Blue Spiral's Adventures in Solitude

[Silverbirch]

I THINK Blue Spiral wants to know why women who look as good as supermodel types are not available to him for ongoing sexual relationships where there is no emotional involvement or any expectations from him. He assumes a lot of it is to do with money, and that whilst he knows HE is hot, he thinks not hot enough as well. He says there are some women who are semi-hot who are interested, but that they are not hot enough for what he wants.

 

BS, I'm wondering if it was possible that if a HOT woman was available for what you say you want that you would find something really wrong with her which would then preclude you from the type of relationship you say you want.

 

I would doubt though that you will meet someone like that who is willing for what you say. I don't think it is just because of money - if at all that money has anything to do with it.

 

We can't really tell what you are like in the flesh, but you come accross to me as someone who doesn't experience empathy, that you don't feel or want any type of connection with others apart from the most rudimentary physical relationship. I suspect that a lot of women would find your manner, not only cold, but - sorry - creepy, icky - when they realise that your emotional makeup is so different to most peoples.

[Blue Spiral]

I THINK Blue Spiral wants to know why women who look as good as supermodel types are not available to him for ongoing sexual relationships where there is no emotional involvement or any expectations from him. He assumes a lot of it is to do with money, and that whilst he knows HE is hot, he thinks not hot enough as well. He says there are some women who are semi-hot who are interested, but that they are not hot enough for what he wants.

 

Look, I know that I'm not getting a supermodel-hot woman. I'm just not that lucky, and god knows that they have better options than me. But, whenever I go out in public, I constantly see way-above-average women that are with average/dopey-looking guys. OK, they're taller than I am, and they probably have better jobs, too. (And, to allude to one of your later points, I'm sure that their social skills are vastly superior to mine, as well.) I'd just like to get a way-above-average FWB and have it last for more than a few weeks.

 

BS, I'm wondering if it was possible that if a HOT woman was available for what you say you want that you would find something really wrong with her which would then preclude you from the type of relationship you say you want.

 

I'm not a Jerry-Seinfeld-type perfectionist that's looking to rule out women. On the contrary, when it comes to the non-physical, I'm about as low-maintenance as you can get. She could be a pyromaniac...as long as she was attractive enough, I'd find a way to work around it! I'm flexible like that.

 

I would doubt though that you will meet someone like that who is willing for what you say. I don't think it is just because of money - if at all that money has anything to do with it.

 

You can call it "money," "ambition," "being settled," whatever. But you can't convince me that my eyes are lying.

 

We can't really tell what you are like in the flesh, but you come accross to me as someone who doesn't experience empathy, that you don't feel or want any type of connection with others apart from the most rudimentary physical relationship. I suspect that a lot of women would find your manner, not only cold, but - sorry - creepy, icky - when they realise that your emotional makeup is so different to most peoples.

 

No need to apologize. You're right to a degree--I'm pretty good at hiding it, and not that many women have noticed it. They may very well subconsciously sense it, though.

 

This week has been absolutely horrible...and next week may suck, as well. Maybe it's time to do my obstacles post.

[Silverbirch]

Just a little thing I forgot to mention BS. I wonder if you could also share a similar trait to some people. That is that when somebody really does seem to like them/ be attracted/whatever . . . . They are like "Oh, what is wrong with them, must be something because they are with me."

 

Look, it's okay if you don't experience empathy or connection in the way that a lot of people do, but isn't going to be easy to meet someone who is comfortable with that. It might be possible though . . . I'm not sure, but maybe.

[Blue Spiral]

Just a little thing I forgot to mention BS. I wonder if you could also share a similar trait to some people. That is that when somebody really does seem to like them/ be attracted/whatever . . . . They are like "Oh, what is wrong with them, must be something because they are with me."

 

It's less about me and more about my perceived sexual market value (SMV). As I said earlier, if a woman expresses serious interest in me, I get worried, because she must not have many other options. There tend to be reasons for that. This isn't some angsty, emo, "no one can love me" crap, it's just a matter of realizing that most women should be able to do better than me, in the sense that I don't have the qualities that most women want.

 

Look, it's okay if you don't experience empathy or connection in the way that a lot of people do, but isn't going to be easy to meet someone who is comfortable with that. It might be possible though . . . I'm not sure, but maybe.

 

I experience empathy! Sometimes, anyway. But, "meeting someone" is sort of a moot point, since I'm celibate now.

[Silverbirch]

Well, I think MAYBE you do want a TYPE of relationship otherwise why do you want FWB to last more than a couple of weeks, but you are in denial. Why not just keep sleeping with different women?? Why would it matter if they move on. I think that you are overwhelmingly scared of any expectations or possibility of what you would see as commitment. Don't know there is an answer on that one though. Maybe just accepting celibacy - it's really not that bad. Everytine in my life when I haven't had a member of the opposite sex in my life, other things have been better for me - especially work.

[Silverbirch]

PS well if you experience empathy then you are able to connect with others - if and when you choose to. That's more than some people are able.

[zentoCC]

Blue, normally women will go out with guys who aren't as good looking it because they make up for it in some other way, including personality.

The reason you can't get them is because if a hot girl wants a guy to just have sex with she's going to go for a hot guy.

[Blue Spiral]

Well, I think MAYBE you do want a TYPE of relationship otherwise why do you want FWB to last more than a couple of weeks, but you are in denial.

 

Nah, it's just math. Two years with Kate Upton > two weeks with Kate Upton. I'm not much of a math person, but I know "more" when I see it, and "more" is a good thing.

 

Why not just keep sleeping with different women??

 

Oh, I'd keep doing that, too. Ideally, I'd have an entire harem of hot FWBs.

 

Blue, normally women will go out with guys who aren't as good looking it because they make up for it in some other way, including personality.

The reason you can't get them is because if a hot girl wants a guy to just have sex with she's going to go for a hot guy.

 

I know.

 

Now, I could just lead women on. I could lie about not wanting marriage/kids, have sex with relationship-seeking women for a while, and not have to worry about the future, because they'd eventually tire of certain Blue Spiral traits and dump me. But I'd be causing those women to waste some of their prime baby-makin' years (or at least months), and I don't like the dishonesty angle, either. I'm just too angelic for my own good. (What's that? The real reason I don't do that is because I don't want a relationship, even a pretend one, because I find monogamy to be about as exciting as watching grass grow? Nah, let's stick with me having pure, selfless motives.)

[annie24]

I think it's good that you don't lead people on. Even if you spent 2 years with Kate Upton, you'd eventually have to start doing heavy lifting in the relationship (going to boring family events, making her feel better when her goldfish dies, listening to her complain about her boss), and if that's not what you want, it doesn't matter how hot your gf is. Obviously you have no lack of FWB, so good for you.

[Firiel]

I guess a part of me remains confused about your reaction to not having the hottest-of-the-hot as a FWB. Now, it seems like it upsets you to at least some extent. Maybe I'm wrong on that front. Feel free to correct me. But I guess I don't really understand why.

 

Assuming I was single, sure, I'd be thrilled if a ridiculously attractive, extremely emotionally attentive, very quick-witted, super athletic guy were interested in me. Let's say someone like Craig Alexander (my favorite triathlete... and waaaaay out of my league!). He's my version of Kate Upton, ha ha. But the fact that I "can't" get a guy like that takes up about 0.001% of my daily angst allowance (and I have particularly high angst allowance ). It's just... I don't even know how to describe it. It's kind of like thinking about winning the lottery (except for, actually, not having won the lottery bothers me more!). Once in a while, it might cross my brain, and I might think, "wouldn't that be crazy and awesome!" but that's it. It doesn't bother me and it doesn't take away from the experience I do have with my boyfriend.

 

image removed

 

This is Craig Alexander. Plus, he's Australian, so accent. I got to meet him once... I GOT TO MEET MY CELEBRITY CRUSH HOW COOL IS THAT.

 

/fangirl

 

Sorry. Please return to your regular discussion.

[Silverbirch]

 

Now, I could just lead women on. I could lie about not wanting marriage/kids, have sex with relationship-seeking women for a while, and not have to worry about the future, because they'd eventually tire of certain Blue Spiral traits and dump me. But I'd be causing those women to waste some of their prime baby-makin' years (or at least months), and I don't like the dishonesty angle, either. I'm just too angelic for my own good. (What's that? The real reason I don't do that is because I don't want a relationship, even a pretend one, because I find monogamy to be about as exciting as watching grass grow? Nah, let's stick with me having pure, selfless motives.)

 

Yeah, I think it's really good that you don't lead women on. I'm like Firiel, thoughts about men who I would consider as physical ideals barely cross my mind. Then again, I have been with a man I considered as such and I USED to think a lot about him. Didn't work out. Like you, most of the time I can't see myself being in a relationship, not even FWB though I know I could have FWB if I want - but I don't want. Maybe it's because I'm a lot older than you that I am quite accepting of that and focused on other areas of my life, and I am mostly happy.

[Blue Spiral]

I think it's good that you don't lead people on. Even if you spent 2 years with Kate Upton, you'd eventually have to start doing heavy lifting in the relationship (going to boring family events, making her feel better when her goldfish dies, listening to her complain about her boss), and if that's not what you want, it doesn't matter how hot your gf is. Obviously you have no lack of FWB, so good for you.

 

I'd be FWB with Kate Upton, not in a relationship with her. So no boring family events for me! (Except for my own family's. Sigh.)

 

I guess a part of me remains confused about your reaction to not having the hottest-of-the-hot as a FWB. Now, it seems like it upsets you to at least some extent. Maybe I'm wrong on that front. Feel free to correct me. But I guess I don't really understand why.

 

Because I'm whiny and immature and want everything I want right now dammit!

 

Assuming I was single, sure, I'd be thrilled if a ridiculously attractive, extremely emotionally attentive, very quick-witted, super athletic guy were interested in me. Let's say someone like Craig Alexander (my favorite triathlete... and waaaaay out of my league!). He's my version of Kate Upton, ha ha. But the fact that I "can't" get a guy like that takes up about 0.001% of my daily angst allowance (and I have particularly high angst allowance ).

 

I'm not asking for Kate Upton, realistically speaking. I'm asking/hoping for way-above-average women, the sort of women that I commonly see with completely-regular men.

 

Yeah, I think it's really good that you don't lead women on. I'm like Firiel, thoughts about men who I would consider as physical ideals barely cross my mind. Then again, I have been with a man I considered as such and I USED to think a lot about him. Didn't work out. Like you, most of the time I can't see myself being in a relationship, not even FWB though I know I could have FWB if I want - but I don't want. Maybe it's because I'm a lot older than you that I am quite accepting of that and focused on other areas of my life, and I am mostly happy.

 

I'm glad to hear that you're mostly happy.

 

As for you thinking less about physical ideals...I think that happens to most women as time goes on. Unfortunately, many men (myself included) were unable to get high-level women during their actually-into-sex stage (i.e. 20s). But time passes, and they "mature" (or have fewer options), and now a whole bunch of not-quite-as-attractive, apathetic-about-sex women are after me. I missed out on all the fun they had, but I can be here to...raise another guy's kids. Joy. I'd rather be the youthful mistake they regret than the perfectly-nice guy they eventually settle for.

[Batya33]

You're assuming that the men they are with are "average" based on snap judgments and same issue with your assumption that the woman is settling even if in your opinion the man is not as attractive looking as the woman.

 

I think it's the difference between looking at a person as a list or bunch of attributes/qualities v. seeing a person as a whole person and as an individual. Among other reaosns.

[Silverbirch]

Hey BS, I'm not 100 per cent there are fewer options - maybe yes, maybe no. When I went on a dating site aged in my 50s, I got HEAPS of mail. I only went on for a short while before deciding it wasn't for me, but I do have a friendship with a guy who I met via the dating site. He does happen to fit the stereotype you mention - is financially well-healed, above average in looks (all his own hair and teeth!), but most importantly, he seems like a nice guy, and I think I will possibly be friends with him a long time.

[Blue Spiral]

Hey BS, I'm not 100 per cent there are fewer options - maybe yes, maybe no. When I went on a dating site aged in my 50s, I got HEAPS of mail. I only went on for a short while before deciding it wasn't for me, but I do have a friendship with a guy who I met via the dating site. He does happen to fit the stereotype you mention - is financially well-healed, above average in looks (all his own hair and teeth!), but most importantly, he seems like a nice guy, and I think I will possibly be friends with him a long time.

 

I have no doubt that you got a lot of attention--regardless of age, women are the ones in demand, and the ones that are chased. But, with all due respect, I think that a woman in her twenties (and thirties, if she ages well) will always have more options than a woman of any other age. The women that are hitting on me now...when they were at their (physical) peak, they wouldn't give me the time of day. Either I magically became more appealing, or their options are narrowing. I'm betting on the latter. (And let's leave the "Maybe they matured and grew out of liking bad boys!" argument out of this; google "the epiphany phase" if you want to understand that particular phenomenon.)

 

Also, in regards to your last line...I've decided that I'm never going to be friends with a woman again. "being friends" was an ugly, painful compromise, a humiliating fallback position that I only took because I couldn't get what I want. Never again.

 

In more me-related news: I was afraid that this week might suck. There were two main things that I was worried about. But, as of right now, both seem to have been resolved. One of them kept me up, last night, so I'm hoping that means I'll get some sleep. In other positive news, I had a productive day, today. And I got to play one of my favorite video games, one that I hadn't played in years.

 

I'm sort of crushing on two cam models, but, unfortunately, neither are online, tonight. Maybe I should play that game some more...

[itsallgrand]

Because I'm whiny and immature and want everything I want right now dammit!

 

Enough said.

[Firiel]

I have no doubt that you got a lot of attention--regardless of age, women are the ones in demand, and the ones that are chased. But, with all due respect, I think that a woman in her twenties (and thirties, if she ages well) will always have more options than a woman of any other age. The women that are hitting on me now...when they were at their (physical) peak, they wouldn't give me the time of day. Either I magically became more appealing, or their options are narrowing. I'm betting on the latter. (And let's leave the "Maybe they matured and grew out of liking bad boys!" argument out of this; google "the epiphany phase" if you want to understand that particular phenomenon.)

 

Maybe you're aging better than other people do and so are becoming more appealing.

 

Seeing your age, you also might be in that stage after a lot of the guys are married but before the first round of divorces really picks up steam (hence fewer guys around). I used to tease my roommate about that-- I'd tell her that her options would open up a bit once all the couples her age started divorcing.

[Blue Spiral]

Enough said.

 

Oy. This is why I usually hesitate to use self-deprecation or admit weakness/flaws in front of women...they encourage you to open up and be vulnerable, and then they turn around and use it against you.

 

Maybe you're aging better than other people do and so are becoming more appealing.

 

Seeing your age, you also might be in that stage after a lot of the guys are married but before the first round of divorces really picks up steam (hence fewer guys around). I used to tease my roommate about that-- I'd tell her that her options would open up a bit once all the couples her age started divorcing.

 

I think that men gain SMV (sexual market value) as we get older, yeah. A man in his early/mid thirties has much more SMV than a man in his early/mid twenties, while the same isn't true of women. That's because there's a serious financial/social status component involved in male value. When I was a teenager, girls my age were going for college guys, because they were "mature" and "sophisticated." When I was in my early twenties, women were going for guys in their late twenties/early thirties, because they were "settled" and "ambitious." Indeed, my first ex left me for a guy that was...wow, I can't even remember, anymore. But he must be at least forty by now. I'm probably at my peak SMV, right now, and I'm doing ****-all with it. Ugh.

 

In further me-related news: that potential FWB contacted me again and came on strong, talking about how lonely she was, but I remained non-committal. I'm trying to do a slow fade. She has a great, open attitude towards sex--and I wish I could transplant that attitude into certain other women--but I'm afraid that she's subconsciously looking for a relationship, and I'm not 100% physically into her.

[Firiel]

If it makes you feel better, I'm about to turn 27, so things will just get worse off for me from now on!

 

LOL at college guys being "mature" and "sophisticated." I mean, I see how it seems that way to high school kids, but as someone who has taught college courses, it just amuses me to no end.

[Silverbirch]

When I was 16 or so, I recall getting attention from men in their late 20s. I thought they were OLD and creepy - maybe they were true of the latter.

 

There does seem to be a view amongst a lot of people that once a woman us past a certain age, she is pretty much an outcast in relation to some matters. Thankfully, for a lot of us, when we get to that age, we are more evolved as people and have more in our lives to satisfy ourselves.

 

I have known a couple of women whose husbands left them in midlife to go live with bimbos they were carrying on with. Within a time, those relationships made the men feel older - something I think they were running away from. In at least 2 cases, the wives, despite being initially devastated, moved on to have much better lives and came to see their husbands I. A different light so they could completely let go of them.

[annie24]

Within a time, those relationships made the men feel older - something I think they were running away from.

 

why do you say that and how do you know that?

[Silverbirch]

Well, on of the womens husbands stayed in contact with her. He left her to live with a much younger woman who had children who were primary school age. He told his ex-wife that his new partners children were driving him crazy because for years he'd had a power nap in the afternoons, but now her children were too noisey for him.

 

I know for myself that I briefly went out with an older person, and when it came to things like music, his tastes were more like my parents, and mine were closer to the tastes of his children.

[annie24]

yeah, that makes sense!! I can see wanting to take a nap, and the kids running around, I would feel like grandma on the couch.

[itsallgrand]

Well, it's not women, it was only me who pointed it out.

 

And I didn't think I was using it against you in any way. I just thought it cut through the bs nicely and got straight to the point.

You want what you want when you want it. And you get upset if it doesn't land in your lap, too.

And you are not interested in taking a different approach to change that. You would rather remain fixated on the wants you have been harboring for a long time - the stories about when you were younger, the bitterness about super hot women not wanting to have sex with you.

 

And I think it's kinda silly too that you would take umbrage at my saying "enough said". And to then spin that into a reason why you have chosen to remain closed to women, only wanting them for their bodies.

 

It's especially silly considering you basically look at women as body bags, there for sex. What I write or don't write doesn't 'count' for you, and I know that.

 

It's your journal, so I'll leave ya to it.

[Firiel]

When I was in my early twenties, women were going for guys in their late twenties/early thirties, because they were "settled" and "ambitious."

 

Sorry, I missed the edit window to add to my previous post.

 

I've got the best of both worlds right now-- a man who is six years older but not "settled." He is ambitious, I suppose, but he's ambitious in a field we are both realistic enough to know may not be feasible. But he makes me noodles and has a cat. So that pretty much shoots his SMV through the roof.