Cherylyn

I would end it.

I agree. Defer to him. I defer to my husband and let him handle HIS mother or say something to her because she'll listen to him more than me. Funny how that works. MIL listens to her son but I'm just hot air. Suits me just fine. Less work for me. 👍 I no longer waste my time and energy on her. I'm rather dismissive. You do the same. Don't do anything and don't say anything. Don't text either! Learn to disengage. Stay out of it and enforce strict boundaries. It's dicey with in-laws but you can survive if you play your cards right and navigate the dynamic shrewdly. You have to be calculating in order to protect yourself and your relationship (someday marriage) otherwise being too close can sorely backfire. Take it from me, use your brain and think ahead. You will be fine as long as you're smart. Also these MILs (if they're smart, that is) will discover that if they're nice to their DIL, they'll have more access to their son and be able to see him more often than not. Be unkind, inconsiderate and disrespectful to DIL? Well, good luck with that. 😖 Mothers won't be able to be with their sons very much and phone calls will greatly decrease to nil. Smart MILs will do the math. Dumb MILs will wonder why she alienated her son and DIL? Note to all mothers: Be very kind and respectful towards your DIL or it won't end well. 🙄 😒 Bye bye son.🖐️

I doubt your feelings will ever change over something over this. You'll always distrust him within the deep recesses of your brain. Your memory will be vivid. Of course, you feel distant and don't want to be around him now that you know his real behavior. He has a Jekkyl 'n Hyde personality. He is two faced. One minute he's a good person and seemingly calm and the next minute there's no telling how he will react when he's infuriated. It's only a matter of time before his next explosive tirade. I agree, throwing a temper tantrum over a pair of shoes is indeed alarming. He's scary if he's nice sometimes and other times displays his rage. 🤬 He does not sound like a keeper. ☹️

It's the package for me. Not only physical attraction but what type of human being is he? Is he careful with his words? Is he kind not just to me but to others? Is he trustworthy? Humble? Sincere? Has a good heart? Considerate? Peaceful? Uncomplicated? Doesn't have bad habits such as gaslighting? Is he neat and clean or a slob? Is he conscientious overall? Is he financially strong? It's everything for me because it's my personal preference. I agree with @Batya33 regarding no tattoos nor body piercings, no disheveled hair, neat haircut, appropriate clothing, etc. I have nothing against other people who do as they will but for me when choosing my husband, it's simply what I preferred. I like a clean cut guy, general overall neat appearance, always clean and tidy. I think of long term life and how a man is to live with. I want a secure, content life together. I realize not everyone is the same and it is fine. It's just the way I am. 🤗

According to your FMIL, the umbilical cord is still attached. She is meddlesome. She wants her son to be a "Mama's Boy." Her implying that you are controlling is a form of gaslighting. She's manipulating the narrative. Establish boundaries. Your fiance and you should have decreased interactions with your FMIL. The less, the better. Decrease in person socializing. Decrease texts or emails. Decrease phone calls or voicemails. Decrease all of it. Decrease all of greatly. Sure, remain respectful and diplomatic at the bare minimum. You can be polite and well mannered yet maintain a cool distance. It's what I do and it's the only thing that works to protect yourself. Boundaries, boundaries, boundaries. There is no other way. I've tried them all and nothing works as well as boundaries.

I think it's a red flag. I don't like anyone who explodes in anger no matter who it is. 🤬 It's not a matter of self control either. He (or in other cases she) shouldn't have anything to control in the first place. A fiery temper of shouting, yelling, hitting a wall or person, throwing things and displaying a hot temper is indeed alarming. Sure, he can apologize but there's no telling when it will happen again and it will at some point. This is not the end of it. He showed you his true unsavory character during an unguarded moment and now you know the real him which is your sobering reality check. Beware and date him at your own risk. 🥺

My condolences for your loss in your family. I wouldn't feel offended due to Mike's delayed condolence text because he's not considered your friend. He's most likely relegated to less than acquaintance status for you. The less close you are to someone, the less you should expect of them regarding social graces or etiquette. They're not important to you and you're not important to them either. It works both ways. In the future, BEFORE you get together with your friend, confirm that the tag along guy, Mike will not be present as part of socializing that day or evening. Yes, my feelings would be hurt and I'd feel very disrespected to have to share a friend with more people in the mix which is awkward and uncomfortable. I wholeheartedly agree with you. Have boundaries and speak up.

I can't speak for all women but my vote is for smart guy who also happens to be generous, kind, empathetic and a keeper. Most women shop around. With handsome guy, good looks eventually fade and if he's boring, self centered and selfish, run for the hills. I know an in-law who is like that and he's a nightmare to live with. ☹️

Yes, thank you, @Wonderstruck 💗. Unfortunately, I've heard it all. I can sniff a gaslighter from a mile away. 🥺

I'll go against the grain here because I've been in your shoes and unfortunately, I still am. 😒 ☹️ Congratulations on your engagement! 💍 🤗 I hate to tell you this but be prepared for a wild ride as the new DIL and eventually you'll become a seasoned veteran as a DIL just like me. 😉 Long ago, I too deferred to my husband (then fiance) regarding MIL's uncalled for obnoxiously rude comment during a social setting and other times during smaller social settings or 1:1 with me. 😖 Save your breath, energy and time. You can't change MIL (or anyone). You can't fix her. She is who she is because she gets away with it and it works for her. This is what spoiled, entitled people do. They say whatever they want because they can. There are never any punishments nor harsh consequences so they continue doing what they know best which is be their rude selves. Should MIL be confronted to explain herself, you'll hear nothing but gaslighting. (Deflecting, changing the subject so you're perceived as crazy, there's something wrong with YOU, not they, twisting your words, distorting the issue and the same old trickery ad nauseum.) You'll hear lines such as these: I was joking! You're dramatic! You're too sensitive. I wasn't serious. What is wrong with YOU? You took it the wrong way. And, I saved the best for last: My MIL said to me two days ago: "Everyone has foibles including YOU." Sure, I can defer to my husband and he'll explain it's not foibles regarding a past offense by someone else and that it's been ongoing for decades. You can defer to your fiance but it won't change MIL. She'll keep on doing it because she can and she will. You will hear more as this is not the end of it. The only thing you can do is no longer be naive. Live and learn. Know whom you're marrying into. Some people such as your MIL are complex people (narcissists / malignant narcissists) and since she won't change, you're the one who has to change, learn to adapt and most of all, establish your own boundaries. You can't interact with people who lack emotional intelligence because they're dumb as a box of rocks. Boundaries are altering your behavior, altering your dynamics, making yourself less available to MIL as her verbal punching bag, not accepting every opportunity to be together with her and pumping the brakes on being together as much as possible. It's what I do and it's the ONLY thing that works as I've exhausted all avenues. In the future, no more benefits of the doubt. No more phone chats and any interaction should be brief, polite, superficial (talk about the weather), be boring as ______ and keep it short! Take it from me. It's a losing long game. All you can do is control what you can. Never grant permission for MIL to abuse you. Don't make yourself vulnerable for attack. Learn how to protect yourself, keep safe and avoid harm. Perpetrators only abuse you if you allow it. Boundaries reign supreme. With practice, you'll learn how to hone this new boundary skill of yours. This is not the end of your MIL's comments. There are more to come. This is only the tip of the iceberg. 😧😖 You have to put up and shut up or don't be in your MIL's presence as much as possible. The less you engage, the better off you'll be.

Two's company, three's a crowd. This picture is getting awfully crowded. 😒 ☹️ Either she goes or you go. I wouldn't tolerate having a boyfriend or husband who was very chummy with his ex. No way. He won't change. It's your job to change. Either accept your boyfriend's behavior or exit the relationship and be with a man who knows how to behave honorably for himself, for you and knows how to treat you as if you matter. In other words, be with a man who knows how to treat you with respect.

You didn't ruin anything. His aunt's mouth problem caused the estrangement. Had she not said what she said, then family gatherings would've been peaceful. I can relate. Anytime a person is incensed AND there's no remorse nor sincere apology ever forthcoming, naturally a person does not wish to be with the perpetrator. It's a perfectly natural response. Not that I ever exploded in anger but once anyone dispenses obnoxious disrespect to me, my husband and / or sons, I'm done. I don't want to be with him or her permanently. I prefer to feel protected and safe from harm. I no longer make myself vulnerable to attack. I'm risk adverse. This is human nature. The problem is a lot of people test others sorely and call your bluff only for your reactions to backfire whether verbally or in a passive aggressive manner. Either way sends a strong message which requires no translation: Stay far away and / or part ways permanently. It's called establishing boundaries.

If he lives with his parents and either pays reduced rent or lives at their house for free, then he's beholden to them, owes them a lot of favors such as helping them, assistance, family commitments and the like. Nothing is for free. There's always a catch. He's obligated to do their bidding. Until he has complete financial independence, he will have to prioritize his family over you. This is the arrangement. No, you're not selfish. His parents have the advantage because money talks.

Remember this: Friends and money don't mix. Family and money don't mix. What does this mean? It means keep your relations without the subject of money whether loaning, lending, expecting to see your money again, borrowing and the like. Money creates a lot of problems, heated arguments, resentment and bitterness. My relatives, in-laws and friends and I don't have money issues between us. Sure, we give each other gift cards, treat some people to meals on rare occasions and whatnot but we do not ask for money, lend money, pestering for repayment never happens and we have harmony because money is not part of our relationships. Change your dynamics and / or choose your friends wisely because if you do, it will be more peaceful and enduring.

Don't believe what you see on social media. Of course, they'll shine and blast their best to you. I know some friends, relatives and in-laws on FB who have numerous boastful posts yet I know the real dirt. I know about their miserable marriages, toxic, dysfunctional family dynamics, their insecurities and a world of hurt behind closed doors. This is what is deliberately concealed from you. Sure, everyone looks blissfully happy but you don't know their painful, real story. Often times it is shameful, humiliating, embarrassing and hidden from you. You're still young. Work on yourself and get serious with your endeavors whether it's your education, career, doing what you enjoy, taking good care of your health, home life, surrounding yourself with moral people or whatever makes you content. Build your own security. Ever since I've exited FB, I've never been happier. This is how I stopped comparing myself to others. I'm too busy with my own life to care about what other people are doing during every waking hour.

No, you cannot work through it. At least he was honest to tell you how he is and it's a way of forewarning you of possible risks to your relationship with him. Perhaps this revelation is your signal to exit the relationship so you can be in a normal, safe, content, harmonious relationship compatible to your values. My wise mother taught me this: "You can never change a man." She learned this harsh lesson the painful way.

Ask yourself what you would be willing to hear without being classless. Fighting fire with fire makes you look worse than the bully. Take the high road.

Both of you are mismatched. You don't need to flaunt whereas your boyfriend is very mentally unstable. I agree with you. It's better to tone it down, remain modest and conservative at the workplace because showing off anything is distracting, invites criticism, judgment and / or gossip. As for social media, my sister posts pics of her affluent lifestyle including her enormous house in a coveted, exclusive neighborhood, her expensive travels, fine dining and obviously everything money can buy. She wears a gaudy, rock (diamond) which is tacky and an eyesore. Some people have no qualms nor shame being the narcissists that they are. It works for them so they continue acting the way they do. My sister grew up poor as did I yet we're different. I've since exited FB altogether and don't feel the need to blast my minutiae to the world. It's so unnecessary. Why? Because I'm secure. You need to have a talk with your boyfriend and explain to him that while you appreciate his gifts, you don't feel the need to show everyone what you have. I like nice things, too but I practice discretion regarding who my audience is. There are a lot of successful, prosperous people whether they grew up poor or fortunate. I know several affluent people in my midst yet they're quiet and under the radar. Sure, they live extremely well (expensive house / cars / vacations / tasteful jewelry / clothes, no crazy debts, etc), successful more than you can ever imagine, however, they're modest and humble in attitude and behavior which impresses me immensely. They're self confident and secure without the flash. Their focus is kindness towards people, modesty, humility, being considerate of other people's feelings, helping the disadvantaged and do what truly matters in this life. If you and your boyfriend cannot and will not find common ground, then perhaps he's not for you long term. I agree with others. Your values are vastly different which no amount of love can cure.

The problem is fighting dirty. Turn it around. If you were the bully, what would silence you without being vulgar?

Anytime, @WintersDay. Immerse yourself in all you do. Gradually and eventually, he'll become merely a blur and fade away from your brain space. Should your paths cross with him, deliberately ignore him and do NOT look at him. Dial up the frost and ice. Remain strong and be very tough. This is how you build your self esteem and self confidence which transforms into courage and bravery. You can do this. Concentrate and stay focused on what matters which is work, study, surrounding yourself with very moral people and yes, I agree, delete / block him everywhere. He will become out of sight, out of mind for you. Make drastic changes and he will be wiped off the map.

Then wait until the engagement ring is within the planned budget. Or, have her contribute towards the ring. Also, look into simulated diamonds. They're grown in a lab and much less expensive than mined diamonds. You can purchase a high quality ring at a fraction of the cost. Check it out. Or, you can start out small and eventually exchange it for a larger stone which is what I did. My original diamond was 1/2 ct and years later, I exchanged it for 1 ct. I only wear my mint condition engagement and wedding rings for special occasions and for local errands, I wear my CZ ring which does the job for out in public.

I have several thoughts on this. It is often said that you are the company you keep. Or, if you want to judge a man, look to his friends. This means your character is in question dependent on whom you choose to socialize with as alike minds associate with alike minds. Birds of a feather flock together. Not saying your boyfriend is reminiscent of his friends but it makes you question why he would choose to associate with friends who are not completely kind and considerate of others. 🫢 You can't control your boyfriend. He's free to choose whom he socializes with but again, it makes me question his choices in people. Since you're uncomfortable being in the company of his friends, don't be with them. Let your boyfriend hang out with them while you do something else whether it's remaining at home or whatever. Some people are very rude. They'll say uncalled for comments such as commenting on your accent, comment about how you you attained your job without a degree and on and on. It's just the way it is. You don't have to be with them though now that you know what they're capable of saying. I'd steer clear if I were you and in my mind, I'd question what type of boyfriend you have to choose to have the type of friends he has. 🙄 They say your friends are your future so beware. I only choose very moral friends which I think says a lot about my character. I'm very picky and choosy and it has since paid off. My friendships are smooth, harmonious and extremely respectful which is the way it should be. Any other way is intolerable and unacceptable.

Don't be fixated on flowers. (Btw, I'm the opposite of you. My husband brought me flowers almost weekly long ago and I finally requested no more flowers because flowers die. If he really wants to do something for me, some random, infrequent, permanent gifts would be nice. I have a penchant for handbags or clothing, for example.) Appreciate who he is. If he's loyal, steadfast, true, humble, very moral and a decent human being, you've struck gold. He's a keeper if he ticks all the boxes. Don't fret about the frou-frou stuff because it doesn't matter. Save that for Hallmark commercials. 🙄 As for hanging out with his friends, why pester him about it? Sure, you can get together at random once in a while but it's not that important. If you have to ping him every now and then to give him a heads up regarding your wanting to feel included in an enjoyable group social life, then do it but don't make it mandatory every time he wants to be with his friends. Develop a happy medium somewhere. Don't be a pain otherwise he'll eventually end the relationship with you. Don't push him away by being overly fussy.

Even though my story is not the same as yours, estrangement is estrangement no matter what. Feelings are same. It's difficult to move on as they say. What helped me to prevent myself from being fixated on the person who rejected me and / or if we are currently in no contact mode, is to get on with my own life. Apparently that person doesn't think I'm worthy so I should return the favor by doing likewise. I've since become very industrious, productive and work hard whatever endeavors whether it be at work, my fitness, getting healthy, surrounding myself with very moral immediate family and friends. I do what I enjoy whether it's hobbies, cooking, outings, reading my library books (not e-books), real paper newspaper subscriptions, catching up on watching some movies or documentaries and the choices are truly limitless. Work on you. Ruminating is easy to do. I no longer give that person my brain space which he or she does not deserve. You'll never forget the person who wronged you. However, you can do the best you can by living your best life. Start anew with a clean, fresh slate. Do a reset and re-program your brain and your life. Make daily or weekly plans and stick to it. Put yourself on a schedule. You will be pleasantly surprised to discover how much you will enjoy life without people you don't treat you with respect. This is how it is in life. You learn to readjust and adapt during various stages of your life. Create your own healthy boundaries. Get busy. Preoccupy yourself and you'll realize insignificant people in your life will become merely a blur and eventually nonexistent. When you pass each other, ignore him. Don't look at him. Go your own way. Stay strong and most of all, be tough.

I like @NighttimeNightmare's idea about sending a care package. Ship everything you know he likes such as various miscellaneous items, perhaps his favorite snacks and the like. Enclose a note and let him know he can call you anytime and that you will lend an ear. Or, perhaps kind and compassionate email exchanges. Be careful though. Don't over do it with electronic correspondence. Give him a lot of time and space. He suffered a tremendous loss. Not everyone wants constant attention. The bereft needs to process their mourning and void. Back off by using common sense and wait for him to come around. There's only so much you can do and after that, you need to leave him alone until he's ready to share more of himself with you.