This is TORTURE!

[Tigris]

The earring hasn't been found!

 

The excess is $100 AUD the earrings cost £35.00!

 

I had no idea she was going to change her name so soon. We'd discussed who's surname we were going to take when we got married but that's not supposed to take place until 2007!

[Hope75]

How do you feel about that?

 

ARe you OK with the fact that she changed her name before you even met after making the commitment?

[Tigris]

I'm ecstatic that she changed her name to mine!

[Tigris]

My Fiancee wants to come back to England with me when my holiday ends on 3rd March. It came as a shock! The reason for this is I'm the one that's supposed to be emigrating to be with her. Unfortunately, it's going to take at least a year (possibly 2) to get my debts sorted before I can go to her.

 

I can't believe she wants to do this. Her 5 children and 2 grandchildren live there! However, the two children that live with her have been making their own plans to move out before she mentioned it.

 

She's been ill recently and it's going to take her a long time to recover properly, thereforeeee, her business is going to decline rapidly so she has decided to sell up.

 

We've never felt love as deeply as this before, it's hard to explain. We desperately need to talk to each other every day. We're always on MSN. The telephone calls are costing us a small fortune and neither of us have got that sort of money available right now.

 

There are a lot of advantages to us being together so soon, however, I am worried that financially things are going to be a strain?

 

There is also the problem that my Father still doesn't know that I'm a Lesbian! Remember my 2 sisters threatened to disown me if he found out! Plus am I supposed to inform my soon to be ex husband that she'll be living in our house? (The house needs a lot of work doing to it before it can be sold!)

[avman]

Um ok I've been watching this from afar for quite some time and I now feel compelled to speak up. If nothing else, I am concerned for the children and other people's lives who this is affecting.

 

Isn't it just a little suspicious that things are moving so fast when you two haven't even met in person yet? I mean, ok I get the infatuation feelings, the rush of something new, the excitement, the anticipation, and all of that. But don't you find it just a bit odd that she changed her name without you two having a formal committment? Or that she's ready to drop her children and leave with you in a couple of months? I certainly find it unusual and deeply concerning.

 

I'm sorry, I realize that both of you have these feelings and such - but nobody seems to be taking a truly rational look at all this and saying "Whoa, lets step back for a moment and figure things out". Relationships usually start out this way but then you get past the honeymoon period and can look more rationally at whether your goals are compatible, whether you are capable of living together, if your habits mesh, and so on. Both of you really seem to be jumping the gun and are on the verge of some very drastic actions without considering all the consequences.

[Moore]

Avman, I have said exactly the same thing to tigris as what you are but she believes that my motives are sinister. I know of the woman tigris is in love with and I believe that she is being strung along, however tigris will not listen to me. I'm glad that someone else has the courage to stand up and say what is really going on here. I did and have become an outcast. I'd like to know if it is possible to check if a person has really changed their last name because I really doubt that she has.

 

In the end its tigris life and she will need to face what ever comes her way.

[avman]

I would certainly never stand in the way of true love, if indeed that is what this is. But from the outside looking in, there are thousands of alarm bells going off in my head. I'm not involved in the situation so I have no ulterior motives. I just really hope everyone is going into this with their eyes wide open.

 

Other people's lives will be affected by what happens here. Consenting adults may do what they please, but some people in this situation do not get a choice. Please be careful.

[TiredMan]

av, I agree.

 

But if I HAD to guess, judging from her previous posts in this thread, she had been trying with many different women in her life for a relationship and they would never accept her advances. Now, that someone has (even though they have never even met) she is jumping the gun, as you said. It's dangerous and irrational, I agree. But then again, I feel that sometimes people have to learn from the experience.

 

I hope it turns out ok but it does feel very risky to me.

[Hope75]

I have to agree with others. It's difficult to understand how someone could get engaged and plan to relocate for someone they have never even met in person. Not to mention that they have children to consider, Tigris is leaving one failed marriage for another, her "fiance" has gone and changed her name and planned to leave her children to move to another country to be with her, all without first consulting Tigris about these major changes!

 

There are red flags going off left and right, and I feel badly for all involved. I just don't see this as a healthy partnership.

[RayKay]

Avman, I have said exactly the same thing to tigris as what you are but she believes that my motives are sinister. I know of the woman tigris is in love with and I believe that she is being strung along, however tigris will not listen to me. I'm glad that someone else has the courage to stand up and say what is really going on here. I did and have become an outcast. I'd like to know if it is possible to check if a person has really changed their last name because I really doubt that she has.

 

In the end its tigris life and she will need to face what ever comes her way.

 

I am sorry to hear that Moore, I too have spoken up many times on this thread previously, however the truth is people believe what they want to believe, or listen only when they are ready to, or have no other choice. I know neither personally, but did become concerned when I first heard of the engagement/plans to move before ever meeting in person.

 

I have found many of the events that have occurred alarming, and these more recent changes even more so. I have nothing against meeting someone online, and beginning a relationship, but to get engaged (even if no "official" yet), to change one's name before there is any commitment (if true) and make plans to move before ever meeting and many of them without even discussing...all are severe red flags. And I fear the fallout on at least one of the persons, and the children involved - whether they live at home or not anymore, it does affect family.

 

I hope things do turn out well, but the signs are too great that there is something not as "pure" going on here as "true love".

[darkblue]

the signs are too great that there is something not as "pure" going on here as "true love".

 

What signs?

Her partner-to-be's uncontrollable enthusiasm to change her name?

[novaseeker]

It's just all very odd, darkblue.

 

I have been keeping quiet, but I have to say I agree with the other posters here in that there are red flags left and right here. In my own experience, it is best not to drive through red flags, they are there for a reason. I do hope that things work out well, but from this vantage point things look ... well, problematic.

[darkblue]

What is so problematic about it?

[novaseeker]

In my view it's problematic to get engaged to someone without ever having met them in real life. Again I hope things work out for everyone, but that in itself is a big red flag.

[TiredMan]

In my view it's problematic to get engaged to someone without ever having met them in real life. Again I hope things work out for everyone, but that in itself is a big red flag.

 

HUGE red flag. I completely agree but I think I know why it's happening, as I said in the previous post to avman.

[Tigris]

GREAT CHRISTMAS EVE THIS IS!!!!!!

 

I thought I was doing my Best Friend a favour by taking her out for a drink because she was going to be alone. Also, because she needed to take her mind off her 13 year old daughter's recent rape! (The daughter lives with Foster Parents!)

 

I didn't realise how much she'd had to drink in her house. We went to a pub where some of my Mother's side of the family drink. I wasn't drinking because I'm driving tomorrow morning! I bought her 2 pints of lager.

 

I introduced her to some of my family and at first there was no problem. The two older men (my Mother's cousins) left and two male and one female second cousins remained. Everything was going fine and then she 'outs me' by announcing that I am a Lesbian! I wanted to crawl in a hole and DIE!!!!!!!!!

 

I said, 'Please don't say anything, my Father doesn't know yet!' The Male cousins said they'd always known even though I'd been married twice, however, the female cousin remained silent! They advised me to tell my Father on Christmas Day. I can't ruin everyone's Christmas!

 

My two sisters' told me a while ago that if my Father finds out they'd disown me and I won't see my Nephew 15, Nephew 8 and Neice 6 ever again!

 

As soon as I got home I contacted my Fiancee. Both her and her youngest daughter were angry! My Fiancee advises me to tell my Father as soon as possible before someone else does!

[darkblue]

If you can, I suggest that you contact your relatives who now know - and tell them that you would very much appreciate if they could keep it to themselves for now, as you do not want to ruin your father's Christmas.

 

Don't panic, Tigris. This is just yet another obstacle.

Take care of yourself.

[darkblue]

I won't respond to your original post, which I received by email, novaseeker.

But I will say that Tigris has already made up her mind.

[Shadows Light]

Tigris... I think Darkblue is right. Talk to the relatives that know.. and ask the for discretion for the time being. ITS CHRISTMAS. And its NOT a good time for these types of heavy conversations or revelations for ANYONE. Your sexuality should NOT be discussed at Christmas Dinner with the family. I just find that.. appalling. To tell you the truth. It'd be like telling my family about what happens in my bed-room. For petes sakes why is it such a BIG DEAL what goes on behind closed doors. Yikes!!

 

AS to the rest of the posts. Hmmmmm..... There is an adage that I like at times like these.. that says..

 

"TRUTH IS STRANGER THAN FICTION"... lol. Tig and Angie are grown women. Adults. And while RED FLAGS may be popping out all over the place, so bright you have to wear shades. It's thier THING.

 

Another adage..."AND HARM YE NONE, DO WHAT THOU WILL"... Aye, I would always advice caution to anyone traveling on an unknown path. But then I'm an overly cautious cat. Thats been my shtick. Angies children are grown women and all above the age of 18. I would think that at this age... they would be ready for the trials and tribulations of whatever life throws at them. IF they were younger... YEP.. I'd say excercise MORE caution.

 

And Harm Ye none, do what thou will. That also applies to NOT harming yourself. To think about what you are doing and weigh out the consequences before you do what ever it is you are going to do.

 

Both of these women are in the mid 40's. IF.. they do not know to weigh and analyze all the pro's and con's by now... NO ONE is going to tell them any different.

 

IF they say they are in "LOVE", then who am I to say that it is NOT a "PURE or TRUE LOVE"... who's to say that what TIG feels is not REAL.

Or that my love is better than hers??? She feels it. She identifies what she is feeling as LOVE. Then... hey, whatever gets her rocks off eh.

 

Now... Changing the last name, and moving etc etc. I'd say that was more a communications issue between the couple. LOL... I know that my friend would probably have a heart attack if i changed my last name to his. Grin. and he wasn't around to witness it!!! LOL. But hey.. if it doesn't bother TIG. And she's ok with it and pleased. No harm, No foul.

 

 

I don't know the LEGALITIES of GAY marriages in either country. Nor do I know all the trials and tribulations a GAY couple would go through to call each other a couple. I DO KNOW.. that it is LEGAL.. to get married by PROXY. One person can be in another country and send a power of attorney for someone else to stand in for them at the wedding. ITs legal. And aye.. it happens.

 

I knew a couple who did this. They'd met while on "VACATION" and had corresponded.. back when there wasn't an INTERNET. When all they had were SNAIL MAIL.. and the phone. In order for them to Marry. She had to travel to his country.. Marry him.. and then do all the paper work to bring him on over. The couple thought it was a tremendous WASTE of TIME AND MONEY. Getting married on the fly was all just to get him a VISA to be able to come over. Sooooooo... it economize.. they married by PROXY. And later... married in her country. NO EMAIL. NO MOBILE phone... just letters and the phone. Were they in LOVE??? YOU BETCHA.

 

Would I do that??? Probably Not. But I've never been in that position.

 

There are many couples who meet on line these days and communicate via NET.. and MARRY. I know a couple. Man is from Great Britian. Girl from America. And they carried on an internet relationship. HE came to the states with RING in hand. Proposed to her.. and NOW.. 7 years later and 2 kids. Very happy together. Do they LOVE each other any less than a "NORMAL" couple. don't know. It works for them. so whatever floats their boat.

 

There are CULTURES.. that marry a spouse without EVER laying eyes on them. There are CULTURES where the mates are chosen by an intermediary or the family... AT BIRTH sometimes no less. Can these relationships be successful. AYE.. many have. Whose to judge. May not work for me.. nor do I understand the mind set. But... who am I anyway??

 

AYE... I'd advice a friend. Any friend who was in a "NORMAL" relationship. "NORMAL" by definition, the couple is dating and live in each others proximit.. I'd advice the friend.. BE CAREFUL. Make sure you CYA. And I have said that to one of my BF. She'd dated a guy for 3 months and had the MARRIAGE thing on her mind... and a ring on her finger. CYA.. I told her. Have you thought this through?? Whats the rush... I had said. give yourself time. make sure its real. I don't want to see you hurt. Be careful. I told my GF what I thought... and you know what... She went and got married withing weeks.

 

PEOPLE will do what they will do, regardless of what anyone says. And thats the beauty of FREE WILL. You do what you will.. and if you mess up.. you pay the consequences. AND you move on.. and LIVE.

 

So.... since these are ADULT children we are referring to. AND... because these two feel they are in love. Well.... hey... whatever happens happens... I'm sure you've done the analysis.. checked the data... and you know what you are doing. So... do what thou will. And if it is consequences and repercussions for your actions that you face later.. then you just keep going. and do what you have to do. Lessons learned.

Hopefully.

 

Live, love, and LAUGH often...............

[Moore]

Yes it is true that they will do what they want to do. The point of this forum is to ask for peoples opinions. That is what people on here are doing. If you didn't want to hear what people have to say then don't ask. This thread has been going on for so long now that it seems to be going around and round in cirlces. Posters put out their concerns and then the same 1 or 2 people try to shoot it down. If Tigris doesn't know how others on this forum feel about her situation by now then she will never know.

 

Just get on with what you feel is best to do. All anyone is doing is ](*,)

[avman]

Shadows Light I stand by everything that I said. There is enough unusual behavior to warrant concern. I am aware that these two people are adults and can do as they please. But this is an advice forum and opinions have been solicited. If Tigris didn't want any opinions then she wouldn't post.

 

And one of the children we speak of is 17, hardly an adult and with virtually no life experience. Simply because we have free will and people will do as they feel like does not mean concerns should not be raised. Were I speaking to any friend of mind in this situation I would say the exact same things I have said here - something doesn't seem quite right. Could I be wrong? Of course I could. Might these concerns be unfounded? Yes, certainly they could. That does not mean they should not be raised.

[TiredMan]

Yes I never understood that. People post about their own situations here (myself included) and then get mad at those who give opinions that they dont' like. No one is insulting anyone here. But I'm sorry if anyone I know personally was marrying someone they never met, I would hit them accross the head lol or I would think it was an arranged marriage but even that is researched thoroughly by the family.

 

In her original post, Tigris talked about all of these women whom she wanted who wouldn't accept her advances. She found someone online who has and now is jumping into all of this without ever meeting. This stands out clear as day to me.

 

I also feel bad for the husband who not only has to deal with being divorced but to find out about all of this too. He is probably thinking that you think you know someone and BAM!!!

[Shadows Light]

Oh I didn't entirely disagree with what anyone said here. You'll note that I did say... I would raise ALL of these questions to a good friend. And I did say.. I'd tell them to CYA.. again and again. But at the same time... I try not to judge my friends. I try to be there for them in good times and in bad. I'll give you my opinion.. for good or for ill..whether you take it or not. You'll do as thou will.

 

I've gone back over the posts regarding her marriage. She DID tell her husband about her initial "Crush" when it happened. She went to her best friend (her husband) ...and at that time spilled the beans. Not understanding what was happenig to her. And I know she's gone into counseling to talk bout the situation. Her husband didn't JUST WAKE UP ONE MORING and find out his wife has lesbian tendencies. This has festered for years between them.

And yes... I can well imagine he is confused, hurt... and feeling a whole lot of everything.

 

I know Tig has been in counseling to discuss her.. "feelings" toward women, and her burgeoning libido and how its exploded. She's even gone to the MD to check her hormone and blood levels to cover her all bases.

 

Divorcing her husband because she has NO feelings for him other than a friend (lets say)... may be the most humane thing she could do for him. Neither one of them are HERE or THERE 100%. I'm glad that she was HONEST enough and took responsibility...and told him that she was questioning her "sexual identity". There are numerous issues in the marriage itself that went on and on unresolved. NOT A GOOD MARRIAGE. NOT a good thing for either partner to keep sweeping it under the rug and thinking... its going to right itself.

 

Now.. the relationship she's developed with this other women is... poor timing. Granted. (I'll add that she "IS" leaving the marriage, its not as if she's carrying on an illicit affair hoping to get away with something... it would be wrong of her to continue the marriage and decieve)

 

And yes.. yes.. yes... everyone involved should be careful and watchful. Anytime a relationship takes off like a run away freight train.. I'd say, hold on to your hat and BE VERY CAREFUL... BE VERY MINDFUL.. if you continue down this path.

 

With ANY NEW relationship at anytime...we should be mindful, be careful.. especially if we'd had other broken relationships. We all carry into our relationships baggage. And for Tig...I'd say she was carrying quite a load to sort through. And I hope that she's working toward that end. And continues to pursue...counseling.

 

If I put myself in her shoes... I am at the point where I am trying to sort out what I contributed to the marriage that could have been different. I'd be sorting out.. just what kind of person do I want to be in the future. What boundaries would I set for myself and my significant other. IF I don't work through that... I "WILL" only carry through habits and behaviors that may NOT be condusive to a good relationship. I can bad mouth my "X husband" from here to kingdom come... but I also had a "role to play" I reacted. and I allowed.

 

So Tig... those may be some things for you to think about. And I'm sure you are sorting through them. Put pen to paper... and plan. What would the ideal relationship look like for you. What are the operating principles, the day to day stuff. How will this be different? How will you make life different for yourself? When.. should a RED FLAG come up.. and how is it best dealt with? What standards and consequences are there?

 

As another poster said.... her husband isn't on this post to ask for suport, or to ask for opinions. Nor is this other women. Its Tig. And its been given to her.

 

Look out for the red flags.

Be mindful.

Be careful.

Beware of personal agenda's.

Leave no stone unturned.

Go to counseling to resolve your issues, issues from childhood, issues from your marriages... issues regarding your sexuality.

Go to counseling to learn "better problem solving skills" "better coping skills."

Be as fair as you possibly can with your "husband"...

be true to yourself.

etc. etc. etc.

 

Tigris... I don't think any of these posts are meant as "direct hits" to you personally. They are just observations made by people who are trying to help you... keep perspective. I'm sure you are well aware of all of this... and you are taking it to heart. Look toward your own mental and emotional well being. Divorce whether you are the Plantiff or the Defendant... is fraught with emotional turmoil and opens you up to vulnerabilities. Take good care of yourself in all realms.

[TiredMan]

 

Now.. the relationship she's developed with this other women is... poor timing. Granted. (I'll add that she "IS" leaving the marriage, its not as if she's carrying on an illicit affair hoping to get away with something... it would be wrong of her to continue the marriage and decieve)

 

 

But if you read her earlier posts, it appears that she fell for quite a few females (neighbor, prof, etc....). All while married.

[fluffy_girdlebuns]

Hello my darling Tigris,

 

I want your family to accept you for who you are, not who THEY expect you to be...just have the courage and conviction knowing that you arent alone in this and I will support you every step of the way, I love you for goodness sake!

 

Your family need to know WHO you are in love with...I dont want to have to hide away when I join you in March...I am proud of you and the way you love me...and I need to be able to show that to ALL your family, that is the only reason I think they need to know.

 

I want to shout my love for you from the mountaintops wherever we are!!! Your are the kindest, most caring and loving woman I have ever had the privilege of being with and I love you forever and a day.

 

Please have courage and dont be manipulated by your sisters' lack of understanding...she cannot stop you from seeing your niece and nephews...you have a legal right as their aunt to see them. Your sisters are just a little taken aback because the sister they thought they knew is the same person but different also. Be patient with them...they love you and always will.

 

My sister reacted with limits in the beginning when I first told her of my bi status, but she never treated me any differently...I am hoping for your sake with time, your sisters will do the same.

 

I love you,

Fluffy oxoxoxoxoxoxo