notalady Posted November 30, 2015 Author Share Posted November 30, 2015 The wedding and the weekend in general was great, we had lots of fun. I met and got along with his friends. He told me all of his friends that had met me like me, while adding "how could they not!" and gave me a big affectionate hug. However as fate would have it, our first trip away wasn't all smooth sailing! Our flight back home got affected by a severe storm in home city. The airport was shut down and our plane waited in a holding pattern just outside of the city (away from the storm) for about an hour before the pilot told us we had to turn back to the city we came from as the storm wasn't getting better. The airline handled it really well, they booked everyone onto the next available flight (first flight the following morning) reasonably quickly and arranged free hotel accommodation for those who needed it, including us. Even so, it was still somewhat chaotic and stressful, especially considering I had a work meeting to attend the following morning. It was interesting, going through a stressful situation with J for the first time. He was just so relaxed and patient about it all, and not once complained about the situation. I was a bit stressed due to the work situation (although if push come to shove, I could move the meeting), and more generally, I'm just not a very patient person. So that contrast really showed in this situation. In a way, we really complemented each other. I don't think it would've helped if I had someone else stressing out as that would stress me out more, J brought me down a notch just by staying relaxed and joking with me etc. But on the other hand, if J was on his own, he would've waited forever for a hotel allocation from the airline, as I was the one hurried us to get off the plane and get in line (we were one of the first ones in line), and going back to speak to the airline staff when they made us wait unnecessarily for the hotel allocation (she fixed it right away, who knows how much longer we would've had to wait if I didn't). But without J's keen observation, I wouldn't have noticed the staff was making us wait when we should've already got the hotel allocation. J is patient and observant, while I'm organised (planning wise) and efficient, we worked well together. I have to say J handled my impatience really well, with patience, humour and acceptance. We had fun and made each other laugh along the way, in spite of the less-than-ideal situation and how tired we were. The whole thing sucked a lot less because we were together. As J drove me to work after we finally arrived, I exclaimed "we had an adventure!" I hope we have many more in the future (preferably not involving storms or flight delays of course Link to comment
notalady Posted December 1, 2015 Author Share Posted December 1, 2015 I forgot my shirt at J's and he joked about holding it ransom yesterday. Just now I got a message from him, it's a photo of my shirt, a pair of scissors and a note made out of magazine cut-out fonts that says: "This shirt has been taken hostage. For its safe return, J demands you join him for dinner on Wednesday or Thursday, or else!" I literally laughed out loud on public transport hahaha! This man is awesome! Link to comment
WithLove Posted December 1, 2015 Share Posted December 1, 2015 That's adorable!! What a clever way of making you smile!! I'd say he gets a date for going the extra mile for that one Link to comment
reinventmyself Posted December 1, 2015 Share Posted December 1, 2015 So sweet! It's good milestone to see each other under stress. It does sound like you two really do compliment each other. Good for you NL Sent from my SM-G900V using Tapatalk Link to comment
notalady Posted December 1, 2015 Author Share Posted December 1, 2015 When I was on holidays overseas, I got to see my best friend who lives there. She just got married in October last year and I was one of the bridesmaids. They've been together for 10 years now and I've always considered them as one of those perfect couples I know that I can see staying together for the rest of their lives. On my trip, we got to chatting and she told me two months ago she left their home for a week or so. I asked her why. She said she accidentally saw his texts with a girl when the phone lit up. She had a bad feeling about it and requested him to show her his phone, which is their agreement in the relationship, that they wouldn't snoop on each other but will show each other their phones/emails/whatever upon request, with the other present. He refused and she insisted. So he did show it to her in the end. Turns out he's been texting with a girl he met at the bar when he was out with his guy friends one night, it had only been going on for a week and nothing actually happened. In his texts he insisted on meeting the girl to give her some medicine as she's sick and did meet her. She didn't let him up to her place to "take care of her" and he seemed disappointed from what she can gather in the texts. He claimed he was just showing concern for her because he felt bad for her (she's in the country all alone and was sick) and thought he hadn't crossed the line. She asked where he thought the line is and told him that there need not be sex for it to be considered cheating or "crossing the line". After much discussion, and his repeated apologies, he still didn't understand what he did wrong. Her in-laws were somewhat involved too as they all live together. Her father-in-law and brother-in-law were surprisingly supportive of her but her mother-in-law, whom she is very close to, was surprisingly telling her to just let it go and that she should just accept his apology (as she did when the father-in-law actually cheated on her years ago lol, she holds a completely different generational mindset/values as a woman). She was very disappointed that the one person she thought would support her didn't. She needed to show them (her husband and MIL) that this is not acceptable behaviour. So she left and went back home (to her own parents) even though internally she was reluctant to do so as she didn't want her own parents to be involved. Eventually she came back after his repeated apologies (and crying lol) and as he seemed to understand what he did wrong. She told him loud and clear, if it happens again in this marriage, even if they have kids (which they don't yet), she will take the kids and go and will never return. It seemed like the whole thing shook him and he did seem to understand the consequences such that he will likely not do it again. She did tell me that her trust in him built over 10 years was shaken just like that. And she's still working on rebuilding that trust. I told her it will just take time and be patient. And that I think he's not a bad guy, but probably just didn't really understand boundaries quite as well as we did and that I thought she did the right thing. So I wrote this post in my old journal. The event itself would've happened around June. So a mere 6 months since that event, last night, my friend (S) messaged me and another friend in our chat group, asking for our opinion on something that just happened the day before. Her friend/colleague is single and on Tinder, and she came across S's husband's (L) Tinder profile. So S confronted him and he claimed he only wanted to make new friends. But the search criteria is very specific, it's female with age limits. My reaction was W T F, sorry girl but that is a pathetic excuse. He said he'll delete the app if it makes her unhappy but she told him it's not about appeasing her but doesn't he see that it's wrong for a married man to be on a dating app? Apparently he can't see it. She told me she got one of her colleague and the colleague's gf to set up a "trap", the gf set up a profile on Tinder (I assume L doesn't know her), and they got chatting, he even took things off Tinder to add her on a normal chatting app. S sent us the screenshots of the chats. The conversation was innocent enough. The friend's gf asked L if he was interested in something short term because that's what she's looking for. He said "my wife will kill me if I do something funny haha...but hey I have no issue knowing a new friend". I told S I don't believe for a second that he's just wanting to make new friends including the last time he met that other girl. Especially with the criteria being so specific (female, with age limit). You can make new friends in many ways, everyone knows Tinder is for dating/hook up. I also said I don't think he's just looking for sex or casual since he didn't take the offer in this instance, but I feel that he may be looking for more of an emotional connection with someone (a pretty female obviously) in the guise of friendship. And if it develops into more, he can claim, ohh oops it just happened, I had no control over it. And looks like he's not going to stop looking until he succeed, since he's done it twice now. I also told her that something rubs me wrong with him saying to her "my wife will kill me if I do something funny". It's inherently and morally wrong to cheat, that should be the reason, not because his wife will kill him. So if under the condition that she will never ever find out, it's ok with him then? Same with his attitude about deleting the app, he doesn't see something is inherently wrong about it. I asked her how she felt about this, and she said she thinks the essential problem is the fact that he doesn't see that what he's doing is wrong. But I don't think she thinks (or want to think) he has the intention to cheat. I told her to ask him why he is so keen to make new female friends, why not male ones? And that if he is genuinely wanting to make new friends, they can attend events and activities together (eg meetup) to make new friends together, as that's what married couples tend to do, they make new friends together (especially when it involves friendship with the opposite sex). I also told her that, to be honest I still don't believe he's just looking for new friends, I've given him the benefit of the doubt with the last girl she told me, but now my gut is telling me he's just pretending to be innocent/ignorant since he got caught out (twice). But she can try what I suggested before if she like. I'm reluctant to suggest she walk away, since this is my friend and not a stranger on the Internet. If he had actually cheated (emotionally or physically), I would've suggested she get divorced, no question about it. But I can see how this is a tricky situation for her, especially since they are married, it's not so easy to just walk away based on this. Being an outsider, 100% I think he has the intention to cheat, whether it's emotionally or physically or both, and 100% I believe she should walk away now before things get even more complicated (eg if they have a child together). But honestly if I was in her shoes, I have no idea what I would do. Link to comment
WithLove Posted December 1, 2015 Share Posted December 1, 2015 That's tough. I'm sorry, NAL. It's harder when it's a friend. I guess he's not getting something out the relationship with his wife. 10-year itch? He feels the need to stretch the boundaries, see what he can get away with. Do they go to counseling at all? I mean, that's the only thing I can suggest at this point. I don't think he is aware of how much he stands to lose if he continues his behavior. J and I talked about opposite sex friends last time we were together, actually. He was telling me about how his ex was very jealous and possessive. She didn't trust him at all. He lost female friends he'd had for years because of her. She'd go onto his social media without him even knowing and unfriend/block women and he wouldn't even know until he noticed one day that he didn't see their feed anymore. She didn't like his best friend's wife, so if the two ever got into an argument, J and his best friend weren't allowed to see each other. It made no sense at all. It's probably something that will always make him wary, and I understand that. I'm not a jealous or possessive person normally. I'm very insecure, but only about myself. It doesn't extend into my feelings towards other people. I told him the only time I would be bothered by a friendship with another woman was if he and I were having problems and we weren't doing anything to work on them; because that's how the beginning of the end started with C and I. And how he eventually ended up cheating on me (so I believe). Link to comment
thejigsup Posted December 1, 2015 Share Posted December 1, 2015 Having problems never made anyone cheat. Being insecure themselves and needing their egos stroked by many is the main cause. Nothing you did or didn't do caused him to cheat. Link to comment
WithLove Posted December 1, 2015 Share Posted December 1, 2015 ^ Exactly. I begged for communication with C and got nothing. We both emotionally checked out and then I found out he had been saying inappropriate things to a female coworker (and probably doing inappropriate things too, since he was at her house a lot). Anyway, sorry to hijack your thread, NAL. Link to comment
itsallgrand Posted December 1, 2015 Share Posted December 1, 2015 She told him loud and clear, if it happens again in this marriage, even if they have kids (which they don't yet), she will take the kids and go and will never return. All she has to do is hold true to her own word. If she doesn't, she may as well write "walk on me, I'm garbage" on her face. I had a whole rant about this, but decided, hey NAL probably doesn't want to hear it (especially about a friend). But as much as it sucks, I think the writing is on the wall clear as day here, and your friend is facing a major life decision. One that will shape the kind of person she will be for years to come, and tell a lot about what her values really are. Link to comment
notalady Posted December 1, 2015 Author Share Posted December 1, 2015 I guess he's not getting something out the relationship with his wife. 10-year itch? He feels the need to stretch the boundaries, see what he can get away with. Do they go to counseling at all? I mean, that's the only thing I can suggest at this point. I don't think he is aware of how much he stands to lose if he continues his behavior. That could very well be true, but he doesn't seem to be openly communicating what he's not getting out of their relationship and what exactly he wants. Without that communication, they can't work on it. I don't know how common is couples counselling in their country (they live in an Asian country). I'll see what she says first. He was obviously very broken up by the thought of potentially losing her the last time (crying and begging), but so soon he's forgotten it all already. I think they just have intrinsically different moral values. I would hate to see her getting into a pattern where he does something shady like this, she leaves for a few days then he begs her to forgive him and she does, then rinse and repeat. Link to comment
notalady Posted December 1, 2015 Author Share Posted December 1, 2015 All she has to do is hold true to her own word. If she doesn't, she may as well write "walk on me, I'm garbage" on her face. I had a whole rant about this, but decided, hey NAL probably doesn't want to hear it (especially about a friend). But as much as it sucks, I think the writing is on the wall clear as day here, and your friend is facing a major life decision. One that will shape the kind of person she will be for years to come, and tell a lot about what her values really are. That's spot on IAG, and that's what I'm afraid she's getting herself into. It is a major life decision for her. Link to comment
itsallgrand Posted December 1, 2015 Share Posted December 1, 2015 By the way, I think you handled the talk with her so well. That's the kind of support it is so nice to have from a friend when facing such a rough decision. Allowing her to reach her own conclusions. Good job, NAL. And the stories about your bf are great. I'm so glad things are going so well for you. Link to comment
notalady Posted December 2, 2015 Author Share Posted December 2, 2015 Thanks IAG So apparently it was S, not her friend's gf, who was chatting with L (her husband) on the chatting app, Wechat, as after he had requested taking it off Tinder, she went and created a fake account to chat with him and see what proof she can get out of him. She told me after all that, he told her he deleted Tinder, she asked him if he exported any new "friends" from there to other social platforms. He said he had one girl on LINE (a chat app) and he had blocked her. She repeatedly asked if there was more, obviously knowing that there is another girl (being herself) on Wechat and he repeatedly told her there was no one else. So she blew up and revealed that she knows there is another girl and that was her friend's gf. His excuse for lying was he didn't want her to be even more angry so he didn't tell her. I said how would you be more angry if he said "I had one girl on LINE and one on Wechat, and I've now blocked both" versus "I have one girl on LINE and have blocked her"? He was clearly keeping the other girl secret so he could still chat to her. Anyway I told her I don't think he's a loyal or honest person, that's just who he is. Not saying he's a good guy or bad guy. People have different morals and values and those things don't change. And asked her to take some time to calmly and logically think about how she wants to proceed. So I've left that with her. Link to comment
WithLove Posted December 2, 2015 Share Posted December 2, 2015 It just sounds like he's the type to alter reality to fit what he wants, so that he doesn't look bad, or as bad. I really hate people like that. Like, he was caught, but tried to explain it away or convince her she was wrong so that he wasn't seen in such a bad light. Maybe not one to outright lie, but just tweak things to suit him. Either way, it's not looking good for your friend and I'm truly sorry for that. Link to comment
notalady Posted December 4, 2015 Author Share Posted December 4, 2015 It just sounds like he's the type to alter reality to fit what he wants, so that he doesn't look bad, or as bad. I really hate people like that. Like, he was caught, but tried to explain it away or convince her she was wrong so that he wasn't seen in such a bad light. Maybe not one to outright lie, but just tweak things to suit him. Either way, it's not looking good for your friend and I'm truly sorry for that. A lot of people do that though.. One of my other friends, still single and dating, has met a number of guys like that. They like to rationalise what they're doing as normal / not bad / not as bad as some, but really, it's just bad behaviour all the same. Anyway I haven't hear from my friend about progress. I kinda doubt she'll divorce him because of this. But who knows, she may surprise me. She's usually a really strong minded and rational person, has good boundaries and good self-esteem. I think she can see what he's doing is wrong, she didn't get 'gaslighted' into thinking she was wrong to doubt him or is overthinking. But it will still be very hard to make that decision to walk away. Link to comment
notalady Posted December 9, 2015 Author Share Posted December 9, 2015 J has been sick for a few days, just a cold. Today I offered to visit him and cook some noodle soup for him. It's my family-tradition-sick-person-noodle-soup lol...It's got tomato, egg, noodles, add some salt, a shake of white pepper, splash of sesame oil and some coriander on top. My dad normally makes it for me when I'm sick. Very simple and easy to make, I love it when I'm not feeling well physically (or even emotionally) because it really warms you up and helps you feel better. I guess I just always associate it with warmth, love and care. I wanted J to feel the same way and to include him in my "family tradition". He really appreciated it and he said it was yummy and he liked it. He was also really happy that I came to visit. I told him I'll make him the noodle soup every time he gets sick and he said he'll be deliberately getting sick then, haha... I like seeing him happy. In other news I applied for a new job and went for an interview yesterday, was told I'll be contacted by the end of the week. I was really surprised that they called me this morning! They were happy with the interview and wanted me to do the online testing (personality, numeric skills etc), and if all goes well, I imagine I'll get a second interview and ultimately the job! After being at the same job for 6 years, it's exciting and scary at the same time. But I know the current job isn't what I'm passionate about and the new job will be a move in the right direction. I told J the news, and some other things that was up in the air for the past week but now seem to be somewhat finalised (in a good way), J said "A lot of good things happening for you!" then he hugged me and said "I like seeing you happy!" I like that he likes seeing me happy. He's the only boyfriend I've ever had that is genuine interested in what's going on in my life and genuinely happy for me when I do well. Link to comment
reinventmyself Posted December 15, 2015 Share Posted December 15, 2015 Any update on the job? Link to comment
notalady Posted December 15, 2015 Author Share Posted December 15, 2015 Thanks for asking reinvent I got a second interview scheduled for next Tuesday where I'll meet with the CEO! Very hopeful as people don't normally invite you back for a second interview unless they want to hire you Link to comment
reinventmyself Posted December 16, 2015 Share Posted December 16, 2015 Thanks for asking reinvent I got a second interview scheduled for next Tuesday where I'll meet with the CEO! Very hopeful as people don't normally invite you back for a second interview unless they want to hire you Sounds good. . Rooting for you! Link to comment
WithLove Posted December 16, 2015 Share Posted December 16, 2015 Let us know! I'm waving my pom-poms madly for you, too! Link to comment
notalady Posted December 16, 2015 Author Share Posted December 16, 2015 Thanks reinvent and WL Link to comment
Silverbirch Posted December 20, 2015 Share Posted December 20, 2015 Good Luck with the job interview Lady. I'm glad J has turned out to be so nice! Link to comment
notalady Posted December 21, 2015 Author Share Posted December 21, 2015 Thanks SB! interview is tomorrow morning! Link to comment
notalady Posted December 21, 2015 Author Share Posted December 21, 2015 I don't normally do new year's resolution, but I think I have one this year. I resolve to be on ENA less. I think I have an ENA addiction. I'm constantly checking it (and Tapatalk app makes it easy to do it throughout the day), I guess to kill boredom at work as I've become less engaged about the work I'm currently doing and also during my free time when I'm alone. But it doesn't make me feel good anymore, reading other people's relationship problems and seeing those who can't seem to see reason or do anything to resolve their problems (which is a majority of people asking for advice here) makes me feel frustrated and feeling less and less inclined to give advice. Yet I'm still frequently checking it, even though it actually kind of depresses me to read about other people's issues, so I guess it does resemble the traits of an addiction (I know it's not a real one of course lol). Anyway, in the new year, hopefully with a new job (fingers crossed), I will be plenty busy with work and will also seek other entertainment to occupy my free time instead of coming to ENA. I will still check the journal section of course, and write in my journal if there's something to write about, but I'm going to limit it to significantly less. Link to comment
IAmFCA Posted December 21, 2015 Share Posted December 21, 2015 NAL, I have had to do the same thing for myself in the past. It was a good idea and I applaud your resolution... even if it means less of you here. Link to comment
Recommended Posts
Archived
This topic is now archived and is closed to further replies.