On The Side

[Openreach]

Hey long time since Ive been here if i could get some feedback please?

*****Backstory****

Have been single since end of LTR (12 years) for 2 years. Not been looking for new relationship. Had a chance meeting with someone who I was in a short term relationship with 20 years ago. The first relationship ended as we found out she'd become pregnant with a casual fling shortly before we met.

*******Here & Now*********

Chatted online for a few weeks and had lots in common, both very attracted to each other, have met in person a few times and have been intimate. But she has a partner - LTR says she's unhappy but trapped in her situation. They were married and divorced but then reconciled and have 2 children in mid/late teens. I knew this before we met in person.

We spend hours everyday messaging and talking on the phone. I'm in love with her and have told her this. I have been married myself and had 3 other LTR's but I can honestly say I have never felt the way i do about this woman. We connect in ways i did not think possible- i cant put it into words

I've been cheated on myself and i know its wrong. She tells me how controlling & manipulative OH is and is convinced he's got other women on the go. She's also financially dependent on him too i think. I've never been in this situation before.

Sensible thing is to end it and tell her she needs to make a choice and if she comes to me then great and if not thats life.

I'm just finding it hard to do this, i feel bad but never felt like this about anyone before- not even my ex wife who i have kids with! I dont want to lose her but I dont want to be a side *** either. She's also confused as hell too.

It's a frightening and confusing situation. Does it have to be "Its me or him" or is there any other way?

Thanks if you made it this far,

 

Sensible advice given by friend is to step away and tell her to make the choice. They're right aren't they?

 

[redswim30]

You mention feelings a lot in your post.   How you feel about her, how she feels about you, how she feels about her husband. 

But sometimes people put too much importance on feelings.  Because at the end of the day, what matters is what we DO.   

I've had people in my past say they have feelings for me, and still choose not to date me.  

Feelings are easy.  We all catch feelings for multiple people in our lives, but at the end of the day- it's ACTIONS that count.  Feelings are involuntary.  Actions are choices. 

For whatever reason, she's taking the action to stay with her husband. Whether it's for financial stability or for her children, I can't say.  But she's getting something out of staying with him and that means more to her than whatever feelings she has for you. 

You have feelings for her, but you are allowing her to cheat with you.  You aren't honoring yourself or her.  You are allowing her to stay in her comfortable (if not happy) marriage while taking from you what she isn't getting from her husband. 

You should step away, but don't tell her to make a choice.  Because she ISNT choosing now. 

You should talk to her and say "Look.  I've told you how I feel.  But I can't be in love with someone who is married. So for my own well-being, I need to step away from you.  If you decide to get divorced someday, we can reconnect.  I would love for that to be the case.  However, I can't allow myself to accept the crumbs you're willing to give me when I want all of you. It's not fair to either of us or to your husband and I can't do it anymore."

If we want things to change in life, we have to take action. 

She can have all the feelings in the world for you, maybe she's even in love with you too, but when push comes to shove, if her marital security means more to her than love, all the "feelings" in the world don't mean squat. 

[Wiseman2]

10 hours ago, Openreach said:

  Sensible advice given by friend is to step away and tell her to make the choice. 

Unfortunately you're the only one who can make a choice. She doesn't have to because you are playing along.

Unavailable people choose other unavailable people. So if you wanted a full time GF/ wife you would have one..

Affairs are easy. You sneak around for sex while the betrayed person does the heavy lifting of a relationship. 

You can give her an ultimatum, but even if she got together with you, your grand prize would be a cheater.

[smackie9]

She's just using you as an emotional escape and you are living in a fantasy world. I'm gonna cut to the chase here...stop it. Cut her off. People who cheat always say it's real bad blah blah blah, play the victim, need rescuing, blah blah blah. It's a crock of $%^&. She's still the $%^& show she always was and your gut knows this. You are just all caught up in the emotions because you just realized how thirsty you are for something. Harsh words but I'm trying to knock some sense into ya. Time to get real with yourself and walk away. 

[shouldhavelearned]

Cut it off and move on

[NighttimeNightmare]

13 hours ago, Openreach said:

But she has a partner - LTR says she's unhappy but trapped in her situation.

Yes, this is what all cheaters say because their MO is to blame others for the situations they find themselves in, and they have no healthy emotional coping mechanisms to deal with interpersonal difficulties. so, they feel justified in going behind their partners back and breaking trust and commitment in order to get “needs” met 

 

if she cheats with you, she’ll cheat on you

 

and as for you, you need to do some serious soul searching as to why you likewise feel justified and entitled to mess around with someone else’s spouse 

[SooSad33]

15 hours ago, Openreach said:

I'm just finding it hard to do this, i feel bad but never felt like this about anyone before- not even my ex wife who i have kids with! I dont want to lose her but I dont want to be a side *** either. She's also confused as hell too.

I will say it's a 'fantasy' you're living in.  It's something you think you really do want- as of yet it's not yours.  So, you're coming up with these 'images & thoughts' of how it could be.  Might be.. only if.

But, reality speaking.  Look at the whole picture.

This woman took her ex back and remains with him.  Basically only for financial reasons?  Okay fine, they are both fooling around (maybe).  Or maybe it is just her!  Like, why would he fool around?  He got his wifey back.

Either way, this couple has agreed to get back together. Can you imagine how her mindset is?  Just how stable is she? 😕 .  She's probably one hot mess, who's relying on you, emotionally & physically and if it wasn't you, it'd be someone else. 😉 

Nope, this is someone I'd steer clear of.  I don't bother with people newly out of relationships or still involved.  Always causes distress 😕 .

 

So, you have been single about 2 years?  When did you two start all of this?  YOu say you'd been chatting a lot in the beginning, then it progressed.

It's quite possible, while YOU are gaining feelings, she has none.  BUT, she will lead you and let you believe this is all good - for her own sake.  Think.  And tread carefully.

 

[HeartGoesOn]

21 hours ago, Openreach said:

Sensible advice given by friend is to step away and tell her to make the choice. They're right aren't they?

The honorable choice to make is telling her to step away, yet by telling her to make the choice is a disaster waiting to happen.

Why not ask yourself what you find attractive about a married woman who is openly demonstrating their disloyality towards the person they exchanged vows with.

At any rate it appears you're viewing this through tunnel vision, rather than looking at what's directly in front of you.  In short, I hope you make the right choices.

 

[Openreach]

I asked for this i know but just to clarify as i've made a mess of explaining. shes not married now. They used to be married- got divorced. She said he wouldnt leave her alone in the seven years they were divorced and got back together for the sake of the kids and pressure. I was in a relationship with her 20 years ago - a long time before she was married- and we were in love but circumstances conspired against that progressing.

We have a deep connection that i cant put into words and she says the same. Shes everything i always wanted in a woman and im being completely honest here - i wasn't even looking for a new relationship and was happy being single- i cant stress that enough. It was a chance meeting. And now we find ourselves in this situation.

I explained the torment ive been experiencing and she asked if i wanted her to back off and leave it....I know i should... but i cant 😞

I feel like ive wasted the best years of my life with other people and she's the one i should have been with. It was heartbreaking to lose her the first time but i was the one to do it as she find out she was a couple months pregnant a few weeks after we got together back in the early 90's when we were both quite young.

Im listening to all the advice. Im not someone to ask for help and then just do what i wanted to anyway. It just helps to read it on the screen if that makes sense.  I know its wrong to cheat. Ive never cheated once on any girlfriend myself but i have been cheated on andi know how bad that is... Thing is this OH of hers is by all accounts well known for being a cheater himself, with her and with previous girlfriends he's had. So thats lessened my sympathy for him to be honest.

 

[NighttimeNightmare]

7 minutes ago, Openreach said:

Thing is this OH of hers is by all accounts well known for being a cheater himself, with her and with previous girlfriends he's had. So thats lessened my sympathy for him to be honest.

You’re doing what cheaters and cheater advocates do: justify 

 

you’re using his behavior to try and justify something you know is wrong so you don’t have to feel bad about it

 

also, as you can clearly see, this woman is willing to not only stay in unhealthy arrangements, but pull you into it as well - and instead of your red flags going off and walking away, you’re eating it up.  That’s scary to me.  
 

to an emotionally healthy person all of this is bad news.  Her bf is bad news, she’s bad news, and you’re bad news

 

read up on the karpman drama triangle because you lot are a case study for it 

[boltnrun]

11 minutes ago, Openreach said:

She said he wouldnt leave her alone in the seven years they were divorced and got back together for the sake of the kids

If that's true then the two of you can let her fake husband/whatever he is know that the two of you are together now. 

[Wiseman2]

16 minutes ago, Openreach said:

 they were divorced and got back together for the sake of the kids . we were in love but circumstances conspired against that progressing.

What circumstances were those? As you know "staying for the kids" is a classic.

[Openreach]

4 minutes ago, Wiseman2 said:

What circumstances were those? As you know "staying for the kids" is a classic.

Apparently he's isolated her to the point she lost all her own friends so her entire social circle are connected to him, and her job is, plus the kids, and she lives in his house

Im feeling that cake and eat it vibe, I fill in the gaps that are missing in their relationship..Im getting it.

grr its so bloody typical... when something is too good to be true .....

thanks @boltnrun you also helped me previously years ago as well as @Wiseman2. I respect your opinions and the others whove contributed so far.

i know this stuff but just needed it spelling out.. yes im upset and im weak...but ill sort it.

[Openreach]

it's not been going on long.. hours of talking everyday but only met a couple of times.. fair to say its been a massive shock to us both and has messed us both up. I know i should say "i cant be in love with you whilst" etc.... but that would be the same as giving them the ultimatum... changing someones entore life where they have to move, move the kids, lose job, hassles with multiple friends, family...all because of a fella they've met a couple of times over the last 6-8 weeks is a bit much isnt it?

She's told me honestly that she doesnt love the OH and feels trapped but the upheaval will be major and im feeling its a bit unrealstic at this point to start demanding / putting down power plays.

I know ideologically pure way of thinking would say this but this is real life and sometimes things are easier said than done. That said i wont allow it to continue for a months on end but i feel she deserves a bit more time to work things out before the balloon goes up and everything goes mental 😕

[lostandhurt]

20 hours ago, Openreach said:

Chatted online for a few weeks and had lots in common, both very attracted to each other, have met in person a few times and have been intimate

First off you are not in love, in lust maybe but you have not spent enough real time with her to be in love with her.  By real time I mean real life not sneaking around living the exciting cheating fun.

 Of course you know nearly all cheaters cheat because their partner is controlling, they are just like roommates, abusive, unloving, uncaring, cheating too, no sex for a long time and on and on.

 All excuses and justifications.  Nearly 100% of the time it is all BS to make cheating less of a bad thing. The one thing to always remember about cheaters is that they lie and then lie some more.  The first lie they tell is to themselves.

She is betraying her husband and it does not matter why, she is a cheater plain and simple.

 Of course the right thing to do is tell her that you do not want to be party to cheating.  If one day she is single, really single then she should look you up but until then you cannot be in contact with her in any way.

 Make sure she is single for a bit before you start anything with her otherwise you are just the next limb she swung over to.

 I would bet good money things at home aren't as bad as she makes them out to be and she will stay right where she is unless she finds some other guy to take his place before she leaves for good. Don't be her safety net or her sugar daddy.

 Lost

[Starlight925]

2 hours ago, Openreach said:

 I know i should say "i cant be in love with you whilst" etc.... but that would be the same as giving them the ultimatum... changing someones entore life where they have to move, move the kids, lose job, hassles with multiple friends, family...all because of a fella they've met a couple of times over the last 6-8 weeks is a bit much isnt it?

None of this.

Zero.

No ultimatum.

In fact, nothing of anything.

If she chooses to leave him (she won't), then give her about a year to figure  out her life, how to become financially independent, raise her kids, etc.  Then, you could make a move on her.

But to carry on with all this, this....mess?  Why do you want it?  Because you're soooooo in looooove.  Ugh.

I have a friend going through similar.  This friend is....wait for it.....close to 70.  Yes, a 70 year-old is going through similar.  What a waste.  And I've watched it, with my popcorn, for 2+ years.  My friend's "loooooove" ain't moved an inch in 2+ years.  And neither will yours.  What a waste of time this all is.

Move.  On.

[boltnrun]

If things are so bad with her husband the solution isn't to be a deceiving cheater. The solution is to tell her husband her concerns and either give him the opportunity to address them, or tell him the marriage is over for good and they need to discuss logistics.

[catfeeder]

On 7/16/2023 at 10:51 PM, Openreach said:

Sensible advice given by friend is to step away and tell her to make the choice. They're right aren't they?

Sure. Beats skulking around and feeling like a worm.

[MissCanuck]

9 hours ago, Openreach said:

i feel she deserves a bit more time to work things out

Work what out?

She's very unlikely to leave him. Based on what she says, she isn't financially independent and she's with him because he supports her. Whether or not she is emotionally attached is another story, but as long as she can't stand on her own two feet (financially), she ain't going anywhere. 

You're a crutch to her.