Commitment issues? (A general discussion)

[faraday]

I think DF nailed it here. My thoughts when I read the OP is that the first guy isn't that into the girl he's seeing....if he was, he would naturally want to spend more time with her- he would make her a priority..because who wouldn't want to spend as much time as possible with someone that makes them feel good and makes them happy?

 

I know a lot of guys in long term, live in relationships with women that are dying to get married and they don't. The women wait for rings...and the guy won't propose...even after 10 years. And yeah...I think the guys feel like something is missing...or that something isn't quite right...

 

When couples agree "we don't want marriage" that's a completely different thing than when one person wants to get married and the other doesn't. People need to take responsibility for themselves, and if those women can't get what they'd like from their partners, it might be time to move on.

 

Like DF, I've found most of the men that I've met to be very marriage minded...they want to meet someone great and settle down. I've met a few guys that are against it...and at the same time, I probably have an equal number of gfs that boycott the marriage idea. To each his/her own. But find someone who has similar ideologies.

 

My old neighbour and her bf intentionally got pregnant (they tried for more than a year)...they've been together 8 years. She wants to get married to him *so bad* but he just says "I have no interest at all in marriage." I think she's hoping he'll change his mind with the birth of their child...and maybe he will...but I doubt it. I doubt they'll make it...eventually she'll resent him for loving her enough to want her to be his child's mother, but not enough to promise his life to her.

 

And that's why...you can't date someone hoping they'll change. You have to have boundaries...and stick to them.

[Hermes]

Yes, Faraday.

 

"And that's why...you can't date someone hoping they'll change. You have to have boundaries...and stick to them.

 

The unfortunate fact is that an awful lot of people are quite convinced they can "change" the other. If someone tells you from the outset that they are not into marriage or a committed relationship, then listen!

[lilypadgirl]

Yes, or that they believe that the other person will eventually change on his/her own. Unfortunately, I think people get themselves in that situation not because they aren't listening to the clear signals, but that most of the time the signals they get are very vague.

 

For example, how do you handle a guy who is currently focused on career, but suggests that eventually he is open to more commitment...except that never comes? Or sometimes two people start off on the same page, but eventually move to different books entirely but the emotions are too invested? Sometimes the guys (or girls) themselves truly don't know what they want or don't want until later in the relationship.

 

I think it becomes easier to read between the lines after more experience, heartbreaks, and maturity. But sadly it takes experience to gain those things most times. Which is why it is frustrating/sad to see people on here go through some things most of us have been through, but knowing they will still make the same mistakes despite all the advice from people that have come through it.

 

The sad fact is most situations on here are not that unique from an outsider's perspective, but when it's personal everything seems unique. You end up thinking no that doesn't apply to me - I'm going to beat the odds.

[saluk]

The first one is actually really simple. Not easy. Bit simple. Don't accept vague answers! A "no, but" is a no.

 

The second one, where people change as the relationship goes on, is always going to be a problem, and you can't really prepare for it. For all the talk about "people don't change", the fact is that they definitely definitely do. It's just usually not in the way that you want them to, nor something you can control. Even with experience, this can hit anyone. No one is safe!

[Batya33]

Of course people change and you commit to working through those changes and perhaps changing yourself - growing more flexible, etc. I would be careful about future promises -putting too much weight on them I mean. Sure, young people (like my parents did) might say "I don't want to marry till I am done with college" but that is different than "someday when I am less focused on my career I think I will want to be more committed".

 

Within the first year of my marriage we became parents, relocated, I was unemployed/not in school for the first time ever - all in my 40s. Talk about changes! We had to deal with changed relationships with our parents -getting older plus wanting to spend time with their grandchild, etc. We are lucky that we have similar core values and goals but you have to expect that people will change. Of course if he changed as in abuse/adultery/drinking problem that would be a different situation but yes, you have to be ready for some rollercoaster stuff (and that does not have to mean drama).

[Fudgie]

I never understood the whole "I'm busy now so I will look for more commitment in the future". I would be wary of such a guy if I were looking for marriage. You can still be committed minded and be busy. You can choose to put off marriage until you're done with school or whatever but still be in a relationship that is building up toward that. People do it all the time. I would be very wary.

[faraday]

People totally change. All the time. But it's naive to go into a relationship expecting that someone will change to suit your wants.

 

You should a,ways think, "if nothing changes, can I love this person as-is"....and if you think, "everything is perfect except if..." And it's a big one...I'm not taking socks on the floor, I'm talking...wants children/wants marriage/started going to the gym everyday instead of watching reality TV and eating nachos/became more extroverted/introverted, didn't go out drinking every night, stopped spending all their money on late night tv infomercials-they already have 42 magic bullets...or in the case of one man I met: didn't have a hoarders collections of waving golden cats, several arcade mortal combat machines filling his living room, and broken electronics used as door stops. Great guy...but I couldn't live like that. (Side note, I ended things after I saw his house....and a few weeks later he contacted me to ask why. I gave him my blunt answer...and 6 months later, he contacted me to let me know what I said resonated with him...and he cleared out his house of all the clutter...and now he has a gf )

 

The point is...if it is that's big enough that if it didn't change, you wouldn't want to spend the rest of your life with them- you should just walk away.

 

And I don't think there's any vagueness in dating. If he doesn't propose....he doesn't want to marry you. It's as simple as that. So you set a timeline, and if it doesn't happen in that timeline and you've made your stance on marriage clear before...you pack up and move on.

 

I met my bf a year and a half ago. Two months ago, we bought our dream home together. He knows that I want to marry him. In our 5 year budget plan, we have a wedding budget. He hasn't proposed yet...but I believe he will. If he doesn't, I'll be kicking myself- but it will be my fault for buying a place with him before the proposal. I have a set time in mind for my deadline. I'm going to give him 2.5 years. If he doesn't....it will totally suck, but we will have to sell our property so that we can separate and move on. I don't think that will happen. But...he knows I will do this. He knows I'm not someone that will wait around indefinitely...because I have made it clear in conversations that if he wastes my last few fertile years, I will resent him forever...I have told him that if at any time he realizes I'm not his forever person, I want him to end things immediately....no hard feelings. No vagueness.

 

I think people except vagueness because they don't want to scare the other person away...which is exactly what you want to do- if you want something...marriage...kids...and the person you're with is on the fence...you want to make it very clear to them what you want. Give them an out. Tell them, "you're awesome and I want a life with you...but if you can't be a "husband, father, whatever" you have to let me go so I can find someone that wants to do those things with me."

 

There are two people in every relationship....someone can only be vague if they're allowed to be vague...if it's accepted. Make your own standards....and adhere to them. Don't be afraid to walk away if it's not what you want. You'll love someone else just as much as you love that person- you'll probably love them even more because they'll want the same things as you.

 

 

 

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[lilypadgirl]

I completely agree with that! But I think that way of thinking and that self-confidence or self-love of sticking to your standards doesn't come until later. Especially for girls who have been conditioned in society to be the more patient and accommodating one. I think that's part of the reason why you more often see girls on this side of the commitment-discontinuity situation. But that's getting off-track - don't want to turn this into a gender conversation. At least for me, I found that I had a tendency to stay far longer in a relationship than was healthy until I became more experienced and mature and starting taking my own needs more seriously.

[Helpexpressme]

I think to a degree that kids come along sooner than marriage, so that makes men stay longer in relationships than they probably would have. Commitment is so over-rated these days.

[Hermes]

Absolutely, Faraday!

 

"and I don't think there's any vagueness in dating. If he doesn't propose....he doesn't want to marry you. It's as simple as that. So you set a timeline, and if it doesn't happen in that timeline and you've made your stance on marriage clear before...you pack up and move on.

"

 

and (I keep repeating this!)

 

"I think people except vagueness because they don't want to scare the other person away..."