A message from my ex's roommate that I'm not sure how to process...

[Cynder]

11 minutes ago, Batya33 said:

I've had that experience many times The Friends cannot believe it, want you back together, etc.  It's normal.  Hearing the gossip has the benefits you wrote and the downside is it slows down moving on and/or brings it to a dead stop.  You will choose what is important to you.  Also I would take this gossip with a huge grain of salt -it's second hand and clouded by bias/perception and of course since these people want you two together again.

I've been through one other breakup with someone else in the festival scene.  And it was like night and day because my other e was someone a lot of people didn't like.  He has a bad reputation in the scene, which I didn't know because I started dating him when I was pretty new to it all and didn't know who to avoid yet.  Toxic people like him like to pounce on new blood.  So when I broke up with him a lot of people I didn't even know came out of the woodwork to tell me how glad they are we broke up and that I'm better off.  People shared their horror stories about him, etc. 

This situation is completely different because my recent ex doesn't have any enemies in the scene that I know of. 

Mel did tell me earlier that W (his husband ) is "planning his escape."  That worries me, even though I know it's really none of my business.  If W leaves him I'm worried it will cause a relapse, or worse. 

[Wiseman2]

21 minutes ago, Cynder said:

  But knowing that he misses me just as much as I miss him feels good, even if it also sucks because we are both suffering.  

Try to picture yourself getting out of a storm, but now you're inside looking out and still find looking out the window beautiful in a way, as long as you're no longer out in the elements. 

[Batya33]

From what you said their relationship already was very rocky.

[Cynder]

2 minutes ago, Wiseman2 said:

Try to picture yourself getting out of a storm, but now you're inside looking out and still find looking out the window beautiful in a way, as long as you're no longer out in the elements. 

This is brilliant.  Thank you. 

[Cynder]

1 minute ago, Batya33 said:

From what you said their relationship already was very rocky.

Yea, it was. 

It's hard because for a while ours wasn't.  For the first 6 months or so, he treated me better than anyone ever has.  And even after his mental health started tanking.  It wasn't that he treated me bad.  He just was so out of touch with things that it was hard to maintain any real connection. 

Him and W are opposites in a lot of ways.  W is very down to earth.  He has had the same full time job for years.  He is all about living the average life with the job, the mortgage, etc.  D is not like that at all.  For him whatever odd job he can get is fine as long as it pays the bills for that week or whatever.  And he would rather be breathing fire and walking around a festival with a skunk than sitting at home watching TV.  W really isn't a part of the festival scene.  He just never got into any of that.  And I'm not even saying that's a bad thing.  It's just his choice. 

[Batya33]

11 hours ago, Cynder said:

And he would rather be breathing fire and walking around a festival with a skunk than sitting at home watching TV. 

What does having a steady job/income have to do with being a person who prefers to sit at home and watch TV -yes it sounds like they were very different but also sounds like his partner is being painted as some sort of couch potato just because he as a stable career and income with which he is content -two separate things - a person can choose a stable job and also lead a very interesting life and of course a person can choose to pursue arts/risky endeavors not based on having an adventurous spirit or for a positive reason but because of instability or some other unhealthy motivation -not saying D was just surprised at all the assumptions and generalizations. 

I know of people who are artists and prefer to stay in their own home and binge watch TV/be online constantly, etc.  Perhaps W was also a couch potato.  Somehow D chose to be with him for years - perhaps financially motivated who knows.  Anyway..... you will decide whether you still want to make his life your concern to this extent as you describe.  Defer to your choice!

[Cynder]

8 hours ago, Batya33 said:

What does having a steady job/income have to do with being a person who prefers to sit at home and watch TV -yes it sounds like they were very different but also sounds like his partner is being painted as some sort of couch potato just because he as a stable career and income with which he is content -two separate things - a person can choose a stable job and also lead a very interesting life and of course a person can choose to pursue arts/risky endeavors not based on having an adventurous spirit or for a positive reason but because of instability or some other unhealthy motivation -not saying D was just surprised at all the assumptions and generalizations. 

I know of people who are artists and prefer to stay in their own home and binge watch TV/be online constantly, etc.  Perhaps W was also a couch potato.  Somehow D chose to be with him for years - perhaps financially motivated who knows.  Anyway..... you will decide whether you still want to make his life your concern to this extent as you describe.  Defer to your choice!

I didn't say those two things are linked.  That's just W's personality.  He isn't really into going to festivals and stuff.  He's more of a home body.  They are just opposites in a lot of ways.  I even said in my post that it's not a bad thing.  It's just how the two of them are. 

[Cherylyn]

His roommate needs to mind his own business. 

You've broken up,  you dumped him,  he should accept your decision and learn to move on.  There is nothing more to say.  It has been clear that by your ignoring him,  he should've gotten your message by now.  Actions speak louder than words. 

I was in a situation where I was hovered directly and indirectly much to my ire so I blocked and deleted this person.  It was final. 

I wouldn't text him.  I'd block and delete him so you can move on with your life.  He should become 'out of sight,  out of mind' for you.  It's unhealthy to resume contact after a breakup. 

[Cynder]

Well, this is what I woke up to today.  This isn't his roommate.  This is him.  I've ignored his other attempts to talk to me.  And now I feel like I have to reply because I told his roommate, "If he wants to talk to me, he can talk to me."  And I also told them I would rather keep this between him and I (A polite way of saying "You don't need to involve yourself in this." 

I am debating on whether or not to respond.  I know how it feels to be ignored.  But I also need to look out for myself. 

Also, the second text is referring to something I said all the way back in July when we were still together.  So he might have been going through our message history at some point last night. The idea of him sitting around reading our old messages on New Years Eve makes me feel a little better about my own situation, honestly.  Because I was alone and depressed last night, too. 

 

[Batya33]

I read that as a lot of psycho babble.  Positive communication? after an assumption you "still hate him?" 

Since you feel you promised a response I would write:

Thanks so much for your message.  I hope you are well, no hard feelings. Take care and here's to a good 2024.  Best, __.

That is a response. That is a positive and thoughtful response.  That tells him in a tactful way you responded to reassure him you bear him no ill will AND have communicated to the extent you wish to.

I wouldn't assume he read anything. At most he may have randomly clicked, may have remembered at the moment, might have seen it week ago and remembered.  I'd not tell yourself a story of what he did or did not do on NYE.  I'm sorry you were feeling sad!

 

[Cynder]

28 minutes ago, Batya33 said:

I read that as a lot of psycho babble.  Positive communication? after an assumption you "still hate him?" 

Since you feel you promised a response I would write:

Thanks so much for your message.  I hope you are well, no hard feelings. Take care and here's to a good 2024.  Best, __.

That is a response. That is a positive and thoughtful response.  That tells him in a tactful way you responded to reassure him you bear him no ill will AND have communicated to the extent you wish to.

I wouldn't assume he read anything. At most he may have randomly clicked, may have remembered at the moment, might have seen it week ago and remembered.  I'd not tell yourself a story of what he did or did not do on NYE.  I'm sorry you were feeling sad!

 

Yea, I kinda backed myself into a corner with this one. 

I keep looking at my phone and wanting to get it over with.  I plan on sending a completely neutral reply, like you suggested.  I am just afraid of the can of worms it might open up. 

His roommate said the same thing about me supposedly hating him.  I don't waste energy hating people.  If I have anger toward someone I channel it into something.  (In his case it was a novel.) But I don't hate anyone.  I told his roommate that I didn't hate him.  I guess they didn't pass on the message. 

[catfeeder]

"I have no hate for you because I can remember so clearly who you were during better times. I only wish good things for you, and I hope that you will reach a place of good health and happiness again."

[Batya33]

2 hours ago, Cynder said:

Yea, I kinda backed myself into a corner with this one. 

I keep looking at my phone and wanting to get it over with.  I plan on sending a completely neutral reply, like you suggested.  I am just afraid of the can of worms it might open up. 

His roommate said the same thing about me supposedly hating him.  I don't waste energy hating people.  If I have anger toward someone I channel it into something.  (In his case it was a novel.) But I don't hate anyone.  I told his roommate that I didn't hate him.  I guess they didn't pass on the message. 

It can't open anything.  It takes two.  Assume he knows you don't hate him -many many use that sort of language as a throwaway silly tactic.

[Wiseman2]

2 hours ago, Cynder said:

.  I plan on sending a completely neutral reply, 

Good idea . "I know you hate me" is emotional extortion and it's good you're not taking the bait. 

[Cynder]

47 minutes ago, Batya33 said:

It can't open anything.  It takes two.  Assume he knows you don't hate him -many many use that sort of language as a throwaway silly tactic.

True.  He's not stupid.  He knows I don't hate him.  I told his roommate I don't hate him.  I told his roommate I don't hate him.  And if they came to me and repeated everything he's been saying.  It's only logical to assume they repeated our whole conversation back to him.  (If that even was his roommate and not him using their phone.) 

There must be something he wants from me.  The last time an ex kept reaching back out for months after the breakup I ended up having to get a no contact order on him.  This is definitely not the same situation, obviously.  Nothing D has done warrants a no contact order.  I just wonder why, you know? 

I have typed a response and deleted it three times now.  I feel like answering is the right thing to do at this point.  But who is it right for?  Answering him most likely won't benefit me in any way.  And I am at the point now where I need to put myself first.  I've been conditioned to think that what I want matters the least. 

[Cynder]

50 minutes ago, Wiseman2 said:

Good idea . "I know you hate me" is emotional extortion and it's good you're not taking the bait. 

Right.  He knows I don't hate him.  He's just trying to get me to say something. 

[Cynder]

1 hour ago, catfeeder said:

"I have no hate for you because I can remember so clearly who you were during better times. I only wish good things for you, and I hope that you will reach a place of good health and happiness again."

Somehow I missed this the first time I looked at the new replies.  This one actually made me tear up a little because of "I can remember so clearly who you were during better times." 

There are times when it almost feels like the person I was with died and that I'm grieving that.  I know tha'ts not what happened, but the person I was with before his mental health tanked is gone.  It doesn't matter if the same body is still alive and breathing. 

[catfeeder]

32 minutes ago, Cynder said:

Somehow I missed this the first time I looked at the new replies.  This one actually made me tear up a little because of "I can remember so clearly who you were during better times." 

There are times when it almost feels like the person I was with died and that I'm grieving that.  I know tha'ts not what happened, but the person I was with before his mental health tanked is gone.  IT doesn't matter if the same body is still alive and breathing. 

Yep, I hear. The message does point to a better time in his life that he achieved once before, despite addiction and mental illness. While it doesn't encourage him to contact you again, it possibly implies an openness to revisiting who he had become after he accepted help--and can possibly become again.

You might find a better way to say that, and you can even be more frank. You really have zero to lose by pointing to the direction you hope he'll go.

[Cynder]

This is him, on the roommates FB account.  The top line of the first message is only cut off becauae it says his name.  Well, I guess in weak.  He got his reply.  I gave him some dopamine.  I'm not proud of myself.  I feel pretty bad about it actually.  

He is so stuck on thinking I hate him.  I don't hate people.  I don't even hate the man who sexually abused me.  It is wasted energy.  

[Batya33]

Good response and I hope this is the end of his comments/messages.

[Cynder]

Well, later on after those messages his roommate messaged me again (this time it actually was the roommate, I can tell by the difference in texting style.)  And they told me my ex was "freaking out" because I wouldn't talk to him and that he really needed to hear my voice.  So I said, "Fine, tell him to call me." Roommate said, "He can't right now because his phone's dead." 

Ok, this whole situation was just weird.  And add to that, right after this conversation I got two hang up calls, back to back at work. 

I've also heard through the grapevine that he's trying to sue his sister for defamation.  I wonder if he's trying to get me on his good side so I can testify.  (If this is even true.  And even if he is really trying, a defamation lawsuit is really hard to pull off.  Most lawyers won't even take the case unless it's something really serious like someone being falsely accused of rape or something. So if he's actually trying to sue anyone, I doubt it will ever get to court.) 

It's such a confusing position to be in, because I do still care a lot about him.  I have no interest in being with him again.  But I do miss our friendship.  But, I also need to keep reminding myself that he is not right in the head.  But even then, I'm not right in the head either so how do I even know who's handling things better here? 

I'm just really glad I have therapy tonight and can talk about it with a professional. 

[Batya33]

I'm glad you can speak with your therapist tonight.  

[Cynder]

So, I caved.  I'm weak, I'll admit it.  Him and I have been talking a lot over the last few days.  He had oral surgery yesterday so there was a time when we weren't talking, which was a good thing because it let me step back and think about things.  But yesterday morning before he had the surgery he sent me this message.  I know it's long but he is long winded at times.  But this is what he said: 

"The thing I want and need you to understand is these things were nobody's doing.  The universe doesn't hate you, honey.  I promise it doesn't.  There was no lesson to be learned for you.  Unfortunately when other people have lessons to learn, sometimes good people get hurt in the process.  This was a mistaken problem for you. You shouldn't have been involved, and I'm mad at the Universe because you ended up getting hurt.  It's not fair.  Trust me, I'm hurt every single day thinking about how bad I hurt you and my F*ing actions.  It was her lies and manipulation and how f*ing stuck in the lies I was.  This was all stuff you needed to get out honey.  Don't hold it in anymore.  But I wish you wee a little less angry at the Universe and with what life handed to us.  Because trust me, there's a better lesson here for both of us. And maybe, I don't know this might be a long shot I guess, but maybe it will help us learn to trust each other differently in the long run,  and how to be closer and hold each other closer even if it's just as friends.  Who knows what will happen tomorrow." 

The her he's talking about is his sister and he's talking about believing her when she said I had something to do with the niece running away.

And all the stuff about lessons and the Universe is because we were both talking about how this happened, we both suffered, and nothing good came from it.  We have both had NDEs.  People who have been through that tend to think about the bigger picture a lot. 

I showed the message to a good friend of mine and she told me it's nothing but manipulation.  I don't see it that way, but I suck at spotting stuff like that. 

This is causing so much conflict.  My head knows nothing good is going to come from this.  But my heart still has feelings for him.  I also keep trying to remind myself that he is still the same person who snapped and accused me of something completely ridiculous.  He is still the same person who treated his autistic son like crap when he was having one of his episodes.  People rarely change.  I just want to know what some thoughts are on the message he sent me.  I thought about starting a whole new thread about it, but I didn't think it really warranted that. 

[MissCanuck]

4 minutes ago, Cynder said:

I showed the message to a good friend of mine and she told me it's nothing but manipulation.

I absolutely agree. 

I see a lot of manipulation and arrogance in your ex's message. This is not a good person to have in your life in any capacity. 

[Cynder]

2 hours ago, MissCanuck said:

I absolutely agree. 

I see a lot of manipulation and arrogance in your ex's message. This is not a good person to have in your life in any capacity. 

I hope this doesn't annoy anyone and I hope it's not taken wrong, but can you (or anyone else reading this) point out what is manipulative and arrogant?  I'm asking this because I am clearly inept at seeing that.  Not just with him but with everyone.  Not making any excuses but I really do think I'm on the autism spectrum.  There are a lot of things involving people and social situations that just don't register with me.  It's gotten a little better with age but it's still an issue, and especially in written messages where I can't hear someone's tone and see their expressions, etc. 

So I'm sure it's partly because of my own shortcomings that I don't see the manipulation here.  And I'm sure it's part personal bias as well.  Like, I don't see it because I want to believe he has good intentions.  I've learned that most people don't have good intentions.  The world is a cruel place and a lot of people are just out for themselves.  Society is so backward anymore.  Being an ass gets you what you want and gets you respect.  But genuinely nice people get taken advantage of and treated like garbage.