How do I stop feeling jealous and angry towards couples?

[Wiseman2]

13 minutes ago, metalfantom said:

how come a lot of women don't use this sixth sense to avoid men who turn out abusive, violent, disloyal, etc.? I know the answer will be "these men are disarming on the surface". My response to that would be that men like this always give off red flags. It seems women choose to ignore them because the guy's superficially attractive.

That's right. Women choose to get beaten up because men are attractive. Your convoluted logic seems to continually try to convince yourself that you're alone because you deem yourself unattractive. That attractive men can beat up and kill women because their good looks makes women ignore red flags. However it's disgruntled angry jealous sadistic men who do this regardless of what they look like. 

[catfeeder]

1 hour ago, metalfantom said:

... you can sense men who are depressing, self-loathing etc. how come a lot of women don't use this sixth sense to avoid men who turn out abusive, violent, disloyal, etc.? I know the answer will be "these men are disarming on the surface". My response to that would be that men like this always give off red flags. It seems women choose to ignore them because the guy's superficially attractive.

Narcissists are super skilled in making others feel fabulous. That's their hook. They are not just charming in the patronizing sense, but sure, they lure with that. At some point, early, they share some intimate details about themselves that prompt reciprocation. That goes in their pocket.

Some time after they've made the 'sale' of trust--to the degree that their partner is vulnerable--they turn. They begin using everything they've learned as a subtle weapon, but subtle is the key word.

Over time they isolate their partner, often working their partner's family into a concerned state that the narcissist will manage FOR them, or otherwise turning family and friends against the partner in order to shame the partner into needing a 'savior'...

That's when every intimate confidence gets used to blindside the partner who is, by now, in a weakened position after trust was already built--then suddenly shattered.

None of this is anything like the kind of hostility that seeps out sideways from a raging and hostile person--long before you've even formed a bond. This is equivalent to walking the earth with a big neon sign that says, "I'm ripped off, and I'm a hater...so don't mess with me..."

Okay, nobody will mess with that.

[Fudgie]

That's a fair question, Metal. There's a couple things going on:

1) Not every abuser/negative/problematic people have overt red flags. With many (but not all) abusers, the beginning of the relationship is characterized by positivity and romantic gestures. @catfeeder mentions this in her post above. Sometimes "too much too soon" can be a sign of someone who may be an abuser but other times, it takes a long time to come out, years even. Some women don't report a problem until they are actually married to the guy after x years of dating. 

I myself struggled with one emotionally abusive partner in my dating past. We were friends for 5+ years before dating. I saw him date another woman before me (I knew her) and that relationship was not abusive. I saw maybe a couple small red flags but he was my friend before for so long, it was easy to dismiss. Hindsight is 20/20: if we had not been friends before dating, there is no way I would have ignored those flags. Within 1-2 years of the relationship with me, it really turned. 

2) People (not just women) often repeat the bad relationship patterns that have been modeled for them. Grow up with abuse and abuse often feels "normal" - why wouldn't it if that's all you've ever known? Many folks are not really aware of this and their patterns until they get into some therapy.

3) There's kind of a big difference between abusive partners and people who hate the opposite gender.. Straight, male aabusers don't necessarily hate women or have disdain for them - it boils down to control of a partner within a relationship. Brooding, consuming negativity, however, is painfully obvious. 

Do you really think people at the bar don't notice you brooding when your friend is nabbing all the chicks? 

[Batya33]

4 hours ago, metalfantom said:

Also, just to comment on something a couple of you said: that you can sense men who are depressing, self-loathing etc. how come a lot of women don't use this sixth sense to avoid men who turn out abusive, violent, disloyal, etc.? I know the answer will be "these men are disarming on the surface". My response to that would be that men like this always give off red flags. It seems women choose to ignore them because the guy's superficially attractive.

The women who do that -who know of the red flags - choose to ignore them because they're not available for a healthful relationship. No need to be jealous of someone who makes that choice or jealous of a person who is a victim of abuse.

[catfeeder]

1 hour ago, Fudgie said:

People (not just women) often repeat the bad relationship patterns that have been modeled for them. Grow up with abuse and abuse often feels "normal" - why wouldn't it if that's all you've ever known?

Good point. This applies to ALL people during formative years--even during pre-verbal time. It sets our unconscious 'attachment' predisposition to what we can't even understand or explain.

So whatever abused people seem 'willing' to suffer, the factors that attract them to a given lover are not conscious. Longing and a survival-need-to-please are ingrained so early, there aren't even words to explain the draw to someone who presents THAT dynamic which 'clicks'.

So while this might partially address your concern about those who would reject you in favor of mistreatment from someone else, I agree with Fudgie that your conditioning to fear rejection reduces your resilience--yet resilience is what we ALL need to withstand the natural odds against us in dating.

This doesn't mean that your odds aren't harmed by a physical condition--it only means that very few people enjoy the 'charmed' odds you might assign to ALL others. AND, most of us are working a 'niche' anyway. 

Attracting a mate isn't about appealing to the masses, it's about finding ONE right person who gets you and can view you through the right lens. 

So if you want to negate this, here you are. If you can make room for this idea, then you can start to 'see' lots of seemingly mismatched couples or equally 'unappealing' couples who appeal to one another perfectly.

BUT--if your bar is to look down on anyone who isn't a swimsuit model just because your childhood friend could land those, then your resentful condition is self imposed. 

That's not to say you 'deserve' it, but rather that you 'self-inflict' it--and of course, you'll note any incidence of 'proof' to confirm it.

And, honey, that's just a priority to lean how to undo--preferably with professional help.

Head high, and write more if it helps.

[waffle]

 

You will notice that no where on there does it say "they are unattractive."  Because that is never the reason.  Usually it comes down to one thing: you have to be able to offer a woman the relationship she wants.  Has nothing to do with looks.  That's an excuse.

[boltnrun]

If looks are all it takes to attract a mate, and women are constantly being bombarded by hordes of interested men...then why is my friend, who is literally supermodel beautiful, unable to find even ONE date? She's sweet, intelligent and nice to boot, but she's been unhappily single for YEARS. 

And what about all the young ladies who post on here lamenting the fact that they can't find a boyfriend?

Riddle me that, Batman.

[Seraphim]

8 hours ago, metalfantom said:

Again, I'm not saying that physically attractive men are guaranteed successful relationships, I'm saying they'll have more opportunities than a socially awkward loser like me.

Also, just to comment on something a couple of you said: that you can sense men who are depressing, self-loathing etc. how come a lot of women don't use this sixth sense to avoid men who turn out abusive, violent, disloyal, etc.? I know the answer will be "these men are disarming on the surface". My response to that would be that men like this always give off red flags. It seems women choose to ignore them because the guy's superficially attractive.

More often than not women and men who fall prey to abusive people were abused before hand and it has become normalized for them. 

[metalfantom]

8 hours ago, boltnrun said:

If looks are all it takes to attract a mate, and women are constantly being bombarded by hordes of interested men...then why is my friend, who is literally supermodel beautiful, unable to find even ONE date? She's sweet, intelligent and nice to boot, but she's been unhappily single for YEARS. 

And what about all the young ladies who post on here lamenting the fact that they can't find a boyfriend?

Riddle me that, Batman.

No disrespect but I don't believe that for a minute. She must be voluntarily choosing not to go on dates because even an average woman will have no shortage of suitors available to her. There's something you're missing out here.

[metalfantom]

I can look at any woman and instantly know she would have no interest in me. It's not exactly rocket science. Some of you have already admitted it's increasingly difficult for men to find relationships. I don't know the reason for that. Maybe it's because women no longer need to find a breadwinner to settle down with, so they're happy to be voluntarily single or only date the most alpha guys? Either way, if it's that desperate for the average schmo, think what it's like for a physical freak and social reject like yours truly.

I was cursed the moment I was born. 

Today I walked past a couple on the high street and again I was filled with a maelstrom of emotions, namely hate, anger, and shame. I thought I was going to faint at one point. I know they're not projecting those feelings onto me, but in the moment it certainly feels that way. 

[Wiseman2]

44 minutes ago, metalfantom said:

 I walked past a couple on the high street and again I was filled with a maelstrom of emotions, namely hate, anger, and shame.

Stop engaging in hate group propaganda.  Make a list of what you are actually doing to improve your situation..

Do you have a job? A car? Your own place? 

Have you been to a dentist, doctor and gotten help for your perceived defects?

Do you go to a gym, engage in sports or stay in shape? 

What classes courses and education have you pursued?

Stop whining and do something about your predicament. If all you do is read incels and manoshere rubbish all day it's no wonder you can't attract anyone.

. You lack empathy so stories about other disadvantaged individuals is lost on you. You're a hater, pure and simple.

[boltnrun]

1 hour ago, metalfantom said:

No disrespect but I don't believe that for a minute. She must be voluntarily choosing not to go on dates because even an average woman will have no shortage of suitors available to her. There's something you're missing out here.

It doesn't matter if you believe me or not. I figured you'd have a response like that. Anything that doesn't fit your narrative is rejected by you.

I feel you don't want help. Your hate and anger serve you for some reason. That's a shame because that's not a good way to choose to live. But if you don't want to change your mindset there isn't much anyone can do to help you.

[JoyfulCompany]

It's very safe to talk about prejudices, red pill BS and how much it doesn't depend on you. How about being vulnerable and addressing the awful language you use for yourself? And, please, numerous people suggested therapy, have you tried it? Will you? There's nothing to lose at this point. Do you want to wake up in your 40s and feel even more behind in life than how you feel now? I'm the last person who'll say life is a competition and you need to achieve certain things by certain age. But I'm the first to tell you if you start doing better now, you'll thank yourself later.

You seem to focus on parts of posts that are food for despair and ignore all else. Step back, go over your whole topic again, think of ways you can feed your soul with nutritious thoughts and activities.

I once gave a chance to a person similar to you. It turned dark very soon, his view of the world, him and me was very immature and off-putting, an awful cage to be in. I ended it, suddenly I was the reason for his misery and got myself a stalker. Still have nightmares about it. So, that's why I'm saying getting a girlfriend is not an end goal. You need to work on the way you view yourself instead of wishing someone will come and save you from that.

[Batya33]

2 hours ago, metalfantom said:

Maybe it's because women no longer need to find a breadwinner to settle down with, so they're happy to be voluntarily single or only date the most alpha guys?

Women haven't needed this for decades.  Nothing new under the sun.  Also do not date if you really think this little of women that they're focused on some abstract notion of "alpha" when choosing who to be serious with (not go on dates with -many women -myself included - certainly have gone on a date or wanted to with a man because of what he looked like or because he was famous or whatever - but choosing someone to be in a serious couple with - that's a pretty offensive statement you've made and part of being in a relationship with another person is respecting that person).

People who are single are by definition "voluntarily single" even those who really want to be married (as I did).  I chose to be single until I met the right person to marry.  If you mean women choose to be single as opposed to settling - I mean -of course -so do men.  

I would not have married a man who wasn't financially stable and who didn't share the same financial values, work ethic and sense of ambition with me - I was not looking for a financial provider or breadwinner -that person was me -I provided for myself and if my husband could not work for some reason I could provide for the family no problem.  And would do so with joy.

[Batya33]

I haven't read this but read a number of comments on it.  Seemed appropo, maybe???

The Rise of Lonely, Single Men | Psychology Today

[metalfantom]

1 hour ago, Batya33 said:

I haven't read this but read a number of comments on it.  Seemed appropo, maybe???

The Rise of Lonely, Single Men | Psychology Today

That makes for depressing reading but nothing I didn't already know. 

It was difficult for guys like me before the rise of dating apps. Now it's mathematically impossible.

[Wiseman2]

24 minutes ago, metalfantom said:

That makes for depressing reading but nothing I didn't already know. 

It was difficult for guys like me before the rise of dating apps. Now it's mathematically impossible.

 You haven't listed all the things you have done to improve your predicament.

What healthcare professionals have you consulted about your supposed deformity?

What education, classes and courses have you taken to enlighten yourself and make a good living?

 Do you have your own job, car, money, place?

What sports, fitness and healthful activities have you enrolled in to improve your physical and mental health?

 What clubs and groups have you joined to improve your social circle and skills?

Or are you just reading more incels crap daily arguing across multiple platforms looking for pity and trying to convince people of your misogynistic hate philosophy?

 

 

[reinventmyself]

6 hours ago, metalfantom said:

No disrespect but I don't believe that for a minute. She must be voluntarily choosing not to go on dates because even an average woman will have no shortage of suitors available to her. There's something you're missing out here.

it always baffles me when some men think they are on authority on a womans dating experiences.  They state their opinion as if it is a fact.  In spite of women telling them otherwise.

I suppose if you keep telling yourself this it supports your case.  But it you really want to know what it's like for women, ask them.

[metalfantom]

2 minutes ago, reinventmyself said:

it always baffles me when some men think they are on authority on a womans dating experiences.  They state their opinion as if it is a fact.  In spite of women telling them otherwise.

I suppose if you keep telling yourself this it supports your case.  But it you really want to know what it's like for women, ask them.

I could create a fake profile on Tinder and prove my point within seconds. 

 

[reinventmyself]

I've told this story here so many times.  I wish I could go back and cut 'n paste.

In my 20s, working in an upscale restaurant.  I worked with maybe 3 dozen good looking young people.  One day they hired a new male server.  Balding in his 20's, white pasty skin, rather effeminate, rounded shoulders, skinny.  By all intents and purposes, he was not a physically attractive man.

It was an early life lesson I haven't forgotten.  After a very short time, his personality shown through.  He was smart, a fiery sense of humor, outgoing and confident.  It didn't much time before my female coworkers, even the most attractive were clamoring for his attention.  It was pretty interesting to me, at that age, watching all this unfold.  I obviously haven't forgotten it and as a mature woman I witness this all the time.

Why?  Because people have many dimensions to them.  Physical looks are just a small part.  Develop your social skills, your intelligence, your compassion and empathy for others.  Become well rounded by cultivating friendships, gain some hobbies.  

Or. .  continue to beat a drum that you will never have a chance.  Which ultimately is a sad self-fulfilled prophecy.  It's your choice.

[reinventmyself]

14 minutes ago, metalfantom said:

I could create a fake profile on Tinder and prove my point within seconds. 

 

Yes, we get blitzed with multiple interests.  But I promise you that it's rare that any of them come through.  I mean, really?!  What would be the purpose of lying about this?

Again, a woman's real life experience.  Not just conjecture.

[Wiseman2]

17 minutes ago, metalfantom said:

I could create a fake profile on Tinder and prove my point within seconds. 

 

Prove what point? That you know how to catfish?

[boltnrun]

20 minutes ago, metalfantom said:

I could create a fake profile on Tinder and prove my point within seconds. 

 

Seems like this is your true goal. Not finding answers to "How do I stop feeling jealous and angry towards couples?"

[metalfantom]

12 minutes ago, Wiseman2 said:

Prove what point? That you know how to catfish?

That the average woman has no shortage of potential suitors. Online dating is a woman's market. No reasonable person can deny this. 

[reinventmyself]

Just now, metalfantom said:

That the average woman has no shortage of potential suitors. Online dating is a woman's market. No reasonable person can deny this. 

OK, you win.  What exactly can we do for you now?