couldn't take it anymore.

 

If anything, that's a good thing in the long run. He was not the right person for you. And you would have kept pretzel-ing to make him happy.

[reinventmyself]

Actually, I think that's what happened. That's why I said it I think he bottled it up until he couldn't take it anymore.

 

If anything, that's a good thing in the long run. He was not the right person for you. And you would have kept pretzel-ing to make him happy.

 

I left my marriage for similar reasons.

If I wanted to do the pretzel thing (funny because it's the exact term I used at the time) I would have stayed married and my sons would have had an intact family.

I didn't come this far to do a version of that again.

 

My therapist will have fun with me on Wed.

Last time I saw him was after my last controlling relationship that was 3 years ago. I swore to him then I didn't see the signs. He scoffed at me and proved I did. I just chose to ignore them.

 

By what I have written would you say S was controlling?

(so sad I have to ask. . but I see control every where. Not sure if it's them or me at times)

I have my mom to thank for putting doubts in my mind over the weekend.

[WithLove]

It's still a form of control, even if he didn't do anything like forcibly, because it caused you to change your normal behavior to accommodate his.

[reinventmyself]

My therapist moved our meeting up to tonight.

I am so fortunate to have this therapist. I started seeing him in 1999?

Good grief. He knows me all to well and will know exactly why I am coming to see him.

It's almost a joke of ours. I only see him when I break up with someone.

 

I reached out immediately post break up but he was on vacation. It am glad that some time has passed because I have sorted alot of it out myself.

I do want to know . .and I don't know how to articulate it exactly is - how I get in these circular arguments with men. The ones that feel like you are trying to ride a bronco bull while they are trying to throw you off.

 

My first couple conflicts with S, I was pretty good about it. I sat quietly and listened closely.

I waited to respond thoughtfully and then - the diversion.

Calmly I responded that I will address the issue #2, but if we could first continue to stay on track with issue #1.

And then it just starts spinning and I get lost. Issues pile on #3,#4. . It takes me back to a bad place in my past.

 

I am pretty sure that's their intention. To bamboozle me so I get overwhelmed. Yah, it works. Nothing gets resolved.

At times I just shut down. Most times I am quietly processing what's going on.

 

In the end I lost my patience with S. The constant grilling about being insecure and nothing I said was right.

I don't think he wanted me to get it right. I even asked him what it is he needed to hear from me and he couldn't give me a straight answer.

I try to be empathetic in hopes that I get it in return, but I don't.

 

I am not a victim in this. .it takes two. I just want to know what I am doing wrong.

My last 3 serious relationships were like this.

[reinventmyself]

ok. . .so I just googled `circular arguments in relationships' and I am disturbed.

 

(stuff I should already know)

[Realitynut]

Do you always want to be right? I know my ex thought that of me. And he once told me...you always have to be RIGHT...but you are WRONG. So in him telling me I was wrong...he in all respects, was making himself RIGHT.

 

I tried to explain to him, that it's not about who's right or wrong...but he wouldn't listen.

 

I, in the end...am overly sensitive (more like S) and Tom was very quick to anger....and absolutely NO empathy. When i'd ask...do you understand where I'm coming from? Do you even have 1% empathy on how I'm feeling? He said NO... I don't get it at all.

 

It was about him dating another woman....while still seeing me every couple of weeks. After 2 months of dating her....and dumping her to come back to me...I found all this found he bought 'for her' in his kitchen. (gluten free) but yet he never bought anything for me....NEVER. It hurt. I said something. Made him angry.

 

I guess like you and S...just on different wave lengths.

 

I definitely see you as the typical 'male' counterpart in most relationships....and him the overly sensitive, jealous female.

 

My sister is married to a man, that she admits, she's the man in the relationship...and he's the girl. Even tho he's a masculine, controlling, retired cop! She was able to 'out control him' after being single for her first 48 years! lol

[Realitynut]

lol....now i'm going to google it. I'm always up for learning. And my ex...NO WAY. Relationship books. Nope. Stupid. Therapists. Nope. What do they know. Ena. Nope. They don't have a life.

[reinventmyself]

The article cautions you that you are on a slippery slope when you catch yourself trying to explain human behavior and emotions to another person.

Explaining what empathy is and how it ought to work is a perfect example. I have been guilty of that more than once.

 

For S and I, we would see things differently sometimes. Right? We are different people. It's neither right or wrong, it's just about being of different minds and respecting the other's point a view and not feeling injured by it.

 

In the end he said we couldn't resolve conflicts. Well, there often isn't a black and white answer for each scenario. I may not agree with S's position on something but I trust his intentions were good, they were in the right place and that he loved me. Therefore I am not threatened by his difference of opinion even if it was difficult to hear.

 

For S, there had to be a winner and loser and someone better take all the responsibility for it.

(Yah. . well, S is retired DEA agent and a military fighter pilot. But probably one of the most insecure men when it comes to personal relationships I have ever met. Vocation means squat)

 

Oh. . and I am not masculine by any means. I just think in comparison to the last two men I have chosen. .I have a tiny bit more confidence?

[reinventmyself]

Had an elightening visit with my therapist.

Still processing it.

He referred to S as a psycho bully, using his insecurities as a disibiity that he insisted I needed to accommodate to, when it was his job to work on them and self soothe. Instead S was making it my responsibility.

It would have just continued to escalate, much like it did

He suspects S frustration continued to as long as I set limits and wouldn't give in to some of the demands and held my own. It created too much anxiety for him and that's why he said he couldn't do it any more

. . Much like some have already pointed out

[notalady]

I'm interested to see the article you're talking about

[reinventmyself]

I'm interested to see the article you're talking about

Gosh. I probably couldn't find the exact one. I was reading so much about `circular arguments in relationships' and the concept kept showing up in articles about signs of abusive relationships. (crazy making conversations)

I've read it before more than once.

It's a signal that things are going off the rails when you are trying to explain basic decent behavior to your partner. .as if they don't already get it

Sort of like explaining to a small child how to play nice.

[reinventmyself]

I got maybe a third of the way through writing one of those 'letters you never send' and had to stop.

Besides being at work, I am just drained. Between processing my therapy appointment and everything else I just need a break.

That and letter was pretty upsetting, listing all the comments he made and being embarrassed that I tolerated it as long as I did.

All the while missing the good parts of him. It's hard to wrap my head around.

I'll finish it. . someday. Just not today.

Getting ready to meet a friend for a much deserved jalapeño margarita.

[Ms Darcy]

I added your post about happy well adjusted people knowing crazy when they see it and avoiding it.

 

Give yourself your own advice. You know best.

[reinventmyself]

I added your post about happy well adjusted people knowing crazy when they see it and avoiding it.

 

Give yourself your own advice. You know best.

Yah, great at dishing out aren't I?

[Realitynut]

Oh. . and I am not masculine by any means.

 

lol...I did not mean you were masculine by any means....but the more 'dominate' one in the relationship. My sister use to say, before she was married, I'm like the guy in the relationship, I want to have sex, and then have them go home. She was MUCH more self-confident than her 'masculine' husband. He would cry if he gave her a card, and she didn't seem appreciative enough...etc. etc.

 

My sis is a very girly-girl. Always wearing high heels and long hair and fake nails! So not masculine...but one in CONTROL. I thought that tonite as I saw them drive off....and she was driving, with him in the passenger seat. Her car....but still.

[Ms Darcy]

I think that he wanted to avoid some of the drama by bottling it up. But in turn that just ate at him and he had to end it.

 

That's another sign of incompatibility. I certainly wouldn't want to be with someone who couldn't even stand to see my old house because I lived there with an ex.

 

When we are left behind it takes such a hit to our self esteem.

But I am choosing to go with this (what you just wrote). Even if it's not true it helps me feel better.

 

There is no doubt S had admitted insecurities. It's almost the tool he used to try to keep me in line at times.

Seeing I couldn't/wouldn't acquiesce to all of his requests and left him to deal with his insecurities as he should. . he just couldn't do it any longer.

 

I remember a conversation with him about a certain insecurity. I don't recall which one, there were so many.

I was empathetic and listened. But it didn't have anything to do with me or anything I did. At some point he said `I wasn't giving him what he needed'

He was correct.

I can't imagine what the right woman for him would look like. I guess I don't want to.

 

Yah, great at dishing out aren't I?

 

I added to my signature because it's great advice and it's true. Sometimes, you have to take a step back and think of what you would say to someone else in your own situation.