Blue Spiral's Adventures in Solitude

[Silverbirch]

yeah, that makes sense!! I can see wanting to take a nap, and the kids running around, I would feel like grandma on the couch.

 

Annie, I just remembered that movie "The First Wives Club". I don't remember much detail, but it was hilarious and I think it nailed it in an over-dramatised comedic way. Love to see it again.

[Blue Spiral]

If it makes you feel better, I'm about to turn 27, so things will just get worse off for me from now on!

 

In the sense of your SMV, yes. Things are certainly about to get worse for my SMV from now on.

 

I don't have much else to say about the age issue...other than admitting that I've never had a girlfriend over the age of about 21 or so. When I was nineteen, my first girlfriend was the same age as me; when I was about 23, my not-quite-girlfriend was about 19/20; when I was 27, my second official girlfriend was about 20/21. I'm working my way up! By the time I'm forty, I should be mature enough to handle a 22-year-old.

 

"But wait," you say, "you can't possibly have anything in common with them!" I don't have anything in common with anyone, beyond living in the 21st century and being carbon-based. I like people because they're hot, not because I have stuff in common with them.

[Blue Spiral]

You want what you want when you want it.

 

That's right.

 

And you get upset if it doesn't land in your lap, too.

 

Yeah, I've always been a bit spoiled when it comes to certain expectations. But I'm working on that.

 

And you are not interested in taking a different approach to change that. You would rather remain fixated on the wants you have been harboring for a long time - the stories about when you were younger, the bitterness about super hot women not wanting to have sex with you.

 

Well, my fear is that the "different approach" would be something that actually helped women, as opposed to helping me. Most of the advice I've been given over my life has basically amounted to "spend money on women and do what women want, but don't expect anything in return". When men ask for advice, we tend to end up getting advice that helps someone else. I'm sorry, but, much of the advice that ENA women give to men...I read it and I think, "Okay, I'm seeing how that's gonna get free meals and ego-boosting for quite a few women, but it isn't going to get him laid, which was what he was actually asking about." I think that if men seriously listened to romantic advice from women, there would be a lot more virgins in the world, because women tend to be a "do as I say and not as I do" gender. Strangely, the men who are most successful with women are usually the ones who are the least like the ideal that women describe. My first girlfriend described her "ideal boyfriend" to me, and I seemed to be a perfect fit, but she left me for (and married) someone who was the complete antithesis of everything she described. Because we all want what we want, as opposed to what's socially acceptable to want.

[Blue Spiral]

OMG. Today. Was. AWESOME.

 

1. I got a whole bunch done!

 

2. I avoided people!

 

3. Some of my favorite TV shows were on tonight, and they were great eps!

 

4. My favorite cam model is on, tonight!

 

5. I found out some darkly hilarious news about my extended family! OK, I'm a little conflicted about rejoicing because of someone else's problems, but still. Thanksgiving and Christmas could be incredible. That may be its own post, tomorrow.

[Batya33]

"Because we all want what we want, as opposed to what's socially acceptable to want."

 

Or, many people realize that what they thought they wanted isn't really what they want after all in a long term partner. Or, just as simple as changing one's mind. Happens all the time.

[Firiel]

Regarding the bolded, that's not fair, and I think you know it. Certain people are "do as I say and not as I do." Both men and women. That's why my ex dissed women who gained weight during relationships while he gained 80 pounds over the course of being together. Or a million other examples that I could give that don't reflect on a whole gender but rather on those particular individuals.

 

Regarding the paying for meals issues, I actually see many women on ENA who don't advocate the man paying for the meal. Not all, of course, a lot. In fact, it seems like in the "who should pay" debate, both sides have a strong male and female presence. For instance, I think that people should generally pay their own way in a relationship. I like the idea of taking turns paying for dates rather than splitting each bill because it fits my ideal of going out on a long string of dates with a single person (I'm a monogamist at heart!). If I were going on a lot of first dates, I would likely go straight for splitting. It's really not fair to say "women give advice that gives women free meals" when SO MANY women on this site agree with splitting the bill and having men and women pursue the relationship, sexual and/or romantic, equally.

[Blue Spiral]

Regarding the bolded, that's not fair, and I think you know it. Certain people are "do as I say and not as I do." Both men and women. That's why my ex dissed women who gained weight during relationships while he gained 80 pounds over the course of being together. Or a million other examples that I could give that don't reflect on a whole gender but rather on those particular individuals.

 

I think that, on average, women are more "do as I say and not as I do" than men. Most men aren't subtle enough to be passive-aggressive like that. However, there's one area where we clearly have the edge--the sexual experience double-standard.

 

Regarding the paying for meals issues, I actually see many women on ENA who don't advocate the man paying for the meal. Not all, of course, a lot. In fact, it seems like in the "who should pay" debate, both sides have a strong male and female presence. For instance, I think that people should generally pay their own way in a relationship. I like the idea of taking turns paying for dates rather than splitting each bill because it fits my ideal of going out on a long string of dates with a single person (I'm a monogamist at heart!). If I were going on a lot of first dates, I would likely go straight for splitting. It's really not fair to say "women give advice that gives women free meals" when SO MANY women on this site agree with splitting the bill and having men and women pursue the relationship, sexual and/or romantic, equally.

 

I don't think that that many women on ENA are pro-splitting. Having said that...I don't actually care. I've never dated, and I'm never going to date, so it's irrelevant to my life. I'm a "the principle of the thing" guy, so I've let it bug me way too much. I absolutely care about sex, but the cultural detritus that's built up around it, over the millennia? Pffh. Oh, I'll make fun of it from time to time--there's nothing quite as enjoyable as watching monogamy slowly collapse--but I've allowed it to take up too much of my brainspace. Time to focus on the things that I actually enjoy.

[Silverbirch]

BS, all through your posts, you point out your many perceived shortcomings of women and how unfair it seems to you.

I haven't seen any of your self-criticisms which you are considering working on - but maybe I'm wrong.

[Blue Spiral]

BS, all through your posts, you point out your many perceived shortcomings of women and how unfair it seems to you.

I haven't seen any of your self-criticisms which you are considering working on - but maybe I'm wrong.

 

I'd say that I've criticized myself quite a bit, or at least been honest about my various flaws and issues. I'm incapable of commitment, I'm not very social, I'm not very emotionally open, I'm immature, I have little in the way of ambition, I don't value family at all, and on and on. I've also spoken out against my own gender, warning women not to trust us. (Strangely, I haven't seen many women doing that, for some reason.)

 

Now, am I working on those issues? lolnope. I'm basically fine with me the way I am, thank you very much. I am working to be less bitter/negative, but that only means changing what I focus on. It doesn't mean changing my beliefs about women.

 

I'm far from perfect...but I'm surprisingly honest, I don't play games, and I've never used the "relationship culture" to get something that a woman in my position couldn't get. I think I'm doing okay.

[Silverbirch]

Ok, yes I think you seem honest. Well, that's very good to start at being less negative and bitter.

[LikeWater]

Blue Spiral... I don't really respond to anything on ENA anymore but back when I did, I remember always enjoying your posts. You have a kind of honesty that's rare and I'm not sure if it carries over the same in real life, but online it's always caught me off guard, but in a good way.

 

I didn't know you had a journal, but through reading it I feel like you are the polar opposite of me. Maybe not in every way but in a lot of ways. I'm actually kind of envious about it. Here you are, a guy who seems to just be absolutely fine with everything that he is and all that surrounds him, whereas I'm fine with none of the above. You're a good writer to boot and seem to have that ability to put words on a page so effortlessly (of course, I have know way of knowing the extent of effort applied,) just as I wish I could.

 

It's possible you're a lot luckier than you realize.

[Silverbirch]

Yes ^^ . I agree with all of that, and I like some od his quirkiness too.

[Blue Spiral]

Blue Spiral... I don't really respond to anything on ENA anymore but back when I did, I remember always enjoying your posts. You have a kind of honesty that's rare and I'm not sure if it carries over the same in real life, but online it's always caught me off guard, but in a good way.

 

Thank you, I really appreciate that. I tend to avoid personal conflict in real life--if I were honest about how I really feel/think, I'd completely disrupt everything around me, and inadvertently make it All About Me. I don't want to do that, so I basically Clark Kent my way through life. As an example, whenever my family goes out of their way to tell me about some guy getting married (as a way to subtly put pressure on me), I don't say, "That's a stupid ****ing mistake on his part, he's giving her the legal and financial equivalent of a loaded gun--and thanks for trying to passive-aggressively manipulate me, by the way." Instead, I say something like, "Mmm, that's interesting" and change the subject. I don't want to be one of those dramatic people that goes around upsetting everyone around them.

 

I didn't know you had a journal, but through reading it I feel like you are the polar opposite of me. Maybe not in every way but in a lot of ways. I'm actually kind of envious about it. Here you are, a guy who seems to just be absolutely fine with everything that he is and all that surrounds him, whereas I'm fine with none of the above. You're a good writer to boot and seem to have that ability to put words on a page so effortlessly (of course, I have know way of knowing the extent of effort applied,) just as I wish I could.

 

It's possible you're a lot luckier than you realize.

 

I'm sure that I am. (And thank you for the writing compliment; it may be the only thing in life that comes easily to me.) That said, I'm definitely not fine with everything around me...I'm deeply uncomfortable with this world I'm trapped in, and I avoid it as best I can. But I try to be content with who I am and what I enjoy.

[LikeWater]

I don't have anything in common with anyone, beyond living in the 21st century and being carbon-based.

 

Well, looks like we were both wrong. I feel the same way you do about the outdated idea of marriage as well as being trapped in a world that I just don't like. So you do have something in common with someone and we're not as different as I'd have guessed. But I'd assume when you made that remark you were referring to women, specifically.

 

However... you've been surprised by a woman once or twice, have you not? I definitely have been, and it was right smack-dab in the middle of one of my "f**k all women and everything about them" phases. That, of course, went sour as well so I mean... what then? Does that phase become a life-long mentality? I hope not. And I'd venture a guess that you'll be surprised again... eventually.

 

Let me ask you this. If you found your ideal, perfect woman, one who despised marriage as much as you. Super attractive; super sexual. Fun and interesting. Isn't it possible that the way you view things would end up being the factor that keeps that dream from coming true? I guess it's pretty doubtful such a perfect situation would fall into your lap (many would make the joke saying, "isn't that every man's dream?",) and I'm not sure if even this would be something worth putting effort into, in your mind. I'm just saying that things aren't always as cut-and-dry as you make them out to be. We're not as different as I first believed, and there's probably a couple women at least that actually do have more in common with you than you'd ever believe.

 

One last question. In your head, is it absolutely impossible that you could ever be in love with a woman again?

[Blue Spiral]

Well, looks like we were both wrong. I feel the same way you do about the outdated idea of marriage as well as being trapped in a world that I just don't like. So you do have something in common with someone and we're not as different as I'd have guessed. But I'd assume when you made that remark you were referring to women, specifically.

 

However... you've been surprised by a woman once or twice, have you not? I definitely have been, and it was right smack-dab in the middle of one of my "f**k all women and everything about them" phases. That, of course, went sour as well so I mean... what then? Does that phase become a life-long mentality? I hope not. And I'd venture a guess that you'll be surprised again... eventually.

 

I honestly don't feel that way about women. As I stated earlier in the thread, my problem is actually that I like women way too much. My issue is with the unfairness of certain dynamics, and the legal/financial danger involved in state-sanctioned monogamy. (And how they take advantage of it, just as men once took advantage of the patriarchy.) And, yeah, I've been surprised by women, in the sense that a few of them have actually liked me back.

 

Let me ask you this. If you found your ideal, perfect woman, one who despised marriage as much as you. Super attractive; super sexual. Fun and interesting. Isn't it possible that the way you view things would end up being the factor that keeps that dream from coming true? I guess it's pretty doubtful such a perfect situation would fall into your lap (many would make the joke saying, "isn't that every man's dream?",) and I'm not sure if even this would be something worth putting effort into, in your mind. I'm just saying that things aren't always as cut-and-dry as you make them out to be. We're not as different as I first believed, and there's probably a couple women at least that actually do have more in common with you than you'd ever believe.

 

Actually, I searched for such a woman for about a decade, because that was my goal: to be with a woman long-term without marriage or kids. But I was in denial about the fact that I'm incapable of monogamy. I'd like to find a long-term situation, but it'd have to be poly in nature, I imagine.

 

One last question. In your head, is it absolutely impossible that you could ever be in love with a woman again?

 

Not at all. I'm still in love with two different women, or at least past versions of them. And I crush on women very easily, albeit for physical reasons...

[Blue Spiral]

Blue Spiral updates, in bullet-point form:

 

--I've had a surprisingly productive week!

 

--that would-be FWB is still sending me pictures.

 

--I found out some info about a woman that I used to have a serious crush on. I haven't seen her (or heard about her) in years. Apparently, she moved in with a guy that (surprise surprise) turned out to be a jerk. Also, her parents (who were acquaintances of my parents) will likely be getting divorced, and the mom has been living with an out-of-state boyfriend for a while. But, the real question: is she still hot? I was sadly unable to ascertain this.

 

--I recently read an article about how most women keep a "backup boyfriend". It was just one poll confirming this, so take it with a grain of salt, obviously. That said, it definitely tracks with my own experiences. I can't tell you how many women have used me for emotional support, and flirted with me just enough to hold my interest...despite having a boyfriend or even being married. I think that my first ex used me in this way.

 

--I've been happy this week, and whenever I'm happy, I get paranoid and think that something horrible is about to happen. The universe doesn't usually allow me to be happy for long. I have one possible candidate for "bad thing to balance out the good things", but I'm hoping it's a false alarm.

 

--I found a new male-centric forum to go to! I've added it to my list.

[faraday]

I got sick last year, and I was in denial for a while about it....and defying my doctor went "organic" and "gluten free" and "non processed"....and there are so many sites backing it up....and they all feed ff each other. "Big Food" and "Big Pharma" were evil. I found tons of "evidence" supporting the idea that diet could heal me.

 

It's been a year, and eating "clean" didn't help me at all. My doctor told me it wouldn't. But I wanted to believe that these people were right...because then I could be fixed without the meds.

 

The point of that story?

 

 

You posted a link a while ago...and I read through a bunch of the articles...and they really don't value women as anything more than a place to put a penis. It was pretty horrifying. I know my bf values me for more than my awesome sex abilities I'm like, a fully functioning human with like, a brain and emotions and stuff! It's crazy!

 

I think surrounding yourself with people that live with so much hate for women....isn't making you a better person. It isn't adding value to your life. It's validating. And it makes it justifiable to believe, "women only date because it's a free meal", you can wrap it like a cloak of armour to protect you from putting yourself out there and connecting with someone in a real and meaningful way.

 

I know you're going to have some refute, you don't like anyone, I get it. You're an island, you're a rock....but you still like penising women more than a fleshlight...so...there's something. There's a lot more if you are willing to be vulnerable.

 

 

 

 

 

Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk

[Blue Spiral]

You posted a link a while ago...and I read through a bunch of the articles...and they really don't value women as anything more than a place to put a penis. It was pretty horrifying. I know my bf values me for more than my awesome sex abilities I'm like, a fully functioning human with like, a brain and emotions and stuff! It's crazy!

 

I'm well-aware. Or at least, I just assumed that you weren't a robot, or a monkey that had figured out how to type. ("It was the best of times, it was the blurst of times!")

 

I think surrounding yourself with people that live with so much hate for women....isn't making you a better person. It isn't adding value to your life. It's validating. And it makes it justifiable to believe, "women only date because it's a free meal", you can wrap it like a cloak of armour to protect you from putting yourself out there and connecting with someone in a real and meaningful way.

 

I don't agree with them 100%, but much of it confirms what I've already seen and experienced. Sorry, I'm not buying the "If you don't _______, you're afraid/not mature/whatever" argument. You're saying that I should do something I don't want to do because...reasons. The only reason I was ever involved with your gender was because of sex. I was an extremely happy kid, but that all changed when I started "growing up" and sexual urges drove me to "put myself out there". The less I've done that, the happier I've been.

 

I know you're going to have some refute, you don't like anyone, I get it. You're an island, you're a rock....but you still like penising women more than a fleshlight...so...there's something. There's a lot more if you are willing to be vulnerable.

 

I'm not willing.

[faraday]

Lol fair enough. From an outsider though....this is what I see And I mean, I don't know you....but I've dated guys like you (briefly lol- we have different life goals, which is cool).

 

I'm glad that you know I'm not a typing monkey and I'm really glad that your not 100% subscribed to the ideas of those sites....I think...they really do a disservice to humanity.

 

I think when people break relationships down to transactions...we lose what we're really supposed to be doing and it becomes to sterile and clinical.

 

 

Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk

[Blue Spiral]

I think when people break relationships down to transactions...we lose what we're really supposed to be doing and it becomes to sterile and clinical.

 

The thing is...I can do sterile and clinical. I can't do the messy, emotional stuff. I understand transaction--it's logical and quantifiable. "Give X to get Y." But if you put me in a social situation and expect me to understand complex, unspoken relationship dynamics, I'm going to be lost. I should really tell a story about my first girlfriend, here, because it sort of ties into this--our relationship had a very give-and-take nature. But it's Friday night, and I'm in a pretty good mood, and I don't want to dredge all that up right now. So I'm going to watch webcam models, instead, because I'm all about dealing with my issues.

 

(That's one of my favorite things about interacting with women. So many of you assume that all men want to deal with their issues and figure out their emotional motivation or whatever. I don't want to deal with that, and I don't want to know, dammit! I just want to avoid it and function! I already understand way too much about myself, and have grown more than I ever wanted to!)

[Blue Spiral]

Blue Spiral bullet points:

 

--I foolishly allowed myself to have a platonic conversation with a woman, this weekend, and the results were depressing/frustrating. (To me, platonic conversations with women are like eating air, or banging your head against a wall. Just...unsatisfying.) It's another woman that I initiated contact with way back in the past, and she just now got around to remembering that I still exist. She didn't respond to my flirting, so I should have cut my losses and escaped, but I thought I'd try a little more. Dumb mistake. She got what she wanted (attention), while I didn't get what I want. The whole point of my new lifestyle is to avoid situations like that.

 

--so, when I woke up yesterday morning, I felt extremely down, both because of that and because of social obligation crap. Yesterday was an extremely up-and-down day. Much of it was good, though, mainly due to football surprises.

 

--I'm hoping that this week will be as productive as last week. Unfortunately, I have an outside world distraction to deal with, today, so it won't be the best start.

 

--I also made the mistake of doing a favor for someone in my extended family. Without going into detail, it just...yeah.

 

--I have a crush on yet another cam model. I think I'm up to four crushes, now.

[annie24]

How about looking at a platonic conversation as a chance to learn something new about xyz topic, instead of keeping score on who is getting what out of it? It might help you become less frustrated/depressed at the situation.

[Blue Spiral]

How about looking at a platonic conversation as a chance to learn something new about xyz topic, instead of keeping score on who is getting what out of it? It might help you become less frustrated/depressed at the situation.

 

I don't enjoy being social. If I'm going to force myself to do it, it's going to be for a good reason...and "learning" isn't good enough. I can do that just fine on my own, thank you. I don't mean to objectify women, but, it's like buying a car so you can listen to the radio, as opposed to actually driving it. Why settle for less?

[annie24]

I don't enjoy being social. If I'm going to force myself to do it, it's going to be for a good reason...and "learning" isn't good enough. I can do that just fine on my own, thank you. I don't mean to objectify women, but, it's like buying a car so you can listen to the radio, as opposed to actually driving it. Why settle for less?

 

Sometimes in life, the value of something isn't as evident as it first appears. I know you see women very one-dimensionally, which is unfortunate, because you can open up a world of opportunities if you could see women as more than sex objects. As an example, I met a woman years ago through an online site such as this one. We kept in casual contact for the next 5 years, and upon seeing my Facebook status looking for a job, she asked me to submit a resume and I got the job. Now, my goal, when I met her - well, I didn't have any goals other than to talk with her occasionally about our joint interests. But it wound up turning into more and a career move.

 

You might be sitting on a plane, train, bus, whatever. There might be a woman next to you who could help connect you to a job, other people, some interesting opportunity. You just never know unless you are open to it.

[notalady]

You should become a monk and go live in the mountains