Zaphod Posted July 31, 2016 Share Posted July 31, 2016 My response, word for word, "You barely know me. There is a ton of stuff I haven't told you about myself. I have a fiery Irish temper. I cuss a lot. I fart a lot. I'm overweight. I come from a crazy family (and not in the good way.) I don't drive because my eyes are screwed up. I have issues with mental illness, and instead of treating them with Lithium like a normal person, I've treated them with Hallucinogens and alcohol. And I am not over my ex, in fact I think I'm even still in love with him. I am nobody's dream woman. Sorry for being so blunt but I would rather just lay it all out on the table instead of leading anyone on and playing head games. I'm a no BS kind of girl." His response, "Wow, you're honesty just makes me want you more." Yeah I gotta admit, him saying that after the bits I've put in bold would indicate him to be a bit too beta for your needs here. Personally the rest wouldn't have worried me, seen it all before. Especially the "Well I'd be happy with friends" bit he said. Tha's classic orbiter talk. Link to comment
toxigon Posted July 31, 2016 Share Posted July 31, 2016 Could be, but I can never know I might be so good that I have manipulated my self as well I will only gain my true self once I fully move on from this breakup. Link to comment
Cynder Posted July 31, 2016 Author Share Posted July 31, 2016 Yeah I gotta admit, him saying that after the bits I've put in bold would indicate him to be a bit too beta for your needs here. Personally the rest wouldn't have worried me, seen it all before. Especially the "Well I'd be happy with friends" bit he said. Tha's classic orbiter talk. Lol, I really was playing it up a little to make myself sound a lot less desirable. I mean, some of that is true, some not so much. I get what you are saying though. Him saying he is happy with being friends just makes it seem like he want's to stick around and see if he still has a chance. Link to comment
Zaphod Posted July 31, 2016 Share Posted July 31, 2016 Could be, but I can never know I might be so good that I have manipulated my self as well. I do like a good solid bit of self-manipulation. Relieves the tension. Link to comment
boltnrun Posted July 31, 2016 Share Posted July 31, 2016 I do like a good solid bit of self-manipulation. Relieves the tension. LOL thanks for the laugh before work. Link to comment
Zaphod Posted July 31, 2016 Share Posted July 31, 2016 Lol, I really was playing it up a little to make myself sound a lot less desirable. I mean, some of that is true, some not so much. I get what you are saying though. Him saying he is happy with being friends just makes it seem like he want's to stick around and see if he still has a chance. We both know he isn't happy with just being friends. In fact it's masochism really although he doesn't know it yet. Tell him you used to be a man - that should wrap it up for ya Link to comment
Cynder Posted July 31, 2016 Author Share Posted July 31, 2016 We both know he isn't happy with just being friends. In fact it's masochism really although he doesn't know it yet. Tell him you used to be a man - that should wrap it up for ya I'll file that away and use it as my nuclear option. Link to comment
lostlove76 Posted July 31, 2016 Share Posted July 31, 2016 Lol... it was intended to turn him off. I even played a lot of it up to sound worse than it is. The thing about alcohol and hallucinogens.... I admit in the past I have drank wine to calm down during a panic attack. It does help. And last year I flew to the other side of the world to participate in three Ayahuasca ceremonies. So, even though what I said it technically true, it's not as bad as it sounds. I wasn't judging your faults The turnoff would be that it was, indeed, meant to push him away. If someone is being pretty obvious in that attempt, it would be a turn off to most. Link to comment
Zaphod Posted July 31, 2016 Share Posted July 31, 2016 I'll file that away and use it as my nuclear option. He'll probably say to you "That's ok, I used to be a woman". Link to comment
Cynder Posted July 31, 2016 Author Share Posted July 31, 2016 He'll probably say to you "That's ok, I used to be a woman". Lol... i could see that happening. Link to comment
Cynder Posted July 31, 2016 Author Share Posted July 31, 2016 I wasn't judging your faults The turnoff would be that it was, indeed, meant to push him away. If someone is being pretty obvious in that attempt, it would be a turn off to most. Understood. But telling someone you don't even know that they are the woman of your dreams isn't exactly a turn on either. Link to comment
Zaphod Posted July 31, 2016 Share Posted July 31, 2016 Understood. But telling someone you don't even know that they are the woman of your dreams isn't exactly a turn on either. Funny, it would be if say you'd been dating for six months, but saying it immediately just makes it lose its flavour. Strange how things work. Link to comment
lostlove76 Posted July 31, 2016 Share Posted July 31, 2016 Understood. But telling someone you don't even know that they are the woman of your dreams isn't exactly a turn on either. Agreed! I guess my point was that you were trying to push him away/turn him off, and most people would have gotten the hint, and/or at least felt put off at being so blatantly pushed away. Link to comment
ParisPaulette Posted August 1, 2016 Share Posted August 1, 2016 No, no, I meant Smacking My Head at the guy's actions, not yours Cynder. Sorry, I'm a little touchy on this topic right now. I have a guy friend who's being stalked and it's spilling over to me, because she knows me slightly through a work thing, so has taken to blowing up my phone demanding I talk to her about "Phil" (not his real name). They had one date and now she's over the top coming after him. And yes, men get stalked and it's bad, because no one but me believes him or they say things like, "She's pretty, so what if she wants to marry you after one date. Go for it dude, ugh. So I'm just on edge a bit about that whole clingy needy thing and your post struck a nerve with me. Just be careful, I like and respect you, and it just struck me the guy is trying too hard to rush something that's a fantasy in his head instead of reality. Trust your instincts on this one is all, okay? Link to comment
notalady Posted August 1, 2016 Share Posted August 1, 2016 He seems clingy and insecure and his social skills, well, not too stellar. I'd steer clear. Agree with this. It's pretty much 100% agreement here that this guy is coming off way too intense and abnormal before even meeting. But I'd like to offer some food for thought. I would avoid labelling people (including yourself) as alpha or beta or "nice guy", what you're really talking about are certain personality traits or behaviours that are desirable or undesirable, sometimes specific to you, sometimes general. It's probably better to describe the traits you want to avoid or want to find rather than labelling someone in general. The issue with labelling is that there are 100 shades of grey in the middle of "alpha" and "beta" in its truest sense, most people aren't 100% either. For example a guy could be totally respectful of your wants and needs and love to go along with what you want, rather than wanting to take charge all the time or being super opinionated, but are able to step up the plate when needed especially on bigger things. You might see their easy going nature as "beta", when in fact, these are great traits to have. If you are a strong minded, fiery person, it's also worth considering whether it's a good idea to date someone equally so, because what people describe as "alpha" often entails some degree of traits like strong mindedness, opinionated, take control etc. so dating someone like that you will likely butt head (happened to me and others I know), it is interesting that most couples I know who work well together have complementary personalities rather than similar personalities. Anyway, my point is that it's better to describe the personality and character traits you want and don't want rather than using generalisation and labels which often works against you when trying to distinguish whether someone is the right person for you. Link to comment
Batya33 Posted August 1, 2016 Share Posted August 1, 2016 "For example a guy could be totally respectful of your wants and needs and love to go along with what you want, rather than wanting to take charge all the time or being super opinionated, but are able to step up the plate when needed especially on bigger things." That is a very good point. I've been reading up on this a lot because as a parent, when we label children (even positively) we miss the nuances and the child feels boxed into the label -bet it's the same with adult relationships. My husband -if I labeled him- would be "type B" to my "type A" but you are right that if I focus on that I miss the nuances and situations where he is take charge. It's also more respectful to the person to avoid the labeling so that those "exceptions" are no longer exceptions to the preconceived notion but rather just another attribute of the person - treating the person as an individual first, rather than as a label. Link to comment
Cynder Posted August 1, 2016 Author Share Posted August 1, 2016 Agree with this. It's pretty much 100% agreement here that this guy is coming off way too intense and abnormal before even meeting. But I'd like to offer some food for thought. I would avoid labelling people (including yourself) as alpha or beta or "nice guy", what you're really talking about are certain personality traits or behaviours that are desirable or undesirable, sometimes specific to you, sometimes general. It's probably better to describe the traits you want to avoid or want to find rather than labelling someone in general. The issue with labelling is that there are 100 shades of grey in the middle of "alpha" and "beta" in its truest sense, most people aren't 100% either. For example a guy could be totally respectful of your wants and needs and love to go along with what you want, rather than wanting to take charge all the time or being super opinionated, but are able to step up the plate when needed especially on bigger things. You might see their easy going nature as "beta", when in fact, these are great traits to have. If you are a strong minded, fiery person, it's also worth considering whether it's a good idea to date someone equally so, because what people describe as "alpha" often entails some degree of traits like strong mindedness, opinionated, take control etc. so dating someone like that you will likely butt head (happened to me and others I know), it is interesting that most couples I know who work well together have complementary personalities rather than similar personalities. Anyway, my point is that it's better to describe the personality and character traits you want and don't want rather than using generalisation and labels which often works against you when trying to distinguish whether someone is the right person for you. Can't speak for the poster who originally brought up the alpha/beta thing, but on my end it was just me being funny. No need for a lecture. Lol. Link to comment
Cynder Posted August 1, 2016 Author Share Posted August 1, 2016 I suggest that using "nice guy" as a pejorative is divisive and ultimately damaging to both men and women and relations between the two. Instead of combating the myth that women prefer "bad boys" over "nice guys" it furthers that myth by casting derision on guys who are actually nice through linking them to negative behaviors through the use of the term "nice guy". It muddies the waters. In the worst case it becomes a shaming technique for men who are for whatever reason not sexually desired. Nobody likes to be turned down romantically, sexually. But it should be enough to simply not be interested. Placing labels such as "nice guy" doesn't just dismiss a man's sexual interest, it suggests that there's something wrong with him for being interested in the first place, they attempt to convince him that he should be ashamed for pursing sexual fulfillment because it's somehow threatening to women. I find it childish and destructive. Grow a pair of lady-balls and tell a guy you're not interested. There's no need to play some game where you try to make it his decision by painting yourself as undesirable. And there's no need to shame him for being interested in the first place. Just say "no" and stand by it. It's really pretty simple. I did tell him from the beginning that i wasn't interested. It says that pretty plainly in my first post. He kept on pushing. Link to comment
ParisPaulette Posted August 1, 2016 Share Posted August 1, 2016 It says that pretty plainly in my first post. He kept on pushing. And when they won't respect your boundaries or hear a no it's time to shut the door all the way regardless of who it is or what capacity they hold. I won't even deal with an overly pushy sales clerk who does that. Your boundaries and your wishes are worthy of respect always. P.S. I did laugh at your retort to him about all your issues. I've done that a time or two, unfortunately it just seems to excite the ones with serious issues more, not put them off. Maybe an "at last, I can be myself with this one!" (Kidding, kidding, but I think he kind of saw through that. ) Anyways, take care Cynder. Good to hear from you and as I recall you were in the middle of art festival season last time I saw one of your posts. I hope that went well for you. Hubs and I have hit up a bunch over the summer throughout the west and southwest too. I love it. Favorite one was the Navajo couple we brought jewelry from and swapped ghost stories with at a tiny mountain art festival. I love the Southwest and it's culture, always some new strange road to travel down and a beautiful work of art to create and/or find. Link to comment
notalady Posted August 1, 2016 Share Posted August 1, 2016 Can't speak for the poster who originally brought up the alpha/beta thing, but on my end it was just me being funny. No need for a lecture. Lol. Like I said, offering some food for thought. No need for defensiveness. Lol. Link to comment
annie24 Posted August 1, 2016 Share Posted August 1, 2016 i agree with TMifune fully that we should not be calling this man a "nice guy." A nice guy respects your boundaries and does not creep you out. I know we're conditioned to try to let guys down easy and say, "You're a nice guy, but I'm just not interested." It's better just to say, 'You're not my type and i'm not interested." His behavior isn't nice if he's not hearing what you're saying and not respecting your wishes. Link to comment
jgrobanfan29 Posted August 2, 2016 Share Posted August 2, 2016 Yeah I'd definitely block him if I were you. If he doesn't understand the word "no", then things can get WAY worse REAL fast... Link to comment
abitbroken Posted August 2, 2016 Share Posted August 2, 2016 I didn't read the whole thread, so excuse me for that - but I just had to comment after I read the original post. I don't think its a "nice guy" thing you are dealing with. Rather, its a guy with crappy boundaries. You summed it up with your statement of "you don't even know me yet". I think if you are considering being his friend because you are short on them - you shouldn't be friends with him. I am sure he will prove to be more dysfunctional than can be initially imagined. The more you heal, the better caliber of people will come into orbit. he is pushing way too hard. Link to comment
lostlove76 Posted August 2, 2016 Share Posted August 2, 2016 Well, not sure when this trend started, but the term "nice guy" is being used in a more satirical way online here lately. It is more meant to describe creepers and desperately clingy guys. On Reddit there is actually a whole subreddit dedicated to "nice guy" stories, lol. So, me calling him that was more sarcastic then anything. I see where the confusion comes from though. This is what the OP said a few pages back about what "Nice Guy" refers to. I've never heard the term used in this way, myself. Link to comment
annie24 Posted August 2, 2016 Share Posted August 2, 2016 This is what the OP said a few pages back about what "Nice Guy" refers to. I've never heard the term used in this way, myself. ah, gotcha!! I never heard that before (I must have missed Cynder's post) but that makes total sense. Link to comment
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