No More Hope

[CarnelianButterfly]

I gave her space for a reason after the breakup.

Yesterday she went from WANTING to see me, to she needs SPACE, to I can't be in your life anymore. What did I do for that to happen? I pushed, pushed and pushed.

These are contradictory. You can't say both. You didn't give her space, until she told you to back off. You went to her place of business with a shady reason for being in the area. You call, email and send her things even after she's said "give me space". That isn't giving them space.

 

Nor is this.

I am not making any promises that I wouldn't say contact her in a couple of months to check in. It would be her perogative at that point to reciprocate or not. One thing I will not do, is impose myself on her and especially not now.

If she wants to talk to you it should be her to initiate, not you. You contact her and you are violating her space, her choice, and are not listening to a thing she has asked you.

[melrich]

Melrich mate, I have stopped.

 

That's good to hear. I get that you probably feel like you are starting all over again but I am sure that given you have already done a lot of the hard work things will start to feel better for you soon.

[anggrace]

I know its hard to let go. But you are and your going to feel so much better in the near future because of it!!! No more stress of not knowing where she stands, you now know. No more questions of what you can do, you've done all you can. Now you can let go and focus on your own life and well being. I also think if you continue to have a hard time with this, you should see a therapist. Not only for this in particular, but to learn about yourself and its always good to get a little insight as far as how you can make the next relationship better. I see one and I find it very helpfull! Keep in touch!

[Lady Bugg]

HEy GFI......

 

This might not be of much consolation....but it might help you get past this hump.

 

Last year..I was going through a REAL rough patch with someone..and I needed something..ANYTHING to give me motivation to get through it...even if it was for a little while. Then I found out about this exercise program....

the "Body For Life" Challenge. It's a 12 week program...that produces incredible results. I joined.....and even though I only REALLY stuck with it for five weeks...it helped me TREMENDOUSLY. I felt great...looked better.....and it REALLY boosted my confidence. I think in these situations..THAT is what we need most. By the fifth or sixth week..I felt so great.......I hardly thought of ol' "whats his name "

 

Anyway....why not try it? It sounds like you need something to get you through this....and right now....TIME is your friend.

 

You can go the the Body For Life website....and all the info is there....

 

Best in all to you...

[GoingForIt_77]

Melrich,

 

Yeah, I'm starting over from NC Day 1 in a way. Funny, it was not I who broke it persay, but I don't look at it that way.

 

One week ago tonight, her and I were having a long and loving conversation and what a difference a week makes.

 

Should she have known that it was just too soon to have physically seen each other? I should have known and said NO. She would have respected that probably a lot more.

 

I want to thank you and Ang and some others who do acknowledge the effort I have put into it since the break-up. I really did try hard to in many ways, make it up to her. I have been trying hard to change. YES, I was VERY weak with her last night. Talking with her for a week and it going well and then seeing her and realizing she was cold and then backed off again, in many ways did toy with my feelings. I am not blaming her, but she really can't blame me either.

 

She will look back on these last few weeks and see that I really am a nice guy, who tried to take her pain away. She can't hold that one day (yesterday) where I lost control of my emotions and told her how I felt, against me.

 

TIME, WILL make things better. I am confident about that. NC is the only way to go. She needs to think of things without ANY reminders of me.

[GoingForIt_77]

Thanks for the tip Lady Bugg!

[keefy1972]

GFI you are definitely in a rough spot and no one here means to give you the impression that we think the worst of you.

 

NC IS the only way to go, not because she needs to think of things without any reminders of you, but because she said that's what she wants right now. She may never think of the situation again and you're going to have to be okay with that. Of course we know how unlikely that is but it's the mindset you need right now.

 

NC is the only way to go also because YOU need to think of things without ANY reminders of HER!! I know you love this woman but you know you have some work to do on yourself, have taken some needed steps to do it, and we ALL here applaud that. Take this no contact as an opportunity to take care of yourself. Work on your own issues. Leave her alone to deal with hers. She'll manage I'm sure, just like you will manage.

 

Use this board as much as you need because, I know personally, I'd like to keep up with the progress you make. You can do this and be better for it in the long run. We're all behind you despite how you may think some people are rooting against you. While some advice has been more harsh than others, the intent has been the same.

 

Keep posting. We're here for ya buddy!

[GoingForIt_77]

I do believe that she will try and bury this, along with the abortion and try and write them both off as a bad experience in her lifetime. I know though that I am more than that and that WE were more than a bad experience.

 

I wonder if someone tries really hard to not allow themselves to forget the bad, that they never do? At what point, if ever, does the good memories and more so the sincere effort I put into this in the month after she left me, get remembered and sink in?

 

I ask these questions because I dealt with a much different woman last week than I did this past Sunday. I don't believe it was just her having seen my face and been in my physical presense that did NOT allow her to SEE and FEEL the change in me, eveb though she admitted that she did. I know her support system (especially her gf who took her to have the abortion and took her out this entire past weekend, was also the one who drove her to my place). I didn't really have a winning chance on Sunday. I lost before I was able to even open my sincere, remorseful and loving mouth.

 

The truth will eventually sink in I'm hoping. How many people would admit to not only the partner who left them, but to themselves as well that they have a problem and know what they did was wrong and they feel the pain that they inflicted on them on a daily basis and are going for intense therapy? How many care that much? I DO. Why can she not see that? Why does it not make a difference to her? I know. I know. I know. She is scared. She knows that even know she understands WHY I did what I did (me being weak, scared, lost, out of control), she also knows that NOTHING justifies my actions.

 

She says that time will not make this better. I can't change her way of thinking. I know from my experience that time changes a lot.

 

I have people who have wronged me who have NEVER once apologized and admit to having NO regret. Would I ever talk to a person like that? NO. I am not that type of person. She doesn't seem to care? Is that fair to me? YES. For now it is. Will it always be? I don't think so. It truthfully is easier for her to walk away knowing I wronged her and not see me for who and where I am today. I don't expect her too.

 

Even her best gf will hurt her at some point. I am not perfect and now more than ever admit that. I know what I have to work on and AM working on it. She was right to have left me and I don't blame any of her actions as of late. It's all just a byproduct of how I treated her, along with her having a very strong support system.

 

I see things much more clearly now. I do know that I did ALL I could do NOW. She knows she did ALL that she could do THEN. What will happen in the future? I don't know.

[BeStrongBeHappy]

Dan... i think when someone says the kinds of things she did to you on Sunday, they are in an emotional position where regardless of any changes you made in the last few weeks, she may feel it is too late for her to continue in the relationship.

 

what someone considers is forgiveable (and forgettable) is a very personal decision, and not something anyone else can easily logic or influence. so your best behavior may not matter to her in the greater scheme of things, if she considered what you did to be severe enough to be unforgiveable and unforgettable in HER mind.

 

people are individuals, with all kinds of emotions and motivations that have nothing to do with logic nor are they under the control of another person. so you can do everything the right way, but she could still not be interested in continuing the relationship for her own personal reasons, logic, emotions, fears, etc. that seems to be where she is now based on what you have said.

 

so i think the best thing for you right now would be to focus on yourself, with the understanding that it most likely is over; she has made herself very clear on that. that doesn't mean that several years down the road she might not speak to you again, but that is up to her, not you, and you shouldn't expect that that is likely becuase that will be a lonely road for you, if you are waiting for her and she never does want to come back.

 

so please be kind to yourself and continue to focus on healing and respecting her wishes. most of us have been through a situation where we've 'blown' a relationship we really wanted for one reason or another, and it is very had because of regret and all the coulda, shoulda's that occur to us after the breakup. sometimes that is just the way it goes, and we have to heal ourselves and accept what life has dealt us and move on...

 

best of luck, keep everyone posted on how you are doing!

[GoingForIt_77]

The whole issue when she left my place and I acted weak and followed up on it right away, was that I was thrown off with how uncomfortable she seemed and as a result of that, I did not even remember to give her everything she had left at my place, which included her leather boots, her umbrella and some tupperware.

 

We know when she left, she left without these things. I in turn called her back right away letting her know to turn around. I called back twice more and sent a text (my having chased for the first time). This scared her and she panicked (as I was) and told me she needs space, as you all know.

 

I didn't stop there. I called back and asked her to be mature and call me, which prompted her to tell me that she can't have me in her life. I pushed for that. She told me she didn't care about her boots. The conversation spiralled out of control. I got emotional and started crying for the first time and I did everything I said I wouldn't. It pushed her away even further, inevitably so.

 

I didn't let it go. I persisted. I made her call me back later on and she did. I was WEAKER than she had EVER seen me. This was NOT the tough guy she dated. She saw and helpless baby she could no longer take care of. She asked me to let go. YES, I feared letting go of her. This is deeper than it appears. She must have felt SO responsible for my unhappiness and my depency on her, which is something I NEVER showed her during the relationship. She pulled away even more. She became desperate, asking me what I wanted from her? She really didn't know anymore. I wanted a second chance, but that is not what I said. She asked me WHY I am doing this? I for the first time started apologizing for having disappointed her and letting her down. She said I didn't. She started sensing how HARD I really was being on myself for the first time since she met me. Previously, I had been hard on HER, but now, I am hard only on myself since she left. I told her that I must sound like a freak. She said you're not a freak. She kept defending me. I think it hurt her to see me doing this to myself. I stopped and said goodbye.

 

Later that night, I sent her an email letting her know that I hope her tears stop falling and that her cloudy skies turn to sunshine and that she is a beautiful and special person. I wished her good luck with everything. I included a poem of Pablo Neruda (her fav. peot), titled "If You Forget Me". I also included 6 links to coping with abortion sites and told her that I love her and always have and always will and that she's never alone.

 

That was late Sunday night (almost 4:00am).

 

This morning at 8:00am I woke up and felt compelled to give her back her boots. The ones she said she doesn't care about. I picked up my cell phone and texted her saying: Hi, I would like to mail you your boots. I should have mailed you everything. What is your address?

 

She replied IMMEDIATELY, giving me her home address. Strange how she said only 2 days earlier that she didn't want her boots?? Anyways, I replied by text, saying that I would insure the package and if she wasn't home, it would be sent to her post office and asked her if that's okay?

 

She replied and said: Doesn't Matter.

 

OKAY, so I thought to myself....HMMMMMM Dan, she isn't being appreciative at all. This is NOT the girl you know. Now, you can do one of three things. You can reply and demand some respect and be putting her down in the process. You could do NOTHING at all, or you could text her back and continue to be yourself and show her that her coldness is NOT going to affect you like it would have in the past.

 

SO, I waited almost 2 hours (KNOWING she was expecting me to berate her immediately) and said: "Do you want your tupperware too?"

 

She replied IMMEDIATELY saying one word: "NO". There was no thank you there.

 

BUT, she then sent me a second text and said: "AND, you can keep the umbrella. I know you don't have one".

 

What's this NOW??? She's actually being nice and sweet and considerate??? YUP.

 

So, I text her back, saying but it makes me look like Mary Poppins.

 

I got NO response to that. I didn't expect one. She is VERY closed now, BUT, then I sent her a second text and said: "Thanks. You know (insert name), I acted like a (part of the female anatomy) on Sunday. I just wanted to throw that out there."

 

She replied immediately DEFENDING ME, saying, "No, you didn't. Stop putting yourself down. Goodbye Dan."

 

So, this was a girl from 2 days ago who no longer wanted her boots, who is accepting them today and was throughtful, as well as defending me. It shows she still cares.

 

Something else to consider. I did NOT show her that I was scared to contact her. I showed NO fear of her reaction. I did what I wanted to do, which was the right thing and she didn't have to think of me keeping an umbrella, because she knows I don't have one and then telling me that I didn't act like a $#$@ on Sunday and told me to STOP putting myself down. Instead of me having put her down, which I almost did when I didn't initially get the reaction, or respect I was hoping for, I ended up being hard on ME and she came to MY rescue in a matter of words.

 

TIME does change things and my friends, this was only 2 days. I don't think I left SUCH a bad impression on her on Sunday after all.

 

So, I send her her boots later in the week and I give her space. A LOT of it. I'm growing from this.

 

Don't FEAR failure. If you FEAR failing, which I did on Sunday, you WILL lose. When you don't fear failing, you have a chance of winning.

 

Dan

[majord23]

Dan,

I'm worried here mate - what are your thoughts?

[CarnelianButterfly]

She said she didn't want the boots and you still harass her. You expect respect for continuing to disrespect her choice.

 

Leave Her Alone. Period, mail the boots and stop bugging her.

 

No notes with the boots either, just the boots.

[melrich]

Dan,

I'm worried here mate - what are your thoughts?

 

I agree. This is worrying behaviour. You seem to be looking for any excuse to continue contacting her and she is clearly telling you not to.

[lady00]

GFI,

 

I'm confused...you said time has changed things...what exactly has changed? I don't think her being responsive to you (to a limited extent) really shows that she feels differently. You are not afraid to contact her, yes, but you're not respecting her wishes here. The fact that she responded to a couple of your texts or that she was open to getting her boots back after you offered doesn't suggest to me that anything has changed. You need to respect her and leave her alone. You need focus on yourself right know.

[ebsmith1]

Dan you have got to leave this girl alone! You are reading WAY to much into the texts about the boots! She doesn't need to be appreciative or show you anything or be anything like the girl you knew! She is NOT the girl you knew anymore. Someone very wise on this board told me that I needed to forget the man that I loved as he was because that man disappeared when he dumped me. If he ever came back it would be a different person and a new relationship. If someone you love leaves you then they are not the person that you thought they were in some way. Just back off! You are reading mountains of meaning into a simple exchange that she told you she didn't even want to have. You need to stop for both of your sakes.

[BeStrongBeHappy]

Dan, please talk to your therapist before you contact her again... tell the therapist what happened on Sunday, and show them the messages you exchanged with her and what you're thinking... talk to them about your feelings and intentions and ask for the therapist's guidance on this...

 

she asked you on sunday to never contact her again, ever, and you are texting her multiple times today... this isn't about winning or fear either, if it is, it isn't about loving her or respecting her it is about trying to control her.

 

please think this through and consult your therapist before you continue contact... your therapist has a far better grasp on what might be the best thing for you than anyone on this board does...

[kate111]

Oh Dan.

 

This is the old Dan isn't it?

 

You need to let it go. I know it hurts, I'm going through this now and have the same tendency to obsess and overanalyse.

 

You are driving women away by being too needy.

 

You have tried hard enough with this lady. Unfortunately you need to sit and wait now. If she wants you back she will call you.

 

Easy to say and not to do I know.

[GoingForIt_77]

Ladies, don't you see?? Part of the reason she is staying away from me isn't because of her "fear". It's because she was "turned off".

 

Today, I did what I wanted to do, not caring what her or anyone else thinks and guess what? I got a responsive girl. I didn't text her multiple times. We texted each other back and forth (2 sided, not one).

 

I don't regret doing today what I did ONE bit.

 

I didn't have to re-earn her trust first. It was her RESPECT that needed to be re-earned, before her trust.

 

She respected my boldness today. She replied IMMEDIATELY to me. Was nice about the umbrella and told me NOT to put myself down.

 

Things are under control over here. TRUST me on that one.

 

By the way Kate, BEEC, agrees with me on this one 100%.

[GoingForIt_77]

She wasn't SCARED of me on Sunday. She was TURNED OFF. I cared TOO much of what she thought and she knew it. I sought out her approval. Today, I did what I wanted to do. It was bold and she followed and was even somewhat nice and pleasant.

 

Again, no regrets with what I did today. Part of the reason I was insecure in the past, is because I doubted every single move I made and thought I had.

 

Not the case today.

[kate111]

Well I know if I was the girl I would want to get away very fast.

 

But perhaps that is just me, I'm not a passionate person who wants high intensity drama. I withdraw if someone gets like that.

 

If she is anything like me she texted you out of guilt. She feels pity for you because you are so out of control. But you are making her resolve to break up with you stronger aren't you?

 

We are like opposites Dan. I witdraw probably too much whilst you seem to go the other way.

 

If I was you Dan I would leave it for a month or so. Painful as that is.

[ebsmith1]

I'd be completely freaked out if I were her. I don't think she's scared, or "turned off", I think she wants you to leave her alone and feels pity. You need to ship her the boots and go pure NC!

[CarnelianButterfly]

What will it take for you to leave her alone?

[lady00]

Well, I do see where your confusion comes from. She's told you she wants no contact but she's not sticking to it herself. It makes her seem like she's sending you mixed signals. Then again, her reason for breaking NC was that you offered her her boots. Maybe she really wants them and thought it was worth breaking NC to get them. I agree that it is probably confusing for her to say one thing and sound so final about it and then respond to your contact. But I think you're reading a lot into a few text messages.

[GoingForIt_77]

LADY, your BANG ON!!!!

 

I will take it a step further. BTW, Kate and I go back a LOOOONG ways on this site. She knows me under a different name. Kate, don't utter it out loud though .

 

Okay Lady, here goes:

 

YES, she is sending me MIXED signals in a way. WHY? Well, she is drawn to the Dan of today. NOT repelled like so many of you think.

 

She was repelled by weak and insecure Dan of Sunday. Today was a far different Dan, who was motivated to contact her, without any fear, or seeking her APPROVAL.

 

When I lead, she follows. We tend to follow those who are BOLD and courageous, because being bold is the LEAST selfish thing we can do. When you sit back and contemplate what others will think of what you do, they will know that you are thinking just of you and they sense your doubt.

 

Today, I had NO doubt and she jumped at my contact. She pulled away from an insecure Dan. NOT a confident Dan. Today I went in, seeking NOTHING from her and it was my lack of caring what she thought and not NOT caring about her, but of what she THOUGHT. I just DID. It was NOT my heart that guided me today. It was NOT emotion. It was just me going on a gut feeling, which in all reality, wasn't wrong.

 

You see folks. She said she didn't care about her boots on Sunday, after having left, because the Dan she was faced with was a guy who would have done ANYTHING for her and she didn't want that. In many ways, she wanted a Dan who would do anything for himself.

 

That's who she got today.

[CarnelianButterfly]

those who are BOLD and courageous

You texted her about her boots. That is neither bold or courageous. Its a text message, you sent after she told you to leave her alone. You typed a few words and hit send, she typed a few back, and now you're going off like it was some grand feat. It was a text message, emotionless words on a screen, the only thing you did was violate her space again.

 

Go to therapy, you are seriously scary obsessed and delusional.

 

 

Has it snowed since Sunday?