Another online daing journal

[notalady]

Also you know sometimes people admit they have an issue, but is just a roundabout way of getting you to satisfy / fuel their unhealthy needs (eg getting you to explain yourself thereby gaining temporary comfort in knowing that he had nothing to worry about...until next time).

[saluk]

Sigh. No this doesn't sound like a problem he is going to come to terms with in this relationship, if ever. You may have gotten him to admit he has a problem with it, but his belief that men and women can't be friends is deeply seated and from the sound of it he hasn't actually budged on that point.

 

You mentioned problems with dating at an age.. I think a bigger issue than the baggage people come with, is how solid and unchangeable most people's beliefs and thought patterns are at this point. It makes it hard for you to adapt to each other. If this weren't an issue that affected you both directly you could put it on the shelf - but his way of thinking comes into direct conflict with how you live your life.

[Silverbirch]

Being an older woman myself, I wonder if it's just that we have a greater awareness of potential issues in relationships. When I look ba pick on relationships I had when I was younger, I wonder what I was thinking, why I didn't recognise red flags - actually, I think I chose to turn a blind eye to a lot if things. I'd say a lot of us become more and more discerning as we get older, especially when we enjoy being single.

[WithLove]

I don't really think this is something he can change.

 

He may cover it up, tell you he isn't bothered... but he'll internalize it and eventually burst.

[reinventmyself]

I have learned to view things like this as a symptom of bigger problem.

On the outside the jealousy is a symptom of something larger he needs to address.

I don't think he sees it that way. Listening to him, he thinks over time and exposure and getting to know who I am better it will lessen.

Personally, I think that is going about it the wrong way. He needs to look within and not at me and my actions for his answers.

I also told him he could try to hide it . ..but it will likely spill out in other ways.

 

I was firm but gentle when I summed things up. I asked him if he thought he would `be able to get to the other side on this'.

He believed so. (expected response)

With that I cautioned him that all of this affected how I felt about him and whether or not I could continue the relationship.

So more or less, he's on notice.

That's all I can do right now.

 

As I said previously, the opportunity for proof is in the next following weeks, where we won't be seeing much of each other due to work schedules.

I will be out and about with my friends and carrying on as I always do and with him in another country every week, he has little or not contact with me.

 

. . When this first came up (notalady recalled S friends greeting that he had an issue with) and we talked about my friends, my views and my social life. I asked him straight up if when considering the distance and his constant travel, was he going to have some anxiety about what I am doing in his absence.

He denied foreseeing any problems in the future and was totally comfortable with everything. (at least that's what he said at the time)

 

I reminded him of this conversation this last weekend. I also shared with him that I have, from day one told him what I am about and this is what he signed up for.

For him to have issues after the fact wasn't anywhere fair to either of us.

 

I told him I didn't want to be in a relationship with someone who didn't trust me. Of course he said he trusted me. (doubtful)

And I didn't want him to be in a relationship where he had any anxiety about what he partner was doing with their own personal time.

That that would clearly be no fun for anyone.

 

so that's where I am at.

I don't suppose I have seen the last of this. .

[WithLove]

"I have learned to view things like this as a symptom of bigger problem.

On the outside the jealousy is a symptom of something larger he needs to address."

 

To me, it means - ultimately, he'll never fully trust you, or worse, he doesn't trust anyone else around you. Either way, you're going to get stifled.

 

Ugh. This sucks, Reinvent.

[reinventmyself]

I saw this today on FB:

 

"BE HONEST WITH PEOPLE ABOUT WHO YOU ARE, WHAT YOU WANT AND HOW YOU WANT TO BE TREATED.

STANDARDS ONLY SCARE OFF PEOPLE WHO AREN'T MEANT FOR YOU"

 

I feel like I want to copy and paste this on every post today. It's just perfect rule to live ones life by.

Life would be much easier, don't you think?

Sadly, doing this very thing is absolutely frightening to most people.

[notalady]

I saw this today on FB:

 

"BE HONEST WITH PEOPLE ABOUT WHO YOU ARE, WHAT YOU WANT AND HOW YOU WANT TO BE TREATED.

STANDARDS ONLY SCARE OFF PEOPLE WHO AREN'T MEANT FOR YOU"

 

I feel like I want to copy and paste this on every post today. It's just perfect rule to live ones life by.

Life would be much easier, don't you think?

Sadly, doing this very thing is absolutely frightening to most people.

 

Yep very true. They're afraid that if they scare off this person, there's will be no one left, but that's often not true.

[WithLove]

Because - being with someone not meant for you is better than being alone.

[reinventmyself]

Not much to report.

Funny how with a couple days off and the `issue' not in foreground, I can enjoy his company immensely.

I saw him Wednesday night and decided to set the hot button issue aside for the night and just enjoy his company.

Sigh. . I just want to compartmentalize that part and pray the jealously thing doesn't rear it's ugly head again.

We will spend the weekend together and then I don't know what the next few weeks will look like in his absence.

Taking it day by day

[notalady]

You know it's never all bad, it's good until the bad inevitably comes out again. Oh well, enjoy it for what it is!

[faraday]

Have fun. See how it goes. You're right, any newish relationship should be taken day by day....and not everything is going to always be perfect. It's learning how to work through things that's the deciding factor on if it becomes a deal breaker or works itself out...until then, just enjoy the ride.

[reinventmyself]

thx. . nl and farday. .

Have a good weekend!

[Realitynut]

I don't remember EVER being in a relationship where the guy is jealous. I think mostly they didn't think a guy would be attracted to me!!! lol

 

I was probably the jealous type. I remember going to a party after I first met my husband to be, and a woman sat on his lap, who I didn't know. I was soooooo pissed. Now if I was at a party and we were all friends, and my gf jokingly sat on my bf's lap...I probably wouldn't care. But to be honest, none of my friends would cross that boundary.

 

My dad on the other hand was extremely jealous of mom. When mom would go to the Dr. and he was cute....dad was jealous. Mom would come home from the grocery store and go on and on how she liked this check out boy. (he reminded her of her fav grandson!) Mom said dad acted jealous.

 

Of course....dad had affairs all his life. Mom didn't.

 

I can't put myself in your shoes....because I've never been in those shoes. I imagine a tad jealous I could handle....but not stifling jealousy.

And I KNOW you can be friends with the opposite sex....and not feel anything for them. For a FACT! lol

[notalady]

I don't remember EVER being in a relationship where the guy is jealous. I think mostly they didn't think a guy would be attracted to me!!! lol

 

I was probably the jealous type. I remember going to a party after I first met my husband to be, and a woman sat on his lap, who I didn't know. I was soooooo pissed. Now if I was at a party and we were all friends, and my gf jokingly sat on my bf's lap...I probably wouldn't care. But to be honest, none of my friends would cross that boundary.

 

My dad on the other hand was extremely jealous of mom. When mom would go to the Dr. and he was cute....dad was jealous. Mom would come home from the grocery store and go on and on how she liked this check out boy. (he reminded her of her fav grandson!) Mom said dad acted jealous.

 

Of course....dad had affairs all his life. Mom didn't.

 

I can't put myself in your shoes....because I've never been in those shoes. I imagine a tad jealous I could handle....but not stifling jealousy.

And I KNOW you can be friends with the opposite sex....and not feel anything for them. For a FACT! lol

 

It's not about being jealous though, if a woman sits on my partner's lap (at a party or anywhere), and he allows it, that shows a lack of boundaries and lack of respect of my relationship, and for that, I am fully right to be upset (or at least uncomfortable) about the incidence. Jealous to me is a negative term, where someone feels negative about something for unjustified reasons or based on pure speculation (their own imagination) with no basis. I would not use that word to describe when one partner has reason to suspect something is not quite right (and feel upset about that). In reinvent's case, it seems that the word jealous is an appropriate description.

 

Also your parents case is interesting and slightly different still. Your dad is jealous or suspicious all the time because he himself is one who would cheat under the same circumstances, so he assumes everyone think that way. Like, "how could she not cheat if she was hit on by that handsome young man, I would if it were a hot young chick hitting on me."

[reinventmyself]

S made a comment over the weekend.

He was discussing his plans for today, tennis with the guys and then lunch.

He then added ` I suppose I could go out with them for happy hour and talk to a bunch of women'

I am thinking that was a dig for me but I chose to not react and instead responded: `hmmm. . why would you want to do that?'

He said `I wouldn't!'

 

I changed the subject and acted like I didn't get the point he was not so subtly trying to get across.

 

I gave this some more thought on my drive home yesterday.

 

I must admit that my friends and I spend at least once or twice a week going to very nice restaurants/bars where there is live music and have a drink. I am not much of a drinker (but my friends are!) and I do enjoy the outlet and being amongst my single girl friends. There is an occasional guy friend that joins us. S knows this.

 

Having said that if this is how S spent his free time, it might give me a minor pause. Not enough to get ever get jealous about and I would certainly not make comments, subtle or otherwise. But I do kinda get how he might feel, especially given his circle of friends don't do this kind of thing so at this age and this point in his life, it's not his thing.

 

I have included S on one occasion to join my friends and the second time we decided not to go.

 

S had just got in from a trip that particular afternoon and honestly I wasn't convinced that he was just tired or possibly being passive aggressive about it.

 

It's just a minor speculation on my part. .probably not fair to mention it, but we'll see if the opportunity arises again and if he'll want to go or not. But seeing this is the sensitive issue, it did make my spidey senses go up.

 

I also need to fair and as much as this is or can be an issue. . I can see where I can be really hyper vigilant about it.

 

So that's it. We had a great weekend, yet it was only he and I. As it turns out he only has 2 weekends off between now and June!

There will be an occasional midweek day we can see each other, but the logistics of work, my schedule, it won't be real quality time.

 

Bring on the test. .. We'll see what this is made of!

[browneyedgirl36]

S made a comment over the weekend.

He was discussing his plans for today, tennis with the guys and then lunch.

He then added ` I suppose I could go out with them for happy hour and talk to a bunch of women'

I am thinking that was a dig for me but I chose to not react and instead responded: `hmmm. . why would you want to do that?'

He said `I wouldn't!'

 

I changed the subject and acted like I didn't get the point he was not so subtly trying to get across.

 

I gave this some more thought on my drive home yesterday.

 

I must admit that my friends and I spend at least once or twice a week going to very nice restaurants/bars where there is live music and have a drink. I am not much of a drinker (but my friends are!) and I do enjoy the outlet and being amongst my single girl friends. There is an occasional guy friend that joins us. S knows this.

 

Having said that if this is how S spent his free time, it might give me a minor pause. Not enough to get ever get jealous about and I would certainly not make comments, subtle or otherwise. But I do kinda get how he might feel, especially given his circle of friends don't do this kind of thing so at this age and this point in his life, it's not his thing.

 

I have included S on one occasion to join my friends and the second time we decided not to go.

 

S had just got in from a trip that particular afternoon and honestly I wasn't convinced that he was just tired or possibly being passive aggressive about it.

 

It's just a minor speculation on my part. .probably not fair to mention it, but we'll see if the opportunity arises again and if he'll want to go or not. But seeing this is the sensitive issue, it did make my spidey senses go up.

 

I also need to fair and as much as this is or can be an issue. . I can see where I can be really hyper vigilant about it.

 

So that's it. We had a great weekend, yet it was only he and I. As it turns out he only has 2 weekends off between now and June!

There will be an occasional midweek day we can see each other, but the logistics of work, my schedule, it won't be real quality time.

 

Bring on the test. .. We'll see what this is made of!

 

Hmmm...I hope you don't think I'm being harsh here, but...it sounds like you're trying to explain away S's VERY (in my opinion, at least) passive-aggressive comment. It sounds as though he's trying to equate you going out with your girlfriends (and the occasional guy friend showing up) with him "going to happy hour" and "talking to a bunch of women. NOT THE SAME THING AT ALL! You have EVERY right to go out with your girlfriends, without him, and if men happen to be there and you happen to have a conversation with one of them...so what? It's not the same thing as going out to happy hour and actively, purposefully surrounding yourself with members of the opposite sex and chatting them up. Men and women most certainly CAN be friends -- and they can definitely have platonic conversations. Sheesh!

 

reinvent, I appreciate that you're trying to give this guy a chance, but...I feel like you're maybe giving him a bit too much of a chance here. His trust issues are not your problem, and his attempts to equate you going out with friends -- for the express purpose of seeing your friends and catching up with them -- with him going to happy hour with the express purpose of chatting up women -- well...it's totally transparent, and it says a LOT about his issues.

 

 

I'm not saying it's not fine to include him in your friend hangouts sometimes. My boyfriend has been invited to hang with me and my friends on occasion, and he's going to Easter brunch with me and some friends of mine -- a yearly tradition) -- but I don't feel compelled to invite him. I can do things without him -- and he without me -- without any worries on either person's part. He knows I'm not going to pick up any men -- or even flirt with them -- and I know he won't hit on women, either.

 

As I've said before, it's early days, and these things tend to get much worse -- not better -- as time goes on and more of a person's character is revealed. You're a great lady. You don't need this stuff!

[reinventmyself]

Hmmm...I hope you don't think I'm being harsh here, but...it sounds like you're trying to explain away S's VERY (in my opinion, at least) passive-aggressive comment. It sounds as though he's trying to equate you going out with your girlfriends (and the occasional guy friend showing up) with him "going to happy hour" and "talking to a bunch of women. NOT THE SAME THING AT ALL! You have EVERY right to go out with your girlfriends, without him, and if men happen to be there and you happen to have a conversation with one of them...so what? It's not the same thing as going out to happy hour and actively, purposefully surrounding yourself with members of the opposite sex and chatting them up. Men and women most certainly CAN be friends -- and they can definitely have platonic conversations. Sheesh!

 

reinvent, I appreciate that you're trying to give this guy a chance, but...I feel like you're maybe giving him a bit too much of a chance here. His trust issues are not your problem, and his attempts to equate you going out with friends -- for the express purpose of seeing your friends and catching up with them -- with him going to happy hour with the express purpose of chatting up women -- well...it's totally transparent, and it says a LOT about his issues.

 

 

I'm not saying it's not fine to include him in your friend hangouts sometimes. My boyfriend has been invited to hang with me and my friends on occasion, and he's going to Easter brunch with me and some friends of mine -- a yearly tradition) -- but I don't feel compelled to invite him. I can do things without him -- and he without me -- without any worries on either person's part. He knows I'm not going to pick up any men -- or even flirt with them -- and I know he won't hit on women, either.

 

As I've said before, it's early days, and these things tend to get much worse -- not better -- as time goes on and more of a person's character is revealed. You're a great lady. You don't need this stuff!

 

You aren't being harsh at all and I see things exactly the way you do!

I am neither rationalizing his behavior or going easy on him.

 

 

I am however taking everything in . .

[faraday]

I agree with BEG.

 

I've dated a guy that said the exact same thing to me. He was very passive aggressive and extremely jealous...and that kind of stuff came out of his mouth all the time.

 

You're going out with friends. That's allowed. It should be encouraged, actually. It's not like you're going speed dating, or to a swingers club.

 

Just keep your eyes open...his comment made my hackles rise.

[reinventmyself]

I did just call him on my lunch break and asked him about the comment.

 

He said he did remember the happy hour comment but not the talking to women part.

We had been talking about how many people our age socialized this way but not he and not his friends.

His comment could have been ambiguous. . not sure.

He's not very subtle when something is on his mind. That I know for sure.

 

I am walking a thin line here. .Having been with controlling men and passive aggressive ones as well.

I see it everywhere I look.

Not to say he's definitely neither. . Just trying to discern what's his and what's mine.

 

With him being gone now I think in some ways I am looking for the battle or final straw that I think may happen.

I'll be out with my friends and he may give me grief?

He's not even gone yet and I'm preparing myself and checking the exits.

Self fulfilled prophecy I suppose.

I don't know. .this could go either way and until I know more. . .

[notalady]

If giving you grief for going out with friends is something you expect from him (or at least not surprised if he does), something is definitely not right. Going out with friends should've been a non-issue to begin with, not even worth passing either of your minds as a potential point of contention or worth commenting on (other than "have fun!"). You should be able to do all these normal things without someone making a passive aggressive comment (however subtle it may be).

[reinventmyself]

I probably won't have much to report. At least not in the realm of dating or relationships. We'll see.

I noted those bumps along the road with S as well as everyone's feedback.

He's just returned from a week long trip. I'll see him for a couple hours tonight and tomorrow night.

From there he's gone for another 10 days.

 

It will look like this for at least a couple months. I doubt anything much will arise in the few moments we get to see each other.

I had a much needed quiet weekend alone. Cleaned closets and watched movies. I am not much of a homebody so this will grow old quickly. .But until then I am little excited

about all the things I can get accomplished while he's away.

 

An old bf that I keep in contact with saw me on FB Saturday night and text me, asking what I was doing home. We ended up talking on the phone for two hours.

I know S would disapprove but there is no romantic possibilities there and we've been friends for over 10 yrs. Does that make me a bad gf?

 

Saturday night for gee-wiz I logged onto Match (hidden account) and found Mark there. Just out of curiosity for the past couple days I might log on at random times and any time,

any day and if I sort by activity Mark is front and center. Makes absolute perfect sense seeing he was much more of an electronic bf than a real time one.

No doubt he is likely to squat on a dating website for years and perfectly happy having electronic exchanges.

Much safer that real life ones I suppose.

[Silverbirch]

Hugs Reinvent. My concern for you is that over time, bit by bit, this guy has the potential to isolate you from others. I know you're a smart lady and aware of this sort of thing. I think you are trying to be very fair to him, but that you know inside that he is not who you want a long-term relationship with. So glad you have a good bunch of friends who are very social.

[reinventmyself]

Hugs Reinvent. My concern for you is that over time, bit by bit, this guy has the potential to isolate you from others. I know you're a smart lady and aware of this sort of thing. I think you are trying to be very fair to him, but that you know inside that he is not who you want a long-term relationship with. So glad you have a good bunch of friends who are very social.

 

Thanks SB.

It's possible, but I am not yet convinced.

There isn't much opportunity to see otherwise at this moment, so for now. .I carry on.

[reinventmyself]

So, now it's my turn with the insecurities. Uhg.

 

S is gone for 10 days and I now know how to Skype! Never had the need before but S is in another country and his phone doesn't work there.

So for now, we Skype.

S is a private pilot for a wealthy family. He is currently away with the `the sister' and her friends that consist of 4 other women and one man.

He typically does not socialize with the family. He keeps to himself and hangs out with the house staff. `I am just the help' as he puts it.

 

This sister is a little more casual than the principle owners of the property and is inviting him to eat with them and go on outings.

They are currently on a whale watch as I write this.

 

I am not that girl (I keep saying to myself). .That insecure girl that worries about all the `what if's'

S has never given me reason to doubt him, ever.

He still does not. But I don't want to be naïve either.

 

But I can't shake the insecurity of him and the tropical surroundings and the overall atmosphere.

One particular personality is a single mom close to my age, there with her daughter.

Add in for the first time since he started flying for this family, he's currently included in everything they do.

 

I so want to be above this all. . .