Can I Safely Date Older Men?

[Zaphod]

I'd like to date an older man... I do find them attractive but realistically, I know it might be tough to find someone who's both older and, you know, not creepy. So I would also like to just have friends who are older, people who I can talk to for advice or just life in general... Does that make sense?

 

What do you mean "creepy"? This word comes up a lot on this thread. And how is it possible to find them creepy and attractive at the same time?

[RainyCoast]

hehe, plently of aria fresca here these days, it's been very windy you remided me of something with this...

But 18 - can you hold your own intellectually to hold a 40 something man's interest? I think not. Mind you, I don't know you, so what do I know?

 

i don't know OP either so maybe this is completely irrelevant and unnecessary...But OP if the parental issues also involve something quite traumatic...chances are you not only feel more mature than your peers, but that in some ways you are. The way trauma splits the Self, some parts will shows signs of tremendous precocious development. "trauma babies" (the father of trauma theory called them "wise babies") can be unusually intelligent, or of great atristic talent, and quite often their public persona will appear psychologically apt-- this is because they had to learn to "think and feel" like their aggressors, to know them inside out, for purposes of avoiding danger whenever possible by detecting a change in mood on time for example.

 

if this feels like it relates to you, it makes sense you'd conclude you relate to mature people better. What is left out in this kind of reasoning is the undeveloped part of the personality, stuck at the age of trauma, neglect, deprivation etc. That's the part that's looking for an older man, and that is the part from which you will find yourself relating to one. Like a helpless, emotionally starved baby. How erotic, functional, deep and mature. Not. Let that sink in.

 

another thing to remind yourself of, is that while some men may find it pleasing for a while to have a naive admiring girl dependent on them...the appeal of having a dependent soon wears of. Eventually, the "childlike" persona begins to evoke disdain and disgust.

 

yet another thing to keep in mind...anyone who needs to experience themselves as mature and powerful in contrast with a child almost, is certainly not mature and powerful. It would not be surprising to find yourself...mothering an oversized baby.

 

it's not even so much the huge age gap itself. it's the aspect of looking to relate from an infantile standpoint, the role you assign yourself and the other in a kind of preambule before you even start a relationship..it tells you exactly the kind of dynamics you're setting yourself up for.

[Zaphod]

hehe, plently of aria fresca here these days, it's been very windy you remided me of something with this...

 

 

i don't know OP either so maybe this is completely irrelevant and unnecessary...But OP if the parental issues also involve something quite traumatic...chances are you not only feel more mature than your peers, but that in some ways you are. The way trauma splits the Self, some parts will shows signs of tremendous precocious development. "trauma babies" (the father of trauma theory called them "wise babies") can be unusually intelligent, or of great atristic talent, and quite often their public persona will appear psychologically apt-- this is because they had to learn to "think and feel" like their aggressors, to know them inside out, for purposes of avoiding danger whenever possible by detecting a change in mood on time for example.

 

if this feels like it relates to you, it makes sense you'd conclude you relate to mature people better. What is left out in this kind of reasoning is the undeveloped part of the personality, stuck at the age of trauma, neglect, deprivation etc. That's the part that's looking for an older man, and that is the part from which you will find yourself relating to one. Like a helpless, emotionally starved baby. How erotic, functional, deep and mature. Not. Let that sink in.

 

another thing to remind yourself of, is that while some men may find it pleasing for a while to have a naive admiring girl dependent on them...the appeal of having a dependent soon wears of. Eventually, the "childlike" persona begins to evoke disdain and disgust.

 

yet another thing to keep in mind...anyone who needs to experience themselves as mature and powerful in contrast with a child almost, is certainly not mature and powerful. It would not be surprising to find yourself...mothering an oversized baby.

 

it's not even so much the huge age gap itself. it's the aspect of looking to relate from an infantile standpoint, the role you assign yourself and the other in a kind of preambule before you even start a relationship..it tells you exactly the kind of dynamics you're setting yourself up for.

 

You're on the IQ pills again tonight, I see. Another great post, where are you conjuring all this up from?

 

You advertently or inadvertently bring up an interesting point. Who do people date when they feel excluded, or seperate, from people of their own age bracket? That's a tough one.

[Fudgie]

OP, when I was your age (I'm late 20s now), I dated older men exclusively and had a couple relationships with men much older than myself, one lasted a few years.

 

No regrets. I get the attraction and I still see much older men when I am out and about that I find attractive. My boyfriend is about my age now but I am still glad that I spent a lot of time dating older. I learned a lot and had some nice relationships in the end.

 

I have no advice other than to be careful. There are creeps out there. I was lucky, I ran into them but never dated them because I was so quick to cut people off. If you do decide to date older, just keep your eyes peeled and don't let anyone use age as a reason to be an authority figure over you.

 

Good luck.

[Zaphod]

My most successful relationship, or certainly top three, was with a woman who was 21 and I was 35. She chased me. Interesting thing was, she was from a different country, and that bought a new angle to the age gap thing. I forgot she was younger than me within no time at all, she was just... there. Went out with her for four years.

 

Biggest problem was I found from a man's point of view - women can change a lot at that age. As a matter of fact, I'm still friends (loosely) with her now. And she's unrecognisable from the woman I dated, although the way she is now, I like her as friends. We still have some particular interests in common. If she'd had stayed that woman, I would maybe still be with her now. She ended the relationship, but I think I got a bit bored with her a time before that.

 

I'm not sure whether men change a lot at that age, maybe the women can answer that.

 

The ironic twist is this (and it's a cruel one) - Men want women to stay the same, but women change. Women want men to change but men stay the same. Ok, not all the time, but it happens quite a lot, I notice. Perhaps nature and evolution have a reason for this, or perhaps it's a result of social conditioning, I don't know. But it's a real bummer.

[RainyCoast]

I found from a man's point of view - women can change a lot at that age. As a matter of fact, I'm still friends (loosely) with her now. And she's unrecognisable from the woman I dated,

now imagine if this was an 18 year old girl (who will certainly grow and change plenty with time), and a 40 something man. Presuming he isn't emotionally stunted in ways that render him abusive (or creepy, as this thread puts it), i guess it can be a symbiotic relationship...for a while. dependency...but devoid of the malicious aspect (setting myslef up for many a poster's rage here, but i am fairly certain most of what people call healthy relationships are just acceptable forms of dependency-- a word that gets thrown around like an insult around here btw). a girl looking for wisdom and direction, a man looking for a persona untainted by the struggles of being Someone Great/Important or whatever the hell it is the years do to us.

 

The trick is precisely that...the child may grow up. The somehow stunted adult...if he does grow up...the infantile innocence may lose the appeal for him, leaving a vacancy for seasoned partners. If he doesn't...well, that leaves a vacancy for...a new child.

 

 

but then again... don't we often part ways because one or the other outgrows the relationship anyway.

 

 

echoing the fair warning though. i have a hard time imagining a 40 something taking benign romantic interest in an 18 year old. certainly, if they do, fat chance of coming across them...on OLD of all places.

[mustlovedogs]

I'm a grad student after working 3 years. So I'm a 26 YO hanging out in my university's student union when I overhear some undergrads talking. They sound uneducated, immature, annoying... ugh. They were dreadful.

 

And I'm only 5-7 years older than them.

 

You may be mature for your age, but that doesn't make you 5 years more mature. In the early 20's, every year makes a difference. I'm so different from who I was just a year ago and I'm unrecognizable from who I was in college.

[Zaphod]

emotionally stunted in ways that render him abusive (or creepy, as this thread puts it)

 

That's what creepy means, ah. So I guess it's the suggestion of possible abuse, right?

 

Not referring to you, because you haven't said it, but to a few others on this thread - suggesting that someone may be "creepy" simply because they're older is I think a bit unfair and ageist. There are plenty of younger people will ill intent.

 

i guess it can be a symbiotic relationship...for a while. dependency...but devoid of the malicious aspect (setting myslef up for many a poster's rage here, but i am fairly certain most of what people call healthy relationships are just acceptable forms of dependency-- a word that gets thrown around like an insult around here btw). a girl looking for wisdom and direction, a man looking for a persona untainted by the struggles of being Someone Great/Important or whatever the hell it is the years do to us.

 

The trick is precisely that...the child may grow up. The somehow stunted adult...if he does grow up...the infantile innocence may lose the appeal for him, leaving a vacancy for seasoned partners. If he doesn't...well, that leaves a vacancy for...a new child.

 

 

 

Good stuff, another dose of common sense truth here. The only thing I would say is that this assumes that one is looking for a long-term relationship. Perhaps there is a lot of fun and learning to be had from the odd 6 month or year relationship, although I'm not sure that's what the OP is after. Do we call one year long-term? Not really, although it's not a fling. Sort of in between.

 

For a six month relationship, I can imagine this might be quite fun for a man in his forties and a very young woman. But a design for life together? Perhaps not.

 

The world is constantly a changin' though. Who knows, in the future, people may only want shorter relationships. I mean if someone had told us about online dating in, say, 1995 - well. I should have said "Humbug, sir".

[RainyCoast]

it would be fun for 6 months..or however long...if there isn't a perverse motive. i don't know if everyone meant creepy has potential of abuse, but lecherous leery predators hungry for fresh flesh aren't monsters made up to scare young girls with. agreed, they're of varying ages.

 

not a parent, but i'm imagining having an 18 year old daughter on dating sites. not very comfortable with the idea at all. imagining having her contacted by 40+ men...yeah my first instinct would be to hunt them down and slap them with their freshly cut off body parts (starting with the stereotypical choice of body part to mutilate in an ill-motivated male).

 

i'm curious OP. why 40+? i mean you're looking for maturity, guidance...how does that come at 40 and after? we've demonstrated it may come sooner, or it may come never. so are you looking for a number or a quality?

[SkyBlue98]

it would be fun for 6 months..or however long...if there isn't a perverse motive. i don't know if everyone meant creepy has potential of abuse, but lecherous leery predators hungry for fresh flesh aren't monsters made up to scare young girls with. agreed, they're of varying ages.

 

not a parent, but i'm imagining having an 18 year old daughter on dating sites. not very comfortable with the idea at all. imagining having her contacted by 40+ men...yeah my first instinct would be to hunt them down and slap them with their freshly cut off body parts (starting with the stereotypical choice of body part to mutilate in an ill-motivated male).

 

i'm curious OP. why 40+? i mean you're looking for maturity, guidance...how does that come at 40 and after? we've demonstrated it may come sooner, or it may come never. so are you looking for a number or a quality?

 

That's a good question... The best way I can explain it is, sometimes the qualities of being very self-assured or whatever it is, can come across as being a little arrogant or conceited on a younger guy, whereas on an older guy they just seem very natural. There's just some quality that older men have that younger men don't.

 

I think it does have to do with a father figure type thing... I'm very close to my mother but not so to my father. Really what I want is just an older guy I'm NOT related to who I could just go out for coffee with and could be like a friend to me. I don't know if that's possible though.

[Capricorn3]

i'm imagining having an 18 year old daughter on dating sites. not very comfortable with the idea at all. imagining having her contacted by 40+ men...yeah my first instinct would be to hunt them down and slap them with their freshly cut off body parts (starting with the stereotypical choice of body part to mutilate in an ill-motivated male).

 

i'm curious OP. why 40+? i mean you're looking for maturity, guidance...how does that come at 40 and after?

I agree. It gives one a very uncomfortable feeling .... young teen, barely out of high school on dating sites looking for 40-50 year old men (or vice versa). ~shudder~

 

OP, I can only imagine any old guy (40-50 yrs old), looking for 18 year old girls only has one thing in mind and that would be sex. I can't imagine they would be after a romantic relationship with you and looking for a future with you. FWB, sure. Sex, definitely. Relationship? NO. (imo).

[RainyCoast]

sometimes the qualities of being very self-assured or whatever it is, can come across as being a little arrogant or conceited on a younger guy, whereas on an older guy they just seem very natural. There's just some quality that older men have that younger men don't.

 

okay, the aura of confidence appears to be "earned" in a man seasoned with age. But it is worth noting that it sometimes isn't. and that a young person can be mature in many ways, though their age would have us conclude otherwise.

 

i get the desire for this Sophie's World kind of thing, i had fantasized it myself very often (before i even knew of the book).

 

Would it have to be coffee dates? I did have martial arts and debate coaches who were excellent guidance for example. Ethical (though you have to be careful everyhwere and not just assume someone is benevolent because they work with youth, but you get my drift), wise, encouraging growth and individuation rather than getting off on young people's vulnerability. That was mentorship. Female too of course.

[Hollyj]

There are a few of dating sites specifically for that:

 

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Yuck!!!!!!!!!

[Zaphod]

Personally I go by this rule, speaking as one of said older men -

 

I will chase women who are reasonably close to my age, namely about 35 upwards.

 

I will date a young woman, but she has to chase me. I won't chase a young woman. I probably won't date a woman who's 18 because I'll get bored and she won't have enough "woman" for me. 23? Well you can keep me company if you like. Relationship? Maybe not. 28? Possible. 30 - 35? Sure. I may play it careful though. 35 and up? No problem.

 

It's not exactly a rule, and I'm not sure why I have this rule, but there it is. It seems to sit right, I guess. And of course I have to pull those numbers out of the air to give it any semblance of cohesion. There is variance and wiggle room.

 

The thing is - if I meet a woman who's really very compatibile with me and she's say 32, I've got a slight dilemma - and we can't help the year we're born, right?

 

My thing is I, and most of my male friends, all look really young, everyone thinks we're 35 not 45.

 

I hate to be superficial but I'll give this one to you lot anyway at risk of seeming horrendously flippant -

 

I think it has a lot to do with how you look. If a man in his fifites dates a woman in her thirties and they look the same age, no one really bats an eyelid. If a man who's 27 dates a woman who's 25 and he looks a lot older than her, it raises looks. This may be incorrect but it's my interpretation of what I've observed over the years. People have to "look" right in order for others to accept them. You even get it when you see one couple where the man is extremely tall and the woman extremely small, or the woman is taller than the man. Or indeed, years ago, different races. It's the way our primitive little ape like brains work, IMHO.

 

Or at least, it seems to be a contributory factor. My last girlfriend, her Dad met me, then later was "having words" with her about her getting a toy boy. Truth is, I was actually six years older than her.

 

Others might disagree with me though, it's only a hypothesis.

[Hollyj]

That's a good question... The best way I can explain it is, sometimes the qualities of being very self-assured or whatever it is, can come across as being a little arrogant or conceited on a younger guy, whereas on an older guy they just seem very natural. There's just some quality that older men have that younger men don't.

 

I think it does have to do with a father figure type thing... I'm very close to my mother but not so to my father. Really what I want is just an older guy I'm NOT related to who I could just go out for coffee with and could be like a friend to me. I don't know if that's possible though.

 

OP, What kind of conversation can you have? You have limited life experience, and would be in a very different place. I would think that something was creepy with any man in his 40's dating an 18 year old. He's after sex.

 

What would your family think of this?

[SkyBlue98]

OP, What kind of conversation can you have? You have limited life experience, and would be in a very different place. I would think that something was creepy with any man in his 40's dating an 18 year old. He's after sex.

 

What would your family think of this?

 

I am intelligent though... I don't like it when people assume I don't have anything to say just because I'm young.

[RainyCoast]

but...why has it diverted to what people will think?

 

isn't the question what it will be based on, motivated by?

 

on her end, by a desire for efficient parenting and guidance. On his end, well i dunno?! I'd be curious to hear an honest, ethical, benevolent 40+ man who takes romantic interest in an 18 year old tell us what he sees in her? 20 something, yeah. done that and sometimes it didn't suck.

 

because all i can imagine is that villanizing explanation of him seeing gullible, easily controlled fresh meat to feast on. (and why would he be meeting young girls on dating sites if that weren't the case)? and the thought just brings out the beastly amazon in me.

[Zaphod]

OP, What kind of conversation can you have? You have limited life experience, and would be in a very different place. I would think that something was creepy with any man in his 40's dating an 18 year old. He's after sex.

 

What would your family think of this?

 

To be fair, just because one can't imagine what would take place between a forties something man and an eighteen year old woman doesn't mean there is nothing that could take place. I mean, I kind of agree with you, but it's not strictly speaking objectively true is it?

 

Take an eighteen year old woman from Africa. And a forties something year old man from America. My guess is the African girl probably trumps him in many areas involving maturity. Ok, that's stereotyping, but I use it to highlight my point. Perhaps they talk about love, and warmth and compassion, fairness and humanity. Perhaps she's a great cook and he regales her with stories about the 1980s?

 

A real life example, back to the girl I dated who was fourteen years younger than me. I was 35, she was 21. We actually had the same interests. She found my stories fascinating and I introduced her to previous generations of the culture she was into. She loved it. And I wasn't with her because she was 21. When you think about it, 21 and 35 isn't a million miles from 18 and forties, at a stretch, at least.

 

I can imagine it. But I don't think it's very common, or very likely. But I have an inkling that it happens more than we think. Perhaps a woman in her forties and an 18 year old man?

[Hollyj]

I am intelligent though... I don't like it when people assume I don't have anything to say just because I'm young.

 

You can be smart, but you do not have life experience. You also communicate in a different manner. How would you hang out with him and his friends, or attend a business function? You are not legal to drink. If he even incorporated you into his life, as many frown on this and think it's odd. You are a generation behind these guys.

 

What would your family say.

[Hollyj]

To be fair, just because one can't imagine what would take place between a forties something man and an eighteen year old woman doesn't mean there is nothing that could take place. I mean, I kind of agree with you, but it's not strictly speaking objectively true is it?

 

Take an eighteen year old woman from Africa. And a forties something year old man from America. My guess is the African girl probably trumps him in many areas involving maturity. Ok, that's stereotyping, but I use it to highlight my point. Perhaps they talk about love, and warmth and compassion, fairness and humanity. Perhaps she's a great cook and he regales her with stories about the 1980s?

 

A real life example, back to the girl I dated who was fourteen years younger than me. I was 35, she was 21. We actually had the same interests. She found my stories fascinating and I introduced her to previous generations of the culture she was into. She loved it. And I wasn't with her because she was 21. When you think about it, 21 and 35 isn't a million miles from 18 and forties, at a stretch, at least.

 

I can imagine it. But I don't think it's very common, or very likely. But I have an inkling that it happens more than we think. Perhaps a woman in her forties and an 18 year old man?

 

I believe this girl os still in high school. I stand by that she has no life experience and would lack common interests at 18.

[SkyBlue98]

You can be smart, but you do not have life experience. You also communicate in a different manner. How would you hang out with him and his friends, or attend a business function? If he even incorporated you into his life, as many frown on this and think it's odd. You are a generation behind these guys.

 

What would your family say.

 

I never said I'd hang out w/ him and his friends, but I do see your point. And my parents wouldn't like it. It's a complicated situation; that's why I posted this thread because I honestly felt I needed advice.

[Hollyj]

I never said I'd hang out w/ him and his friends, but I do see your point. And my parents wouldn't like it. It's a complicated situation; that's why I posted this thread because I honestly felt I needed advice.

 

I don't understand? Wouldn't you want to share a life with your partner, this includes his friends and family. Hell, his kids may be older than you. What would you do, remain a secret and hang out at his house all the time?

[SkyBlue98]

I believe this girl os still in high school. I stand by that she has no life experience and would lack common interests at 18.

 

I'm a college student.

[Hollyj]

I'm a college student.

 

I still stand by my position.

[SkyBlue98]

I don't understand? Wouldn't you want to share a life with your partner. What would you do, remain a secret and hang out at his house all the time?

 

No, I said I'd also be okay with just a friendship. I want more older female friends too but that's not an awkward situation like it is with men.