Engagment is off???

[Heannaa]

And you, my dear Heanna, could learn to be less defensive towards people here (posters) who are good enough to read you and give their views.

 

We are doing our best to decipher your words......

 

What do you mean by marriage experts? I am sure many posters here (self included) are married.

 

Just because you are married doesn't make you an expert.

 

Anymore than it makes someone who owns a car an expert on cars.

[Hermes]

Give it a rest, Heanna. I sincerely hope you are somewhat less tiresome with these men you hope and/or intend to marry. You have a very bad attitude, and I mean that kindly by the way. Cheap sarcasm is most unpleasant, and the posters on here deserve better than that.

[Stay_home]

Just because you are married doesn't make you an expert.

 

Anymore than it makes someone who owns a car an expert on cars.

 

This might be the reason he decided to leave so suddenly is because of your attitude and approach to things. Everyone here has taken the time to read your post and offer insight and you're still bashing people over the head.

[Heannaa]

Ok, as far as your ex goes, that is where you are at. He's an ex, and he has told you where he stands, and he has given you the 'let's be friends, I care about you but I need time" bit.

So right now you are hanging around hoping he will change his mind, and haven't taken your time to process and heal that this is over, and you are wasting time.

 

Time which, you have set yourself a very very tight time frame to work with here. Three years or less to find the right person who wants to marry you, get married, get pregnant. Almost zero room for error there, or else you won't be having a child, correct?!

 

How important is having another biological child to you? I am not suggesting you give up your dreams. I am asking realistically, you may not get everything you want. Could you live with never having another biological child but having a loving husband who you are very compatible with and the relationship is great?

 

Of course I still have hope. It's only been 3 or so days since we have spoken to each other.

 

When I really think about it I can say that, on this particular day, I would feel wonderful having a loving husband and not have anymore children.

 

But my feelings might change tomorrow. That's a huge decision to make one way or another.

 

The man needs to realize, that as a woman, and ESPECIALLY, one that he might want to have children with one day, he needs to get his head out of the sand and figure out if I am what he wants. If we decide on having children together.

 

I am very transparent so he knows exactly who I am and what I want and what I am not willing to compromise on. And if he splits? Bye bye. Yes it will hurt, but guess what I will get over it.

 

As soon as you tell a man "blah blah I want to get married and have kids yadda yadda" he will know exactly what he has to say to keep you around. "Oh yeah baby, me too, I would totally love to get married. Don't worry it's right around the corner" while he continues to get sex, companionship, ego boost.. Whatever.

 

My approach lets him know I mean business. He can't sweet talk me into sticking around in a "no time frame" dating scenario. At least not exclusively anyway.

 

I have faith and trust in God that he will put the right man in my life when the time is right. And all the cowards will run because they are not worthy.

 

Go ahead and dissect that because I know you will.

[SURPRISE]

Thank you so much! I am sorry to hear about your experience, I am sure that was hard on you. I hope you are feeling better these days.

 

I think you are spot on with your advice "they wont risk losing you" that is so true and you are absolutely right. I think thats the part that is making my heart hurt... Hes not scared to lose me while h takes his time.

 

Thank you! I am doing so much better these days then back then! It ended up being the best thing that ever happened to me because I met someone a couple years later that I have been married to for 16 years now with 2 kids. It's not without it's own challenges and struggles I have been through, but even so, it is 100 times better then what I had before! 20 years later (a couple months ago), my ex tried to friend me on Facebook without saying a word even though she was terrible to me during the divorce and I was still good to her. I kindly declined and she blocked me.

[SURPRISE]

PS - I am glad what I said struck a cord with me. I wish someone would have told me that long ago but I had to learn the hard way. I am sorry to hear you are hurting but I hope you can use this and move one to something much better for you!

[Heannaa]

This might be the reason he decided to leave so suddenly is because of your attitude and approach to things. Everyone here has taken the time to read your post and offer insight and you're still bashing people over the head.

 

So everyone can gang up on me but when I defend myself.. I'm the one with the bad attitude?

[Heannaa]

PS - I am glad what I said struck a cord with me. I wish someone would have told me that long ago but I had to learn the hard way. I am sorry to hear you are hurting but I hope you can use this and move one to something much better for you!

 

Thank you for following up with what has been going on. I'm glad you found your girl... I'm sure she is just as happy. Wishing you a lifetime of magic!

[Heannaa]

You say you didn't expect a proposal but your thread is peppered with statements like this:

 

 

 

So, I apologize if myself and others seem to think that it is indeed what you're expecting, as you've said before, you don't want to date a guy for years before marriage and you see the 6 months = engagement and then wedding 1.5 years from start of dating as an acceptable dating trajectory.

 

You say you don't want future advice but you've been given it: don't be in such a rush, let a relationship develop naturally.

 

Advice for current situation: the man said he doesn't want marriage. So don't wait around, find someone who does want marriage in his future.

 

I am concerned about your statements saying that "you never really know someone" and that you've been with guys for years before and you felt like you didn't really know them. I find that sad and wonder if you've had emotional intimacy with your partners before.

 

It wasn't an expectation! It was a time frame in which I felt comfortable giving him my exclusivity. While turning away other suitors. I don't get how that's hard to understand???

 

Yes, it may not be for everyone. But I'm not like everyone. So leave it at that.

[itsallgrand]

I have faith and trust in God that he will put the right man in my life when the time is right. And all the cowards will run because they are not worthy.

 

No, I won't dissect. The summoning of God and the fleeing of the cowards, this is sounding like the Apocalypse now, not like we are talking about men and relationships.

 

I'm in over my head and bouncing out. Good luck.

[Fudgie]

It's very clear that your past experience with being strung along by a man who said he wanted marriage but then continued to date you for years without a proposal affects your dating mindset today. I think you think that if you don't "lock it down" early and let him know that if he doesn't commit you'll walk, a man will continue to date you forever without a proposal so that this is your only way to ensure that your goals are met.

 

Honestly, I just feel bad for you. You sound very cynical when it comes to obtaining commitment, and it doesn't sound like you have much emotional intimacy with partners ...you don't think men will perceive that from the start? They can. People can tell when someone has a cynical or jaded attitude about dating and relationships and it's really offputting. I can say that as a woman, meeting men who were jaded about women was always offputting and I would never date someone like that. It's an uphill battle.

[Heannaa]

I realize he is gone and I need to get over it, good grief, if it was only that easy to just flip a switch.

 

I am a human and have a wide range of emotions. I will be ok one minute and be sad the next.

 

I know I need to move on and get over it. Yeah yeah I know the speech.

 

For me, talking about it helps. Again, I must be some unicorn or something because no one seems to understand where I am coming from.

 

Guess what. I'm okay being a unicorn

[faraday]

So everyone can gang up on me but when I defend myself.. I'm the one with the bad attitude?

 

It often feels that way.

 

I've posted questions on forums and had feedback that I didn't want to hear. It wasn't the answer I was expecting...and it HURT! I felt like no one understood. That people were taking things to extremes. But ultimately, once I got through that particular issue (often going against advice and forging my own painful, drawn out path) I found that the best thing for me to do (in hindsight) would have been to implement the painful advice I received.

 

It sucks. I know. But many of us have been through similar situations...and most of us (if we've been here a while) have seen your situation pop up in threads over the years.

 

People always think their situation is unique. It's not, sadly. The details might be different...and while life is made up of details- it's the big picture that makes the life...and the big picture answer is what people are giving you.

[Heannaa]

It's very clear that your past experience with being strung along by a man who said he wanted marriage but then continued to date you for years without a proposal affects your dating mindset today. I think you think that if you don't "lock it down" early and let him know that if he doesn't commit you'll walk, a man will continue to date you forever without a proposal so that this is your only way to ensure that your goals are met.

 

Honestly, I just feel bad for you. You sound very cynical when it comes to obtaining commitment, and it doesn't sound like you have much emotional intimacy with partners ...you don't think men will perceive that from the start? They can. People can tell when someone has a cynical or jaded attitude about dating and relationships and it's really offputting. I can say that as a woman, meeting men who were jaded about women was always offputting and I would never date someone like that. It's an uphill battle.

 

I appreciate your comment. But a hand full of text posts does not mean you know me. I am not jaded or cynical or whatever else you want to call me.

 

I love my man with fire and intensity. Same as my career and my son.

 

I am not naïve to think that every relationship will turn into marriage just because we are together for a long time.

 

When you turn up the heat people show you who they really are and the wrong ones will run. The right one will find me intriguing.

 

I am who I am, your approval is not necessary.

 

PS: I don't need you to feel bad for me

[Fudgie]

But too much "heat" early on in a relationship is not going to show you who the person really is. It's going to make all the sane ones run.

 

People's comfort threshold for someone else's "crap" is a lot lower when you're in a brand new relationship versus when you've been together for a while and have spent quality time together. When you don't have as much investment, it's easier to walk away, as it should be!

 

Most men are going to think "Why is she verbalizing this? Is she trying to push me into proposing" and they will get out because, let's face it, even though MOST women probably want marriage/kids, many people let a relationship develop from the start and let it go into that naturally.

 

I can't help but wonder if this is a "test" for the men you date. When I struggled with emotional intimacy in the past (and still do, to some extent), I used to have ridiculous parameters and use things to keep people at arm's length and make it easier not to feel as close and easier to sever bonds. It was because I was afraid of getting close and thus, getting hurt.

 

I can't help but wonder if you have a bit of that too. It took me a long time to own up to it though. Most people who do it are not really aware of it.

 

Of course you don't need me to feel badly for you. But I do. You're coming accross as a very angry, frustrated individual here and you're defending dating practices that haven't worked for you or others in terms of obtaining your goals.

[SURPRISE]

My wife's ex-boyfriend told her he needed 2 years before he would marry anyone especially because he had a daughter and a bad marriage before. They dated 2 years and he was comfortable so that time came and went. I met her with him one night months later and it did not even seem as they were a couple. A couple weeks later she broke up with him and we started dating right away. 2 months later I proposed and 4 months later we were married. It's been 16 years now that we have been married. When she broke up with him he started the "I was going to ask you to marry me" bit but it was a little too little and a little too late! If a guy finds something he wants, he better have the balls to move forward or he'll lose it. So many guys just don't get it!

[Heannaa]

It often feels that way.

 

I've posted questions on forums and had feedback that I didn't want to hear. It wasn't the answer I was expecting...and it HURT! I felt like no one understood. That people were taking things to extremes. But ultimately, once I got through that particular issue (often going against advice and forging my own painful, drawn out path) I found that the best thing for me to do (in hindsight) would have been to implement the painful advice I received.

 

It sucks. I know. But many of us have been through similar situations...and most of us (if we've been here a while) have seen your situation pop up in threads over the years.

 

People always think their situation is unique. It's not, sadly. The details might be different...and while life is made up of details- it's the big picture that makes the life...and the big picture answer is what people are giving you.

 

I understand that I need to move on and get over him. I am not disputing that. Yes, some days I have hope, as some people do get back together but I realize that in my situation it's probably an impossibility.

 

Just because something works for someone doesn't mean it works for someone else(my approach w men). It's called trial and error. I was never one to follow the pack. I like to blaze my own trail and if that makes people on here think I'm stupid or what have you, so be it.

 

As I've said before I have spent many years researching relationships. Especially when my ex left me. Because I wanted to know why it didn't work. I also studied human psychology in nursing school. So I'm not just some dumb idiot going around haphazardly "scaring men"... The ones who waste women's time and keep them on a string for their own enjoyment should be scared.

[Hermes]

That's it, Fudgie.

 

"You're coming accross as a very angry, frustrated individual here and you're defending dating practices that haven't worked for you or others in terms of obtaining your goals."

[faraday]

I will also add this Heannaa...if you're finding that men don't want to commit, that it's a pattern in your life- you need to start screening men more carefully. I know that's what you were trying to do with the 6 month thing...and that's good. That experiment failed, revise it a bit, and try again.

 

Because there are so many great guys out there. Guys that want to get married and have kids, and have a loving, fantastic relationship with someone they adore. So many men. I met tons when I was dating. Probably 3/4 of the guys I met were looking for marriage.

 

In my life, I've been proposed to 3 times. I've also ended two relationships with men that...started looking into rings, and I realized I didn't want to marry them. The point? Men aren't afraid to commit. But they need to be those solid, honest men and they need to be in the right place in their lives. In their 30s- the age your dating now...this is the right time. You'll have a lot more luck this time. Just make your intentions known in the beginning...and enjoy the ride

[Hermes]

Oh you're blazing your own trail all right, dear Heanna. We've noticed, don't worry.

Not one person here, not one said you were stupid (since when have you taken up mind-reading?).

And your psychology is way but way off.

 

Just the very fact of your rudeness here is proof of that.

[Heannaa]

I will also add this Heannaa...if you're finding that men don't want to commit, that it's a pattern in your life- you need to start screening men more carefully. I know that's what you were trying to do with the 6 month thing...and that's good. That experiment failed, revise it a bit, and try again.

 

Because there are so many great guys out there. Guys that want to get married and have kids, and have a loving, fantastic relationship with someone they adore. So many men. I met tons when I was dating. Probably 3/4 of the guys I met were looking for marriage.

 

In my life, I've been proposed to 3 times. I've also ended two relationships with men that...started looking into rings, and I realized I didn't want to marry them. The point? Men aren't afraid to commit. But they need to be those solid, honest men and they need to be in the right place in their lives. In their 30s- the age your dating now...this is the right time. You'll have a lot more luck this time. Just make your intentions known in the beginning...and enjoy the ride

 

Thank you for being such a kind individual. Your words come through more clear than someone who is trying to "force" you to see things their way. I appreciate your ways.

[Fudgie]

I agree with faraday. I dated my age and older (30s-50s) through late teens and 20s and there was always a surplus of men, I found, who wanted to settle down and commit. It was actually a problem for me, trying to find a man who was okay with LTR but didn't want children (I am childfree)...everyone wanted marriage/kids!

And before says anything, no, it is not my age. I am not conventionally attractive and I am overweight and I used to be obese too. But I always found guys out there, nice ones, who truly wanted a long term relationship, usually marriage.

 

These guys are out there but if you find that you are unable to find them at all, you may be looking in the wrong area or not screening properly.

[Heannaa]

My wife's ex-boyfriend told her he needed 2 years before he would marry anyone especially because he had a daughter and a bad marriage before. They dated 2 years and he was comfortable so that time came and went. I met her with him one night months later and it did not even seem as they were a couple. A couple weeks later she broke up with him and we started dating right away. 2 months later I proposed and 4 months later we were married. It's been 16 years now that we have been married. When she broke up with him he started the "I was going to ask you to marry me" bit but it was a little too little and a little too late! If a guy finds something he wants, he better have the balls to move forward or he'll lose it. So many guys just don't get it!

 

Exactly! Thank you for your post. With my approach there are no surprises. Just clear honest communication.

[boltnrun]

I know you say your approach "worked" because he was totally on board and had no problem proposing...except, he didn't follow through. So, one would conclude your approach did NOT work, because a marriage proposal without a marriage...is NOT a marriage.

 

And apparently he wants to be "friends" but marriage is off the table. Is this correct?

 

Again, you can stick around being his "friend" and hoping he'll change his mind back (the "what ifs"). But if your goal is to be married I don't see how hanging around with this guy who said the marriage isn't going to happen is the best idea.

[journeynow]

I feel like I am grasping at straws, but I wanted him to know that I am commited to us and will stick by him through hard times, as marriage is hard. But I feel like the only one trying. I think the month will give me time to get my head together and not say things out of anger like "I don't want to talk to you anymore"

 

I feel so sad and miss him so much, he knows this. But he stays away. So I am a few days into our month apart and am already missing our daily interactions. But I don't like the way things were either. Any advice would be grately appreciated thank you.

 

As I've said before I didn't ask for advice on my approach, yet people keep trying to make me see things "their way" ... I have tried a different approach to each one of my relationships depending on circumstances and what not.

 

You obviously don't listen either. Because he didn't run off scared when I told him that, he liked what I had to say and made his decisions accordingly.

 

And even men who have been in relationships for years and finally propose, still bolt when the wedding is around the corner. It has nothing to do with a "perfect time frame" and anyway I wasn't asking for advice about how I should conduct my life, from strangers. I do have self esteem. I was simply sharing my story so others can read. And maybe bounce a question or two along the way.

 

OP. In your original post you said:

 

"Any advice would be grately appreciated thank you." (sic)

 

When you come on here and ask for advice that is what you are going to get.

 

I realize he is gone and I need to get over it, good grief, if it was only that easy to just flip a switch.

 

I am a human and have a wide range of emotions. I will be ok one minute and be sad the next.

 

I know I need to move on and get over it. Yeah yeah I know the speech.

 

For me, talking about it helps. Again, I must be some unicorn or something because no one seems to understand where I am coming from.

 

Guess what. I'm okay being a unicorn

 

This is quite a thread! First off, welcome to ENA Heannaa. It's understandable if you are frustrated or hurt or angry about how things are with your boyfriend (or ex?), and certainly understandable if your need is to vent or debate or discuss it. However, you clearly asked for advice, then took offense when folks offered their advice, which is based on their experience or observations or understandings. People don't mean harm for the most part. People are different, but there is a certain pattern to human nature. "I am a human and have a wide range of emotions. I will be ok one minute and be sad the next. " THAT is certainly understandable, mosts of us go through that. This "no one seems to understand where I am coming from" seems to go both ways. Take a breath, we're not your enemy here, and please go easy on all us unicorns here.