Just had my first disaster date at 30 years old

[dias]

There are some important facts from OP's account of events that seem to have slipped between the cracks. When you look at these facts and the cumulative picture they paint, it seems that actually the one who dodged the bullet is OP's date.

 

 

 

Based on the title of the thread, OP is 30 and his date is 40. Men who prefer to date much older women fall into one of these 3 groups: men with mommy's issues; men with intimacy issues, because the age gap prevents that anything serious may come out from the dating experience (e.g. no children because she is beyond fertility age), so a man with intimacy issues feels safe as the age gap organically builds distance; and the third group: the immature men-child who think that an older woman would be more willing to take crap/pay for dates, because she must feel "honored" that a young guy took her on a date.

 

The second bolded part in the quote shows that they went on a dinner date (they went out "last night"). If they met at 7.30-8 PM, finished dinner around 9.30-10 PM and parted ways after that, OP's excuse for not texting her because he was busy running errands, does not hold. Who runs errands around midnight! Answer: nobody. OP did not text her because he was playing mind games. One more confirmation that he falls into one of the 3 categories mentioned above...

 

 

 

HE had his cards with him on the date, because he withdrew money on his way to the date. Unless the ATM machines in the US allow people to get money by inserting one's fingers, he should have had bank cards the day of the date in order to withdraw cash! So, the argument that he had no way to cover the bill, because cash was in the car is just BS.

 

 

 

 

Irritated reply by OP

 

 

 

 

 

It seems OP is a very careful financial planner… when it comes to dating women. I'm wondering if he penny-pinches the same way when he goes out with his buddies on the town. I bet he does not. This penny-pinching behavior towards women give away someone with a strong undercurrent of resentment towards women, and I'll put my finger on it-misogynistic . From my dating experience, all men who exhibited penny-pinching behavior, and were not broke, were bitter, jaded men that saw women as a threat and enemies; these men were not good partners, because instead of enjoying the relationship, they were busy calculating ALL the time, if they haven't by accident given too much from themselves. I remember one guy was specifically clear, quoted: "my ex-wife took too much in the divorce, I'll not allow any other woman take advantage of me again." So, inside his head he saw women as enemies and as threat to his well-being. How could a woman have a harmonious relationship with this type of man? The last is a rhetorical question...

 

And the final fact that OP could not resist being nasty and rude to his date, does confirm the ambivalent nature of his relationship to women. A normal man would have kept a dignified silence and moved on, without the need for retaliation and revenge.

 

To conclude the analysis, I'd reiterate that the lady who people here call crazy, actually acted on her gut feeling and she is right. Arguably her communication style could take an improvement, but that's all. She dared voice her opinion in a feisty manner, while other women (including the female posters here who called her nuts) would have thought the same things about OP, the only difference being that these other women would have not said it out loud and clear. Because they would be afraid to be labeled with one of these labels (crazy, nuts, bunny boiler, whatever). So, they would just swallow the disrespect.

Rudeness is not feisty manner.

 

Interesting opinion though.

[purplepaisley]

Katrina brings up a good point in that "it's all her," which I don't think it is, but her reaction was over the top, so yeah, maybe other women would have brushed it off. The thing is, there were 3-4 events that we know of, not just one, and the icing on the cake was a major delayed response at the end of the evening. I've had my fair share of dates where the guy is just kind of on the jerky side, and my tolerance for this behavior has dropped a notch. Sorry for the "baggage," but it is what it is.

 

Very interesting thoughts from East4, and it didn't occur to me the timing. His errands could have been running to the store for some lunch in the morning or out of coffee, get some gas so as not to have to stop before work in the morning, but it could have been really late. I guess a late hour works for both of them or someone had the day off...any number of things, but errands so late on a weeknight doesn't necessarily add up. But I don't know their lifestyle.

 

In any case, I see multiple issues:

1. Late. On it's own, meh, it can happen to anyone, particularly when going to an unfamiliar area. He could have left earlier to accommodate for any mishaps.
   
2. Too tight shirt. I don't know if his attire was cause for issue; however, I have had a couple dates where it appears the guy didn't even try to look nice, and that suggests an aloofness; that and getting ready quickly when I confirm I'm leaving the house to meet them...underlying gut feeling a reminder was needed. This does not go over well for me.
   
3. No money. If he wasn't in a rush due to tardiness, he may not have forgotten his cash. He didn't say he forgot his wallet, he said he forgot his cash. Why not use the debit? This comes across as moochy. Then he only hands over $20. This on it's own could be forgivable, but by now we're potentially on strike three of issues.
   
4. No response for an hour and a half. This is after the woman said she really likes it when a guy expresses his interest as well as the discussion to communicate later. The OP resisted and I do believe it was either him being uninterested/aloof or him playing this game, waiting for her to text first. Again, this alone is really not a major issue, but we're on round 4 that we know of. I think that after the tardy and money fiasco, a text from him sooner could have made a difference.
   

Anything else happen on the date to give this woman pause? The OP may not have recognized it, but I think someone asked if he complained about the tolls, etc. I just wonder if there was more happening and the OP may not have recognized it.

 

We don't know the woman's point of view, so we can't really do anything with her, but the OP asked what HE could have done differently. The nonresponse and not texting really gets under my skin. Again, after more than one unfortunate event, I feel that there was a greater burden on the OP to express his enjoyment and keep the positive momentum going, and even apologize for the money situation..."I promise I'll pay next time. Would you like to get together on Friday?" If he had texted within 30 minutes, even if he said he had to make a couple stops on the way home, if he had texted earlier, letting her know he really enjoyed her and sorry for the mishaps, I do believe it could have changed the outcome. I know if I was late and there were any other issues that popped up, I would feel the need to reach out right away, just to assure him that I'm truly interested and I'm not normally this scatter-brained, whatever. An apology, even.

 

Now, this woman, being a bit of a hothead, may have flown off the handle at a later date, so it's hard to say if he dodged a bullet or not, but the OP asked what he could have done differently or mistakes he made that he could have rectified.

[katrina1980]

@purple, I like your response, but to clarify I didn't say it was all her and if I did I mis-spoke.

 

I said I didn't think his actions were egregious enough to warrant such an over the top response, especially after a first meet/date where people can be nervous, as such forgetful, a bit goofy, awkward, whatever.

 

If I'm feeling enough energy/chemistry, I tend to overlook things on a first date for these reasons and go out with him again. My nature is to give people the benefit of the doubt, especially on a first date.

 

If same behavior continues, I stop dating him.

 

Agree him not having cash on his person he can improve upon, but again perhaps he was just super nervous, and in his frenzy he was a bit late and forgot money.

 

The waiting 90 minutes to call would not have bothered me at all, and I think her anxiety was the driving force there not the fact he waited 90 minutes, plus as has been said she said she would call too.

 

Edit: East's generalizations about men dating women a few years older, etc, I have no words other than I flat out DISAGREE, and that they are nothing more than generalizations and East's opinions.

[figureitout23]

Wow East went Freudian this morning, while I disagree about the age gap reasoning although I’m sure there is research to prove what you’re saying same with women who date older men, unless it’s a pattern it could just be a willingness to date older and younger. The rest though... observant, I missed it all.

 

For whatever reason I didn’t pay that much attention to the OPers other posts but I’ll be darned if there isn’t a need to place blame on others, an issue with who pays for the date and get this, multiple threads on ‘disaster dates’, even though this post is being claimed as the first one. Not saying anything one way or the other but interesting indeed.

 

East looks like you dropped the mic. Unfortunately saying anything about mysogyny much less mysogynoir is gonna fall on deaf ears. It’s well and thriving on ENA. The quickness to label women who act out of the norm ‘crazy’ alone has always been an eye opener for me. I remember maybe a year ago, I reversed the language and spoke of the man the way people were speaking of the woman and I got quite a few up in arms, you’d think I’d hit a puppy. Lol.

 

Interesting twists and turns this post has taken indeed.

[purplepaisley]

@purple, I like your response, but to clarify I didn't say it was all her and if I did I mis-spoke.

 

I said I didn't think his actions were egregious enough to warrant such an over the top response, especially after a first meet/date where people can be nervous, as such forgetful, a bit goofy, awkward, whatever.

 

If I'm feeling enough energy/chemistry, I tend to overlook things on a first date for these reasons and go out with him again. My nature is to give people the benefit of the doubt, especially on a first date.

 

If same behavior continues, I stop dating him.

 

Agree him not having cash on his person he can improve upon, but again perhaps he was just super nervous, and in his frenzy he was a bit late and forgot money.

 

The waiting 90 minutes to call would not have bothered me at all, and I think her anxiety was the driving force there not the fact he waited 90 minutes, plus as has been said she said she would call too.

 

Edit: East's generalizations about men dating women a few years older, etc, I have no words other than I flat out DISAGREE, and that they are nothing more than generalizations and East's opinions.

 

You had stated your main focus was on HER, notsomuch HIM because you felt her reaction was over the top, and my takeaway from that (and you said) is that you feel that nothing he did would have made a difference, and this could be true...or not. I do believe there was an area of recovery.

 

And this is where you and I don't align, because you're seeing these events as single events that are forgivable, to which I agree, as single events, but these were not single events. These were a minimum of THREE (possibly four) acts of irresponsibility, aloofness, uninterested, scattered, OR rude behaviors, all in a 2-hour time frame, plus the fact he really didn't think too much of her or he was playing games, because he was going to make her wait before he expressed how much he enjoyed the evening, wanted her to text first, and was any apology even on the horizon? Any act of taking responsibility? At all?

 

I just feel like if he was truly interested in foraging a relationship, he would have been quicker to contact, in addition to quicker addressing his mistakes, and this is not normal behavior for him (usually he's punctual, has his wallet)...or maybe this is normal behavior for him. Maybe he has an entitled attitude, which I don't think he does if he reached out to ask about what he could have done differently.

[figureitout23]

 

I just feel like if he was truly interested in foraging a relationship, he would have been quicker to contact, in addition to quicker addressing his mistakes, and this is not normal behavior for him (usually he's punctual, has his wallet)...or maybe this is normal behavior for him. Maybe he has an entitled attitude, which I don't think he does if he reached out to ask about what he could have done differently.

 

Heres the thing tough, in this post he asked what he could have done differently but became highly defensive at any point anyone tried to tell him anything. He latched onto any post that placed blame on her though.

[katrina1980]

pp, my main focus *was* on her because no matter what he did, or did not do, whether due to disinterest or nervousness, anxiety, or whatever (and only OP can answer that), her reaction was way over the top, unwarranted and just flat out "crazy." In my opinion.

 

However, that is not to say he made mistakes from which he can learn from.

 

One of which is to let this sh** go, they are not a match, period end of. It was only one meet/date after all.

 

Learn from it and strive to be better and more responsible moving forward.

 

We could speculate why he did/did not do this or that until hell freezes over, only HE knows the answer.

 

In any event, it was her response, her way over the top accusations and assumptions that I focused on because again no matter what he did or didn't do, for whatever reason, that were not justified or deserving and OP needs to let it roll off versus obsessing about it as he was doing throughout a good portion of this thread, which is not healthy thinking and it appears affecting him in a very negative way.

 

Hope that clarifies.

[milly007]

Although I do think the OP can be more prepared and organized for dates, whether or not he was playing games is anyone's guess. If he was, obviously I don't recommend this.

 

Do I find myself scratching my head thinking over the, "I left my cash in the car, can you put it on your card?", yes. Do I think her mean and rude texts where she personally attacked him to be justified based on what the OP described happened during the date? Absolutely not. It wasn't "feisty"; it was mean!

 

I've been trying to look at this scenario from her perspective as well, and I really don't understand her reaction. Sure, maybe he was a couple of minutes late, but the fact that it was new territory to him would cause me to overlook this (however ensuring you're on time will help with dating in my experience). The whole "I forgot my cash, can we put this on your card" I find to be different/careless. I'm not sure how she interpreted this as him not being interested though, since he did give her money after the fact. However, I will say that I have heard men say (including on this forum), that they'll pay for the date if they're interested in the woman. If they're not interested, they'll only pay their half of the bill. Who knows, maybe this is how she interpreted his behaviour. In terms of 90 minutes going by without the OP having sent her a text after the date, well, again...I wouldn't take this as him not being interested. He had to drive home (gosh knows how long the car ride was) and 90 minutes is not that long after a first date. I would never expect any guy to text me that soon after a date, tbh.

 

Maybe the lady he met isn't nuts, bonkers, crazy,...whatever you want to call it, and I can appreciate the fact that maybe she's frustrated with online dating and dating in general, but her reaction (the texts) seemed vicious/mean/rude. Why bother texting someone and personally attacking them if you don't think they're interested. Why not just leave the situation/him be? Heck, even she admitted to the OP on the date that she was moody and a handful. I can assure you that if the roles were reversed, and it was a man who had sent the nasty text, personally attacking his date, I'd feel the same way, and no doubt he'd be picked apart on this forum as well.

 

They both have things to work on, but by no means was her reaction justified. Even if she did want to text him about him seemingly not being interested, she could have gone about it in a different way. But personally attacking him? No way.

 

And fwiw, I believe she even complimented him after they met at the restaurant - said he was "sexy", I believe.

[figureitout23]

If you cant understand her reaction, none of us could, and shes not here to tell her side isnt it safer to assume hes leaving parts out than to assume shes crazy?

[katrina1980]

If you cant understand her reaction, none of us could, and shes not here to tell her side isnt it safer to assume hes leaving parts out than to assume shes crazy?

 

What do you mean left parts out?

 

He quoted her texts verbatim.

 

Nothing justifies that over the top reaction, assumptions, accusations, no matter what he did.

 

It was their first meet.

 

A stable, non-crazy person would have simply concluded they were not a good match and let it go.

 

Both of them. Yes? no?

 

What am I missing, serious question.

[milly007]

We can say that about all of the posts on this forum - that info is being left out and that perspectives are one-sided.

 

But going off what the OP wrote (which is all of the information we have to go by), if she did send the texts that he indicated, it was very mean and rude.

[purplepaisley]

This is true, and I agree, BUT...the purpose of this board (I think) is to chew on the BUTs...and sometimes it seems resistant or combative. I try not to to put too much into that BUT thought process because as we work through our emotions and what we need to do, there can be a lot of BUTs, and we draw off of the experience of others when we present these BUTs to total strangers on the internet. Yes, some people are going to resist and fight and argue if they don't hear what they want to hear. :) Your focus is largely on the end of it...and I fully agree. This woman...these two as a couple...probably not a match, end of story. But we live in a society with manners and behaviors, acceptable acts, rudeness...these rules allow us to live together. The OP failed in several steps, and if his end-goal is to improve upon himself, so that if something like this pops up again in the future, maybe he's better equipped to turn the tables. Hand over $40 instead of $20. Whip out the debit. Discuss "going dutch" ahead of time. Call sooner. Leave the house earlier. Plan drinks instead of dinner, and advance to dinner if things are going well. There are a a lot of ways to not repeat the thing that caused the explosion. If the OP gets nothing from this, another reader could be absorbing all of this and storing it in the vault of yes's and no's.

 

This woman and her rash behavior? Can't do much about that. It's a wash. Move on.

[milly007]

If the OP is leaving out information, that's on him. And if he was playing games, that's on him, too. Only he knows.

 

But in terms of his part in this, I really do think there's some useful advice given here in this thread; advice that will be super helpful when it comes to future dates (that’s if the OP has read through the posts and hasn’t been scared away! Lol).

[dias]

I think the situation is pretty simple.

 

He made all these "mistakes" which are already mentioned and she was rude and nasty. Not a match anyway. Based on OP's version always.

[katrina1980]

Ok don't judge me guys (actually you can if you want lol) but I want to point out the differences between men and women (generally) and how they respond to rejection.

 

Last night I could not sleep so went into living room and started watching the show "Baggage" is anyone familiar? Like four episodes back to back.

 

I'd never seen this show before and boy was it interesting!!

 

Whenever the man rejected a woman, even though she had been gushing about him a few minutes prior, how hot he is, etc, after he rejected her, suddenly her attitude changed and she began belittling him, insulting him, "you're a loser, not that hot, some really nasty stuff"!

 

However, whenever the woman rejected a man, he was very gracious, expressed disappointment and wished her well.

 

Who can explain these differing reactions among men and women in response to being rejected?

 

I dunno I thought it was interesting, and may explain OP's date reaction -- she perceived rejection and lashed out in a nasty way.

 

Possibly.

[figureitout23]

Oh Katrina please stop.

 

There’s so much written about men’s fragile egos when it comes to rejection, neither sex handles it well.

 

Comedians have done skits about men’s reactions when a woman simply says ‘not interested’.

 

Give me a sec, I’ll link a few if you’d like...

 

This post and the subtleties... like Dias made sure to use quotation marks when talking about his ‘mistakes’ and then went to describe her as rude and nasty...

 

I’m finding all this facsinating...

[milly007]

Interesting, I find men to react just as harshly to rejection (as some of you have posted about in this thread after having cancelled dates or informed someone that they weren't a match, etc.).

 

Where is this show 'Baggage' finding its subjects? Lol. Just doesn't sound accurate.

 

At the end of the day, no doubt we all know that both men and women have a hard time accepting rejection and might react in a harsh manner. Definitely not gender specific.

[katrina1980]

Oh Katrina please stop.

 

There’s so much written about men’s fragile egos when it comes to rejection, neither sex handles it well.

 

Comedians have done skits about men’s reactions when a woman simply says ‘not interested’.

 

Give me a sec, I’ll link a few if you’d like...

 

This post and the subtleties... like Dias made sure to use quotation marks when talking about his ‘mistakes’ and then went to describe her as rude and nasty...

 

I’m finding all this facsinating...

 

First off my intention for posting that was to give a chuckle, cause it's a damn game show!! LOL

 

And I also said "in general" these were the reactions based on what I witnessed on the show.

 

That's all, fio, it was meant to be a sort of tongue n cheek, not to be taken 100% seriously.

 

Agree with you, I've had some very nasty stuff directed at me when I've rejected a guy!!

[milly007]

I just did a quick search of that show and saw a brief clip. Didn't realize it was a game show. I can't take any of these people seriously! I guess that's the point. Lol. It looks like it might even be scripted.

[dias]

This post and the subtleties... like Dias made sure to use quotation marks when talking about his ‘mistakes’ and then went to describe her as rude and nasty...

 

I’m finding all this facsinating...

 

There is not always a hidden meaning behind.

 

I used quotation for the simple reason that I don't think there is a certain process/steps that you have to follow when you go on a date. That's why I used quotation.

 

He could be more organized and prepared for the date. Yes.

 

 

Personally I don't have a pre-defined set of rules of how a girl should behave when she is with me. Maybe you have. There are many people who treat dates like interviews.

 

Correct actions/words-> you pass the test

"Mistakes"-> you don't pass the test

 

I find her text rude and nasty. Even if you ego is bruised, you don't respond like this. I can understand if she was 15 but at 40?

 

Different strokes for different folks.

[katrina1980]

I just did a quick search of that show and saw a brief clip. Didn't realize it was a game show. I can't take any of these people seriously! I guess that's the point. Lol. It looks like it might even be scripted.

 

Yes I'm sure it's scripted, including their "baggage"!

 

Again just trying to give a chuckle, apologies that wasn't clear.

 

Funny show though.

[milly007]

Yes I'm sure it's scripted, including their "baggage"!

 

Again just trying to give a chuckle, apologies that wasn't clear.

 

Funny show though.

 

Oh, I knew you were just trying to keep it light/have a laugh. I wasn't offended (if by chance my post came across that way).

 

I just didn't know the show was more silly/a game show. At first I thought it was maybe more serious in nature, and thought "jeez, that can't be right!" (the men's reaction in comparison with the women). My bad! :)

[East4]

East looks like you dropped the mic.

 

Nope, FiO, I was just warming up. But with this post I'm intending to drop the mic.

 

After running a background forum check on OP, there are these really gold-mine threads of his that corroborate the conclusions of my previous post, in particular that he staged the "forgetting" of the money in the car; and that he did not text after the date on purpose to play mind games, rather than being just too busy running errands...in the middle of the night on a weekday.

 

The texting

 

There is this OP's thread carrying the very telling title "Anybody afraid of initiating contact first with a date?" https://www.enotalone.com/forum/showthread.php?t=495877&p=6287763

where basically this individual was sharing his frustration that the lady he was then dating was not chasing after him by initiating texts. He kept careful score who initiated when and he didn't want to text her first. In this recent thread he innocently is trying to convince us that he didn't text his most recent date, because he was running errands at midnight? Yeah, right :facepalm:

But even more disturbing is that OP clearly lied to us about his age, this is an excerpt from his opening post in the thread from 2015:

 

I've been seeing this woman the past 5-6 weeks now, she's 45 and I'm 35 and we've been out on 4 separate occasions now.

 

Sooo, in 2015 OP was 35 and now in 2019 he is 30? OP, could you please clarify in which thread you lied, in this one, or the previous one? I would like to signal to the community here, that we are having yet another instance of OP dating a more mature woman 10 years his senior, of course if one could believe anything he is saying.

 

The "forgotten" cash

 

There's this OP's thread with somewhat pompous title "My dating Philosophy", as if he is some sort of guru, or a century philosopher:

https://www.enotalone.com/forum/showthread.php?t=530508

 

Now everyone, take a seat before reading OP's views on who should be paying for dates:

 

I have realized that when going out on lots of dates and meeting potential love match the odds are more than likely that it won't actually turn into a love match and I'm just wasting money in the process taking girls out on dates. It can add up really quickly. And I'm aware that other options exist that doesn't involve money etc.

 

Now I told the girl that if I'm the one driving the hour and a half distance to see her then I expect that she knows her town/ city better than I do so in essence she'd be the one taking me out and paying.

 

If on the other hand she is the one driving down to see me then I'd be the one doing the finding things for us to do and paying for whatever...

 

The third and final option would be meeting halfway and we can go half and half on whatever...

 

 

So, basically what happened in this last thread is that OP enacted the third option of his "Dating Philosophy" by actually staging the scene to only pay for his meal. He went about it in a very underhanded way though, rather than just being clear with his date that he wants to go Dutch. There was no accidentally forgetting his money, it was a set up. As I said in the previous post he must have had his bank cards with him, because he used them to withdraw money just before the date.

Yet another sad story of men using tricks on women to pay for dates…

 

OP is who he is… what i'm mostly concerned with is how easy it was for him to mislead the community here and worst of all; how everybody ganged up against this poor woman who was actually scammed by this man. How come nobody noticed the inconsistency of facts in his posts, or took some 30 minutes to check his previous threads to see that the way he played tricks on this woman was part of his so called "Dating philosophy", aka "Dating Scam".

[katrina1980]

Deleted, changed mind.

 

Nite all.

[Capricorn3]

Thread has run its course.