BREAKING ALL THE RULES

[GeeCee]

Clevertrevor - you got a wicked glint in your eye and a spring in your step. A devil-may-care attitude? Feel a bit like a stallion today, honey?

 

Rules ... rules .... make 'em to break 'em.

 

G xx

[majord23]

OMG!!!

 

GeeCee and ClevorTrevor met up last night and..ummm...'relieved some tension!!

 

LMAO.....well, that's one way to sort you both out

[Clevertrevor]

Well, actually it wasn't just G and me...heehee..

 

Can I just say as an aside that I have never been in a forum environment before. I have observed a few and have always been totally put off by the complete and utter drivel, lack of communication and general unpleasantness that clogs the pages of these so-called communities of socially-retarded doorstops.

 

Except for this one.

 

Once again, I am present to the awesome possibilities when people are authentic with each other, and that is no mean feat when all we have to communicate with is a keyboard. It feels like a blueprint for a new kind of on-line community. One where ordinary people can share, and gain insight into their own and other's lives with respect and care given through the establishment of a high level of trust.

So I thank all of you, and the Moderators and experts especially.

And nobody paid me to say this, and yes I'm having an OK day, and my heart goes out to those of you having a bad one. Can I offer this pearl of wisdom; "insert trite saying here"

 

[Clevertrevor]

And to offer hope to you all, here's a brief run-down on my date;

1. Arrive at flat, get kiss on side of mouth; she was aiming for the cheek, I was aiming for the mouth, so yeah, that's a really really good start.

2. Dinner, chat, being cool, happy, friendly, absolutely no relationship stuff at all.

3. She wants to keep talking, we have a cup of tea at hers, still no relationship stuff. I am listening, listening…it's killing me, I want to get to the core of things.

4. I break down over something non-relationship, grab my coat and go to leave thinking 'f*!> it! Yeah really good exit nice one fella'

5. She forcefully tells me to SIT DOWN, which is unlike her, normally she would have let me walk without a comment so, somewhat surprised, I complied.

6. We kind of get to the beating heart of things, get a bit emotional, but I'm keeping my head, not begging. In our roundabout way we learnt some stuff, and during the conversation she asked if I would stay the night, I declined 2 or 3 times, then I said OK then but no funny stuff. She says "Of course, no funny stuff"

7. Funny stuff.

 

How do I feel? Slightly manipulated, I think I gave it up dishonestly. But happy in the knowledge that I am sure we both had breakthroughs in our communication and understanding, and meeting with her helped me get clear on what I want. I am still clear on my goal of creating a new relationship with this woman.

 

This my friends, is an illustration as to why BREAKING THE RULES is so important. But you know what else? Here's what an old boss of mine used to say:

 

"Clevertrevor, you've got to KNOW the rules before you can break them"

 

Later,

Trev.

[GeeCee]

Glad that you are OK - Clevertrevor - shall PM you later - get ready for lots of analysis - my evening was even more stressful than Clevertrevors. It was not one rule broken, or even two. In fact I think some laws were broken too!!!

 

Am busy busy busy but will post later - please be ready for lots of analysis. Some of it was good, some oh dear. And some was ... hmmmmm.

 

G xx

[kathyk]

what have you done??? don't keep us waiting. its killing me. need your advice also. see my new post.

[GeeCee]

Shall be able to post in the next half hour.

 

G xx

[SincerlyHurt]

Looks like last night was "devils night" for the majority of us. This place is about to get busy, I hope I can keep up!! What fun this is!

[dikaia880]

Yeah, one wild night...whew, laundry...tv...it doesn't get much crazier!

 

Oh GeeCee, I guess I just threw out the "just kidding" part so I sounded a little aloof, you know playin my game!

[GeeCee]

So you will know that the beautiful ex pulled out of our date last night citing work commitments. A couple of hours after he texted, I decided that I needed to say goodbye and recoup myself and decide on a new strategy. So before I tell you what I wrote and what happened last night, let me preface this by saying I am not a needy person in the slightest. My ex heard me cry once on the telephone and once only. He has never seen me cry and every time we have met up since, I have looked fabulous and confident (which I am!!!!). So, the ex knows that i want him, but has no doubt that I am going to get onwith my life.

 

So, I sent an SMS:

 

Ok gorgeous - what you should do is have a good long drink that makes you feel lovely and then chill - I am making the most of a kids free zone and enjoying chilling. Take care and hope that work eases up for you sometime soon, honey. Keep in touch M - you are a sweet guy. G xx

 

And he replied:

 

Thanks u. M xxx

 

So I then decided that I would retreat, and plan my next initiative. I have now put a time-frame on this of six months. Six months is nothing. Two months have already passed. Six months, in the whole scheme of things is nothing.

 

So the message was sent at 9.30. I am then, of course, floating aroumd this site, and talking to friends on MSN messenger. Now, when the ex dumped me, he blocked me off messenger, and whem I realised this I blocked him. yesterday, during the day, I took the block off. At about 11.00 I realise that oh me oh my, he is online and has unblocked me. An invitation perhaps? So i pop up and say Hi - and we chat for a while. And I ask him how he is - he is usually like me - upbeat and happy. And he says, not good, depressed. Feels like &^%$. And I am shocked. Really shocked. So I say, look M, stop being such a sad bastard and get your ^&%$ over here. And he says, no really, am not good. Need to do a Greta Garbo. And now I am more than shocked. So I call him up and we talk, and I make him laugh a bit. And it is all good. And I say he is full of crap, does he realise that I sold my children for the night etc. And he says you are mkaing me feel guilty. But I laugh and there is no tension. Eventually I say, have to go.

 

Back on messenger and he starts another conversation. What are you doing? Playing computer games. He then asks me if I am seeing anyone. None of your business. Am i having sex with anyone. None of your business. And so, because he has asked I ask him and he says no to both. Says I don't want to have sex. Not happy. More chit chat.

 

Then I continue on my game. And i do not initiate anything.

 

And then, of course, a plan starts to begin. A plan that you will all go aaarggh!! At 12.00 pm I decide to go to him. I am worried about him. So I drive over - 45 mins later - arrive at his house - decide that if the lights are off I will not knock. Knock at the door and he opens. I say ... Even in my advancing years M, I am still impulsive. And he laughs. And I say, because you are depressed, I thought you should have a thing of beauty and so I brought you this and give him a huge peacock feather!! (Don't ask - I just happened to have one lying around the house!!!!) And he laughs and hugs me. We sit and talk and talk. He's lost weight and he looks really tired. And I say, I am worried about you and he says, yes it will pass. And then he reaches out for me and says I need a cuddle. And so I he lays his head on my breast and I stroke his hair. And he starts to fall asleep. And I say, M you need to go to bed. And he asks if I will stay. And I say yes, I will sleep ont he sofa. And he says 'don't be ridiculous. And we go upstairs. And lay in bed. And he is stroking me - and I am stroking him in a conpletely non-sexual manner, like a child. And then I feel him changing. And I say kiss me. Adn he does and it is soft and gentle and tender like a butterfly. And it builds up and builds up. And then I say sleep now.

 

And he rests. Adn then he kisses me sooooo deliciously. And I say hmmmm .. this vow of celibacy might just be broken. And he says yesssss. And i say M are you sure about this and he says yesssss. But, he says, it doesn't change anything. Of course not, i say. And so we make love and it is delicious and very very tender and very very loving. And, without giving too much away, I will say that I tend to be more of a giver but I lie back and he does it all to me. Lovely. And then he lays on my breast and sleeps. And usually he would not do this. He tends to lay on his side. And we sleep and in the night, his arms find me and he holds me.

 

And in the morning he wakes me with a kiss. And he holds me - spooning - holds my hand.

 

And it is very comfortable. And then, of course, rushing around. Ready to go and he says I'll call soon. He thanks me for being a good samaritan. Bye Kiss kiss. Big hug.

 

No contact from him today, but he did have his children all day.

 

Ok, Beec, Majord, Lostinvan, I know that you think that this is a very bad tactical move (Spatz too). February, stop cheering and hollering!! And Dikaia take that bemused smile off your face. Kathyk thank you for welcoming me to your club.

 

Here it is ... he needed something last night and I provided it. Now even if it was just for last night, I was able to fill an emotional and physical gap in his life. He has no-one else in his life. He has made no promises, indeed, I am sure that he remains convinced that this is over. However, he is unsure. Wavering. Has never been able to look me in the eye and say with conviction I do not want you. He is confused. I can confuse him further. What I have to do here is show him that I am a good friend, someone he can trust and open up to, someone he can rely on. If we have sex, that is all good. Very very slowly I need to build up his dependence on me. He is isolating himself somewhat, and so no contact would be disastrous. He would not reach out for my help (I understand this, I am exactly the same). He made a small invitation by unblocking me from messenger. He is acting like a frightened rabbit caught in headlights. While I am not obviously the love of his life, he is unsure of his feelings. I intend to exploit that uncertainty.

 

My plan now, is to retreat - not send a message or phone, because that would send a message I do not want to - that I need to see him and quickly. I hope to wait for a few days, and then send him an email asking how he is and telling him about something fabulous to do with me. At the same time, I will suggest that we catch up on that movie we missed.

 

Of course, it could be that he is resolute in his decision and it is over. But I am not so sure. Really, I am quite realistic. I am not so sure. I know that in the past he has never gone back to exes. He says that when it is over it is over. And so this is interesting ...

 

You can tell me that it was wrong to have sex with him, that I have taken a step backward. I disagree - if he used me to fulfill a need I used him to fulfill a need. I feel that I held more power in that regard than him. And quite apart from anything else ... it felt sooooo good.

 

So, give it to me. Analysis analysis analysis. Gooooo...

 

G xx

[dikaia880]

hmmm...

I think it's good and not so good....It shows that you want him, too much?

We all talk about being aloof and all that, butyou also gave him a lot....fullfilled some definate needs...not just the sex.

Also I think guys respond to this sort of thing more...even if we breeak up with a girl, more times than not she can seduce us...Long term effectiveness, I don't know if it gets you anywhere in the long term, but it definitely helps in the short term, and I don't think it hurts the long term at all.

I say you had a good night...he was reaching out to you, and you were there for him!

 

No bemusedment here, if i understand the word right, I'm still just thinking about...well you know what I'm thinking about

[spatzcolumbo]

You know what Gee, i'm fed up of saying negatives about this kinda thing. It made him happy, it made you happy. I would give ANYTHING to be in your position right now, you know that. I'd love to be able to wake up next to my ex and give her a kiss, and just hold her because she is so special. I think one of the most important things, regardless of no contact, or any of the other crazy theories that are around, the most important thing...is to just NOT BEAT YOURSELF UP about things.

 

So people will tell you how you made a mistake. How you shouldn't have done it. How its not part of the game we are all playing.

 

You KNOW how i've been feeling recently. You KNOW how down i have been. And it runs deeper than just issues with my ex. I have learnt to take every scrap of positive feeling, and enjoy that feeling whilst i can. You should do the same. It made you feel good last night. And i am glad. Work out what you want to do now, but don't regret what you did last night. Even if others will tell you it was a mistake, don't put too much emphasis on it.

 

You'd much rather be in your position than mine, believe me. I dream of stuff like that happening. I dream of when stuff like that used to happen. I'd give anything in the world for it to happen again.

 

As for a game plan for the future, maybe i am not the best to say. I am finding it hard enough to work out my own game plan.

[GeeCee]

Thanks Dikaia and Spatz. I know that what happened last night was right for the time. The guy is under a lot of stress and whilst I am no doormat, believe me I am no doormat, 'I wanted to allow him to reach out to me. And that was achieved in the most glorious way imaginable. This is certainly no fix. It's a simple band-aid for now. And when he is sitting alone and watching TV, he may well give me a thought. And wonder. And that is all good. He may not. Right now, I feel stronger than he looked. He didn't seduce me and I didn't seduce him. We did what felt natural and right at the time. That is not to say that it would not happen again ... but it is just so hard. You want to feel close to your ex, what better way than laughing, talking and making love. And, luckily for me last night, that happened last night. It might never happen again, but it happened last night, and I am pleased about that.

 

I have deluged him with G (notice the use of the third person, folks!!), and now I shall retreat and glow!!

 

G xx

[Beec]

OK, if I have a worry hear that is different from what I've said, it's that you are coming in and out of his life in one night. Similar to a couple weeks ago. You meet, talk, have sex, part ways for a couple weeks. If this is the tactic you are choosing to use, shouldn't you be around for a longer period, a couple days, then break away?

 

It's not what I would do, but it can be used to give him what he needs emotionally. But you don't want him to a be recreational user of the drug "GeeCee" you want him to be an addict.

[dikaia880]

Spatz I hope you didn't think mine was negative...

GeeCee I think what happened was a good thing!

It may not make a huge difference in the long term, but everynow and then short term is great!

And it wasn't need that brought you to him last night, you went to him, he needed you whether he knew it or not...but he will definitely be thinking about it.

 

Wish me luck, I'm heading to her town right now...Good luck everyone with this weekend in whatever your doing...Hope I don't miss to much being away from the computer...You got that GeeCee, no more dirty talk until I get back!

[GeeCee]

Oooooh Beec - I get a thrill when you post on MY thread!!!

 

Yes, and this is the problem!! How to increase the contact without initiating - impossible!!! Well, I have done what I have done - it's all good.

 

I have to confess that I had no intention of having sex with him last night - no intention whatsoever, Beec, you know that. I am able to control my lust and was going to do so last night. I was shocked at the way he looked and felt he was in need of both emotional and physical support. You are right, tho Beec, from past experience, we both retreat and nothing happens for a couple of weeks. But I have not initated contact and neither has he. And I really do think that NC does not work for us. We need to work on the premise of friends. Build that friendship up to a level where he misses me. Now, despite what you may think. I can be steely determined. If being his friend only is the way to do it ... I will do it. I also have no doubt, no doubt, whatsoever in my mind that should we meet again, there should be no sex whatsoever. Not even too much flirting. My role, now will evolve to friendship. Withdrawing the sex now, I believe, will confuse him more. I am not being petulant and withdrawing because he dumped me and I want more commitment. I am saying, no you are not fulfilling all of my needs, I no longer need that from you. That, I think, will confuse his expectations of me. But then again, what do I know?

 

G xx

[spatzcolumbo]

Beec,

 

an interesting idea about 'the drug Geecee'.

 

I've thought this a lot lately. i feel like my ex is a drug that i am addicted to. I get my fix, and i am happy for a few hours, then i want more.

 

Yet at the same time, all we are ALL trying to do (those ASKING for advice at least) is get that ex hooked on OUR drug. Get it so that they want to come back for more every few hours.

 

I've been thinking some more about my situation with the ex...i know i am emotional at the moment. I just pured my heart and head out in my 'new guy' post. but you know what. I know some of you may disagree. But i just want to know who i am up against. I'd love to know who the other guy is. Otherwise its like going into battle blind. Its like going to war with a blindfold on. Like going into the most important match of the season without having done any research on your opponent.

 

Maybe he is not my opponent though. Maybe she is. I'm trying to beat both of them. but in different ways.

 

Sorry Geecee, took over the thread a bit there. I'm just having so many thoughts and i got nobody else to put them out to at the moment.

[GeeCee]

Damnit Dikaia - you are going away for the weekend? The WHOLE weekend? Who will I play with now? Hmmm ... let me think .... Feb!!!!

 

Hope all goes well for you Dikaia - shall be thinking about you and wishing you well. Keep that really positive spirit going - it really is doing you and us the power of good.

 

G xx

[February]

G,

Wow!! I am amazed by how much ablls you have!! Holy crap. I aspire to be that ballsy someday. Damn!!!

 

I think that ou should be very proud of yourself and how things are going. G, you are rational and independent and have know the reality of the situation. You know you can live without M. But you are making a choice to live how you want to live. Games aside. You know that this man may never return to you as you wish him too. But you also know it is a possibility and in the meantime you are living how for yourself. You are strong (stronger than him) and you can be there for him w;/o jepordizing yourself. So BRAVO.

 

I think your retreating for awhile is a fantastic plan. But G, what is up with this guy, what is he depressed about? I mean what are his issues really? Any ideas?

[GeeCee]

You will not like this ... will give you cause to frown ... mutter ... do you seee ... I told you!!!

 

So no contact from the ex today, although not expected because he is with his kids.

 

Seven pm and I get a text

 

Hey you. Found your earrings in the bathroom (tactical manouevre - might encourage him to think about the owner!!!). Do you want me to post them to you or hold onto them? Hope last day at work went well. M xx

 

Hmmmm ... not exactly Byron or Keats!!

 

Have not responded yet. Shall leave it a while and suggest that he holds onto them (more gazing at them and thinking of the owner!!)

 

I know that you will not like this - am not overly impressed myself. However, in my current positive frame of mind, which I would like to point out came before I went to him last night, I am OK with this. All is good. In terms of the bigger picture, this is ok. In six months time, he will be so close to me that he will want to wear my &^%$ing earrings!!!!!

 

G xx

[GeeCee]

Yeah right Feb ... you could pull this one off and pull it off in style!!!

 

What is up with him?? What is up with him?? Have no idea whatsoever. His body language is all good, but it does not agree with his verbal communication sometimes, ie don't think that the relationship is going anywhere.

 

He is very stressed out at work, has his own small company and is extremely busy. Working very long hours and very tired. Not very motivated by work at the moment either. He hates living alone, and yet fights commitment. Wants to be in a relationship, and yet kicks against it. He currently lives in an apartment, and hates that too. Says he has nowhere to entertain his friends. And so he has just bought a four-bedroomed house. Now he is worried that will make him feel more lonely. Actually, this is not what I fell in love with at all. He is full of angst. And this is what shocked me to the core. I cannot tell you how optimistic and upbeat he usually is. Very much a no-looking backwards type of guy.

 

Last night, he looked like a rabbit caught in headlights!!! Oh for the era when men behaved like men and women were bloody grateful!!!

 

G xx

[SincerlyHurt]

Hey Hon, I have been swamped today but somehow have managed to keep up with your thread. You gained strides last night IMO. The only thing to me is that you had to go to him, I wish he would have come to you. Your game has evolved and you must act accordingly now. Is pulling back all the way the correct thing to do? I don't know. I would wrestle with the idea of creating a bit more contact soon and the backing off after you have him getting comfortable with it. Don't be hot or cold all the time, be warm sometimes and then freeze. It will stop him in his tracks. I am proud of you for having the courage to make something, anything happen. Now use your head head instead of your heart. I will post later as sis is in town and need the puter.

 

I am doing quite well. Is it normal to have your first break down in the anger stage? My first tears fell today. Check out my thread for yesterdays events. Its getting good.

 

Will be back soon. Time for a jog.

[GeeCee]

Sincerelyhurt

 

Oh the confusion and the indecision. I would have thought that now would be the time to withdraw. But both you and Beec are telling me that I should deluge him at the moment. Feed his needs whether they are sexual or emotional. Act like a buffer to whatever he is going through. And then, when he is comfortable, and has built up trust, them retreat. But I just don't know. I guess like all of us, I am afraid of the rejection. And I think that he might be suspicious of me suddenly making a lot of contact when I have not initiated any for the last two weeks. What little there has been (one call, one brief visit for coffee and one SMS) has all been initated by him. But the call and the visit also coincided with him collecting something from me, so don't read too much into that.

 

I need to think this one through very long and hard. I think that I scare him off if I contact now, after what happened last night. I shall see what I think in the morning.

 

Glad that you are feeling better Sincerelyhurt. Oh, the tears, when I read your email to your ex, I was close to breaking down myself. I feel very damned tired of this today. But that follows my normal pattern. Up for 2-3 weeks and then come crashing down for two days. Aaaargh!!!!

 

G xx

[majord23]

GeeCee,

You know what I think

 

I don't think it's my place to give advice here...but what I can do is ask you to ask *yourself* two questions.

 

Since the start of this thread (end of Feb....138 pages ago)....what, in your situation, has changed in regards to your ex's commitment to you?

 

Secondly...why do you think that is?

[Out to sea]

Hi my GeeCee, just a thought on this situation, I agree with Beec And Majord23 on this one, if he is that low about things at the mo, you need to be there for him. He will remember that you were really there for him.

 

However, I wouldn't go getting all excited at things when he is so down. Wait until he has gotten over this ' bad time' and see what he does then. You know how you get much more confident in yourself when you feel happy, you need to see what's going on when he's all happy out with himself.

 

Will he say,' thank you GeeCee for being there it means alot to me, will you marry me?', or will he say, 'thanks for that see ya around!!!'

 

Only my 2 cents worth!