35 years old. Never married. No kids. Feeling so out of faith and alone

[Sparkly Eyes]

Your apology is passive-aggressive, half-hearted, and only partially sincere. But I will still accept it.

 

Well, let's just say I'd rather not insult back.

 

Anyways, so I assume since you didn't correct me, I was right about assuming?

[Sparkly Eyes]

duplicate.

[strangeman]

Ah, a return to playfulness. And I'm up for it.

 

Anyways, so I assume since you didn't correct me, I was right about assuming?

 

Not only can assumptions be right or wrong, I myself can be right or wrong. And I'm often wrong.

[Sparkly Eyes]

I agree with you. Not only can assumptions be right or wrong, I myself can be right or wrong. And I'm often wrong.

 

Well I guess it's good that we can at least agree on one thing.

[strangeman]

I think we agree on a lot more than one thing. For example I very much appreciate your posts here against cuckolding. But don't let me change the subject...

 

I hope OP comes back soon to weigh in on what she's been thinking about.

[Batya33]

Have to say I love the comment about women gaining weight as they get older - I think it depends whether the standard of attractiveness is skinny (as opposed to slim in a healthy way, not emaciated), genetics and lifestyle. I was never overweight and have a very slim mom (who was slim when she got married over 50 years ago and now is even slimmer, has been for years, doesn't diet). I was "overweight" when I was pregnant but because I'd already been working out for over 25 years I was able to reestablish my exercise routine (with modifications - my "weight training" relied on my baby in the baby carrier rather than weights lol) with relative ease. I was thin when I got pregnant and now I am thinner and more toned, for the last year , i.e. it took me 5 months to get back to pre-pregnancy weight after gaining over 30 pounds). I point this out to dispel yet another myth about women who are over 30 - often it is the women in their 20s who are bloated from alcohol and late night partying with the bad eating habits/too much caffeine and chemicals not the women in their 30s and 40s who might be a a stage where they care more about their health.

 

(and yes I have met men who were highly interested in meeting my mother to see if I would turn out "fat" - give me a break).

 

I think men are entitled to be concerned about getting serious with a woman over 35 especially if she is either in no rush to try to have a baby (and/or smokes or has a very unhealthy lifestyle) or if she is in such a rush that she is desperate. But there are 20 somethings with "baby fever" as well.

 

I think the OP should do her best to live in or relocate to a major city where there are more singles in their 30s and 40s even if it means a financial sacrifice - it's what I did at age 28, not just to meet a man but also so that I could shorten my commute to work and be able to socialize in the city later at night without having to worry about getting home. It made it much easier to meet people and date.

[newwave]

Why would I want a 65 year old guy? Yuck. Incidentally the guy I want is 43, never married, no kids and nerdy. That's the guys I like. I hate alpha guys. So what if 39 is middle aged? So is 39 for a man! Besides, I don't consider that middle aged anymore because people are in better shape.

[newwave]

I'm in far better shape now than I was in my 20's. In my 20's I drank pop constantly, ate a lot of junk and just unhealthy lifestyle. I was never fat, but if I lived like that now I would be. I workout often and drink more water than I do pop. I also eat much healthier. My mother is 62 and she looks very good and very trim.

[Rob1000]

I'm 35, male and today is my first wedding anniversary.. or would have been! I was 6 months from getting married last year until my ex decided she didn't love any more. I'm still single, and with all my friends married and engaged, I get left out of a lot of stuff. But you know what? My life right now is awesome because the best days are all ahead of me. My beautiful wife is on her way, looking for me at the same time that I'm looking for her, which helps me enjoy today simply because I'm 100% sure, when it all comes together, I will be the happiest man alive. All we have is this moment... so we'd better start practising being in it.

[Sparkly Eyes]

I'm 35, male and today is my first wedding anniversary.. or would have been! I was 6 months from getting married last year until my ex decided she didn't love any more. I'm still single, and with all my friends married and engaged, I get left out of a lot of stuff. But you know what? My life right now is awesome because the best days are all ahead of me. My beautiful wife is on her way, looking for me at the same time that I'm looking for her, which helps me enjoy today simply because I'm 100% sure, when it all comes together, I will be the happiest man alive. All we have is this moment... so we'd better start practising being in it.

 

I'm glad you're back rob. And it's wonderful that you feel better, I'm sure you'll find a great woman.

 

PS: Now you have to change your username to rob2000 and attempt to make 999 more posts.

[Rob1000]

Hehe.. I'm not back... just checking in!!!

 

Sit back, relax and enjoy it, simply because there's absolutely nothing you can do about it. It's gonna happen, and when it does, give me a call so I can say 'I told you so'!

[change_in_tide]

DEAR GOD!!!!! Hey guys, remember me??? the lonely 35 year old that started this post? Honestly, I hopped back on here a couple times to see what was going on but being in the horrible state of depression I'm currently in I could not focus on it and it was giving me a headache! I'm sorry that this has provoked such an unpleasant exchange but i'm here looking for POSITIVE ENERGY PLEASE! this thread has done nothing but make me feel about 1000 times worse!!! LOL It's almost comical! It's like a twelve page competition of who is better/smarter. C'mon people.

[Rob1000]

i'm here looking for POSITIVE ENERGY PLEASE! .

My post above was trying to do just that.

[change_in_tide]

My post above was trying to do just that.

 

Yeah Rob I didn't mean you... I appreciate your efforts. lol. I'm talking about the prior 8 pages or so.

[Rob1000]

Yeah Rob I didn't mean you... I appreciate your efforts. lol. I'm talking about the prior 8 pages or so.

Change, you just need to believe. Believe.

[lifeisgood93]

I am with you. Same situation..I think I am a great catch too...independent, full life and just looking for a partner to share it with, but not finding a lot of good options out there and wasting a lot of time. I just try to remind myself that my life is good no matter if I have a partner in it or not and whether I ever have a family and kids. It's a hard pill to swallow, especially when you see others in your social circle who have want you want. It gets lonely, but try to stay positive and focus on the things you do have. I know it is easier said than done because I am constantly trying to remind myself as well. Good luck to you.

[Rob1000]

I love what an earlier poster said... "you have to be the right person to meet the right person." It's just like what Chopra said; "The person you are with at this moment is the "right" person, because he or she is a mirror of who you are inside."

[MissDaisy]

Moreover, the frustration you describe reminds me of how I felt when I was the same age as a woman in her peak fertile years. Most desirable women just weren't interested in taking me seriously, that is, until I was more established and experienced. I was a pretty boy type, which sometimes helped, but more often it didn't. Plus I had a lot of issues of my own to work on, which were quite unattractive. Such women were probably right to reject me back then.

 

So the sense I have here is that modern women exploit their 20s in hedonistic ways, and it's their 30s where they have a last chance at being conventional.

 

Again I fear a kind of cynicism when you talk about women exploiting their 20s in hedonistic ways. When I was in my early 20s I was sincerely dedicated to sorting myself out; figuring out who I was. I had quite a few issues and I was always working on them. I was not at my best, and would never have been a whole partner to a man, let alone a mother to a child... (not ready!)

 

During my 30s I finally realized which avenues I might take to fulfill parts of my potential, and this is when I spent an enormous amount of time and energy focusing on my career [i finished my PhD at the age of 37]. My PhD was a tough road, but at the same time I was also putting energy towards building relationships with men, but nothing ever really worked out.

 

Now I am 42 and I feel like a "late bloomer". I am better looking (I think) than when I was in my 20s and early 30s. I am also stronger because I know myself better and I know what I have to offer. I guess what I am saying overall is that not all women waste their peak fertile years by simply being 'hedonistic'.... some of us have been trying in earnest to be the best person that we can be.

[strangeman]

You are right, and so let me try to answer your point more directly. In our modern society, a growing number of people - lots of women, lots of men - who are in their 20s are not ready to settle down in the conventional way. You and I are both leading examples of this, and we are products of the 60s/70s era. We are the canaries in the coal mine, and we are making noise because we detect a problem.

 

Like I've said earlier, as a man I welcome the freedom modern women have to make choices. This is because if you didn't have them, as a woman you'd generally have few to no options available if you ever found yourself being exploited by bad men. Bad men suck, and they must be defeated. I cannot agree more with this. I hate bad men. Bad men have caused me to suffer. Greatly.

 

However, this (women now having the freedom to escape bad men) does not counter the trend I see where more and more people are too immature and generally screwed up in their 20s; if anything it perpetuates this. Instead of good women suffering under the old order, under the new order, it's the good men who are suffering. How is this really better? I can see how it's better for certain individuals here at this forum, but that's really just another form of Darwinian competition and survival of the fittest. Which makes us less like allies and more like enemies.

 

If our society glorifies selfish, wandering 20s as the new normal, we're going to introduce all manner of problems in our children and in ourselves. Meanwhile the developing nations such as China have ever-more technology and modernity on their side, plus the ability to dictate that social norms be preserved. Meanwhile the West will slide further into Rome-like decay, while our people enjoy all the choices available. I'm not arguing for totalitarianism, but I am arguing that letting women's whims run wild is not a good thing, and, taken to its logical extreme, it is a threat to the foundations of Western civilization. This is because women who stray from the path, and are bitter/angry/entitled about it, i.e. hating traditional men, don't understand that freedom is not free.

 

For women to find it desirable/appropriate/more attractive to pursue their first child in their 40s is rather like making a bunch of mistakes, finding a solution at the last moment, and then claiming this is better than having never made mistakes at all. Modern women have the unique duty to be mature and responsible about how they use this power they have to make choices; after all, the decisions they make have direct biological impact. Not only regarding birth defects and other complications (for baby or/and mother), but also on their actual value to the most desirable men in LTR/marriage.

 

So, please allow me to rephrase that point about hedonism in women: I think a lot of women - and men - exploit their 20s in selfish ways. And they have that right because they have freedom; with that freedom comes power, and with that power comes responsibility. That responsibility is what I referred to earlier as the "cost" that is unavoidable. Please, go ahead, make your choices, but it's a zero-sum game and whatever you take from Peter cannot be used to pay Paulina. The ability to make choices can be wonderful, but it can also be terrible because once a person has the freedom to make choices, that person automatically has to accept the consequences. Those consequences may be good, bad, or neither.

 

Regarding your particular situation, the crux seems to be that in your 30s you made a crucial decision: to focus on career instead of family. You put the energy that could have gone into children and a happy husband into the Ph.D. program. Now in your 40s, you've accomplished so much. You have resolved the confusion of your 20s, then invested your 30s into academia and career. Now you are in your 40s and with so many amazing things accomplished, now you are ready to consider the more conventional areas of the female experience. Which is great, and I hope you find success.

 

Meanwhile, men have their own needs and it's not reasonable to argue that they, as a gender, should find a way to change their biology to indulge women who, for whatever reasons, choose to "stray from the path" in their 20s and early 30s. Some women will choose to do this, and some will not. The most desirable men, I believe, will not invest in those women who choose to take that different road, and since they cannot bear children themselves they will never fully accept that women can somehow have it all by keeping their options open to have 100% fully realized careers and be 100% fully realized mothers/wives. In my view, feminized males are not the most desirable type thereof, except in societies that value drone labor (i.e. a matriarchy or a colony of bees).

 

I'm not surprised that you feel you are more physically attractive now than you were in your 20s and early 30s. However to me this seems psychological and based on your strong sense of self-esteem. I'd guess you have many strong, successful women in your circle of friends; a support group that is similar to you and may often tell you how gorgeous and young you are. As I've said in previous posts, I am happy to hear it when an outlier finds success and is somehow able to have it all. Still, I believe strongly that our society can't be made up, primarily, of people living the lifestyle of outliers. People need the freedom to be outliers, but, it seems unhealthy for outliers to see themselves as the "new normal."

 

Now, as it happens, my mother has a Ph.D. but she did it during her 20s, and had me during that same decade. Her hunger to have it all played a role in the ending of her marriage to my father, and that caused me decades of confusion. It is this confusion which led me to the philosophy I have described and argued for in this thread. I am interested in clear, unambigious, positive femininity in my wife, and I will be a clear, unambiguous, positive masculine. That doesn't mean she can't work, or I won't cook/clean/change diapers/etc. But it does mean that, in the context of marriage and lifelong commitment in the way women desire, her value to me is in her number of eggs remaining, the related likelihood of defective children, her physical capacity as a mother.

 

So, to summarize, I don't think it's cynical to urge young women to avoid emulating career women in their 40s trying to have their first child. We all have to make our choices, and accept the consequences. We cannot have it all, and where we compromise, perhaps we can have some of the best accross all the areas in our lives where we attempt to do the impossible.

[strangeman]

DEAR GOD!!!!! Hey guys, remember me??? the lonely 35 year old that started this post? Honestly, I hopped back on here a couple times to see what was going on but being in the horrible state of depression I'm currently in I could not focus on it and it was giving me a headache! I'm sorry that this has provoked such an unpleasant exchange but i'm here looking for POSITIVE ENERGY PLEASE! this thread has done nothing but make me feel about 1000 times worse!!! LOL It's almost comical! It's like a twelve page competition of who is better/smarter. C'mon people.

 

At this point, a good deal of thought has been invested in this thread. Perhaps you could comment on some of those ideas when you have time and feel up to it. No easy task I reckon, but I'm still here and still willing to discuss with you.

 

You are quite pretty and you have the blonde, good girl, all-American look I prefer. You also seem to have some pretty deep psychological problems that make you unready to live with a man and become a positive part of his life. Since we're strangers here: are you in therapy? Do you take prescription anti-depressants?

 

Maybe if you take a year to just mediate and connect with your hobbies, you can get to a point where you live alone and are self-sufficient without feeling such crushing sadness? In my view, if you were able to work toward something like this you'd become more interesting/valuable to good men.

 

If a woman is heavily dependent on a man, then she should be submissive and communicate that to men she finds attractive. If she sees herself as strong and independent, however, then she really needs to embody that by being emotionally, physically, and financially self-sufficient. Some men get confused/threatened by this, because it forces them to refine their sense of self and masculinity; others are glad to have a partner who isn't a constant drain.

 

Looking back on your relationship, what would you say are the changes you need to make, and, what kind of man do you really want? Based on what you wrote it sounds like you prefer the alpha-male types who are dominant, fun, and exciting. In all honesty, if you still want that, I think the man for you is going to be in his 40s and up, and this has as much to do with how he's wired as it does with you. Which is not a bad thing! But it is risky because these men are wired to avoid commitment; meanwhile feminism has rewarded them with an endless variety of women.

 

Otherwise, do stable, predictable men invested in their daily routines tend to bore you? Do you usually look to your men for constant stimulation and entertainment? If so, then I think these are areas that you need to work on (hobbies, introspection, alone time), such that men closer to your age can become more attractive to you.

[change_in_tide]

At this point, a good deal of thought has been invested in this thread. Perhaps you could comment on some of those ideas when you have time and feel up to it. No easy task I reckon, but I'm still here and still willing to discuss with you.

 

You are quite pretty and you have the blonde, good girl, all-American look I prefer. You also seem to have some pretty deep psychological problems that make you unready to live with a man and become a positive part of his life. Since we're strangers here: are you in therapy? Do you take prescription anti-depressants?

 

Did you read my thread? If so how are you making it about Me and not him. You say I appear to have deep psychological problems that make me unable to be a postive part of HIS LIFE?? I WAS THE POSITIVE ONE. HE was the NEGATIVE ANGRY ABUSER. I did everything for this man to help and support him in fulfilling his dreams and he took took took and was never satisfied. Of course I had a life outside of him because he was actually never around much as his life was stress packed w/work & night school. It reached a point where I felt I was doing all and not getting any love in return. In fact instead of appreciation for all I did I was nit picked criticized harrassed neglected and condescended to. NOT ACCEPTABLE BEHAVIOR... I was very self sufficient and independent in most respects but I will admit I did become what he viewed as an emotional drain because he IGNORED ME and he refused to offer me a kind word or a hug when he saw I was sad. He had zero tolerance to even listen to me about my day EVER because at his job he listened to people talk and problems all day!! I only talked to him maybe 15 -30 min PER NIGHT as we lived apart during the week the first year and he couldn't even handle that. I am not some huge whiner negatron either. So pretty much anything I said ANNOYED HIM. I specifically made it my purpose to never mention anything negative to him for like a month straight and he didn't even notice. And during that time he was b*tching up a storm. He was never happy about anything said ever!! He just had a problem with everything I said, how I changed topics or repeated things or whatever. It honestly seemed like he would just prefer I never speak AT ALL. On our first date he told me there was another girl he had dated before me and he didn't like the way she interrupted him or predicted his thoughts. Pretty soon he was saying I did that too. Honestly he calls every woman in his life "out of their minds" I think he has zero respect or tolerance for women or anyone's problems other than his own. He either has counselor burn out or he's just a self absorbed !

What really gets me is how much I listened to him and how much I supported him and loved him and gave to him and he was just totally selfish and closed in return. I'm sure he hates me now because I never let him control me although he tried to turn me into his carbon copy! I never allowed him to think it was ok to speak to me the way he did and I refused to lay down and let him walk all over me and I think THAT is WHY we had problems.

[uncomfynumb]

But it does mean that, in the context of marriage and lifelong commitment in the way women desire, her value to me is in her number of eggs remaining, the related likelihood of defective children, her physical capacity as a mother.

 

So you are interested in a breeder not an equal partner?

 

To the OP, you can always adopt children and go the route of artifical insemination if really, truly want children. If finding a partner is more important to you, that shouldn't be a problem either. I've not had any problems and I am in my 40's and a single mother.

 

As for your nasty ex, you are better off without him and better off to find someone suitable now being that you've learned something from your experience, and more about what kind of man you do not want to be with. Your ex was a stepping stone to a better relationship so no need to lose faith.

[strangeman]

So you are interested in a breeder not an equal partner? I've not had any problems and I am in my 40's and a single mother. .

 

You may not have any problems but your kid probably will, especially during puberty, then his/her 20s, which are at risk for being spent wandering/wasting. I haven't read your other posts here so I don't know what your political bent is, but what's the real difference between what you wrote here (that Strangeman is just looking for a breeding partner) and looking at your kid's father as just a sperm donor? It seems you don't need a man, but your kid does, even if you think the opposite is true. Unless of course you grew up without a father and thought it to be no problem.

 

I do want an equal partner but "equality" is fungible. That means there will be some things where she predominates and others that are clearly my domain. I trust that it will even out over time and I'm not interested in keeping score. I think a lot of feminists are so hyper-sensitive to equality that keeping score is of critical importance; that tends to add stress and a lot of negative energy to the relationship. I may even end up being a Mr. Mom.

 

Basically, by referring to her value to me, I was talking about what I need in order to make a marriage commitment. I don't need to get married for companionship, sex, or good times; I can get that easily just by making myself available and putting in the effort. I didn't mean that's all she's good for, or all she means to me. Just that in order to commit to a marriage, she must be a safe, competent, capable mother who is young enough to be good at it without the emotional baggage of getting started in her 40s. And that boils down to her number of eggs remaining.

[Batya33]

You're forgetting that women are now freezing their eggs so before you dismiss the 40-something woman, better check that out. I am in much better shape physically and emotionally (and financially) than I was in my 20s -I am 44, mother of a toddler. Emotional baggage? Nope - just took the long way around in finding myself and a good partner and healthy relationship. Sure it was scary to be pregnant for the first time at 41. Today, like most days, I walked and ran several miles including 2.5 of them in about 35 minutes. I'm tired but hanging in there just fine - I don't think I'd be less tired if I was 25 and maybe moreso because I have better eating habits now. I still have another two hours of work to do and it's 7pm -been at this since 745am. Not complaining at all just find your dismissal of us 40somethings bizarre and amusing, as well as sad.

[strangeman]

Batya, I'm not dismissing. I'm also not agreeing (yet). As I've said many times, I support you having the freedom to find success, and I'm glad when an outlier does that successfully. Freeze your eggs all day long, with my blessing.

 

But do you expect men to glorify your situation as something young women should aspire toward? If so, why?

 

Also, do you have a husband? If not, it's probably not accurate to say there's no emotional baggage happening. If you don't have it, the kid will, especially if the mother thinks having a man around is utterly redundant.