MONEY and spending with an income disparity - advice please?

[Fudgie]

I never said that they should go 50/50 on these trips. That's ridiculous. OP couldn't afford it. What I said was that they should make an effort to find things to do together that they can both afford, ie no expensive trips, no expensive dinners, etc. And if he wants to go on a vacation and doesn't want to fund her to go with him, he doesn't have to. She can stay home.

 

I've never heard of a relationship rule that says: "if one wants to go on vacation, one must bring thy girlfriend and pay her way if she cannot." Ridiculous.

 

Old fashioned or not, if you're expected a boyfriend, NOT a husband or fiance, to fund your way and boost your lifestyle, sorry, that screams gold digger.

[Batya33]

I never said that they should go 50/50 on these trips. That's ridiculous. OP couldn't afford it. What I said was that they should make an effort to find things to do together that they can both afford, ie no expensive trips, no expensive dinners, etc. And if he wants to go on a vacation and doesn't want to fund her to go with him, he doesn't have to. She can stay home.

 

I've never heard of a relationship rule that says: "if one wants to go on vacation, one must bring thy girlfriend and pay her way if she cannot." Ridiculous.

 

Old fashioned or not, if you're expected a boyfriend, NOT a husband or fiance, to fund your way and boost your lifestyle, sorry, that screams gold digger.

 

He doesn't have to take her but there's a point where if he chooses vacations that he knows she cannot afford to split the costs on that sends a certain message and the financial part of the message is the least of the message.

[Fudgie]

He doesn't have to take her but there's a point where if he chooses vacations that he knows she cannot afford to split the costs on that sends a certain message and the financial part of the message is the least of the message.

 

He is free to take whatever vacations he wants, he just has to be prepared to fund most of her ticket/way though because they are too expensive but that's only IF he wants her to come along. If she can't afford it, she needs to say so and then he can make a choice on what he wants to do. If he ends up going alone, he is free to do so. He is not obligated to take her.

 

I dated older men with much more money when I was a student (pretty much all of my exes made more $$ than me), including my ex B who made 100k+ a year and I never expected him to boost up my lifestyle. Heck, I would treat him on his birthdays and such. We dated and did things within (my) means. If you really care about someone, it shouldn't matter what you do with them, as long as you are together.

 

As for "old fashioned", my grandparents were together for 70 years...never shared incomes until they married. My grandfather made a lot of money. Their dates? He would take her on a walk and then they would get ice cream cones. 10 cents.

 

OP, you're a girlfriend, not a wife, remember that.

[Hell_On_Heels]

I never said that they should go 50/50 on these trips. That's ridiculous. OP couldn't afford it. What I said was that they should make an effort to find things to do together that they can both afford, ie no expensive trips, no expensive dinners, etc. And if he wants to go on a vacation and doesn't want to fund her to go with him, he doesn't have to. She can stay home.

 

I've never heard of a relationship rule that says: "if one wants to go on vacation, one must bring thy girlfriend and pay her way if she cannot." Ridiculous.

 

Old fashioned or not, if you're expected a boyfriend, NOT a husband or fiance, to fund your way and boost your lifestyle, sorry, that screams gold digger.

 

Gently speaking here - it's not a rule. It's how the OP feels about it that matters. Based on what she's written, I don't think gold digger applies. I think it's a lot more about being left behind, constantly.

[Fudgie]

I agree, what she feels about this is what matters. If she is bothered, she needs to move on.

 

Generally speaking though, I think if she feels that way, she should stick to dating men that make a similar amount of money to her. That way there is no real difference in lifestyles and no one should feel pressured to fund the other on vacations and whatnot. Because boyfriends/girlfriends shouldn't be pressured to bankroll each other to that degree. If she is expecting or wanting that deep down, then she's going to have trouble if she dates men who have a lot more money and "bigger" lifestyles.

 

So she may do very well with someone who makes about as much as her or even a little more, but not by a ton, and not someone who has more extravagant views in lifestyle.

 

But yeah, shouldn't that apply to everyone though? Wouldn't you be happier with someone who is more modest if yourself are more modest?

[Hell_On_Heels]

That's a great question! I wish I had a great answer, lol. I am in the midst of a breakup with someone who has been freeloading off of me for a long time.

 

I don't resent footing the bills. I resent footing the bills while my exBF spent his money on luxury items instead of his bills. I would've been quite happy to pay while he regained his financial footing, but he chose not to. I would've been happy to pay while he went to school or did something to advance himself - anything! But he chose not to.

 

On the opposite end of the spectrum, I was a stay at home mom when my kids were young. I worked part-time when they went to school. This was a lifestyle my husband and I agreed on, and it worked for us. We were poor, we didn't take vacations to Disney, but I learned to use and re-use to save money, and I was there for our kids. That was what we wanted.

 

So from this, I think it's about shared values, regardless of income. Income is secondary - couples will find a way to work it out within a common framework of shared goals. I'm still working my way through this emotionally and mentally, so that's about all I've got right now

[Fudgie]

Hellonwheels,

 

That is utter crap, you footing the bills while your your ex spent $$ on luxury items. I don't know how people like that can live with themselves. I'm really sorry that he did that to you.

 

I think stay-at-home situations can absolutely work if agreed upon by both parties and in the context of marriage. Shared values are very important. I think a shared vision of lifestyle is important too. If someone wants luxury things while the other person is fine with the more modest and humble life, how is that going to work out? The luxury person will see the other one as "cheap" or "not fun" and may accuse them of not wanting to invest in their life together, while the more modest person sees the other as having bad money management, screwed up priorities, and not being responsible.

[journeynow]

You could look at his traveling as a hobby and remove the focus on money. His hobby could be racing cars, competitive skiing, sailing. You might have similar interests, but the two of you may have different natural abilities, learned skills, and active participation. Take skiing, for example, you both love it. He grew up in a skiing family, is a natural and very fast racer, and races often on hills far beyond your abilities. In addition, he skis frequently because he is part of the racing scene. You, might not have the same background or level of interest or commitment to it, yet enjoy it at the level you can handle. You sometimes ski together and enjoy it, but he wouldn't be happy if that is all he could do now that you are together, and you wouldn't be able to keep up with his level of skiing because you simply are not capable of it. Now you could improve by committing your time and resources on it, and if you were really motivated you could put your all into it to improve as much as possible as quickly as possible. You may not reach his level, but you could participate more in the same level of activity. However, you may not be able to commit much more time or resources on skiing because they are limited based on other choices you've made. It's important to honor your ability to choose. At this point, you can choose to maintain your abilities, join him in a different capacity that still meets your abilities and resources, ask him to change, or decide it's not working for you to try and do this together anymore. Make the choices yours.

[Ms Darcy]

He doesn't have to take her but there's a point where if he chooses vacations that he knows she cannot afford to split the costs on that sends a certain message and the financial part of the message is the least of the message.

 

I agree. And I think it's a bit of a red herring for the discussion to keep devolving to "well, he doesn't have to fund her" and that expectation screams gold digger.

 

I don't think the OP is a gold digger nor is she saying he has to fund her. Moreso, she's troubled by his lack of generosity in these experiences he'd like to share with her knowing the economic impact may prohibit her attendance.

 

Many years ago, my best friend spent a semester in Argentina. He wanted me to visit him for a few weeks but he knew I couldn't afford it. He paid for half of my plane ticket and I am still very grateful for that. Especially since things were super expensive once I got there. I didn't expect it. He offered. But I wouldn't have been able to participate otherwise.

 

And if you are a person who values reciprocal generosity, it makes you generous in other ways. Years later, he needed a loan (and I NEVER loan money to anyone) but I was willing to lose that money - I took it out of my "do not touch" savings account - out of gratefulness and reciprocity. (He paid it all back in only a few weeks.)

[michelle89]

Ah, but he did come around and offer to pitch in more, but you perpetuated the disagreement because of your feelings of guilt and shame over the money thing . . . explore your feelings more about being a good "feminist" and how you'd feel even if he did offer to buy you plane tickets all the time - would you be able to accept that or would you feel too guilty?

 

I agree with your therapist that this will level out one way or another over time, and it's also okay if it ends with you saying to yourself, "I am actually not okay with him paying my way because I want to pay my own way in a relationship."

 

 

You hit it right on the head. Thanks for this insight

[michelle89]

If you really care about someone, it shouldn't matter what you do with them, as long as you are together.

 

This is something I've been contemplating a lot lately. Despite the judgey tone of your posts I think you have some valid points.

[michelle89]

Income is secondary - couples will find a way to work it out within a common framework of shared goals.

 

After some major troubled feelings reading some of these responses and doing my own thinking, I actually had a conversation with my boyfriend about it. Of course this post and some of my feelings that spurred it are not just about finances but about feeling like I have been the giver overall in my relationship. It had really reached a head by the time I posted the original post and I am glad that it led me to having a conversation.

 

Amazingly, it turned out very well. He understands that I've felt that way because of our circumstances but promises that he wants things to shift and change and assures me that I am his priority. I know actions speak louder than words but for the first time I'm gaining some confidence that things are really going to start shifting. He was able to explain that right now, since he is trying to save for a house... a house that he stated he wants to eventually share with me, and pay off his loans as soon as possible, his disposable income really isn't as great as I thought it was, which makes me feel much better. It is still higher than mine, but not THREE TIMES more than mine, and it makes it easier to go 50/50 knowing we are on more equal footing than I imagined, and the impact to my finances isn't that much greater than his.

 

We also talked a lot about the trip to New Orleans that he wanted to take, and we are planning a separate weekend trip to replace it at some point. Somewhere we can both afford. I know these conversations will keep coming up. He knows that he can work on his thoughtfulness and generosity just in general. I also have confidence right now that we do have so many other shared values and goals that we are going to be able to get past this.

[ThatwasThen]

I think you should listen to your therapist and in the meantime, while you're waiting to see if he "comes around" that you limit your entertainment venues to things you CAN afford to contribute 50/50 to while you save to go on one nice vacation together a year. I also think you should stop being a martyr and when he offers again to pay for the majority of the costs of a get-away that you don't refuse him out of guilt... Afterall, it's exactly what you wanted him to do so why would you decline? No more "Martyr Michelle89."

 

On Edit... Just noticed you had a nice conversation with him and you seem to have come to some mutual compromises that work for the two of you.

[Ms Darcy]

Excellent! Communication is key. This is very good news. I would still go for more proportionate than 50/50 but it's a step in the right direction.