At what age does being a PUA get creepy?

[tylercdurden2004]

I don't know sometimes so I get hurt.

 

I haven't met a guy who "picks up" women who hasn't been hurtful in some way providing that I care enough about what he's been doing.

 

Dietrying

 

You wont here me argue that there is no guy out there that wont hurt you. Some may even try to hurt you.

 

But think about it. For most people they will have to date around before finding "the one". Even at that there is a 50% divorce rate plus how many unhappy in the 50% that stay together.

 

The only way to do things is to move forward. To date. Date as many as you are comfrotable with, but never settle just for the sake of settling.

 

The problem with many of these nice guys is they live most of their young adult life unhappy. They yearn for female attention but dont know how to interact with females in a way that females find attractive. Instead they end up neing "friends" with them all the while yearning.

 

On the flip side many women find a guy attractive but because of social norms etc they never approach the man. The man being too nice never approaches them.

 

I am all for everyone being able to go out an get what they want. There are limitations and obstructions to this, but its not impossible.

 

I really do believe the world as a whole would be better is some of these things were, well, understood.

 

If a guy can go up to 100 women and get their numbers all the power to him. If a woman can get 100 guys asking for her number all the power to her.

 

Imagine if we all had options.

[tylercdurden2004]

You can't see how it would be annoying for a girl to be approached by four guys in an a hour, all with the same artificial patter, all trying to get into her pants without even knowing who she is?

 

I can see that. So what as a society can we do to stop that?

 

Everyone has a choice whether to be offended or not and everyone has a choice to be annoyed or not.

 

I am not particularily worried is a woman is annoyed in life. That is her choice. Just like it is mine.

[dietrying]

Thanks, JadedStar. I just don't personally appreciate that.

 

I think it's all about what you're attracted to. I'm pretty shy so I love introverted shy guys without much experience. Provided they can open up to me and don't whine about not having a gf. lol

[tylercdurden2004]

I don't think it is so much that Carrie cares as it is that she is a young woman out there in the dating field and it is pretty disconcerting to run into a bunch of player's and pick up artists. Sure she can shrug them off, but she is also allowed to be aggravated by the whole scene.

 

Her aggravation won't likely change anything, but its a valid emotion given the issue.

 

Just because it doesn't bother or matter to me doesn't mean that the whole thing isn't bothersome to many.

 

Of course she can be annoyed, angry, bothered. Its perfectly fine to have emotions. But you choose how you react to things.

 

Carrie is not going to avoid being hit on by guys or player for that matter unless she locks herself up in a box somewhere.

[Adrian28]

Look at these forums, it is littered with posts from guys who don't know how to handle relationships with women...

 

"when should I call her?"..

"she said this or that.. what does it mean?"..

"there is this girl in my gym/work/school/whatever, how do I talk to her?"

"I like this girl, but what if she doesn't like me?"

 

etc..etc..

 

All being a PUA does is to help you answer these questions yourself.

 

- To know how to approach and get to know a woman you are interested in

- To not be afraid of rejection

- To be a better man

 

That is ALL!

 

Of course, some use these developed skills for other purposes, but that is not the basis of being a PUA.

[dietrying]

Well it's about numbers. Nothing at all wrong with a guy who has dated before. But 100 is excessive. And keep in mind that I'm 18.

[JadedStar]

Thanks, JadedStar. I just don't personally appreciate that.

 

I think it's all about what you're attracted to. I'm pretty shy so I love introverted shy guys without much experience. Provided they can open up to me and don't whine about not having a gf. lol

 

I think because i am NOT shy is why it doesn't bother me.

 

I think that when I was shy and younger it would have bothered me a lot more. I am not sure why, but it does seem to be a correlation between shy or assertive females and their tolerance levels to this.

 

Because I am not shy I am also not going to be nervous when out and about and approached so that is probably why.

[Adrian28]

You can't see how it would be annoying for a girl to be approached by four guys in an a hour, all with the same artificial patter, all trying to get into her pants without even knowing who she is?

 

If men did not do that and approach women they are attracted to, a lot of posters on this forum would not have been born.. including you.

 

Welcome to mating and the human race.

[Daddy Bear]

I can see that. So what as a society can we do to stop that?

 

Not defending it would be a good start, methinks.

 

Everyone has a choice whether to be offended or not and everyone has a choice to be annoyed or not.

 

That may be a little too Zen to have any practical application.

 

I am not particularily worried is a woman is annoyed in life. That is her choice. Just like it is mine.

 

Spoken like a true Tyler Durden. I'm a bit less nihilistic when it comes to women I care about being beseiged by slobbering primates.

[tylercdurden2004]

Well it's about numbers. Nothing at all wrong with a guy who has dated before. But 100 is excessive. And keep in mind that I'm 18.

 

Come on. You know I was using 100 as an example.

 

 

The point is Carrie that you will never know what the guy you start dating is doing. As time goes on you might get more of an idea. But we all have our different opinions on what is tolerable and thats what makes life challenging and interesting.

 

How you find a guy who turns your crank and doesnt date other chicks will be something you have to find out. I dont darte guys so I cant tell you where to find them.

 

But somehow I dont really think the "Nice Guy" turns your crank.

[dietrying]

 

But somehow I dont really think the "Nice Guy" turns your crank.

 

I cry my eyes out almost every night over a "nice guy" whose never had a gf so I would say so. lol

[tylercdurden2004]

Not defending it would be a good start, methinks.

 

 

 

That may be a little too Zen to have any practical application.

 

 

 

Spoken like a true Tyler Durden. I'm a bit less nihilistic when it comes to women I care about being beseiged by slobbering primates.

 

Defending guys talking to woman and women having the option to turn them down. Not sure what that would do.

 

Zen? Bendy I thought you were all about Zen. But again its all about choice not smoking dope with Buddha.

 

Why woud you care about what women think when they are annoyed. At the end of the day there is nothing you can do about it. as long as its not abusive or harms anyone the whats the worry. Not sure what you mean by true tyler durden though.

[tylercdurden2004]

I cry my eyes out almost every night over a "nice guy" whose never had a gf so I would say so. lol

 

Then why dont you go out and get him?

[Dating Coach]

The personal attacks that you're fond of making don't win arguments. If you disagree with my definition of PUA, show me one that refutes it. Don't ever tell me where I can post or what I can say.

 

I have. I already described my brothers friend who learned better social skills with women and is not in a relationship. I also posted a YouTube link where Mystery read a letter asking if the Method can lead to a relationship and Mystery responded as yes, and said he receives emails and letters from guy who used to to help them as such.

 

I have provided evidence that not all PUA's are Player, you've added zero evidence to show all PUA's as Players.

[Raiden]

"Nice Guy"

 

You know.... and not pointing the finger at tyler, but I think people are starting to use the term "Nice Guy" as a derogative.

 

What would the average girl prefer? A sex-mad pervert OR a love-shy virgin?

 

Be honest.

[DN]

Moderator Note:

 

I closed a similar thread to this one this afternoon because people insist on making personal attacks. I will close this one if it continues on here.

 

A debate about pick-up artists is fine. An acrimonious argument is not and will result in the thread being closed.

 

Your choice.

[Dating Coach]

You can't see how it would be annoying for a girl to be approached by four guys in an a hour, all with the same artificial patter, all trying to get into her pants without even knowing who she is?

 

Yes, I can see why it would be annoying. It's those socially inept guys whom are the ones annoying these girls because they don't have the social skills in order to represent themselves in a non-creepy annoying manner.

 

Look at the show. Watch those nice shy guys try to pick up on girls. They totally are turning women off and making them feel very awkward. Then watch Mystery go in there. No woman is feeling awkward, no woman is begging to get out of the conversation with him, etc.

 

That's the very definition of learning superior social skills. To represent yourself in a way that's not annoying and unattractive.

[bubblyblonde11]

When - when it becomes extreamely desperate! IMO

[Adrian28]

I have. I already described my brothers friend who learned better social skills with women and is not in a relationship. I also posted a YouTube link where Mystery read a letter asking if the Method can lead to a relationship and Mystery responded as yes, and said he receives emails and letters from guy who used to to help them as such.

 

I have provided evidence that not all PUA's are Player, you've added zero evidence to show all PUA's as Players.

 

Not all PUAs are Players as you say.

 

But, even if they were, so what? I am not sure I understand this negativity. A player doesn't force women to have sex with him. When a women is with a player, she KNOWS he is a player. And KNOWS what he is all about.

 

I think Mystery is in a long term relationship himself, and so is David D'Angelo. So, to say PUAs are only players is wrong. But, even if there were...

 

Could the negativity be a result of jealousy?

[bubblyblonde11]

Four words - Duece Bigalo Male Giggalo

[tylercdurden2004]

You know.... and not pointing the finger at tyler, but I think people are starting to use the term "Nice Guy" as a derogative.

 

What would the average girl prefer? A sex-mad pervert OR a love-shy virgin?

 

Be honest.

 

Ken I dont mind if you call me out. I stand behind my arguments.

 

Heres what I mean by "Nice Guy"

 

link removed

 

Yes it is derogatory to some degree I guess, Simply because its not a positive thing.

 

Have you picked up this book yet as I suggested?

[dietrying]

Then why dont you go out and get him?

 

He doesn't want a relationship with me apparently. We've talked about it and he likes the way we are now. You can break hearts no matter what your label is, lol.

[tylercdurden2004]

He doesn't want a relationship with me apparently. We've talked about it and he likes the way we are now. You can break hearts no matter what your label is, lol.

 

So you went after a guy you liked?

 

No luck?

 

 

And you are right. No matter what people label you you will still break hearts. Its inveitable.

[dietrying]

So you went after a guy you liked?

 

No luck?

 

 

And you are right. No matter what people label you you will still break hearts. Its inveitable.

 

We were friends first and I made the mistake of not hinting that I had started to want more until I was already too hurt, and I never directly asked for or admitted anything. As far as he knows I was just having a bad day that day, lol. But he did mention that we are just friends and not in a relationship.

[Daddy Bear]

Defending guys talking to woman and women having the option to turn them down. Not sure what that would do.

 

You've mischaracterized the subject at hand. I'm all for dialogue with respectful intent. How do you think I met the women I've been with?

 

Well... some of them approached me, but still... it isn't intergender contact that we were talking about. Change the subject, and the point goes to the other side.

 

Zen? Bendy I thought you were all about Zen. But again its all about choice not smoking dope with Buddha.

 

I'm neither a Buddhist nor a potsmoker. We're not going to get anywhere by slinging mud (referring to the latter) at one another. You and I can keep it above that level, I think.

 

Why woud you care about what women think when they are annoyed. At the end of the day there is nothing you can do about it. as long as its not abusive or harms anyone the whats the worry. Not sure what you mean by true tyler durden though.

 

I equate the Durden character from Fight Club with nihilism and Machiavellianism. To say that it doesn't matter how women feel and that nothing should be done to protect them from unwanted sexual advances -which is what PUAs spend most of their energy doing! - is to take a step in that unfortunate direction.