Ex boyfriend messaged her a sketchy message

[Meow18]

You're giving her an excuse as to her cheating saying that she may have had a reason. I'm telling you that it doesn't matter. People always have reasons to cheat but no one should use it as an excuse!

 

Tell that to Foglifter. I was only going by his logic here.

[TheFoglifter]

... you have not noticed that I am male"

 

Apologies.

 

... the old "the ends justifies the means" argument. I'm too old to fall for that one."

 

So every snooper who found evidence of an affair was wrong, and the cheater should get off the hook. So evidence in a murder trial which was obtained improperly should not be considered, and a guilty party should walk free? Its not a question of "falling" for an argument. What you asserted has conditions which do not hold up in the long term.

[TheFoglifter]

... that to Foglifter. I was only going by his logic here."

 

You quoted chocolate, not me. Please clarify how you are using my logic, and I will respond fairly.

[avman]

I know that some women do get beat up and hurt. However, what I did does not compare to "battered women's shelter".

 

Yes, it does. Have you not read anything I said about how it starts with slaps and progresses from there? Read sandyv's post about how it started for her.

 

I bet you that in a court of law, I would be sentenced to jail. However, if the roles were reversed, I guarantee you that she would be off the hook!

 

That is a convenient excuse. Saying "well a woman would get away with it" does not excuse what you did. It's wrong for both sexes and nobody here has said any different.

[DN]

... you have not noticed that I am male"

 

Apologies.

 

... the old "the ends justifies the means" argument. I'm too old to fall for that one."

 

So every snooper who found evidence of an affair was wrong, and the cheater should get off the hook. So evidence in a murder trial which was obtained improperly should not be considered, and a guilty party should walk free? Its not a question of "falling" for an argument. What you asserted has conditions which do not hold up in the long term.

Look, I'm not going to be drawn into an debate with you based on specious arguments. It's a waste of my time and hijacks the thread. So let's not go there.

[avman]

I think AVMan wants you to put a proverbial face on your action. Its easy to say "I was right" but try saying that after you have walked through a shelter for people who are victims of the road you walked down.

 

So great idea, but I have to add a caveat. Chocolate also needs to spend an equal amount of time consorting with men who were cheated on by women they loved and gave their all too. That would put an equally strong face on the opposite viewpoint.

 

Yep, that's exactly what I had in mind.

 

And I agree that spending time with men who have been cheated on is equally beneficial.

 

However I take issue with the "opposing viewpoint". I am not saying she was right to cheat and that chocolate is wrong to feel hurt and angry. I am saying the violence was wrong.

[JadedStar]

... her is illegal, and altho you may be infuriated if she cheats on you, that is NOT illegal. "

 

Ain't it great to be a lady!

 

FOGLIFTER this is NOT gender specific! If he were female, and the cheater in this case was male, the same holds true. The female would have NO excuse to slap him. NONE!

 

I never waver on that ... ever.

[TheFoglifter]

... I'm not going to be drawn into an debate with you based on specious arguments. It's a waste of my time and hijacks the thread. So let's not go there."

 

I respect your decision, and until a solid contradiction of the point is offered, it stands as valid.

 

Edit: Thank you AVman for acknowledging the merit of spending time with both groups.

 

... this is NOT gender specific! If he were female, and the cheater in this case was male, the same holds true. The female would have NO excuse to slap him. NONE!"

 

Chocolate feels differently. I'm sure others who have hit because of infidelity do too, regardless of gender.

 

... never waver on that ... ever."

 

Nor would I ever ask you to. Nor would I ever ask him to. We all feel differently here. I just don't see chocolate coming back right now, or maybe ever and saying "I shouldn't have hit her". Indeed, only time can make that judgment.

 

Nor do I see any of you coming back and saying "yeah... he WAS right to hit her". Thats what makes this so productive -- if we were all drones, what would be the point.

[Dako]

I don't sympathize with your gf at all. She cheated on you and screwed you over in the process. At issue is your admitted pleasure in hitting her. You feel you're justified and your victim status gives you a right to extract revenge. You even lapsed into imagining sexual acts to hurt her more.

I doubt this is the real you.

 

Someday when you aren't in pain from this whole episode, you may look back and wonder what you were thinking. I sure hope so.

You've been dealt a bad hand and certainly deserve sympathy for that, but nothing but time and distance can heal what she's done to you.

 

I was once cheated on in a foul way. My first impulse wasn't to hit a woman, it was to hurt the guy.

Luckily I calmed down and saw they deserved each other. When he left her alone with a child to raise, I felt no pleasure at all.

[i_love_chocolate]

I don't sympathize with your gf at all. She cheated on you and screwed you over in the process. At issue is your admitted pleasure in hitting her. You feel you're justified and your victim status gives you a right to extract revenge. You even lapsed into imagining sexual acts to hurt her more.

I doubt this is the real you.

 

Someday when you aren't in pain from this whole episode, you may look back and wonder what you were thinking. I sure hope so.

You've been dealt a bad hand and certainly deserve sympathy for that, but nothing but time and distance can heal what she's done to you.

 

I told you earlier that the sexual violence was not justifiable and I apologized. I was mad. As for the slapping, like I said I still believe that I did the right thing. I wonder if a year from now I would feel the same or not. I will let you know.

[i_love_chocolate]

My OTHER earlier point about how if chocolate visits a battered woman's shelter, he also needs to visit a support group for men who were cheated on has also not been addressed. Suppose he visits both battered women AND emotionally hurt men, and still believes that he made the right choice?

 

Even if I do that and believed I did the right thing, people here would still hold their opinions. I don't think it would matter.

[TheFoglifter]

... told you earlier that the sexual violence was not justifiable and I apologized."

 

That was my fault, I got him riled up.

 

... here would still hold their opinions. I don't think it would matter."

 

This isn't a bad thing. You are among strong people here, would you respect them as much if they suddenly changed their minds? They aren't feeling what you are feeling. Only some of the participants here have been in a similar situation to you.

 

I think its OK to disagree, and pretty clear that opinions aren't going to change.

[i_love_chocolate]

CHECK THIS OUT!!!!

 

This is what Dako said in the other thread

 

Some do get over it, but only if they can agree to a fresh start.

If the trust dies, you're in trouble. He has to atone, and you need to forgive. Some couples just drag this baggage along for years, with one resenting life under scrutiny, and the other never letting up. He'll never forget those three slaps, and you'll never forget that long silent drive. You don't have to re-live those moments to feel the impact.

 

If he cheats again, you'll be hurt too deeply for all the effort to matter.

[TheFoglifter]

Hey chocolate, maybe to go in a different direction, tell us a bit about what your plans are for the future now?

 

Where will you move to in order to secure short, and long term lodging?

 

What are your career plans?

 

What are your plans to heal? counseling, therapy, volunteer work?

[i_love_chocolate]

Hey chocolate, maybe to go in a different direction, tell us a bit about what your plans are for the future now?

 

Where will you move to in order to secure short, and long term lodging?

 

What are your career plans?

 

What are your plans to heal? counseling, therapy, volunteer work?

 

I'm not moving to that subject until Dako responds to my response above.

[Dako]

Could you and Foglifter please explain what your point is?

I'm a bit sketchy about what it is.

 

That fellow won't forget being slapped at all, because they hurt.

[DN]

... I'm not going to be drawn into an debate with you based on specious arguments. It's a waste of my time and hijacks the thread. So let's not go there."

 

I respect your decision, and until a solid contradiction of the point is offered, it stands as valid.

 

No - it just stands. People will make up their own minds as to whether it is valid or not.

[i_love_chocolate]

Could you and Foglifter please explain what your point is?

I'm a bit sketchy about what it is.

 

You said that this man will never forget the three slaps she gave him. Never seemed to condemn her but since I'm a man ....

[TheFoglifter]

... - it just stands. People will make up their own minds as to whether it is valid or not."

 

Sounds fair, and I welcome that challenge.

 

... you and Foglifter please explain what your point is?

I'm a bit sketchy about what it is."

 

In my case, when I quoted Dako's post from the other thread, it was intended to illustrate that Dako was the only person who mentioned the slaps, and clearly did not disapprove of them at that time. Chocolate quoted the whole paragraph, in which no disapproval of the slaps is shown, and in which some form of atonement is championed.

 

This is not a personal slight (thats why when I quoted it, i didn't mention the name)

 

Personally, I am satisfied and impressed with the professionalism of both AVman and DN, moderators, who agreed that in order to be consistent with their beliefs, the violence in that thread should have been met with equal condemnation.

[Scout]

Regarding double standards about women being abusive, I do agree that they exist. Let's face it, probably because guys are, for the most part, physically bigger and stronger, and could "technically" better protect themselves. I say "technically" because the reality is that if they do protect themselves, they run the real risk of getting arrested for doing so.

 

I've done some research about domestic violence against males, and one reason it's under-reported is because men are ashamed to do so. They are afraid it makes them look weak.

 

All I can say to that is there was a time when domestic violence against women wasn't taken so seriously, either. It took years of activism to change that (and anti-domestic violence against women activists included both females AND males, I'd like to add).

 

So, if you want to see change, well...as the old quote goes, be the change you want to see. Get involved, or at least get into discussions about it.

 

I put this thread up recently about a cartoon where a girl slapped a little boy. I was disturbed by it, and hoped it would open up a good dialogue, which it did. Some of you might find it of interest:

 

 

 

I definitely like to see discussion about this topic. As an expectant mother of a son, I don't want my little boy to grow up around negative stereotypes about his gender anymore than I would want a daughter to. But it does disturb me to hear people justify any kind of bad behavior with the excuse, "Well, what's good for the goose is good for the gander."

 

I feel that's a cop out.

[Dako]

hahahaha. You know what? The night before I met with her ex, I had a feeling that what he will tell me would end our relationship. So anyway, we were having sex and I swear I felt that it will be the last time we would have sex. So I thought to myself "maybe I should give her anal just so that I would feel like I hurt her in some way before we break up" but I changed my mind. Now I wish I did but I know she wouldn't have let me because she hates it. Now maybe she would let me do it. Not that I enjoy it, but I feel like it's a revenge and I can hurt her. I feel so mean now. l.

 

 

Because in this thread, I sense a pattern.

[DN]

I do think it is important for you to separate the two issues of men being blamed for violence more than women and the fact that you hit this particular woman - it is just irrelevant to your situation.

 

No one on here is saying it is OK for women to hit men.

 

Let me ask you this: did you or do you still love this woman?

[i_love_chocolate]

Because in this thread, I sense a pattern.

 

There is no pattern. I was just upset and apologized about the sex thing. But you, on the other hand, said that that man would not forget the slaps on the other thread and came here and condemned me of making a mistake.

[i_love_chocolate]

Let me ask you this: did you or do you still love this woman?

 

I loved her. Do I still love her? I don't know coz I'm not in the right state of mind.

[DN]

I loved her. Do I still love her? I don't know coz I'm not in the right state of mind.

I think that is probably your first step in getting to grips with this issue.

 

 

When you are in your right mind you know you don't hit people you love. Even when they hurt you.

 

When you are in your right mind you know that violence is not an answer or a solution.

 

It is because you are not in your right mind that you feel attacked whereas when you do get in your right mind you will almost certainly feel different. If you are a decent man - and I think perhaps you are - you will soon get your mind around what has happened and sort through the rights and wrongs.