Best Friend and ex lover visiting and staying with GF

[jackie103]

Hi everyone, I (29f) recently got into a monogamous and exclusive relationship - we'll call her C (26f). Some background information:

When C first admitted that she wanted to date me (early February), she mentioned that there is just one thing that I might not be okay with - there is a man (lets call him T) she met when they were both teens and they started out as friends first and then eventually became romantic and sexual. He is polyamorous and she is open to polyamory or monogamy. He lives in a different state and they visit each other once a year. This year, he will be visiting her in May and staying at her place. She calls him one of her best friends and that just like any best friend, even in a relationship, she would want to visit him and she would want him to visit her. I told her that I am not going to control who she is friends with but that polyamory is not for me and if we were going to work out, it would need to be monogamous. We agreed to date each other, take it slow to test the waters and see if we wanted to pursue something more serious. 

Mid February, I brought up my insecurities about T. She said they have been friends since they were 14 (I do not see how this is supposed to make me feel better about their relationship when the romantic and sexual boundaries have already been broken between them) and that they have good boundaries with one another. I brought up the fact that things happen when two people are alone and he may try to cross a boundary. She said if he were to cross a line, she would say something and/or kick him out and that she would do whatever to make me feel secure. After this discussion, I honestly felt good. I felt secure and trusted her wholly. 

After about a month of seeing each other, C asked to be in an exclusive and monogamous relationship. She said that she would tell T that she just wanted to be friends and that he would need to sleep on the couch when he was visiting. I didn't have too many negative feelings about T sleeping on the couch, I trusted her.

This past week, I was telling C about an experience that happened recently with a previous crush of mine, who C had vocalized she was a little insecure about.  The crush had laid her legs momentarily on me during a movie (this happened before me and C were exclusive). I didn't react to the crush's legs and I kind of just sat there and froze because I didn't know what to do. I wasn't exclusive with C, I don't actually know the crush's intention as women are usually touchy feely with other women, but I did know how C felt about her so i just chose to sit there and not react at all to the legs.  C was extremely upset and jealous over this incident and said that she had wished I set some boundaries knowing how she felt about the crush. She said that due to issues in all of her previous relationships, she especially sensitive because her partners always ended up doing something with the other person she was insecure about.  She wanted to feel reassured and secure and had asked that I (for the time being while she works on the insecurity and regains some trust) only hang out with the crush in a public space. I agreed as I obviously want her to feel secure in our relationship and I have no problem doing activities with crush in public spaces as we truly are just friends and have no romantic or sexual history. 

After this entire incident, I started feeling a lot of resentment and anger about the fact that I have to be okay with T staying over at her house. I don't know anyone in a monogamous relationship who would be okay with this. To me , it doesn't matter that they are "best friends". The emotional and sexual barrier has been crossed and the relationship dynamic will never be the same. I know that if something is going to happen between them two, it will happen regardless but I would feel much more comfortable if T found somewhere else to stay during his visit. I am fine with them spending time together but spending the night even if he is on the couch makes me extremely uncomfortable. 

Am I out of line for wanting this? I don't think I'm asking for too much.  I want to set this boundary and obviously if she is not okay with asking him to stay somewhere else, I need to seriously re-think this relationship as it would be out of line with what I want and value. Is there a healthy way to communicate this to her without making it sound like I'm trying to enforce a rule? I'm not interested in toxic behavior or manipulation.

 

EDIT: She did tell T that we are exclusive so he is aware of the relationship. She has said before he and her have respectful boundaries but I don't know this guy so I'm wary

[Batya33]

If she believes there is any chance he would cross a line then either she hasn't communicated to him that she is exclusive with you or he is not supportive of the relationship she has with you.  Also it's playing with fire to have someone stay at your house who you know might not respect such boundaries and it's inconsistent with being in a committed relationship with you.  She says she wants to have you feel secure so either she finds him a place to stay or pays for a hotel. Or she doesn't see him in person.  

How do you say it? "I feel uncomfortable and disrespected if T stays overnight at your home because you know he might not respect that you and he are platonic and he is not supportive of your relationship with me if he does that or might do that."  See what she says.  That might resolve it. If she says "the best I can do is promise I'll fend him off if he comes on to me but he is staying at my house" say "ok have a great time and I don't think that arrangement is something I can handle - sounds like your loyalties are more with him and you won't have him stay elsewhere even though you know he might come on to you."

[jackie103]

4 minutes ago, Batya33 said:

If she believes there is any chance he would cross a line then either she hasn't communicated to him that she is exclusive with you or he is not supportive of the relationship she has with you.  Also it's playing with fire to have someone stay at your house who you know might not respect such boundaries and it's inconsistent with being in a committed relationship with you.  She says she wants to have you feel secure so either she finds him a place to stay or pays for a hotel. Or she doesn't see him in person.  

How do you say it? "I feel uncomfortable and disrespected if T stays overnight at your home because you know he might not respect that you and he are platonic and he is not supportive of your relationship with me if he does that or might do that."  See what she says.  That might resolve it. If she says "the best I can do is promise I'll fend him off if he comes on to me but he is staying at my house" say "ok have a great time and I don't think that arrangement is something I can handle - sounds like your loyalties are more with him and you won't have him stay elsewhere even though you know he might come on to you."

Thanks for the response. To be clear, I was the one who brought up him crossing boundaries when we were discussing the issue before. I had mentioned my fear of him not being respectful and trying to make a move and how I know things happen between two people when they are alone. She said that that would be cheating and that she would set a boundary if that were to actually happen. 

He is also aware that we are in an exclusive relationship, she's communicated that to him. But I don't know this guy and I don't know his intentions

[Batya33]

8 minutes ago, jackie103 said:

Thanks for the response. To be clear, I was the one who brought up him crossing boundaries when we were discussing the issue before. I had mentioned my fear of him not being respectful and trying to make a move and how I know things happen between two people when they are alone. She said that that would be cheating and that she would set a boundary if that were to actually happen. 

He is also aware that we are in an exclusive relationship, she's communicated that to him. But I don't know this guy and I don't know his intentions

Oh ok so if she didn't say she suspects he will make a move then - what if he stays till 3am then goes back to a different house or hotel? What's the big difference? I absolutely would not have an ex boyfriend stay in my home without my husband here.  It's just not a good look.  Emergency -yes.  A "visit" - no.

You only need to trust her.  I don't think it's loyal on her part to hang out with him one on one in her home whether or not he stays over.  Meeting him in a public place -then it's a question of whether you trust her.  Why haven't you met him? Does he want to meet you? Speak to you?

[jackie103]

6 minutes ago, Batya33 said:

Oh ok so if she didn't say she suspects he will make a move then - what if he stays till 3am then goes back to a different house or hotel? What's the big difference? I absolutely would not have an ex boyfriend stay in my home without my husband here.  It's just not a good look.  Emergency -yes.  A "visit" - no.

You only need to trust her.  I don't think it's loyal on her part to hang out with him one on one in her home whether or not he stays over.  Meeting him in a public place -then it's a question of whether you trust her.  Why haven't you met him? Does he want to meet you? Speak to you?

Yep, those were my same thoughts on what the huge difference would be with him staying at her place or a hotel... But we do not live together and our relationship is still so early on, along with the ending of their romantic relationship being fairly recent (when we became exclusive, which has been 1 month). I think a part of me is frustrated and resentful that she was so upset about me and my former crush, when nothing had truly happened. It seems hypocritical of her. 

I haven't met him yet because he lives in another state, they only meet up once a year for a week or so. I brought him up briefly last weekend just asking about the date he would be arriving, and she did say that I could meet him. I said that I didn't know and I would need to think about it. 

I trust her but again, the late nights alone worry me. 

[Batya33]

4 minutes ago, jackie103 said:

Yep, those were my same thoughts on what the huge difference would be with him staying at her place or a hotel... But we do not live together and our relationship is still so early on, along with the ending of their romantic relationship being fairly recent (when we became exclusive, which has been 1 month). I think a part of me is frustrated and resentful that she was so upset about me and my former crush, when nothing had truly happened. It seems hypocritical of her. 

I haven't met him yet because he lives in another state, they only meet up once a year for a week or so. I brought him up briefly last weekend just asking about the date he would be arriving, and she did say that I could meet him. I said that I didn't know and I would need to think about it. 

I trust her but again, the late nights alone worry me. 

I didn't live with my husband until we married.  Why is that relevant to you that you don't live with her? You two promised to be exclusive and committed.  Just tell her that him staying overnight in her home is crossing a line and, to you, inconsistent with being in a committed relationship.

When my husband and I were dating about 2-3 months a man I never dated (but had considered dating a couple of years before -there was a good reason we didn't) who I was friends with wanted to meet my new bf but also wanted to see me privately for an hour before the plan at a local bar to talk to me about some personal stuff he was going through.  The only time in our entire relationship -we've been together since 2005 and dated in the past too - my husband said -no, I am not comfortable with that -I've never met him, this is a Friday night and it's not appropriate for you to see him one on one beforehand like that. 

I was a little surprised.  But I called my friend and told him this.  He totally agreed.  Why? Because his goal was to meet my boyfriend and befriend him, and get to know him hopefully since he and I were friends.  So we all went out and my friend went out of his way to be friendly to my boyfriend.  We ended up hanging out a couple of more times.  I put my new bf at a priority when it came to having him feel respected in our exclusive, ccommitted relationship.  I believe that is the right thing to do. 

[jackie103]

19 minutes ago, Batya33 said:

I didn't live with my husband until we married.  Why is that relevant to you that you don't live with her? You two promised to be exclusive and committed.  Just tell her that him staying overnight in her home is crossing a line and, to you, inconsistent with being in a committed relationship.

When my husband and I were dating about 2-3 months a man I never dated (but had considered dating a couple of years before -there was a good reason we didn't) who I was friends with wanted to meet my new bf but also wanted to see me privately for an hour before the plan at a local bar to talk to me about some personal stuff he was going through.  The only time in our entire relationship -we've been together since 2005 and dated in the past too - my husband said -no, I am not comfortable with that -I've never met him, this is a Friday night and it's not appropriate for you to see him one on one beforehand like that. 

I was a little surprised.  But I called my friend and told him this.  He totally agreed.  Why? Because his goal was to meet my boyfriend and befriend him, and get to know him hopefully since he and I were friends.  So we all went out and my friend went out of his way to be friendly to my boyfriend.  We ended up hanging out a couple of more times.  I put my new bf at a priority when it came to having him feel respected in our exclusive, ccommitted relationship.  I believe that is the right thing to do. 

Thanks, I completely agree. I think a big part of this issue is that they have been friends since they were 14, "best friends" in her words.... When we were discussing this issue back in February, she said that it would be crossing the line to control who she can and cannot be friends with or spend time with - which I agree with. She can be friends and hang out with whomever she wants. He's staying for a couple days so they are going to be spending a lot of alone time together, there's unfortunately no way around that. 

But I think it's important to let her know how I feel and how him staying over is really pushing it. 

[Andrina]

No, there is no controlling who another can be friends with. More accurately, you choose, that is if you want a satisfying relationship, a partner who shares the same views on friendships.

I know there's no way I'd stay with a partner who told me of being in the same situation as your gf. If I'm reading this correctly, they were in an open, long distance relationship where when they'd visited each other once a year, they had sex. And being best friends, they likely communicate very regularly.

I can't imagine anyone being okay with that. As for me, even if by some miracle I had proof that they would never cheat and all of a sudden had zero attraction, I still wouldn't be okay with that closeness. 

Be true to yourself. Nobody is worth you having a lifetime of upsets.

 

[Batya33]

24 minutes ago, jackie103 said:

Thanks, I completely agree. I think a big part of this issue is that they have been friends since they were 14, "best friends" in her words.... When we were discussing this issue back in February, she said that it would be crossing the line to control who she can and cannot be friends with or spend time with - which I agree with. She can be friends and hang out with whomever she wants. He's staying for a couple days so they are going to be spending a lot of alone time together, there's unfortunately no way around that. 

But I think it's important to let her know how I feel and how him staying over is really pushing it. 

No they are ex lovers/ex romantic partners.  So much so that she is not ruling out him making a move on her again.  Of course he would -they recently had sex.  I was friends with my exes and my husband with his.  But on both sides we were totally over and done with them and they were over and totally done with us.  We were not best friends with any of them.  When my most recent ex met who I realized would be his person -realized as soon as he told he was dating her -I backed way off - I didn't ghost him just stopped our messaging back and forth -to give him total space to be with her and to prevent any appearance to her of "impropriety".  I saw him one more time -after they were married, at her request to me (I'd never met her) and we double dated.  My husband met one of his exes for dinner once for professional reasons -and she was in a serious relationship.  I befriended another ex who was already married and my husband and she had never been serious.  So yes it can work.  But this is ridiculous and if T respected your gf's relationship he'd never suggest staying over.  (I know I wouldn't). 

[jackie103]

10 minutes ago, Andrina said:

No, there is no controlling who another can be friends with. More accurately, you choose, that is if you want a satisfying relationship, a partner who shares the same views on friendships.

I know there's no way I'd stay with a partner who told me of being in the same situation as your gf. If I'm reading this correctly, they were in an open, long distance relationship where when they'd visited each other once a year, they had sex. And being best friends, they likely communicate very regularly.

I can't imagine anyone being okay with that. As for me, even if by some miracle I had proof that they would never cheat and all of a sudden had zero attraction, I still wouldn't be okay with that closeness. 

Be true to yourself. Nobody is worth you having a lifetime of upsets.

 

 

1 minute ago, Batya33 said:

No they are ex lovers/ex romantic partners.  So much so that she is not ruling out him making a move on her again.  Of course he would -they recently had sex.  I was friends with my exes and my husband with his.  But on both sides we were totally over and done with them and they were over and totally done with us.  We were not best friends with any of them.  When my most recent ex met who I realized would be his person -realized as soon as he told he was dating her -I backed way off - I didn't ghost him just stopped our messaging back and forth -to give him total space to be with her and to prevent any appearance to her of "impropriety".  I saw him one more time -after they were married, at her request to me (I'd never met her) and we double dated.  My husband met one of his exes for dinner once for professional reasons -and she was in a serious relationship.  I befriended another ex who was already married and my husband and she had never been serious.  So yes it can work.  But this is ridiculous and if T respected your gf's relationship he'd never suggest staying over.  (I know I wouldn't). 

I am totally on the same page with both of you but this trip has already been determined for a while now - before we became exclusive. How do I navigate this? I think it's out of line to say that he needs to cancel the flight and the trip entirely? 

[itsallgrand]

This may come across harsh but she's not giving ready to be in a serious relationship energy here. To just have fun? Sure. But you shouldn't even have to negotiate this, it's common sense for someone who wants to see what can really come of committing and seeing where it can go. She doesn't have to pledge her life, but needing to be told the dude she was still sleeping with when she first started dating you is off the table for sleep overs goes without saying ! 

[Andrina]

So you're really okay with dating someone, who it seems has been in a sexual relationship with a man for approximately a decade up until a few months ago, and he will continue to be her best friend forever?

If so, well, you only have two choices:

Do nothing, hope for the best, and get used to being a third wheel since it's obvious they are quite tightly woven.

Or:

Tell her if her relationship boundaries don't match yours, and that he doesn't stay in a hotel, and she doesn't stay in a hotel when she visits him annually, then the relationship you two have isn't a good match and wish her the best.

[catfeeder]

Maybe you could invite C to stay overnights at your place while T is visiting? Her place would be like his hotel. 

My own private rule is that I won't involve myself with anyone who is still involved with an ex beyond shared children. You're learning why.

[Wiseman2]

23 minutes ago, jackie103 said:

. How do I navigate this? I think it's out of line to say that he needs to cancel the flight and the trip entirely? 

Since this was before you were a couple there's nothing to navigate. However there's a lot to observe regarding her relationship and sexuality boundaries. Perhaps someone into nebulous multiple liasions is not a good fit for you, but since this relationship is new all you can do is watch and wait. 

[Kwothe28]

7 hours ago, jackie103 said:

He is polyamorous and she is open to polyamory or monogamy. He lives in a different state and they visit have sex with each other once a year.

Fixed.

You wont get exclusivity there. She already lied to you about having sex with him. That wont stop. Demand that he sleeps in a hotel if he visits. And see how she changes colors and behavior. You shouldnt be fine with things like that.

[MissCanuck]

I wouldn't continue this relationship at all, OP. 

She is showing you very clearly that she has flimsy boundaries and very different values from you. She also talks out both sides of her mouth and has different standards for you than she does for herself. 

In short? You two are not a match. I would let her play with T all she wants and find someone who is more emotionally mature to date instead. This girl ain't it. 

[TeeDee]

At 26 I normally wouldn't be so hung up over a connection to a teen romance but this is more.  They were lovers and he is polyamorous which she is OK with.  

At a minimum, if he is interacting with her, you need to be present.  Like you I wouldn't be comfortable with him staying alone at her place.  It's too easy for them to slip back into old habits (bed) when they are alone, especially if they have been drinking.  

The fact that she is sooooo upset about some woman having her legs on you -- even though you & she were not exclusive or committed to each other when this happened -- is projection / gaslighting on her part.  She's indicating that she doesn't trust because she is not trustworthy.  

So I hope she's ready to make the weekend T is visiting into a party of 3.  

You are not telling her not to be friends with him. They can stay connected on social media.  They can talk on the phone.  Heck they can even grab a meal in public.  You are drawing the line at sleepovers with past lovers.   That is not controlling.  It's having boundaries.  The fact that you GF doesn't want to allay your fears by addressing your concerns & prioritize your comfort over as past lover speaks volumes.  

[smackie9]

So she's upset over some leg incident yet she's letting this ex lover stay at her place. Time to revisit the conversation again about setting boundaries. You may have to end this relationship because if the rules won't go both ways then it's doomed anyways.

[Batya33]

When they planned the trip they also were planning to be sexual and have sex during his visit, right? Same thing when people start dating, get serious and one let's say shared a timeshare with an ex, or had a vacation planned way in advance.  Then, the person modifies his or her plans now that she is in a relationship.  So that there is no more being together in a private space.  Sometimes that means lots of inconvenience, lost $$ but very often all this happens in the background - the person with the plans on her own initiates the unraveling and often the new SO knows little about it except in passing.  Or if the plan is maintained it's redone so that the new SO is comfortable and typically that means if ex is at the same location there is no personal or private interaction.

Also she should be excited to have you involved as much as possible in this plan - yes as someone wrote -a meal to catch up privately in a public space one night when you're not available -fine -but both of them should wholeheartedly want to include you for obvious reasons.  And if not, red flag.  

Also my sense is she's experimenting with you -experimenting with her sexuality but she's not going to be satisfied only having a female partner in her life -I don't feel this way in general -I'm responding to the information you provided.

[jackie103]

Thank you all, this is all very insightful and eye opening. I think I have been forcing myself to be okay with the situation. I'm hurt and angry that she thinks having him still stay over and having him stay at all for a week is okay. I'm trying to see both sides, I feel her feelings towards me and our relationship is genuine and maybe she doesn't realize how crazy it is based on her previous experiences in more open relationships. 

I need to talk to her about the boundaries and values I have in a monogamous relationship and how I would always prioritize her feelings and insecurities and I would do this willingly, without feelings resentment or being controlled by her. If she feels like I'm constraining her or imposing rules onto her, I don't think I can continue being in this relationship.  I agree the sleepover thing should've been completely off the table the second we became exclusive. I'm giving her the benefit of the doubt that she just doesn't realize some of the boundaries of a monogamous relationship as its been a while since she's been in one. We'll see how she reacts.

I need to make sure explain everything in a coherent and logical way. I'm working on being a better communicator in my relationships and I find it difficult, especiallly in emotional moments where my feelings are taking over, Ito get my point across in a clear and concise manner

[Batya33]

2 minutes ago, jackie103 said:

need to talk to her about the boundaries and values I have in a monogamous relationship and how I would always prioritize her feelings and insecurities and I would do this willingly, without feelings resentment or being controlled by her. If she feels like I'm constraining her or imposing rules onto her, I don't think I can continue being in this relationship.  I agree the sleepover thing should've been completely off the table the second we became exclusive. I'm giving her the benefit of the doubt that she just doesn't realize some of the boundaries of a monogamous relationship as its been a while since she's been in one. We'll see how she reacts.

I need to make sure explain everything in a coherent and logical way, I'm working on being a better communicator in my relationships and I find it difficult, especiallly in emotional moments where my feelings are taking over, I have a hard time getting my point across in a clear and concise manner

Nope.  Absolutely work on communication -we all can use that and I do regularly even daily - in my marriage, at work, with friends.  Great skill to hone/improve on.

There is NO need to twist yourself in a pretzel.  This is basic stuff like playing nicely in the sandbox.  If she doesn't get it on the basic level do not waste your breath. It's not about how it's neatly packaged or the words you choose or your logic. Please.  She thinks it's ok.  Full stop.  If you feel like telling her -again - how you feel say it in 10 words or less.  Make yourself do that. No apologies, defensiveness, psychobabble, references to abstract concepts or how her mom or your mom treated you all when you were kids.

I dated someone who wanted us to have sex but just be monogamous so he could have "coffee" with other women if he so chose.  Here is what I said to this man I was besotted with already -totally over the moon - after a year of friendship and 6 weeks of dating

I said two things.  The first time he tried to go further with me on the second date I said "I want you to know -flings are not my style and they are not my style with you."

Then with the sex thing a couple weeks later I sat on his couch -faced him - sat talll and said "I am not comfortable having sex with you unless we are exclusive and if you're not ready to be exclusive that is fine."  The end. Finito. 

Turned out he was ready.  Turned out I made a mistake -and this relates to you.  Look - totally fine if another woman would have been ok with that monogamous arrangement  - but if he was into that -high risk and chance that we weren't compatible. Juat like if this woman thinks her plan is ok - huge red flag of some sort -likely she's not that into you and better to know early on.

That risk came to pass -we weren't compatible for the simple reason that even though he was a reformed player as he said and we were 36 and 40 - he never fell in love with me, never was gonna happen so that is why he wanted the option to date others. I should have seen that (he met his future wife 6 months after breaking it off with me - he I believe wasn't totally loyal to her but they've been married many years and yes she was always prettier than me - that's reality too!).

[TeeDee]

You will get your point across more effectively if you ask questions rather than make statements. 

Good luck.  

[MissCanuck]

31 minutes ago, jackie103 said:

 she just doesn't realize some of the boundaries of a monogamous relationship as its been a while since she's been in one.

This is you making excuses for her. 

She didn't fall off the turnip truck yesterday. She knows this would be absolutely unacceptable for most relationships. She just wants to continue doing things her way. 

You know you are in a dubious relationship when you need to explain why having an ex for a sleepover is not alright. The vast majority of adults would not need this spelled out to them. Neither does she. There is a difference between not understanding, and not wanting to hear it. She's the latter. 

 

 

[TeeDee]

I agree with @MissCanuck.  Willful ignorance is not helpful here.  She doesn't want to change.  She wants everything her way, period. 

[Wiseman2]

2 hours ago, jackie103 said:

. If she feels like I'm constraining her or imposing rules onto her, I don't think I can continue being in this relationship.  

Unfortunately you're in parallel relationships. You're in a monogamous relationship with her and she's in a non-monogamous  with you and her other lovers. 

You shouldn't have to feel bad or controlling in order to live by your own values in order to accommodate her poly lifestyle. There are even words invented for what she wants 

"The word “compersion” refers to a form of joy in the joy of others. In the world of consensually nonmonogamous relationships, it more specifically relates to the happiness someone finds in their partner seeking out and enjoying sexual and romantic intimacy with other people".

This is to cope with the cognitive dissonance created by trying to be happy for someone stabbing you in the back.

Please be true to yourself and your own set of standards.