I love him BUT...

[CallingAllAngels]

OH Maya...

 

I know that! I have read the thread! I just get shivers when I do read it!!!

 

I know and said in many of my posts that she has gotten WONDERFUL advice from this forum, and I certainly meant NO DISREPECT AT ALL, and if or anyone took it that way, please know that was NOT my intention!

 

I just DO NOT want to see this girl meet this guy...my skin crawls when I read the stuff he tells he.

 

He is NOT on the up and up.

 

I agree with you, and also with what Bayta said...if she is hell bent on meeting him I think:

 

1 - She should do a background check (hopefully there will be "no such name" so she doesn't go to begin with)

 

2- She should tell her parents and/or another trusted adult

 

3- She should BRING SOMEONE WITH HER and meet him in a VERY public place.

 

Again...I don't wanna read about her on the news.

 

Thanks for your post.

 

~Allie

[Maya_A]

^^^

No offense taken at all on my part personally.... That was just FYI for you, as it really, truly sounded as though you hadn't read the thread when you said "I hope others besides Batya & myself encourage her not to meet him" Was going by how that statement came accross & so just wanted to put your mind at ease & update you.

 

I see how you meant it now (to continue to encourage her, over & above alternates, I think) I can see that we are all on the same page

here Thanks for your reply...

[diamond78]

well, I'm not going to say the guy is a predator because noone knows that but him..

 

 

HOWEVER, at the very least.....if this guy truly cared about you and your well-being, he would provide you with the things you need in order to feel safe and secure. He is at least 30 years old and you're 20....if he was any kind of real gentleman he would not put off providing you with a picture, especially if you two have plans to meet and vacation together.

 

No matter if it's just plain insecurities on his part, you have the right to know who you are talking to if you guys are serious about being together. The fact that it's been a year and he has not ponied up is worrisome.....along with the fact that he let you think his name was something else for 3 months. I mean, who does that kind of thing???

 

You just need to be on your p's and q's for your sake. You don't need to make excuses for him because there is none. If he can't do something simple such as send you pics of himself, then do you really expect him to be able to pull off vacationing with you?? It just doesn't make sense.

 

He doesn't even have to buy a webcam...he could simply take several pictures of himself and send it to you. You are a young woman and he should be doing everything needed to make you feel safe and comfortable before meeting up.

 

I think you've been a real trooper taking in everyone's advice here, and it's good to see you at least consider some of the things people are posting in this thread. We'll be here to help you in any way we can!!!

[Batya33]

Obviously we can't be sure he is a predator but when you look at all the red flags it is clear enough that he is that on balance she should not meet him. It makes no sense to say "only he knows" - so ..... what's your point, that since only he knows a woman should never decline to meet a man with red flags suggesting (even if not proving) "predator?"

 

Pictures can be faked - especially in this situation where so much else is shady. The typical safety precautions of meeting a stranger aren't good enough when it's this shady, that's the point.

 

Edited to add - and of course there are predators who don't know they are predators - they believe their behavior is perfectly normal and justified.

[desert_rose26]

 

The typical safety precautions of meeting a stranger aren't good enough when it's this shady, that's the point.

 

Just wanted to emphasize the above statement because this is what everyone wants you to UNDERSTAND and get. What is shady you ask? just read back on the red flags that are mentioned. Don't analyze it. It is what it is. Plain and simple. You deserve better.

[diamond78]

Obviously we can't be sure he is a predator but when you look at all the red flags it is clear enough that he is that on balance she should not meet him. It makes no sense to say "only he knows" - so ..... what's your point, that since only he knows a woman should never decline to meet a man with red flags suggesting (even if not proving) "predator?"

 

Pictures can be faked - especially in this situation where so much else is shady. The typical safety precautions of meeting a stranger aren't good enough when it's this shady, that's the point.

 

Edited to add - and of course there are predators who don't know they are predators - they believe their behavior is perfectly normal and justified.

 

 

Clearly you missed the whole purpose of my post and I'm pretty sure I didn't say anything close to "that since only he knows a woman should never decline to meet a man with red flags suggesting (even if not proving) "predator?"

 

I was simply saying that while I can't say for sure if the guy is a predator or not (because I cleary don't know him personally)....there are several things the original poster needs to look at seriously before even considering to meet up with him.

 

That's my point.

[TheSmilingTurnip]

This relationship will never become real, mark my words. That is why he doesn't send her a picture...in the long run, it will not matter whether she knows what he looks like. If he intended to make it real, he would send a picture. Even as a predator, he would send pictures, fake ones though.

 

I have been in this situation and I can tell you that you won't give this up until you're good and ready yourself. Caution will be thrown to the wind until there is no way to reason around the inconsistencies. People can tell you everything you *ought* to do but this is right out of an Alanis Morrissette song.

 

When you get tired of sitting at the computer, sitting on the phone, sitting sitting and sitting some more, and you want a real partner for companionship, then you will seek someone real or make changes. It's that simple. Good luck! You will be ok.

 

Just remember, you have to be able to let go of the old in order to have hands available to grab onto the new.

[lila...]

Wow I’m really upset. You guys don’t really know for sure he is a bad guy and that he is hiding something, so why tell me I should not meet him? I’m in love with this guy, nothing he’s done in the year we’ve known each other shows he is a bad guy, he’s a very sensible, smart, caring, kind-hearted man. He’s very sweet and funny. He’s always attentive to me, he worries about my well-being, and he’s given me great advice whenever I need it. I really trust this guy and he really is a good person. There is absolutely no malice in him.

 

There’s still a while before we actually meet in person, plenty of time for showing pictures and getting a webcam. I will ENSURE that I see him at least by webcam before that happens. I’m going to tell a trustworthy friend of mine about him. I WILL meet him in a very public place. I think that going as far as doing the background checks is way too much, there is no need. Oh and to the last poster, yes he will show up, he's always been the one determined on meeting me and going on vacation, I KNOW he will show up. We've been talking for a year, we love each other and we've made so many plans.

 

He cares too much about me, I know he loves me, he would never do anything to hurt me.

 

The red flags you’ve mentioned can all be explained. For example, his common name, yes he has a very common first and last name, but how do you know for sure it’s not really his name? Traveling a lot: It’s his job, he works by contract and doesn’t stay too long in once place, but he’s always told me what company he works for and what city he’ll live in, in fact before he chooses one job offer over the other he always discusses it with me and explains with detail the benefits of each one, he always includes me in his plans. The relationship being kept secret from everyone: This was MY idea. He NEVER told me not tell anyone.

 

He has never gotten mad or impatient with me over anything, for example sometimes I will be very immature and indecisive with things that affect him but he never makes me feel bad.

 

I don’t want you guys to think I’m getting all defensive and that I’m being stubborn and no matter what you say will not make me change my mind. Not at all. I really appreciate the fact that you guys care and give me advice for my own safety, and I will take into consideration some of it, but I think some of you are exaggerating when you go as far as saying he is a predator and I should not under any circumstances meet with him.

[Aurian]

If he loves you, why does he not bother to buy a webcam and show himself to you?

[metrogirl]

If he loves you, why does he not bother to buy a webcam and show himself to you?

 

Because he is shy.

[midnightrambler]

If he loves you, why does he not bother to buy a webcam and show himself to you?

 

those things cost much?

[lila...]

If he loves you, why does he not bother to buy a webcam and show himself to you?

 

I don't know . He says he will though, it should happen soon.

[metrogirl]

I don't know . He says he will though, it should happen soon.

 

soon like in another year?

 

Hon, you don't see it do you. The rest of us see it... We see it....

[Mythical_Suicide]

those things cost much?

 

you can get a decent webcam for around $15 at most places.

 

This guy is just trying to find every excuse to cover his lies.

[Mythical_Suicide]

I don't know . He says he will though, it should happen soon.

 

Should happen soon? It should have happened months even a year ago..

If he really cared about you and wanted to be with you he would do anything in his power to get to you or atleast a picture or webcam to you so you could see who he really is.

[midnightrambler]

you can get a decent webcam for $15 at most places.

 

This guy is just trying to find every excuse to cover his lies.

 

i know men who do that

[TheSmilingTurnip]

Bebe, I think that one thing you should think about is this -- you feel the way you do and what would you do if your webcam broke? You'd probably go buy one as soon as possible. What if you were unable to take pictures of yourself? You might send ones from a photo album. Suppose you were unable to scan them yourself. You might go to a drug store and get them scanned there. These tasks are easy to accomplish and I'm sure you don't have loads of spare time any more than he does.

 

So basically, your words and actions match in this regard. Your actions match the intensity of your feelings for him. Do his actions match the intensity of his feelings for you?

 

What do his actions say to you? Do they say 'madly in love' or do they say something else?

 

Just something to think about. I think he's probably harmless but that doesn't mean he's not shady.

[CallingAllAngels]

BEBE:

 

Preditors don't come looking as Monsters. If they did, young woman would not be lured away. Have you ever heard of Ted Bundy? He was gorgeous. He was a serial killer. Not trying to go to extremes here, just trying to get you to see what you cannot see...

[Aleadragonhawk]

I'm not going to say that he's a predator. There are some things about his behavior that are suspicious though, and I think it's very likely that he's at the very least glossed some things over about his identity, which is something that predators commonly do. Right now just focus on getting the webcam, and after that happens (or doesn't) you can go from there. You've said that you aren't going to meet him before you get that confirmation, which is great.

[Batya33]

You're not in love with him - In this situation you're in love with the image he has chosen to show you through typing and talking. Huge difference.

[HappyAsALark]

I think he is lying about what he looks like and probably weighs 448 pounds and wants to live in the dream world of the internet.

[Maya_A]

Wow I’m really upset.The red flags you’ve mentioned can all be explained. For example, his common name, yes he has a very common first and last name, but how do you know for sure it’s not really his name? Traveling a lot: It’s his job, he works by contract and doesn’t stay too long in once place, but he’s always told me what company he works for and what city he’ll live in, in fact before he chooses one job offer over the other he always discusses it with me and explains with detail the benefits of each one, he always includes me in his plans.

^^^

I don’t want you to feel upset at all… It is just that there seem so many things that look like red flags… If it was only one thing like the photo situation (which would still be at least somewhat of an issue) & you called him at work okay, sent him things at a fixed address that he received, had not such a common name, etc… It is everything together, hon.

 

Why I wonder, do there have to be so many things for one person, that are so vague? It isn't common to my dating experiences or other women friends.

The relationship being kept secret from everyone: This was MY idea. He NEVER told me not tell anyone

^^^

He wouldn't have to if you told him that first. You had the best idea in letting him know you might tell your mother & checking what his reaction might be. I still think you should do this...

I don’t want you guys to think I’m getting all defensive and that I’m being stubborn and no matter what you say will not make me change my mind. Not at all. I really appreciate the fact that you guys care and give me advice for my own safety, and I will take into consideration some of it, but I think some of you are exaggerating when you go as far as saying he is a predator and I should not under any circumstances meet with him.

^^^

I think you are a very smart person & you haven’t seemed defensive in this at all. In disagreement over some things but you haven’t acted defensive. Why not just try some things like telling him you are thinking of telling your mom.. Seeing how he reacts will let you know more about him as a person. It doesn’t have to be an entrapment thing or a negative thing – just a way for you to know the man you care a lot for better.

 

And then just make sure he works where he says he is now… Just a couple of things where there is no harm in trying them out… Maybe you will come back & share with us that he was happy you were telling your mom, or the secretary at his work knew him & you spoke with him there, etc… Last thing is to try to mail him something at a time where he will be at a fixed place for say a week or more…

 

You’ve got absolutely nothing to lose in trying out some of those things… He shouldn’t get mad about any of them either… If so, this is really not okay & will give you yet more information about him. Showing love to you would be putting your mind & heart at ease & nothing less….

 

I think it's great to get to know someone more. Again, you might come back with all positive news... Just knowing is what is important...

[ShelB64]

Hi, Bebe,

 

First, I want to say it takes a lot of courage to open yourself up to the mixture of advice on eNA. I'm fairly new here, and believe me, I am not young and 20, but even at my age all the "Red Flags" and "end it now" suggestions have been tough to take sometimes. However, I believe that every bit of advice given is from the heart and is in the best of intentions and spirit, and that there is usually something to be taken out of most every comment, whether you agree with it or not.

 

Next, I want to say a couple of things about your situation. I, too, have a bf who is not comfortable with having his picture taken. In fact, we have had fights over this in the past. Unlike your situation, I actually met him in person when we first met briefly, then talked with him for a few weeks on the phone and online and fell in love, and then he came to live with me a month later for two months. Everyone, of course, thought I had lost my mind, letting a complete stranger come to live with me.

 

However, even though I had seen what he looked like, I still didn't really know who he was. I needed to be safe (and I HAD heard of Ted Bundy).

 

I insisted that before he came to be with me that he send me a copy of his passport (since his is foreign), which I required him to do before he got on that plane. He had some questions as to why and was skeptical, but I told him it was because I needed to be safe. He said I knew him and everything, but I was forceful, but loving. Ultimately he agreed because he wanted to see me and honestly cared about me.

 

I was able to use his passport information to run only a limited background check (it is NOT very easy with non-US citizens and it can be expensive), but I got enough information to be satisfied he was not a criminal or a predator.

 

We have been together almost six months, most of the time long distance, and he still has issues with having his picture taken, but I would suggest that you REQUIRE him to send - fax or scan to you - some OFFICIAL GOVERNMENT DOCUMENT that bears his picture before you meet him. This way, you can both confirm the identity he has given you and see what he looks like. It may not even be recent, but you'll have more of an idea.

 

If you ultimately think this would offend him, you two have issues of trust, and I would think this is not going to be something that will work out. You need to tell him this is for your safety.

 

I understand completely that you love him; I know, I am in love, too. But you have to be able to trust in that love enough for him to respect you enough to honor your requests for safety and take the steps to build the trust between the two of you.

[Batya33]

Apples and oranges as far as sending a picture -- since you met him in person already it wasn't related to whether he was who he claimed to be. I am certain your bf would have gotten over the discomfort if a picture was required for you to verify what he looked like - just like he was willing to have his picture taken for his passport.

[RayKay]

My class was cancelled this morning, so I have been watching Dr. Phil (lol) and I had to write about it here because I thought of you the entire time I watched it. There was a woman on the show whom has been led on for THREE YEARS about a guy she met online and never met (until the show).

 

He has told her he is in the air force, flying in Iraq, that he is never home as a result and has no "address", that he owns property in NY, also works for Delta airlines, gave her his name, given her pictures and always asked her to webcam herself to him, but always refused to webcam with her saying he did not have one (though she sent him a webcam), he asked her to marry him, professed his love to her.

 

Turns out he is older than he said he was, is married (or at least living with some other woman he calls "unbalanced"), not in Iraq (but for brief stints a couple times while he told her he was there the entire three years), living in Florida the entire time, and used pictures he found online of himself, along with pictures of his vehicles, etc. He finally met her after the show came to find him. He was indeed older (about ten years older or something), and while he had been a pilot with Delta and formerly in Air Force he was no longer in it (though was in National Guard still). He also turned out to be rather obsessive and even though he was not whom he said he was wanted to run off and get married. He is definitely a bit emotionally unbalanced...he justified even his lies "well, I WAS in Iraq, just not the entire time"....

 

Anyway, the moral of the story...is people whom are GOOD at this will tell just enough truths in their lies to keep it believable yet can still be very deceiving about whom they really are. If everything was an obvious lie after all, no one would believe any of it. Someone can deceive people about whom they are yet still put in enough truth to be able to stick with it and even believe it themselves.

 

The funny thing is she is STILL justifying his behaviour "he never meant to lead me on", he "was not scamming me, he just took it too far"......which shows she REALLY wanted to believe in him and that clouded her judgment too.