Found out my "awesome" wife is an awesome liar

[DN]

Counselors are not miracle workers. It is tempting to think that counselors have an answer to everything and can facilitate almost any situation but it doesn't work that way. Just as in individual counseling, people have to first admit there is a problem and in couple's counseling that means both. This woman won't even admit there is a problem and dragging her off to counseling won't work until she does.

[diamond78]

Oh, VIII, boy have I been where you are....

 

The only way it stopped was me ending the relationship. But it's going to be harder for you because you are married, living together, and have a child.

 

I was able to say, "Ok, then this relationship is over between us", hang up the phone, and walk away. I made it clear that we could never be together again if he continued to talk to her. In the end, he came back around, but it won't be so easy for you.

 

You alone are going to have to decide if this boudary is something you want to split over. For me, it would bother me that my partner couldn't let go of an Ex and the fact that she said she is afraid of being honest with you tells me that she isn't telling you the real reason. She clearly knows it, but is afraid of telling you what it is. That is dangerous and scary behavior on her part.

 

I don't like playing with people's marriages, but if you have another place to stay...you may have to remove yourself from the home for her to realize you are serious about this and will not accept it.

 

I will never understand why people will knowingly do things that are detrimental to the relationship.

[Miss Firecracker]

I know why she's doing it. She wants several men at once. Most people really do and have to make a choice if they decide they want a family. She's backing out of the contract.

[swampyankee]

She hasn't told me definitively that she's cheated, though all the signs are there. She hasn't given me a reason for her behavior or why this guy keeps coming into the picure. I really need some sort of solid answer before I make a decision to dismantle our family or stay in a relationship with someone who responds to situations like this with "I don't know"

 

It sounds like she's making the decision to dismantle the marriage through her actions. If it was really out of a reaction to how you are treating her, or being too restrictive, etc. she would be getting angry and letting you know how she was feeling. She's gone passive rather than have to open her self up and expose where she's been at and what she's been doing.

It's either an emotional affair or physical one at this point. The fact that she is unable to break contact with this guy tells me she's emotionally invested anyway.

If it were me, I'd either confront this guy yourself since she's not willing to, and let him know you don't think his attentions to your wife are very appropriate and that he's on the verge of breaking up a marriage.

Or I'd hire a P.I. to keep a tail on her and see if they are in fact in a physical relationship. If there's nothing going on then at least you can rest your worst fears.

 

Either way, you need to bring things to a head. As someone has on their footer, "I don't hate that you've lied to me as much I hate not being able to trust you."

[journeynow]

I'm with lavenderdove. Tell her you are making an appointment with a counselor to go together, bit you go even if she refuses. It indicates how serious you are about the issue and the marriage is in trouble. That she left her facebook open and TOLD you about it seems to me she's trying to communicate something to you (but poorly). Her "I don't know" answers could be that she's confused or is lacking in communications skills (or acting irresponsibly). A counselor could help in any event, and the communications skills are something worth working on whether the marriage survives or not. You'll have to communicate because of your child, married or not, so it's in your interest to at go with that in mind at the very least.

[DN]

I don't think an ethical marriage counselor would take a case where one of the couple refused to go.

[journeynow]

He could see a counselor on his own.

 

I don't think an ethical marriage counselor would take a case where one of the couple refused to go.

[DN]

Possibly, but to what purpose? Unless the counselor can tell him how to get his wife to admit there is a problem.

 

Counseling costs a lot of money that he may need for other purposes.

[journeynow]

DN, to show his wife by his actions that there is a problem and he's wanting to work on it with help. If he goes, he's opening the door for her to join him there. It would help him with communicating about the issues, and she may warm up to joint therapy. Unless he's decided he's through, it's a direction to improve the situation and not leave things as is. I wouldn't be quick to throw in the towel. As I mentioned before, they have a child together and help with communicating now will benefit long term, whether they stay married or not.

[DN]

Look, I understand that, these days, counseling is considered a universal nostrum for all personal and marital issues, and the instant response on forums such as these is 'get counseling'. I get that, I often recommend it and am in an associated field myself. But it isn't always the panacea that people think it is and like any other 'treatment' has to be considered carefully and used with discretion. Sometimes the mere suggestion of it can do more harm than good, reputable counselors are very hesitant to recommend it for people who are either closed off or unwilling. Unless you are lucky enough to find someone who is competent and free (very rare) it is expensive and not always effective even when both partners want to engage.

 

On the other hand, people have an equally strong reaction, this time negatively, to ultimatums as if they are always wrong and a mistake and that too is overly simplistic. There are times, with stubborn or recalcitrant people, that an ultimatum is in fact the best course to take. Telling someone that if their conduct or behaviour doesn't change there is going to be a specific consequence will often have the desired effect.

[Staple]

By the way I don't get this. Someone elaborate to me. Why is it "snooping" for a husband, or a wife, to check the messages of the person they are MARRIED to? This isn't boyfriend/girlfriend anymore. He has the right and anyone does to check facebook and email and everything. It's called trust- if there is trust, then there is nothing to hide. IMO.

[Fudgie]

By the way I don't get this. Someone elaborate to me. Why is it "snooping" for a husband, or a wife, to check the messages of the person they are MARRIED to? This isn't boyfriend/girlfriend anymore. He has the right and anyone does to check facebook and email and everything. It's called trust- if there is trust, then there is nothing to hide. IMO.

 

Are you saying that people who are married should allow open access to their FB/email/text messages to their spouse and vice versa?

[DN]

Moderator Note: Please stay on topic.

[OptomisticGirl]

By the way I don't get this. Someone elaborate to me. Why is it "snooping" for a husband, or a wife, to check the messages of the person they are MARRIED to? This isn't boyfriend/girlfriend anymore. He has the right and anyone does to check facebook and email and everything. It's called trust- if there is trust, then there is nothing to hide. IMO.

 

Just because you marry someone does not mean they get an all access pass to your private life unless you let them. I dint classify what the OP did as snooping really.. His intent wasn't to try to find bad things.

[Lonewing]

If you're carrying on relations and conversations with others that you know would bother your significant other, or would severely harm your relationship, and you're hiding behind the "I have my right to my privacy!" plea to protect your 'Having your cake and eating it too" game, I have no sympathy...none whatsoever, if someone snoops through your life and digs up the dirt. Once there's a warrant, though, your "right" to privacy effectively goes away, because you used your position to abuse your freedom...and even if the initial dirt is found illegitimatley, there's usually no shortage of future dirt to come - hence things like the show "Cheaters" or whatever it was called here in the states...

[veronicax]

I agree she wanted you to see the messages, but not sure why?? Ask her straight up.. Subway? If you are a New Yorker ( I lived their over 5 years) I think you have it in you to be up front. Say okay, obviously you wanted me to check out your FB, so I did and I found all this BS. * * * is all this ??? Are you unhappy with me ? What is going on ?? Good Luck

[Odysseus]

Moderator Note: Please stay on topic.

 

Three things that will impede getting back together - pride, being stubborn and not correcting misapprehensions

 

 

I'd add lifestyle imcompatibilities.

[Betweenthebars]

Just because you TELL someone there will be consequences, doesn't always make it real for the other person. I learned that in my own marriage. But coupling communication of consequences PLUS informing them you are seeking therapy to work through your feelings (which potentially makes it easier to leave) may make the other person more motivated. It may not. It really depends on if the person truly wants to salvage the relationship.

 

I believe she is afraid of you leaving her, which causes her to clam up. She is aware of her own faults, the constant contact with her ex, the "sloppy tummy", and she may feel if she says anything to you, you will just walk out. Maybe explain to her that if your marriage is to stay intact, you need her to open up, which joint therapy may help her do. Sometimes an unbiased third party makes it easier. Then explain if she refuses to partake in the marriage therapy, that you will seek it out alone, and the consequences for refusing to open up and work on the martial issues will be severe.