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Thread: Should I keep fighting.. Is this fixable?

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    Should I keep fighting.. Is this fixable?

    TLDR at the end of post. Sorry for the wall of text, but I felt like I needed to provide a lot of context. Iím hoping to get some perspective on my situation, I know we all have unique stories, so here is mine. I will use different names to help keep anonymity. My name is Mikey(36M), and her name is Jane(39F). Just writing this seems to help me vent out my emotions and maybe someone will see it and Iíll get lucky and get some good advice via comments.

    Back in 2005 I was hanging out with the wrong crowd and ended up in the meth scene(I know, itís stupid). I was 21/22 years old and just generally not making the best decisions. I met a co-worker at the time who was also involved in the wrong things, we will call him John. For a year or so, John and I would run around town doing and selling meth. We would end up crashing at his place frequently, because I couldnít go home to my girlfriend at the time all messed up. I actually started doing the drugs because she had cheated on me and I was depressed over it(she did it because she didnít like that I was smoking weed..lol), and I wanted a way to escape(even though we were supposed to be working it out), but that ex is a whole different story and not really too important for this story. John had a son with Jane, who was barely 1 year old. Jane also had a 4-year old daughter from a previous relationship mistake. She stopped doing drugs and was trying to do right for her son(and daughter) before and after he was born, so she was never involved in drugs(when I was), and would be angry(rightfully) with John for his continued involvement with this stuff. However, she would still let me come down, and stay at the house, and was a very caring person. I would be fed and we all would talk, and I became friends with her as well. It started to bother me when John and I would go out on missions around town, and he would cheat on her with other women while doing drugs, and it especially bothered me even more when I found out he physically abused her.

    This went on for around a year, and towards the end Jane ended up breaking up with him for cheating. Around this time, my problems came to a head with my ex when she cheated on me again. I was busy dealing with that situation for a few days, and moving out of my apartment with the ex, when John called and told me something to the effect of ďRemember that eight-ball we fronted so and so? Well he still hasnít given the money for it, itís time to regulateĒ. I told him I couldnít go and was busy with a ton of drama already. John ended up going to confront this person over the owed money, and he brought another acquaintance along with him.. Long story short, John ended up beating the guy up for not having his money, and once he had done that, the acquaintance randomly pulled out a pistol and shot the guy. Yes, donít do drugs kids, because life is hardly worth an eight-ball! Anyways, John is still in jail to this day for accessory to murder(will be for another year or two).

    Now I had always had a small crush on Jane, as she was very strong, stubborn(in a good way), independent, but also very kind hearted, brutally honest, and just a wonderful soul to be around. But this crush didnít matter, as I realized first off, I didnít want to be ďthat guyĒ that was hitting her up right after what she went through with John. I also didnít want to betray my friend who was in jail, and they have a kid together. She also had a lot of baggage, and ended up living with a female lesbian friend for years after John went to jail. So we basically were good friends for many years, we would just drink/hangout, bull, and have a good time(with our other friends as well). I would also help her out when I could, even small things like give the kids(thatís Iíve known most of their lives) birthday cards/money/ect. Now there was a point at about the 8 year mark, where we had got drunk and kissed one time, and discussed the possibility of a relationship, but I honestly got scared and it didnít happen(I foolishly ranÖ). She was ready to leave her lesbian ďfriendĒ and move on, and also claimed she didnít want John back when he got out. She also said she was with the lesbian friend because she was ďdoing what she had to do to make it with her kidsĒ....

    This didnít happen though, and we remained friends(this was in like 2012). In late 2013 , I had finished college(yes I finally got my together), and I moved from New Mexico to Colorado for a job. We still talked and missed each other, and after I was here for a year-ish, Jane decided to move to Colorado too. It wasnít just for me, she wanted to get her kids in better schooling and she did want to get out of New Mexico too. Well, after she had been here for a small amount of time, I actually moved in with her to help out(still friends). Well this didnít last very long, and we flirted and talked about our feelings(we both had liked each other in a different way for a while now) Even though I took FOREVER to make a first move(was still scared, I know, itís stupid).. We did end up falling in love though. We had good times for the most part and life was great for us. We did have a couple of blowouts, and one included my frustration with her not telling her kids about us. I understand she was just trying to protect them, but it made it so hard for me to show affection(physical or emotional) when they were around(which is a lot). She also keeps in touch with John over the phone while heís in jail and didnít want to tell him(she said she was afraid for her son who talks to him, and that John might do something to hurt himself, which in turn will hurt the son)Öand I get it.

    Now while John was in jail, he ended up getting a decent sized settlement from the prison(for ďmistreatmentĒ) shortly before she moved to Colorado, and it was entrusted to her. She ended up blowing the entire amount(even though she wasnít supposed to). A good amount of it was spent on moving and paying for rent in between jobs, and getting her a better car, but some of it was definitely spent in a splurge(not really by me at all, except for a few trips to the amusement park). She ended up telling me should would let John know about us, and tell her kids, but she needed to replace the money she owes him first(understandable).. She almost drove out there to tell him anyways at one point, but the jail had shut down(legitimately) for the weekend, due to security(at least thatís what she said, and I believe it). We decided we would save up to give him the money back, before she told him. She has got a few student loan checks that were supposed to help pay him back, but we ended up spending them(most was on needed things though..) We had also had a disagreement/argument at one point about how she lets her daughter(now 20 years old) kinda do whatever. Iíve known the daughter most of her life too, and have done a ton to help her out, but she is very out of control(kinda like the ďCash me outsideĒ girl if you know who that is)... Even though the daughter caused us a lot of grief, and has moved in and out of the house numerous times, and disrespected us and our home numerous times, I still cared about her as I known her forever, and wanted her to do good in life, and still continued to help however I could.. Now in fairness to her daughter, she did see a lot of things she shouldnít have as a very young kid(when Jane was in the drug scene), but by the time she was 5 years old, her mom gave her the best life she could ask for or need(none of the kids never went without what they need)..
    Jane is a server by trade, and was working in a local restaurant down the road the whole time we were together, she got off fairly late(around 10pm) compared to my 9-5 job, but we still had plenty of time for each other. We also never really hurt for money much, and had more than everything we needed. Overall, everything was great, life was good.. Jane also started going part time to the community college to get a psychology degree, and chase her dream of helping drug addicts in need, which is awesome. Well, things got bad at her job(cut hours or whatever), and she ended up needing to quit around the beginning of this year. This caused stress on us financially as I struggled to pay the bills we both had. She started a new job at a bar a month or so later, and everything has just went downhill since. She worked from 4pm, until about 3am daily, 5 days a week, and took the summer off from school. This new schedule has made it very hard to spend any time together(especially when she has life obligations on a good amount of those days off). I got depressed about this, and was also stressed about issues with my health that started coming up. I should have said something about it, but she is so headstrong and stubborn, I felt like I couldnít tell her to ďnot work as muchĒ. I should have talked to her about this, but other than occasionally mentioning I missed her, I really didnítÖ. I did try to show her affection in other ways, like I would get up early for work, and be affectionate with her while she tried to sleep, and she did like that.. So since about April of this year, it feels like we have became more and more distant. She did mention it back in April, that I felt distant, but I told her I was just working a lot(which is true, and was stressed on the money problems). But she didnít tell me things were starting to get that bad at all(or the severity of it). I was also dealing with my mom who lives locally, as she had to fight uterine cancer in May, which was really stressful for me as well..

    Now pause here, so I can say a little background about Jane.. She had a troubled childhood, and was abused by a neighbor teen, as a child when she was like 6(in the sickest way possible). This really messed her up and she would do things like sleep with knives, and it freaked her mom out(who had already divorced her dad who lives in Germany). So her mom basically ended up giving her up to foster care, and Jane was moved from one foster home to another(kept getting abandoned, about 10 times), before her dad ended up taking her in, and she went to Germany. Now her dad is messed up too, and he abused her as a child as well.. She ended up running away from Germany and landed in New Mexico when she was 16. She went on a very angry drunken spiral and didnít have any respect for anyone when trying to deal with her past demons, but she ended up getting over it, at least enough to move on with life. She learned English on her own, and met the father of her daughter(a giant loser), and was a druggie for a few years until she got pregnant with her son. A few years after Jane had moved to Colorado, she found her long lost mom via Facebook, and her mom happened to live like 40 minutes away from us. They ended up creating a relationship, which is awesome that she forgave her mom and it worked like that.
    Well, her mom coming into the situation was a double edged sword, as I got along well with her mom, and her moms husband.. But her mom was also an added stress to our relationship(ie : taking away from the little time we did have for each other), but I got over that for the most part.

    Now back to the rest of the story from April until now.. a few months back, she was reminiscing with her mom, and her mom started talking about the time when she was young, and where they lived when she was assaulted.. This caused massive pain for Jane and she basically said she relived the whole assault all over again. We discussed this years ago, before her mom was even around, but there were additional details resurfaced she didnít remember or had repressed. When she brought this up to me, I honestly didnít know what to say to make her feel better about it(or how to fix it). I just told her I have her back and will do whatever to help her get through it(and held her tightly after I said it). Well apparently this, coupled with the distance due to her new job/schedule, has destroyed us. We did finally talk about 3 weeks ago, and I told her what the problems were, and she seemed very angry at me and life in general. We decided to try and fix it all. I decided to play a joke on her a week later, and opened her to phone to do something, and discovered a text message she forgot to delete, to a co-worker, saying she ďmissed himĒ. I immediately confronted her about it, and she got angry at first, but ended up admitting to an affair.. The Jane I know would never do this! She admitted to having feelings for him and cheating, but used the excuse of our recent distance to try and justify it. She also said that he has helped her through the new pain of these memories and that due to these resurfaced demons she is tired of fighting it all(he went through a similar thing as a child too she said). I basically stuck around for a few days trying to talk through it and save us, but she has completely done a 180 on me and was being extremely hateful towards me. Part of me wanted to just run away and never come back, but Iíve promised Jane on numerous occasions in the past that I would never abandon her..it was definitely an internal struggle. Long story short, she said 3 days later that she doesnít want to live together. I moved out, and have been talking to her a lot via text and phone. She is claiming this is really hard for her too, and she is truly sorry for doing this to me. She says she has a problem with self sabotage and that she has a habit of hurting everyone around her when she canít cope with life(new demons I suppose). She tells me she still loves me and that doesnít go away, but she wants space. Iím ok with that, even though it amazes me that I love her so much I tried to fix us after her betrayal, and she just pushes me away. She says she doesnít know what to do, feel or say. Jane is also a very angry person, and lets anger control her heart and mind when she gets very mad..She has a hard time letting the anger go.. I know this from previous experiences.

    She wouldnít even give me a face to face conversation when she wanted to throw me to the curb. She says that she does things she regrets when she is angry, and that she is so sorry that she ed me over, herself, and everything in general. Yet she continues to show coldness for the most part. I confronted her on 8/11 about it, so itís almost been 2 weeks. I moved in with family, and she freaked out when I left(even though she told me to), and I can definitely tell she is struggling with the whole situation and not sure if she has done the right thing.

    She has called me and told me she loves me , and we have both cried on the phone, but she still says via text she is going to keep talking to this guy(but only talk and thatís itÖ) However, she does not want me to disappear from her life either(at least altogether), and still wants to talk to me. This is all very confusing to me, and she says she wants to have a face to face conversation this Sunday(8/25), but itís a meetup/conversation for me to ask any questions I have, and for her to give me a hug.. and try to explain how she is feeling. She said she is trying to ďfigure her life outĒ while she focuses on school and her kids.. She also texts and says things like she has been drinking, and doesnít want to talk on the phone while sheís been drinking(she has always adored me and been even more affectionate when we drink).. and that she doesnít know what to feel, say or do.

    Itís like, well Iím already out of the house Jane, so how can you say that?! I tried to stick by her side and fight for her all along. I forgave her for the affair, and tried to make it right. Most people donít give forgiveness for this kind of betrayal, but my love for her is so genuine, that I couldnít just walk out and not look back after I found out, and maybe I should have... It just feels like Iím stuck with the most difficult decision ever. On one hand, Iím fine with giving her all the space she needs to work out the issues in her head, but at the same time, I canít stick around only to find out she has fell in love with this guy or someone else at some point in the future(it would crush and destroy me all over again). She claims itís not about him though, and itís about us, which I believeÖ Itís all just very sudden and confusing. I donít know if I can go back to just being friends at this point, which it seems like what she wants(even though she obviously doesnít really know exactly what she wants). Who gets cheated on, tries to forgive, and then gets strung along on an emotional roller-coaster ride for who knows how long? When is enoughÖenough? When should I give up?

    One lesson I have learned from all this, is that none of our relationships are ďcheaterĒ proof. Anything can change in a blink of an eye, before you even really see it coming. Relationships will always have their ups and downs, but if you/your partner donít handle the downs correctly, itís easy for someone else to sneak their way in when your feeling low.. Cherish what you have everyone, and remind your lover that you adore them daily! How I can get betrayed and abandoned all within a few weeks though? I have no clue. Itís like double/triple heartbreak. She even made love to me the day before I caught her, and told me how much she loves me.. I just don't understand how she can betray me, then do this...It's like I'm not worth the effort to save or fight for. But again, I wouldn't know how to deal with the demons and resurfaced memories she has either, so maybe this anger is some sort of coping mechanism. I will update this story with what happens on Sunday. She says she is going to be 100% honest with me from here on out, but again, just not sure where to go in my head.. I'm not 100% innocent in this whole thing, but I definitely deserve a lot better than this, and am not the betrayer here.. I'm not the one who came into this relationship with a ton of baggage, and I have still accepted hers and loved her unconditionally. I still love her with all my heart, even after all this heartbreak, which kind of sucks, because it would be so much easier if I didn't. I think a big part of it all too, is she is afraid we will never be the same, she even mentioned how Christmas/holidays will never be the same, because she thinks my family will just hate her forever, or that I will never trust her again(maybe she is right, but I don't agree). I believe anything can be fixed, but she doesn't even seem to want to put in the effort, like Iím not even worth fighting for..

    TLDR; At what point should you call it quits when someone cheats on you, then throws you to the curb, but still wants to stay in touch? Was it the right thing to do, for me to try and work it out, vs. just leaving right away and not looking back? Could something like this ever be fixed? Should I give us both more time, or even meet her on Sunday? Really, any advice on the whole situation would be greatly appreciated. Thanks for reading!

    Regards,
    ~Mikey

  2. #2
    Platinum Member DancingFool's Avatar
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    Cheating isn't about you, it's about their fundamental lack of character, which btw, has nothing to do with their troubled upbringing. Millions of people come from bad backgrounds and you know what they aren't? Cheaters. Stop making excuses for her lack of character.

    As for trying to work it out...I mean I can sit here and tell you all day long that you shouldn't do it, you are wasting your time, your life, your hopes on someone who doesn't deserve you.....buuuuuut....you need to arrive at that point yourself.

    Can it be fixed? NO. Let me explain. Cheaters don't cheat because you did or didn't do something, although they will blame you, society, their past, whatever they can for it. They'll rage, they'll act like a victim, they'll cry, they'll lie and above all else, they'll gaslight you. Why? Because they love love love the very act of deceit. It's a high better than drugs for them. Cheating in and of itself is a form of abuse, an "I have something over you, I'm harming you and you don't even know." It's a power trip for them over others. It.is.not.about.love. It's about control and deceit. IF they can fool you into trying to work things out, into sticking around, even bigger power trip.

    Cheating = I don't respect you, I don't care about, I don't care about our relationship, I don't care about your health and will totally put you at risk of STD's, I like hurting you because it makes me feel strong, I get off on cheating on you.

    NOW....do you really think this kind of a disordered mess who is out to intentionally harm you worth keeping and fighting for? I hope you understand that the answer is no. You get rid of these people with extreme prejudice.

  3. #3
    Platinum Member ThatwasThen's Avatar
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    If she's not willing to put in the work, Mike then you continuing to hope is futile. Stop all contact with her and tell her you are going No Contact so that you can get over her and find a woman that actually wants to be with you.

    If you don't have the strength to do that then get yourself into therapy to help you get the strength because you are just wasting a lot of time you could be using to find someone else. No one is going to look good to you as long as you are carrying a torch for her.

    She has been a lot of financial and emotional drain on you. Time to move on, I think.

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    Thank you for this, you have both made some very good points here, and I really appreciate the perspective. Cheaters definitely don't deserve to be forgiven. You're also making a good point in regards to the emotional and financial drain. Should I even bother meeting her on Sunday, for closure or what not at least?

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  6. #5
    Platinum Member ThatwasThen's Avatar
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    I think at this point you should go so that you can close the door on her and let her find herself without the comfort of you. If you keep it up with her you will be helping her to get over you. She is still talking to this guy. If she wanted it to work with you, she would drop all contact with him because she would realize it was disrespectful to you and would cause you to not trust her.

    She is trying to use you (again). From where I'm sitting, she's done enough of that when she allowed you to take on her debt to her jailed b/f. Leave her to sink or swim on her own. Don't enable her to use you to get over you. No more Mr. Nice Guy to her.

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    Platinum Member Wiseman2's Avatar
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    Sorry to hear this. She's a mess. Does she have drug or drinking or mood problems? Leave her to her own devices and leave the drama behind. Next time don't go for the adrenaline rush, it's bound to crash and burn like this.

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    "Don't enable her to use you to get over you" ..This is brilliant, thank you random awesome person on the internet lol, I never thought of it that way. She is definitely showing no respect for me at the moment still talking to him too. With all this happening lately, it feels like she is being very selfish.

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    She doesn't have drug problems, and no mood problems normally. It does seem she has mood problems after being caught. It feels like the old Jane I know comes through when we talk/text briefly, but then it's like she's a whole different person I dont know. She has also been drinking a lot more frequently over the last few months. It's almost like someone has taken the Jane I know, and replaced her with an evil twin lately. But the old Jane comes out briefly sometimes..

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    Platinum Member Rose Mosse's Avatar
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    This seems very drawn out and painful. She hurt and betrayed you and left you for someone else. I think anything beyond this point is riddled with too many issues. I'd be cautious about how long you linger in this limbo and while it's a good idea to take stock of your emotions and gather your thoughts, it's not a good idea to dwell on this for longer than you have to. The longer we stay stuck in one place (one way of thinking or in a painful rut) the more we adopt it as our new norm. In other words, you'll accommodate for this type of drama in your life because it'll become your normal. Don't condition yourself this way.

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    Originally Posted by Crushed303
    She doesn't have drug problems, and no mood problems normally. It does seem she has mood problems after being caught. It feels like the old Jane I know comes through when we talk/text briefly, but then it's like she's a whole different person I dont know. She has also been drinking a lot more frequently over the last few months. It's almost like someone has taken the Jane I know, and replaced her with an evil twin lately. But the old Jane comes out briefly sometimes..
    Drinking IS a drug problem. People who are trying to get or stay sober aren't usually encouraged to drink by sobriety counselors, are they?

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