The challenges of an open relationship

[Kibo]

I usually don´t feel comfortable in a relationship because I like to have casual sex. I usually don´t really need the emotional security, that a relationship would give me, as much as I need sex with varying partners.

So I met a woman on Tinder, let´s call her Lara.. I told her I don´t want a relationship during our first date at a café. She said, that every form of interaction was a form of relationship, and that it´s ok for her if I don´t want a "relationship", as I imagine it.

For the next date, we planned to meet at her home to have sex (I like it when a woman is so open about sex). But this was a new form of sex I had never experienced before. So intimate, passionate and warm. So we kept dating for several months. I had a few other dates simultaneously. After some weeks, I felt so comfortable that I wanted to go one step further: Sex without condom. Ok, stop, you will certainly be laughing now or something, but I usually only have Sex with a condom and having sex without it makes the experience a thousand times better. It really is a big deal for me, I cannot stress enough of how important this actually is. I don´t have the best relationship with my own feelings, but that´s a story for another time. Let´s just say that this is actually an important step for me.

So we talked and made some rules:
-we would only have sex without condom with each other (to mitigate the risk of sexual diseases)
-if we date other people, we don´t do it over a longer period of time (so we don´t catch feelings for someone else)

At this point I "admit" to Lara, that we are in an open relationship. Just as a note: Lara had never been in an open relationship before and, despite her openness to sex during our dating, she was not that "outgoing" with other people.

So over the next year, it was (admittedly) only me, who enjoyed the benefits of our open relationship. I had some dates here and there, never lasting longer than a few weeks. And I honored our agreement.

The relationship with Lara was going great, I could totally relax with Lara, we loved each other passionately, she seemed really happy in this relationship, I was happy, it was really perfect. Suddenly, I lost interest in dating other women. This has never happened before. It seemed, that the freedom, I could experience with Lara, gave me the calm I needed to enjoy our relationship to the fullest. But the peace would not last.

Some background information: Lara had a colleague at work. Long story. She actually got divorced from her husband a few years before, because she had feelings for that colleague, but when she had wanted to be in a relationship with him, he was "unavailable", because he did not want to end the relationship with his girlfriend at the time. But Lara and he were meeting regularly, having the same friend circle and similar hobbies, etc.

During our relationship, Lara had some "dates" with him, doing sports together and stuff, but they did not have sex. But then, one day, he ended the relationship with his girlfriend and things started to go south.

Lara finally had sex with him. It was "great" she said to me smiling (we usually talk about our sexual encounters).
- Now here´s quite a problem that I am having: I am interpreting so many things into this. Sometimes I feel things and I feel them so strongly. I am 100 % certain that my feelings tell the truth. This just as a side note -
I interpreted her smile the following: "the sex with him was really good, so good, that he would also be a candidate for a relationship".

So basically Lara violated one of our rules: "Don´t have sex with people over a prolonged time, so you don´t catch feelings". I guess at that point I was ***ed: Lara had known him for so many years and already built a strong emotional fundament with him. He also had rejected her some years before, which, I think, also creates a strong emotional craving. If now a sexual component comes to this. her emotions will multiply.

"Relax, you have nothing to worry about" Lara said teasingly while she looked at me smiling. She really enjoys when I get jealous. For now, I saw the coming disaster, but I was willing to give it the benefit of doubt. Maybe things would work out. A few weeks later, Lara asked me, if it was ok if she had sex without condom with him. He would test himself on sexual diseases and promise her he would tell her if he had sex with another woman. Lara says, he is not really sexually active or outgoing and that she could trust him 100 %. We had an argument. We had lot´s of arguments. How could Lara violate our agreement multiple times and expect me to be ok with it? This is such a big deal for me, I cannot stress how much.

Her argumentation is, that she does not enjoy casual sex but would need an emotional basis to have sex with another person. She said she wanted also some benefits of our open relationship and I should deal with it. We had so many arguments over the next weeks, I almost ended our relationship multiple times. I actually had to decide: is it ok for me if she has sex with him without condom or do I end the relationship. It was never an option for Lara to continue having sex with him WITH condom. I must say, during our arguments, she often said that she could do it with condom with him, if it was such a big deal for me, but when I pursued that, she always got annoyed and said how much worse the sex would be. So I don´t think it was an option.

And that´s how things are going now: I see Lara and that guy getting closer and closer, now she is seeing him on a weekly basis. She goes on holiday with him. She constantly tells me how much she loves me, that I have nothing to worry about and that each of us (the guy and me) is so unique, one could never supplement the other.

I feel like a total sucker. For me, it is obvious that her emotions to him will grow and grow and her emotions for me will diminish. I am 100 % certain, that within 6 months or so, she will leave me and I will have become irrelevant. How could she not see this? Lara disagrees. She really fought for me when we had our arguments and when I wanted to leave her. She cried and said, that she does not want to loose me, but that she cannot end it with this guy either.

At this point, I already emotionally distanced myself from her. I think a relationship, even an open relationship should be two people against the world. Two pieces that fit perfectly together. Two people that share their most intimate thoughts only with each other.

Not some weird big family multiple emotionally equal partners stuff.

Usually, I don´t have a relationship. I date women without having any agreements with them and I´m ok, when they do things that I don´t even know about. IF I need a relationship, I need it for the emotional value, not for the security of having sex. I really feel that I don´t need the relationship with Lara anymore. I don´t think I want the relationship with Lara anymore. I find just the thought of having an open relationship with love-level feelings for multiple people disgusting. But I also think that I could just relax and lean back. See what´s to come. Broaden my horizon. Maybe things will turn out great and the guy and me will harmonically coexist.

I actually only have to options: Accept his guy and trust Lara that everything is going to be ok, or leave her.

What do you think?

[Batya33]

I think you had eyes wide open to the downsides of your initial approach, the downsides of the intricate rules you had which you didn't need when you were the one benefiting from the arrangement, and the risks involved. What happened should not be surprising to you.  Separately I am sorry for your hurt feelings and disappointment.  I would stop having the sexual arrangement with Lara.  Not worth the downsides and enjoy the fun memories.  

[Kwothe28]

58 minutes ago, Kibo said:

At this point, I already emotionally distanced myself from her. I think a relationship, even an open relationship should be two people against the world. Two pieces that fit perfectly together. Two people that share their most intimate thoughts only with each other.

Not some weird big family multiple emotionally equal partners stuff.

You do realize how what you said it doesnt make sense? "Two people against the world" while you are both, lets check, oh, having multiiple other people to have sex and share those moments?

One of the biggest leftist streamers on Twitch got divorced. From the woman he was also in an open relationship. Because she, get this, found some Swedish guy and he didnt wanted to share her. So she decided to leave the streamer. And that is one of the big misconceptions with "open relationships". Lots of you think that you can "go around" as long as you go back to each other. While in a reality, it doesnt go like that. Having sex and forming bonds with multiple people carries the risk of people catching feelings there. Especially when it comes to women who in lots of cases see sex as a form of emotional bonding. That is why "open marriages" have abysmal rate of success.

Other thing is, you basically played yourself here. You wanted an open relationship. But caught feelings for somebody to who you were a passing thing until some other man becomes available. And when other man became available, you were casted on the side. Which wouldnt be a problem if you viewed all of this as a sex arangement. But again, you caught feelings there. Get out of there while you still can. Before you become a leftist streamer whos girlfriend is leaving him for somebody else.

[Wiseman2]

Unfortunately it seems she moved on when she met a better match.  It's interesting because of the open relationship, she could explore better options while seeing you. 

[smackie9]

Why argue about it. You both expect different things...cut her loose. When you make such arrangements, there should be a getting out rule, that if someone doesn't want to follow the rules anymore, then it's over. Time to move on. 

[Coily]

You seem to have wanted one sided benefits in this situation. She on the other hand saw what she wants and went for it.

[Kibo]

I want the relationship to be fair. I get the point, that she does not find casual sex fulfilling, but seeks more emotional experiences. That´s fine for me. I really don´t want to be the guy who gets all the benefits from an open relationship and then complains when a woman wants her fair share. But the moment she wanted to have sex with this other man without condom, was the moment she showed me that the relationship with him is more important to her than her relationship with me. At least it appears to me that way. She claims that she does not want to use a condom because her skin gets irritated and that there are practical reasons for it. I see it as a sign that she does crave a more intimate relationship with this guy.

And why do so many people think that you cannot have an open relationship with love? In the past year, we had one of my most intimate and loving relationships I ever had. When we go out, we constantly touch, kiss, cuddle and tell each other how much we love each other. She likes to cook when I visit her, I bring her flowers, massage her... It was heaven.

Now the only thing that I cannot find peace with: I cannot guess her intentions. My feeling tells me that she will distance herself more and more from me and she will get closer and closer to the other guy (a). I talk to her about my feelings and she just tells me that I have nothing to worry about, I should trust here and I would see that in a few months, nothing will have changed (b).

So what are her true intentions? I just think option a is obvious, but she vehemently defends option b.

I would try to arrange myself with this new relationship triangle, if that made her truly happy and if that would be a way for her to live a happy and fulfilled life. But I could not accept, if she just wants to be sure that things with the other guy will work out and then she will let me go.

So should I just trust her? Currently we still have fights, because each time she tells me that she just got even closer to that guy, that triggers me. Can anyone at least understand my position? I tend to just quit the relationship, but then again, I am wondering if I am not fair to her and don´t let her have her "fair share" of the open relationship.

I guess I could just lay back and wait for the day she leaves me. Maybe I will find out that things will turn out to be just right?

[Wiseman2]

10 minutes ago, Kibo said:

. But the moment she wanted to have sex with this other man without condom, was the moment she showed me that the relationship with him is more important to her than her relationship with me. 

Exactly. You gave each other the freedom to find someone else while being with each other. 

She's correct. All situations are some type of "relationship".  Whether it's hookups, FWB, casual, exclusive, open, poly or whatever else. 

You may have to rethink your terms and conditions if the very ones that you yourself set are backfiring. 

 

[itsallgrand]

I wouldn't worry about "fair share". If you want to leave her, leave her. She's not operating any different than you have, just whatever is opportunistically convenient at the time. 

There's nothing left to stick around for except risk to your health, ego boosting her as things suck more for you, and fights. 

And read my first paragraph again for why there's nothing to fight for anyways even without this guy. 

[Batya33]

A relationship where both people agree that they can have sex with others outside the relationship can work.  I don't think it requires loving feelings and it doesn't sound like you wanted this out of love -you met on Tinder, had intercourse soon after meeting.  Near strangers having sex.  Which is fine but it's not an "open relationship out of love".  You can find women who want what you want. She doesn't anymore so move on IMO.

[MissCanuck]

This arrangement is clearly not working anymore. 

I wouldn't over-complicate it. It's not sitting right with you, which is your cue to part ways. 

[Kibo]

Ok I ended the relationship now.

But I want to stress: It was a loving relationship. Originally Lara had wanted to take it further, given me security and trust and I had decided to fall in love. I did not "catch" feelings. We both "agreed" to fall in love.

Neither was it a purely sexual relationship. During 18 months, I had sex with ~5 other women. Lara was always number one for me. My love. I think I never loved a woman so much before.

However, I think Lara underestimated the situation with her colleague. I remember how nervous she was when she told me that he had left his girlfriend. She did not want him to do it and was afraid that it was because of her. I think she sensed the emotional conflict that this situation would cause for her.

When we had our fights because of this guy, she came crying to my doorstep. Wrote love letters about how much she loves me and how important I am to her and that she does not want to loose me.

I really had the feeling she wanted to make this triangle work.

But now, I realize something. It was so hard for me to understand this situation. When we talked about this, all seemed reasonable and understandable. She would have another person that she meets regularly, besides me. That´s it. Not a big deal.

But what I come to realize is the absurd obsession she has with this guy. It is like her life depended on him. At no time she was willing to agree on any compromise. It was always all in for her. She HAD to see him at least once a week. She HAD to have sex without condom with him. And she just couldn´t stop herself. And, of course, everything about him was great.

I really believe that she loves me. But I also really believe that she underestimated her feelings to the guy and still is not fully aware of them. To me, it is obvious that she is totally in love with this guy.

I think she needs some time to process her feelings. I feel like after 6 months or so, we could talk again. Let all the euphoria and fresh love feelings settle. If she wants, we could talk again, then. I am curious if he really is such a good fit, or if this is just this fresh love euphoria. But then again, I am not waiting for her and we will probably never be together again.

But for now, it is just painful to watch how her intimacy and feelings for this guy grow from day to day, while our relationship is getting damaged and we get caught up in these stupid fights.

I don´t want to feel her slip out of my hand, so I just let go.

[Kwothe28]

36 minutes ago, Kibo said:

But what I come to realize is the absurd obsession she has with this guy. It is like her life depended on him. At no time she was willing to agree on any compromise. It was always all in for her. She HAD to see him at least once a week. She HAD to have sex without condom with him. And she just couldn´t stop herself. And, of course, everything about him was great.

 

I feel like you dont see the woods from the trees. Condom thing is largely irrelevant when she is literally in love with another man and just waited for him to end his relationship so they can be together.Good thing you ended it. Sadly, you were the 3rd wheel in there.

[waffle]

On 3/12/2024 at 5:26 AM, Kibo said:

So we talked and made some rules:

-we would only have sex without condom with each other (to mitigate the risk of sexual diseases)
-if we date other people, we don´t do it over a longer period of time (so we don´t catch feelings for someone else)

Your rules, while not uncommon in situations like this, are unenforceable.  How do you legislate someone else's feelings?  You can't.  You also have no control over someone else's condom use.

I'm not saying don't keep the lines of communication open.  But recognize the risks.  Sort of reminds me of that '70s song "Fooled Around and Fell In Love."

[AshyCat85]

I feel for you. I myself am in an open relationship. Although you could consider me the side of their relationship. Anyway, he was happy for me to have sex with others and play the field initially. Then a few months ago wanted to keep me for himself. I haven't dated anyone else because for me I just have to have that intellectual bond as well and don't have sex for the sake of it. Perhaps she is catching deep feelings. In my opinion, over time I think when you settle into a routine, someone either becomes more deeply bonded and others become bored. The dynamic is hard. I used get jealous when he talked about his partner but then i knew what I was signing up for. We can play naiivity here but everyone eventually catches feelings and wants to just become two. There are the odd exceptions. I'm sorry you have been feeling this way it doesn't feel nice. I would think either explain your feelings clearly that you no longer want an open relationship (which maybe you're scared to admit?) or at least change the rules. 

[catfeeder]

I don't think it makes sense in an open relationship to discuss the people outside the primary one. It sounds like the perfect way to unravel and sabotage the relationship.

Not that I'm an expert, I think most relationships are complex enough without adding additional exploits, and then trying to pretend that it's honest to rub those in a partner's face. As though the only emotions allowed are unconditional support of another testing how well one can pretend to not be jealous. I don't see anything 'loving' about that.