Online Dating for the 2nd Time - A Journal

[NorthDallas40]

to me, this has been a very low contact scenario with the fact that brenda never seems to initiate anything. I don't think you have overcontacted her. If you matched her communication style, you would never text her because she doesn't initiate herself.

 

---bingo---

[Batya33]

To me, this has been a very low contact scenario with the fact that Brenda never seems to initiate anything. I don't think you have overcontacted her. If you matched her communication style, you would never text her because she doesn't initiate herself.

 

I agree other than the suggestion when they first met that she text every day. I simply wouldn't take that kind of risk with a new person in that scenario. But again that's just me/my opinion. That's not about matching a communication style and it's not really about communication - it's about asking someone to initiate every day in a specific way in a context where she doesn't know the person well at all. Totally fine if she'd mentioned that she likes that kind of fun game/approach but she didn't. And sure she might have been charmed by it - but I wouldn't risk it that early on. Too much of a downside risk.

[saluk]

Maybe this is just me, but I would be very turned off if one of my dates asked me to text every day (I'll text when I feel like texting), or emailed me something and then texted me telling me to look at my email. Like, I check my email (I get a notification on my phone when a new one comes in!), I'll read the dang thing when I normally check it. I get enough spam from people I'm not dating thank you very much!

 

But that may be what some people want - a little chase - so I don't know.

[SweetGirl28]

Maybe this is just me, but I would be very turned off if one of my dates asked me to text every day (I'll text when I feel like texting), or emailed me something and then texted me telling me to look at my email. Like, I check my email (I get a notification on my phone when a new one comes in!), I'll read the dang thing when I normally check it. I get enough spam from people I'm not dating thank you very much!

 

But that may be what some people want - a little chase - so I don't know.

 

That's what I was trying to say yesterday, dial it back a bit. It can be a turn off to feel like you need to text a potential partner every day, unless that connection is strong. Chase shows interest, but a "hey I'm busy" "ok then text me everyday" whatever it was, something like that, is too much.

[NorthDallas40]

My band's show tonight is put on by the same guy and held at the same venue where SHAY came to see me DJ awhile back. I'm also going to DJ there tomorrow night.

 

BRENDA confirmed she'll be there tonight.

 

DAKOTA confirmed she'll be there tomorrow night.

[NorthDallas40]

Maybe this is just me, but I would be very turned off if one of my dates emailed me something and then texted me telling me to look at my email.

 

This is my standard procedure when I meet someone new and communicate on another platform with them for the first time: I alert them on the platform that we've already established is working that I've contacted them on the new platform.

 

I have no idea how often people check their email, nor can I guarantee that I have their email address or phone number correct the first time I contact them that way. If someone new texted me that they just sent me an email, I would assume this is why they were doing it: just to make sure it gets through, not that they're pestering me needlessly.

 

But by all means, please everyone continue to inform me of all the ways I'm crowding BRENDA. It's very helpful.

[NorthDallas40]

The event we played tonight was a small horror film festival, so were playing in a huge room in front of a stage (where guests were interviewed). Half the room filled with seats to watch us/the stage, and the other half consisted of various vendor tables, so people walked freely around and talked while we played.

 

BRENDA texted me she'd be a little late for the show tonight because of traffic. She showed up about halfway through our set, looked AMAZING from across the room, and wandered around looking at stuff before she took a seat all the way in the back of the room.

 

When we were done, we waved hi and I went to talk to her. Immediately it felt a little forced; this was definitely not her kind of event (she tends for way more upscale setting), and her big news was telling me her thoughts about the new A STAR IS BORN movie.

 

I asked how her writing was going and she evaded and dissembled; I have no idea if she wrote a word or wrote 30 pages.

 

The conversation eventually warmed up slightly, and luckily she was turned to me the whole time. I asked if she had eaten, suggesting we go get dinner nearby. She declined, saying she had eaten a few hours earlier.

 

After a bit more chit-chat, she finally apologized for being distracted, saying that her near-80-yo father wasn't well, and she was thinking she might have to fly to Shanghai to see him, believing he might pass away soon. Of course I was comforting and we talked about him a bit, though the entire topic felt like a excuse for the brush-off. I wasn't really buying it, tbh. And indeed it didn't take long for her to say "Well you should hang out with your band. Where's the restroom?"

 

I waited for her to finish, and when she came out she asked, "Walk me to my car?"

 

We walked to her car, she looked beautiful, was very friendly and smiling... and told me how nice and sweet I was. Not good.

 

"So would you like to go out again sometime?" I asked, knowing the answer.

 

She smiled, paused, and said "Wellll... not right now."

 

"Of course. Maybe I'll check in sometime in a week."

 

She smiled, said "Ok," and went in for a hug.

 

I tried to kiss her on the lips and got a cheek.

 

She left, and that's probably it.

 

--------------------

 

After I got back inside, I told my guitarist what just happened, he put on a sad face, then told me the girl he's been dating on and off blew up at him today and didn't show up for our gig either, even though she was supposed to bring 4 other people.

 

Sad Sack Friday.

[Batya33]

Sorry it didn’t work out and glad you and the guitarist could commiserate. In a good way you have the information you need. At least you had beautiful scenery to look at during and after your performance. From what I read i believe her father is unwell and agree that is not why she ended the night. And certainly within reason you want someone flexible enough to try different venues and activities.

[NorthDallas40]

I have not communicated with SHAY in any way for over a month.

 

This morning she texted:

 

"Do you think we can be friends?"

[Realitynut]

And???? lol

The guy I've seen off and on for 5 years....then disappears on me every single time we have sex...or a disagreement...just walked into my bedroom this morning after not hearing or seeing him for 3 weeks. He was suppose to go on a 12 day trip with me out west. Then the week before he said, I NEVER said I'd go. So.....he's burned 100's of bridges in the last 5 years. So when he walked in...I just kept my head covered, never looked at him and answered him as shortly as possible. (did you take pics. Yeah. Lost my phone.) did you have a good time? A little. He finally left.

It's taken me a long time to get over him....and it hurts to hear from someone after they've disappeared.

 

But hey...I went back THOUSANDS of times.....so did you ignore Shay?

 

Maybe she can be another Dakota......

[NorthDallas40]

BTW - this post-intimacy "let's be friends" phenomenon seems to be a thing with several Korean-American women I've dated.

 

- 9 years ago I met a KA woman on FB, we met at a party that night, and we ended up making out and sleeping in our underwear at her place (no sex, but plenty of sexually-adjacent activity). Over the course of the next weeks I tried to get a second date as we texted daily (she being extremely snarky the whole time), but at one point she said "Can't we be just fwiiiiiiends?" We ended up having dinner about a month later but she seemed to be doing it as a favor so afterwards I stopped contact and so did she.

 

- I dated a KA Christian high school teacher 4 years ago for a month and we had sex several times. After I finally attended her church's night service one evening, after dinner she said she wanted to date other people... but when I dropped her off at her place, she said wanted to have sex with me. I declined, we met for lunch a week later to discuss our future, she had sex with me after lunch, then a week later said I was an awesome guy but not the one for her. So I interpret that last sex session as her wanting to be FWB without informing me.

 

- Two years ago I dated a sex-crazy KA woman for about a month. Before she dumped me for utterly nonsensical reasons a week later, she asked me - after just having had sex - "If we don't work out, can we still have sex together?"

 

- I went on about 5 dates with a KA woman earlier this year but we only ever kissed a few times. She seemed kind of a negative and rather boring person, so after our last date (where she nearly fell asleep at dinner), I stopped contacting her. About 10 days later she texted "Would a proposal to hang out as friends be too awkward?" I didn't reply.

 

- And now SHAY. For a bit of context, my last email to her said "SHAY, you deserve to have a strong, patient, caring, reliable, fun, responsible and loving person in your life, and your son deserves the same when the time is right. I’d be honored just to even be considered for that role. So if you still have feelings for me, please don’t assume that my lifestyle isn’t compatible with yours, or that your work and family demands mean that we should end things altogether. Reach out to me instead. Whenever you like. :)"

[NorthDallas40]

I'm torn on how to respond to SHAY's "Do you think we can be friends?" text, if at all.

 

Some ideas I'm musing...

 

"What would that look like to you?"

 

or

 

"If it includes sex, sure."

 

or

 

"With benefits?"

 

or

 

"Read my last email. All of it remains true. Let me know when you've read it."

(she says she re-read it)

"Thank you. To answer your question, we can certainly be no-strings-attached friends as long as you're ok with me trying to get you into bed on a regular basis."

[Batya33]

I would assume she means platonic and I would reply yes if you want to be friends with her including discussing her dating life just as you've done with Dakota. And sure you can ask her -within the context of platonic -what that would look like - friends who just text/keep in touch, friends who do activities together or she comes to see your band perform, etc.

[itsallgrand]

Sounds like the answer is no. You want more than to be her buddy. Why not just say that. ?

[NorthDallas40]

I would assume she means platonic and I would reply yes if you want to be friends with her including discussing her dating life just as you've done with Dakota.

 

And as far as DAKOTA goes, I broke up with her, not the other way around, as with SHAY. And despite her repeated attempts to communicate, I went strictly NC with DAKOTA for eight months. And the only reason we started hanging out was because we ran into each other by chance at a movie, she was completely hostile when we did, yet emailed me a couple of days later to hang out as friends, at which point I capitulated, knowing full well that I didn't want to be intimate with her but that there was a decent chance that she wanted to rekindle our relationship.

 

Back to SHAY, she and I went out eight times. Every time, including the first date, we kissed or were physical in some way, and - when possible - it escalated with every meetup. In fact, on many dates we spent more time being intimate than talking. And as the physical intimacy on our dates increased, the time spent communicating between dates decreased, and not because of me.

 

So I find her request utterly baffling. We haven't communicated in a month, and towards the end of our dating, she barely responded when I tried. Does she really just suddenly miss my texts/emails/calls and dinners so much that she would forgo being intimate with me in order to have a friend? It would actually make much more sense to me if she was actually trying to set up a FWB situation.

 

Then again, like men, women don't always make a lot of sense.

[NorthDallas40]

Hell, SHAY may actually be trying to set up FWBs with several different guys for all I know.

 

Or maybe she's dating someone else and just wants a guy friend to talk with about him.

 

Or maybe she's just feeling lonely this morning. Or she feels guilty for turning me down.

 

I just don't get why she felt the need to get back in touch to be "friends" when I made it clear in my last email that I wanted to be in a relationship, or at least on the road to one.

[Batya33]

So what I meant as far as Dakota was that you were able to be friends with her and I meant that because you didn't want to be with her - so it's easy to discuss her dating life and her "marriage".

 

I think there's no point in exploring what Shay means unless you want to be platonic friends. If she wants to have sex with you she has to be clearer and you've expressed interest in the past in a sexual arrangement with various women who might not be suitable/available for a serious relationship (maybe including Shay, don't remember) so you can decide then. But yes - I'd respond with "thanks for your message. I'm not quite sure what you mean by friends." I think she is bored and misses your flattering attention and doesn't want to explore anything serious with you. So she's referring to it as friends because at least she'd get male attention from someone who wants to have sex with her which can give the little thrill or ego boost she might be seeking.

[SweetGirl28]

Willing to bet men are ditching her so she turns back to ole reliable-she knows he likes her, so she'll use him.

[Batya33]

Willing to bet men are ditching her so she turns back to ole reliable-she knows he likes her, so she'll use him.

 

Yesss I considered that too because I don't think she was a good friend to him -she was flaky and unreliable.

[milly007]

I'm guessing that Shay is missing the consistent attention from ND, and although she is still not sure what she wants or that she's unable to commit to a full blown relationship, she would rather propose keeping him as a friend, since this way she still gets his attention, with the possibility of some physical intimacy. The relationship would also be a distraction from the stress that comes with her job and the divorce.

 

It would be one thing if neither ND and Shay weren't attracted to each other, but the fact that there was clearly a physical attraction between them makes a friendship nearly impossible.

 

Shay is proposing friendship, but she knows full well that if and when they spend time together, they'll both give into temptation (especially if alcohol is involved).

 

Even if ND were to ask her what a friendship would constitute between the two of them, what she says in reply and what actually happens between the two of them in person will turn out to be two completely different things.

 

I've tried being friends with men I was attracted to. Truth be told, I was only fooling myself, and so is Shay if she believes that a platonic friendship is possible.

[NorthDallas40]

i'm guessing that shay is missing the consistent attention from nd, and although she is still not sure what she wants or that she's unable to commit to a full blown relationship, she would rather propose keeping him as a friend, since this way she still gets his attention, with the possibility of some physical intimacy. The relationship would also be a distraction from the stress that comes with her job and the divorce.

 

It would be one thing if neither nd and shay weren't attracted to each other, but the fact that there was clearly a physical attraction between them makes a friendship nearly impossible.

 

Shay is proposing friendship, but she knows full well that if and when they spend time together, they'll both give into temptation (especially if alcohol is involved).

 

Even if nd were to ask her what a friendship would constitute between the two of them, what she says in reply and what actually happens between the two of them in person will turn out to be two completely different things.

 

I've tried being friends with men i was attracted to. Truth be told, i was only fooling myself, and so is shay if she believes that a platonic friendship is possible.

 

i am 100% okay with this

[Batya33]

Maybe ND and Dakota can double date with Shay and her husband. I agree with Milly (and SG) - good points!

[NorthDallas40]

Maybe ND and Dakota can double date with Shay and her husband. I agree with Milly (and SG) - good points!

 

Ha - I'm already 50% there... I cancelled on DJing tonight so I could work on freelance stuff, so I let DAKOTA know. She responded by asking me to see a movie with her on Monday night and I accepted, pending work responsibilities.

[milly007]

i am 100% okay with this

 

Lol. This doesn't surprise me, ND. :)

 

And no offense with respect to what I'm about to say, ND, but...if you do agree with being "friends", I'd recommend to all of you ENA'ers to place your bets in terms of what you think's gonna happen between Ms. Shay and Mr. North as "friends". Lol.

[SweetGirl28]

Lol. This doesn't surprise me, ND. :)

 

And no offense with respect to what I'm about to say, ND, but...if you do agree with being "friends", I'd recommend to all of you ENA'ers to place your bets in terms of what you think's gonna happen between Ms. Shay and Mr. North as "friends". Lol.

 

He'll get sucked in, used, and rightfully deserving to be because he doesn't seem to talk with very much respect towards women, really. So my bet is she will entertain him until she finds what she's looking for. On her terms. No wiggle room. Her way, or no way. And he will cave because he thinks fwb at near 50 is admirable. Call it something else. That's for young people. It's NSA sex. Which I'm not convinced she's wanting. There's probably another motive. Then he will fall for her, blame her, and they never speak again. The end. Lol