greywolf Posted October 13, 2009 Share Posted October 13, 2009 Not ALL scientists agree with that opinion. You don't need a scientist to realize it. Just look at the statistics. Just look at how many people die from these things in 3rd world countries where these vaccines are not available. We are not even aware that half of these things exist here in North America because we have never even seen them. Why?? Vaccinations. Link to comment
Seraphim Posted October 13, 2009 Share Posted October 13, 2009 I can chose what I want jabbed into my child and I can chose what scientists to believe and you can all be as shocked as you like and call me stupid because I am not a dr or microbiologist all you like. I could really care less. Since most of you all have your vaccines and so do your children and what not, you are all safe. Enjoy. Link to comment
Perfect Dark Posted October 13, 2009 Share Posted October 13, 2009 not all vaccinations are created equal. Do you take anti-biotic's when you get ill? Link to comment
karvala Posted October 13, 2009 Share Posted October 13, 2009 Not ALL scientists agree with that opinion. Really? You can find me even one reputable, medically-qualified scientist who thinks that ALL vaccinations are bad? I'm curious to know who that might be. Link to comment
Perfect Dark Posted October 13, 2009 Share Posted October 13, 2009 I can chose what I want jabbed into my child and I can chose what scientists to believe and you can all be as shocked as you like and call me stupid because I am not a dr or microbiologist all you like. I could really care less. Since most of you all have your vaccines and so do your children and what not, you are all safe. Enjoy. So if your child gets seriously ill from not getting a vaccination; who will you blame? My guessing is the doctors... Link to comment
Seraphim Posted October 13, 2009 Share Posted October 13, 2009 So if your child gets seriously ill from not getting a vaccination; who will you blame? My guessing is the doctors... Excuse me? Nice supposition. That is pretty rude. Link to comment
karvala Posted October 13, 2009 Share Posted October 13, 2009 not all vaccinations are created equal. This is true, and certainly people shouldn't take things on blind faith, or believe that the medical profession is infallible. But that simply means that we need to agree on a method of knowing when something is beneficial, or at least maximising the probability that it is so. That's why I'm always at least as interested in knowing what methods people use to determine the truth as they see it, as I am in what they actually believe. This was evident in my responses on the haunted house thread, I think. So, if you don't believe in this vaccine, that's all well and good, but what leads you to this view? Link to comment
waveseer Posted October 13, 2009 Share Posted October 13, 2009 While it may be a noble cause to try and convince a person to immunize their child against the established illnesses, nobody can argue with their right to choose what is best for their child when it comes to well patient procedures. Link to comment
sophie274 Posted October 13, 2009 Share Posted October 13, 2009 To answer the original, non-controversial question, I had the HPV vaccine very soon after it came out - I think in fall 06 (? maybe 07). My arm hurt a bit after each shot, but that was it. Link to comment
agent1607307371 Posted October 13, 2009 Share Posted October 13, 2009 At one point penicillin was an experimental drug. And people who are allergic can die from it. Does that shut down all the lives that have been saved by it? (Hate myself, but this reminds me of a House episode (don't know why) where Cameron had written a paper arguing that as most patients don't have medical degrees consent means nothing as they don't have the information/grounding to make the choice in an informed way.) Link to comment
Perfect Dark Posted October 13, 2009 Share Posted October 13, 2009 Excuse me? Nice supposition. No offense but it's what usually happens. Link to comment
tiredofvampires Posted October 13, 2009 Share Posted October 13, 2009 One thing I have to wonder. For all the people here who are pro-vaccination, I wonder if their opinion would change if they were the ones who had a child who was a perfectly healthy baby until a vaccination (or a group of them) caused them permanent serious illness or death. I wonder if the response would be, "Well, it was a roll of the dice, and at least I know it's saved other people's children and been a global boon." Link to comment
IphigeniaSaysHi Posted October 13, 2009 Share Posted October 13, 2009 And that is what science needs to do and DOES... keep working towards making these medications and vaccines safer and more effective. Still I think to just say the world is out to get you, all medicine is bad, the body is natural and perfect is dangerous! I know people blame vaccinations for a lot of other diseases, but this paranoia is unsafe in the long run. Hopefully Gardasil does not turn out to be dangerous and can actually prevent women from dying. I almost lost my mother to cervical cancer, I almost developed it myself. I hope no one goes through that bs. Link to comment
annie24 Posted October 13, 2009 Share Posted October 13, 2009 This is true, and certainly people shouldn't take things on blind faith, or believe that the medical profession is infallible. But that simply means that we need to agree on a method of knowing when something is beneficial, or at least maximising the probability that it is so. That's why I'm always at least as interested in knowing what methods people use to determine the truth as they see it, as I am in what they actually believe. This was evident in my responses on the haunted house thread, I think. So, if you don't believe in this vaccine, that's all well and good, but what leads you to this view? Yes, I agree. "how do you know what you know?" Data, not opinions, is needed to back up claims of safety issues. Link to comment
lostandhurt Posted October 13, 2009 Share Posted October 13, 2009 It is possible to agree to disagree isn't it? Anything new can be scary to a lot of people. Most vaccines have a long track record others do not. This is were the worry comes in. There have been many children that have harmed by reactions to vaccines. Wasn't YAZ just relabled? There are always at least two sides to everything. Link to comment
Seraphim Posted October 13, 2009 Share Posted October 13, 2009 One thing I have to wonder. For all the people here who are pro-vaccination, I wonder if their opinion would change if they were the ones who had a child who was a perfectly healthy baby until a vaccination (or a group of them) caused them permanent serious illness or death. I wonder if the response would be, "Well, it was a roll of the dice, and at least I know it's saved other people's children and been a global boon." No crap.I bet they would not be saying it. Well my child is now has issues but hey it is ok everyone else is fine so life is good. Link to comment
annie24 Posted October 13, 2009 Share Posted October 13, 2009 One thing I have to wonder. For all the people here who are pro-vaccination, I wonder if their opinion would change if they were the ones who had a child who was a perfectly healthy baby until a vaccination (or a group of them) caused them permanent serious illness or death. I wonder if the response would be, "Well, it was a roll of the dice, and at least I know it's saved other people's children and been a global boon." I would still be pro-vaccination. 100%. Link to comment
dragon lady Posted October 13, 2009 Share Posted October 13, 2009 This is true, and certainly people shouldn't take things on blind faith, or believe that the medical profession is infallible. But that simply means that we need to agree on a method of knowing when something is beneficial, or at least maximising the probability that it is so. That's why I'm always at least as interested in knowing what methods people use to determine the truth as they see it, as I am in what they actually believe. This was evident in my responses on the haunted house thread, I think. So, if you don't believe in this vaccine, that's all well and good, but what leads you to this view? I always enjoy your posts, karvala. Link to comment
Seraphim Posted October 13, 2009 Share Posted October 13, 2009 It is possible to agree to disagree isn't it? Anything new can be scary to a lot of people. Most vaccines have a long track record others do not. This is were the worry comes in. There have been many children that have harmed by reactions to vaccines. Wasn't YAZ just relabled? There are always at least two sides to everything. Apparently no you can't agree to disagree. Link to comment
lostandhurt Posted October 13, 2009 Share Posted October 13, 2009 BTW Yes I know YAZ isn't a vaccine. Link to comment
Seraphim Posted October 13, 2009 Share Posted October 13, 2009 I would still be pro-vaccination. 100%. Then let's hope nothing happens to your children. Link to comment
waveseer Posted October 13, 2009 Share Posted October 13, 2009 I would still be pro-vaccination. 100%. Are you sure you wouldn't hesitate to give your next new baby the same shot that killed your previous baby? Link to comment
IphigeniaSaysHi Posted October 13, 2009 Share Posted October 13, 2009 One thing I have to wonder. For all the people here who are pro-vaccination, I wonder if their opinion would change if they were the ones who had a child who was a perfectly healthy baby until a vaccination (or a group of them) caused them permanent serious illness or death. I wonder if the response would be, "Well, it was a roll of the dice, and at least I know it's saved other people's children and been a global boon." Should the response be "no one should ever vaccinate their child because of this rare occurrence, let's have a polio party?" lol It's a tough thing and completely tragic when negative side effects harm or claim a life but most people will go with the odds. Link to comment
Perfect Dark Posted October 13, 2009 Share Posted October 13, 2009 This thread is another reason for me not to have children!!! Link to comment
annie24 Posted October 13, 2009 Share Posted October 13, 2009 BTW Yes I know YAZ isn't a vaccine. it's a risk vs. rewards issue. For some people they would rather risk the possibility of blood clots and whatever else Yaz may do vs. having an unplanned pregnancy. that's life. risk vs. reward. knowing what i know about microbes, the number of bacteria in your body actually outnumber the human cells in your body by 9:1. we are walking bacterial incubators and bacteria and viruses are all around us. Especially in this day and age, with mass transit and international travel, a germ can make its way from one side of the world to the other in less than 12 hours. I know that the illnesses are far worse than the risks associate with the vaccines, which is why I am pro-vaccination. Link to comment
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