When rejecting guys gets you the reputation of a b!!tch

[Hermes]

Here goes:

 

"The pledge to criminalise "verbal, non-verbal or physical" sexual harassment is one of the commitments in the Council of Europe's convention on violence against women, which David Cameron will commit to signing at a special event to mark International Women's Day.

 

Among the pledges in the convention, which has already been signed by 18 countries including Germany, France and Ukraine, is one to pass legislation or other measures to criminalise or impose other sanctions for "unwanted verbal, non-verbal or physical conduct of a sexual nature with the purpose or effect of violating the dignity of a person, in particular when creating an intimidating, hostile, degrading, humiliating or offensive environment".

 

From an article in The Guardian

[j.man]

This entire thread is indicitive of why so many men are checking out of the dating scene. Women refuse to understand what most men want. They keep projecting what they think they want their man to be, and demonize the ones who wont fall in line. Then you have the white knights who keep telling these "ladies" (most act like 16 year old girls who haven't grown up yet, see discussion in clothing) that there is nothing wrong with you. I've seen some other threads on here that start to reveal the truth and maybe actually get you women to understand us men, but those get quickly locked because some girls cant handle the truth. Anyways ladies, there is major gap between men and women. And its nit going to be us men trying to close that gap anymore. We are done, we washed our hands if this mess.

The only men checking out of the dating scene are the ones who suck at it.

[Helpexpressme]

I have an answer for this, but I'll be nice and not write it.

 

Yes please. I have thick skin.

[Seraphim]

This entire thread is indicitive of why so many men are checking out of the dating scene. Women refuse to understand what most men want. They keep projecting what they think they want their man to be, and demonize the ones who wont fall in line. Then you have the white knights who keep telling these "ladies" (most act like 16 year old girls who haven't grown up yet, see discussion in clothing) that there is nothing wrong with you. I've seen some other threads on here that start to reveal the truth and maybe actually get you women to understand us men, but those get quickly locked because some girls cant handle the truth. Anyways ladies, there is major gap between men and women. And its nit going to be us men trying to close that gap anymore. We are done, we washed our hands if this mess.

No ,I just don't appreciate Aholes. I have a perfectly wonderful man and I know exactly what he wants. And he knows how to treat a woman like a person . And Greta's not out there to date she's out with her friends for a night out.

[TMifune]

The only men checking out of the dating scene are the ones who suck at it.

 

Think about how much disappointment and heartache it takes for a man to completely give up on the idea finding a meaningful romantic relationship with a woman.

 

Then think about whether you'd rather be the kind of person that extends them compassion or the kind that attacks them with shame.

[boltnrun]

This entire thread is indicitive of why so many men are checking out of the dating scene. Women refuse to understand what most men want. They keep projecting what they think they want their man to be, and demonize the ones who wont fall in line. Then you have the white knights who keep telling these "ladies" (most act like 16 year old girls who haven't grown up yet, see discussion in clothing) that there is nothing wrong with you. I've seen some other threads on here that start to reveal the truth and maybe actually get you women to understand us men, but those get quickly locked because some girls cant handle the truth. Anyways ladies, there is major gap between men and women. And its nit going to be us men trying to close that gap anymore. We are done, we washed our hands if this mess.

 

Speaking for all men?

 

I'm willing to bet a very large number of men aren't signing on for this mindset. But that's ok, because the ones who aren't signing on are the majority who treat women with respect.

[Hermes]

Anyhow, to take the fire out of the thread......

 

Greta, maybe time to consider a better class of venue

[Helpexpressme]

No ,I just don't appreciate Aholes. I have a perfectly wonderful man and I know exactly what he wants. And he knows how to treat a woman like a person . And Greta's not out there to date she's out with her friends for a night out.

 

Greta is annoyed at men in general.

[ParisPaulette]

Well maybe if you got called names on a daily basis from the time the time you approached adolescence to the time you get old enough to no longer be considered of interest sexually you would get this whole topic a little more. Oh wait, some do. I believe a few of them have killed themselves over it, because it's called bullying. And that's really at the end of the day what OPs post is about. She is not addressing the topic of respectful, normal guys simply paying compliments or even seeking a date. She's talking about bullies who feel it's their right to couch hostility in a sexual manner and ruin her and her friends' day simply because lordy forbid they said "No thank you" or "Stop that" or "No" to being groped, told really vile sexual things by a stranger and made to wonder if the guy had a weapon on him and might go on a shooting spree, because of being so over the top angry and hateful.

 

And yes, after too many times of just having really ugly incidents that range from just being name called to being physically grabbed, assaulted and in my case even nearly abducted at a party once you get defensive. And it shouldn't be that way. I totally agree it's not fair to the good guys who would never do that to a woman, who are just wanting to talk to someone or maybe score a date or even just pay a compliment. It isn't fair to you either that some bad people spoil it for everyone.

 

OP actually came here seeking help with how to deal with this. And it touched off a firestorm of criticizing her instead of offering up suggestions on how to deal with the problem. Okay, guys. So what do we do to be able to go out in public, be sitting down with friends laughing and talking, minding our own business, and then have someone call us ugly names or worse when we were trying to be polite and simply said, "No thank you" or "I'm sorry, but I'm in a relationship." All ears if you have constructive suggestions I'm sure every woman out there would actually thank you on that. And no constructive is not stay inside, never show any skin, don't live in any major city, don't make eye contact, don't be beautiful or young or female. Those DO NOT help us at all.

 

Plus this: link removed

[journeynow]

I really do live on another planet.

[boltnrun]

I was sitting with a girlfriend in a bar one night and a man asked the bartender to send us each a drink. We raised the glasses and politely said "thank you". He then walked over and announced to me that I now had to go to his place to have sex with him because I "owed" him in return for the drink. He became VERY angry when I refused. He actually grabbed the glass out from in front of me and put it on another table, saying if I wouldn't put out then I didn't "deserve" his drink.

 

True story.

 

I guess I should stay out of bars.

 

HOWEVER...I frequently go to Happy Hour alone. I almost never get rudely hit on. A gentleman might approach me for conversation, but I almost never get rude propositions. It's refreshing.

[Seraphim]

I think some people should come out from behind computer screens and actually go say that to maybe their sister's or their mother's or their girlfriends face and see how far that goes. It's easy to be "tough "behind a computer screen.

[Hermes]

Indeed.

 

"She's talking about bullies who feel it's their right to couch hostility in a sexual manner and ruin her and her friends' day simply because lordy forbid they said "No thank you" or "Stop that" or "No" to being groped, told really vile sexual things by a stranger."

There is NO reason why anyone should be insulted like that in a venue or on the street or wherever.

[Helpexpressme]

WOW. It must be hard to be 2% of the planet that can't walk around without being hit on. I guess some chicks are ridiculously too good-looking.

[Seraphim]

WOW. It must be hard to be 2% of the planet that can't walk around without being hit on. I guess some chicks are ridiculously too good-looking.

 

That's not what it's even about . Sorry you don't understand that. I feel sorry for you.

[Hermes]

Oh boy!

[boltnrun]

It's not a constant thing. But I bet if any man had been mugged he would view the world in a different light. Same with anyone who's been cheated on. It affects you. It affects some more than others. I felt fear when those adult men approached me in front of church and I can still remember that fear. However, when Jerko at the bar with his drink pulled that stunt I found it more pathetic and annoying than frightening. Dude at the party who pinned me down, yeah that was fear. So there are different levels.

 

And no, I'm not Gisele and I don't act like I think I am. In fact, I'm almost excruciatingly average. But it still happened.

[Helpexpressme]

Well I have the same problem as Greta, constantly rejecting woman who throw themselves at me. They too call me an a-hole but you just gotta get over it.

[Hermes]

I fully agree, Bolt. And of course it isn't ALL men, not by any means. I just love men...yes!!

 

There are always going to be nasty men, some, and nasty people anyhow. But that does not mean they should be allowed to verbally abuse others, insult or lay a hand on someone "just because" they can get away with it.

 

I think that more or less sums up what the thread is about.

[boltnrun]

I always want to ask those Neanderthal-behavior men "Does that routine actually WORK for you? How many women have you succeeded in convincing to have sex with you using that method?"

 

Same with the wolf-whistlers and the "Hey Baby!" guys. Do some women actually LIKE that and agree to lay down with them based on a wolf-whistle or crude suggestion?

[Seraphim]

I can only think that starts at home. So that's why I endeavoured to raise my son with respect for all people. And that when somebody tells you no, take it with grace. It is not about you it is about their choice. Just move on.

[ParisPaulette]

Okay, seriously let's end it folks. OP was asking for help in dealing with an issue and I guess it's just not going to happen. Time for the mods to shut this thread down, it's devolving. Sighs.

 

Like Victoria I raised my boys to be respectful to all women, even the ones not treating them so nice. Teaching manners and grace to your children goes a long way in minimizing this problem. And for the record, I used to thank guys who paid me genuine compliments and the ones respectful enough to observe that there's a time and place to approach someone and a time and a place not to. It's the haters I had a problem with and the hostility. That isn't called for at all.

 

And again, that's what this original post was about. How to deal with uncalled for hostility in the face of simply being out for an evening at a bar or club or restaurant, because hello those are what's open after work for people to get together at. Plus more expensive places in "good neighborhoods" and towns were sometimes where I got the most hate. Conversely the little bars in New Mexico in the middle of nowhere or the little mom and pop hamburger stand again in the middle of a NYC are where I got treated the best. It's not a venue problem, it's not a what you weare or how you act or even an all men are bad/all women are beyotches/ us versus them problem. It's a manners problem. It's bullying in another form and I'm sure no one on here would tell a poster, "Suck it up, we all have to deal with that" or even "You're too sensitive, you shouldn't be working there if it bothers you that much" if they posted that their boss was calling them names, belittling and badgering them daily, putting his or her hands on them and flipping out to call them names.

 

At least if a boss slapped or groped you, you could (hopefully) file assault chargers, unless of course you needed that job to feed your family. That's another side of the same coin. Again, bullying.

[thejigsup]

Well probably because how you dress matters to us. It doesn't matter what your intentions are when you dress but it is a communication tool for us. I dont know what else to tell you. Men take cues from women on how available they are. How you dress is a huge important bit of information to us. Sorry that reality doesn't fit in your perfect little world. But there is another world out there you women refuse to see. Its the side of men, and you haven't fully neutered us yet.

 

You sir, are a first rate a**hole. I will dress as I like and any man who makes an unwanted pass after being told nicely, "no thanks" will be very sorry he persevered. Men who take "no thanks" politely are gems.

[Fudgie]

jigs!!!! What's up!!!! Long time, no see!!

[TMifune]

Cutting the tension with an interesting tangent: Did you know that "bully" used to be a positive term?

 

bully (n.)

1530s, originally "sweetheart," applied to either sex, from Dutch boel "lover; brother," probably a diminutive of Middle Dutch broeder "brother" (compare Middle High German buole "brother," source of German Buhle "lover;" see brother (n.)).

 

Meaning deteriorated 17c. through "fine fellow" and "blusterer" to "harasser of the weak" (1680s, from bully-ruffian, 1650s). Perhaps this was by influence of bull (n.1), but a connecting sense between "lover" and "ruffian" may be in "protector of a prostitute," which was one sense of bully (though not specifically attested until 1706). The expression meaning "worthy, jolly, admirable" (especially in 1864 U.S. slang bully for you!) is first attested 1680s, and preserves an earlier, positive sense of the word.

 

I just found that interesting. It doesn't connect in any deeper way than someone said "bully" and I got to wondering why "bully for you" was a positive saying.