Am I not man enough?...

[mike3610]

So my girlfriend of 3 years had her brother in law replace her breaks on her car. I was supposed to watch  him do it, but I had to stay late for work that day. I mentioned I was a little bummed because I did want to learn, but at the same time me learning wasn't a priority.  She told me that I should learn to fix breaks because it will save her and even me money on repairs. I'm open to learning, but I don't have a strong desire to fix breaks. She said that's what her dad did for her mom. She also mentioned that's what a real man is supposed to do. Should I learn how to replace breaks just to please my gf? 

[Seraphim]

Nope; you don’t need to be able to change brakes to be a man. Do you both have a different vision of what a man is ? 

[boltnrun]

"Brakes".

I'd be more concerned with how comfortable your girlfriend is with insulting you. 

You say you did want to learn but then say learning "isn't a priority" and that you don't have a strong desire to do so. Instead of committing to learning and then backing out you could have simply told her your honest feelings.

But again, going for the insult isn't a very loving thing to do, is it?

[bluecastle]

4 minutes ago, mike3610 said:

Should I learn how to replace breaks just to please my gf? 

Short answer: No. 

Longer answer: You should learn something like this because it appeals to you. Of course, if something is super-duper important to a partner that could be part of the appeal, but just speaking for myself? If my partner put it in terms of my manhood I would just laugh and, once the laugher died down, I'd maybe find myself questioning why my girlfriend is so quick to insult me. 

[mike3610]

9 minutes ago, boltnrun said:

"Brakes".

I'd be more concerned with how comfortable your girlfriend is with insulting you. 

You say you did want to learn but then say learning "isn't a priority" and that you don't have a strong desire to do so. Instead of committing to learning and then backing out you could have simply told her your honest feelings.

But again, going for the insult isn't a very loving thing to do, is it?

Yes, meaning I'm open to the idea of learning, but its not #1 on my bucket list of things that I want to learn how to do. Like I said, I had to work late that night, so I couldn't make it.

[boltnrun]

3 minutes ago, mike3610 said:

Yes, meaning I'm open to the idea of learning, but its not #1 on my bucket list of things that I want to learn how to do. Like I said, I had to work late that night, so I couldn't make it.

That's fine. You don't have to justify yourself to us. My suggestion was that it would have made more sense to tell your girlfriend this instead of agreeing to learn when it's really not all that important to you.

I still think she was out of line by insulting you. 

[Kwothe28]

41 minutes ago, mike3610 said:

Should I learn how to replace breaks just to please my gf? 

What?

Psychologically speaking, lots of people base their partner preferences on their parents or somebody close like sister or best friend partner. They see something that works so they try to fit you in that mold if they can. So, if her daddy can do it, and her sister husband can do it, she would expect you to do it as well. 

That isnt to say that you should do it. Its perfectly fine that you cant. If you have a desire to learn sure(also yes, lots f women like "handy man"). But its perfectly fine if you dont and just pay for a mechanic. Not all people are made to do everything nore they can be good at it.

Also yes, her "real man is suppose to do it" comments are insensitive. While some people like traditional gender norms, doesnt mean you should conform them. And you shouldnt be pressured to do it as well.

[Batya33]

Is she willing to learn how to interact in an appropriate and respectful way with you ? Put the brakes on her mouth ? Tell her simply and directly you are not her dad you are not a “real man” you are an individual person who is not interested in learning how to change brakes. Is she interested in learning how to sew her own clothes? That’s what women used to do I think.
 

When I got married and became a mom I had to learn and strengthen certain skills in order to be a good partner and parent. I also desired to learn them because I wanted to be a good partner and parent. Not to be a “real woman “ or for that sort of “approval”.  
I’m also a big fan of outsourcing. Especially with car stuff if it’s complicated. I’d prefer my husband outsource then try it himself and risk issues with the car.  He’s handy and he enjoys being handy.

 I’m not looking for him to be a real man. Just a good partner. And good dad. He is both. I’d tell her you’re not interested in being transformed into her notion of a real man. 

[Cherylyn]

1 hour ago, mike3610 said:

So my girlfriend of 3 years had her brother in law replace her breaks on her car. I was supposed to watch  him do it, but I had to stay late for work that day. I mentioned I was a little bummed because I did want to learn, but at the same time me learning wasn't a priority.  She told me that I should learn to fix breaks because it will save her and even me money on repairs. I'm open to learning, but I don't have a strong desire to fix breaks. She said that's what her dad did for her mom. She also mentioned that's what a real man is supposed to do. Should I learn how to replace breaks just to please my gf? 

I sit on both sides of the fence on this one.  My late father wasn't adept at handyman tasks.  He had a simple tool box and wasn't anymore than a hammer 'n nail guy for hanging pictures on a wall.  It is usually generation to generation type skills passed on from father to son (or parent to child to clarify).  For example,  the only reason why my husband is "Mr. Fix It" is because of his late father who taught him how to do anything from house repairs / maintenance,  car repairs / maintenance,  electrical,  plumbing,  construction, all yard work and everything else.  He followed his father around;  always side by side with him.  He's very familiar with hardware stores, automotive stores, etc.  If anything's broken,  he knows how to remedy the situation.  He has saved us a ton of money.  

Then there's my helpless brother.  His house looks like a dump.  His front and back yards are overgrown,  sloppy jungles.  The house is in chronic disrepair inside and out.  It's not constantly maintained and not up to par with the rest of the residential,  suburban neighborhood.  Fortunately,  he's not part of a HOA (homeowner's association) otherwise he would've been admonished and penalized for decreasing other neighbors' real estate prices.  He lives in his house but he doesn't do anything to it so it's an eyesore inside and out.  This is because our late father merely lived in a house but didn't do anything to it so my brother followed suit which is sad and pitiful.  My husband and I are appalled during our brief visits.  There is no conscientious effort to live in a normal, clean, maintained house because he wasn't raised to live normally. 

Your girlfriend has expectations for you to be reminiscent of her father just like I have expectations for my husband to be reminiscent of his father whom he followed around like a shadow.  My late FIL (father-in-law) trained my husband well.   However,  if my husband was not a "jack-of-all-trades,"  I wouldn't hold it against him.   In my neighborhood,  for those who lack these trade skills,  they hire contractors such as for handymen,  painters,  plumbers,  electricians,  construction contractors,  roofers,  gardeners,  landscapers,  water softener companies and they hire without limits.  I see it all around me daily.  Motorists take their cars for tire changes,  oil changes,  general car maintenance or repairs.  It happens all the time and I don't see anything wrong with it.  Work hard and pay someone else to do it.  It's the norm especially when there's lack of time,  energy and interest.  

Having said that,  my next door neighbor is envious.  My mother said the same and my husband helped my mother with her house and car repairs / maintenance numerous times.  Both my neighbor and mother told me that my husband is very handy and wished their husbands were too but they aren't so in that regard,  I do indeed feel very fortunate,  blessed and lucky.  It's extremely economical.  We've saved thousands of dollars if not more through the years. 

If you don't want to learn,  then don't.  Tell your girlfriend you have no desire to be the handyman type and to either accept you as is or be with a man reminiscent of her BIL (brother-in-law) and father.  Tell her that you prefer to pay a mechanic to do it and in other cases,  a contractor for another job whatever it may be. 

[Coily]

1 hour ago, mike3610 said:

She also mentioned that's what a real man is supposed to do. Should I learn how to replace breaks just to please my gf? 

Should you learn for your GF? No. Absolutely not. This is a trashy insult of you and your existing skills. Being a "Real man" should be knowing your worth and that of those around you. Not some demand put on people as a way to control what you do and don't do.

Now if you wanted to learn for your own sake, do so. I think it's an invaluable skill, among many others. I have taught quite a few people through the years as it will save money. But If I got demanded to prove my masculinity by kowtowing to someone, i would consider walking from the relationship.

 

This kind of crap is exactly why I react so aggressively to the "real man" talk on this forum.

[Cherylyn]

I say if you want to learn these new skills to repair / maintain cars or a house in order to save money,  then learn.   If money is no object, then pay out.  Hire away.  Let your wallet do the talking. 

[boltnrun]

I think people who can drive stick shift are cooler. Do I think men who can't are not "real men"? No, of course not. My mother looked sideways at women who won't cook (it's never "can't" cook as anyone can cook, they just choose not to). She made snide comments to me behind their backs which wasn't particularly nice, but she never to their faces accused them of not being "real women". One of my former female employees told me her alternator went out on her car so she went to the car parts place, bought a new one, then took the old one out and replaced it herself. Is she a "real man" 🤣? Or perhaps unfeminine because she can swap out an alternator by herself? (I greatly admire her for being able to, BTW. I would like to know how to do those things myself!) 

For me it's the insult. It's just not OK for your girlfriend to make such a snide, belittling comment. 

I would think very hard about if you want to be in a relationship with someone who goes to insults when she's disappointed. 

[Wiseman2]

2 hours ago, mike3610 said:

.  She told me that I should learn to fix breaks because it will save her and even me money on repairs.  Should I learn how to replace breaks just to please my gf? 

Why doesn't she learn? She seems a bit naive about roles and cars.

If the job's not done right it's a safety hazard. She can take it too a mechanic to have it properly done. 

There's no need to beat you up for her bad ideas.

[adviceplease2]

That comment leads me to think she has that same idea about your manliness in other areas as well.  Might be wrong, but thats my first impression.

She insulted you, don't do things just to appease her, thats when things start spiraling.  All respect gets lost.

[Seraphim]

Tell her women can do brakes too and she should learn to fix her car. 

[Cherylyn]

As a woman,  I don't want to fix brakes,  change my car's oil,  change a tire nor none of that.  I would do just like my mother and take my car to a trusted mechanic near my house. 

If I had to,  I would hire out contractors for my house as well. 

If I had to,  I'd cut corners elsewhere in order to afford hired help such as not eating out,  no take out,  no entertainment tickets,  no vacations (airfare, hotels, car rentals),  refrain from buying apparel or accessories and such.  I'm glad I don't have to resort to do any of that though. 

Fortunately,  I'm able to defer to my husband to fix and maintain anything.  I struck gold there. 

I didn't want to discard my broken handle on a favorite serrated,  medium sized kitchen knife which I've had forever and use daily.  My husband fixed it so it's in mint condition.  Yes, he's my man and I'm his very lucky wife.  🙂

 

[boltnrun]

I gladly do some things myself. I've fixed toilets, replaced the battery in my car, replaced windshield wipers, installed weatherstripping, installed shower heads, fixed my oven door...as a woman! All small things, but I can't justify paying someone to do these things.

And I never looked down on my husband or called him "not a real man" if he didn't know how to do certain things. If you love someone why would you insult them?

[Batya33]

I can see looking for a partner who has qualities similar to parents you admired.  Qualities like: generosity, compassion, perhaps religious values if that is your thing, or maybe you saw your dad change your sibling's diapers without being asked, or saw your mom make homemade chicken soup when you had a bad cold - those aren't values I guess but certainly reflect generosity/thoughtfulness.  

But I think - JMHO it goes way way too far if a person is looking for into the weeds specificity like "my dad changed the oil and I thought of this as a real man so any partner of mine better do the same" etc -that feels -icky maybe even creepy to me? My FIL did most of the cooking -he enjoyed it! - and he also was very handy.  Isn't that most people -like a hybrid of these created "gender roles?"

I never thought of whether my FIL was a real man or my MIL a real woman and same with my own parents but it's no surprise to me that our parents adored each other and had tons in common -I mean not just interests but values. 

My mother was a true friend and comfort to my FIL after my MIL passed -they just - got each other. I'm glad he could call her and feel less alone and chat about everything under the sun including their shared grandson.

But neither of us was looking to emulate our parents as far as their division of labor/household roles.  For one thing in the 1950s most women didn't go to grad school or have a full time career if they also had young kids, and lots of men believed in a strict demarcation of gendered roles in the household which has changed quite a bit. 

So this whole "be a real man like my daddy was" (I assume more like the 70s instead of 50s but whatever) -just -is bizarre to me.  And insulting about it - takes it to this level of twilight zone -you insult your partner and tell him he's not a real man but you think of yourself as a caring partner while running off your mouth like that??

[boltnrun]

Yes, for sure to me a "real" adult human would never speak to someone they purport to love in that insulting way. 

[Cherylyn]

For me,  I wanted a husband who was the exact opposite of my father and brother who don't do anything handy.  They are rather helpless.  They have no desire to learn either.  They're not reliable.     

I agree,  it does get expensive hiring mechanics or contractors to do vehicle repairs, maintenance,  home repairs and maintenance.  I know what the prices are and it's costly.  It isn't cheap for hired labor.

It wasn't my original prerequisite to marry a handyman type.  When I dated my husband,  his character, good health and economics were at the forefront of my mind and the fringe benefit was that he just so happened to be very much reminiscent of his father whom he shadowed growing up.  Therefore,  my husband can repair and maintain anything from cars to the house inside and out.  I just got lucky there. 

I guess I'm a girly girl.  I like my hands, my manicure and pedicure.  I don't like to get grubby,  dirty and greasy.  I don't like to sweat unless I'm exercising.  I like my hair well groomed.  I like to dress well from head to toe.  I'm prissy in that way.  ☺️

My friend's MIL (mother-in-law) is up on the roof pounding nails and while it's admirable,  I wouldn't do that. 

Men and women can do mostly anything.  It's very individual though and based upon each person's preferences,  level of skill or lack thereof. 

If your girlfriend wants a boyfriend or husband reminiscent of her father,  perhaps you're not for her long term.  Better to know this now instead of later. 

[boltnrun]

2 minutes ago, Cherylyn said:

If your girlfriend wants a boyfriend or husband reminiscent of her father,  perhaps you're not for her long term.  Better to know this now instead of later. 

I don't feel that's the issue. The issue is insulting him by telling him he's "not a real man". That's just classless and rude. 

[Cherylyn]

Just now, boltnrun said:

I don't feel that's the issue. The issue is insulting him by telling he's "not a real man". That's just classless and rude. 

^ ^ ^ ^ ^ It's not the end of this quote though.  She'll compare him to her father at any given time.  "Why can't you be reminiscent of dear old dad?  Why can't you do for me as dad did for mom?  I want that."  It will come up. 

Ha!  I'm the exact opposite.  I saw enough of it growing up.  I wanted what my MIL (mother-in-law) has.  Same with many of my childhood neighbors and many of my current neighbors who are the type with set skills. 

Everyone's different though.  Each couple will work it out amongst themselves however way they go about it.

[Coily]

What does his wallet have to do with this? This is weird and creepy line of "advice." Leave the man be.

OP, Know your worth. Don't ever feel pressured to act or do something just to appease someone who is insulting you. That's exactly what the "real man" thing is about, gaslighting you. Pick up skills you find valuable, that capture your interests or needs. Yes it's awesome to know a bit of everything, but don't feel like you must appease a low quality woman.

 

[Cherylyn]

19 minutes ago, Coily said:

What does his wallet have to do with this? This is weird and creepy line of "advice." Leave the man be.

OP, Know your worth. Don't ever feel pressured to act or do something just to appease someone who is insulting you. That's exactly what the "real man" thing is about, gaslighting you. Pick up skills you find valuable, that capture your interests or needs. Yes it's awesome to know a bit of everything, but don't feel like you must appease a low quality woman.

 

The wallet means in the future,  if he or she doesn't wish to learn new skill sets for car repairs,  car maintenance, house repairs and house maintenance,  pay for it.  Work hard and hire out.  Take vehicles to a mechanic.   It's really not that much different than hiring housecleaning, gardener / landscaping, plumber, electrician, construction workers, contractor type services which I observe all around me in my residential neighborhood.  People are very busy working,  raising families,  don't have time,  energy nor desire for whatever reason.  Therefore, they conveniently pay for services and I don't see anything wrong taking this route whatsoever. 

I agree,  don't settle.  If you're not compatible in this arena,  this complaint will reappear in the future @mike3610.  Perhaps your girlfriend really wants a boyfriend or potential husband reminiscent of her handyman type father who did these tasks for her mother,  family and household. 

If you don't have the desire to learn new skill sets,  then don't.  If you're incompatible,  be with a woman who doesn't think these skill sets are important. 

No, don't learn how to fix the car's brakes in order to appease her.  Only do it, if you want to and since you don't, then don't do it. 

[boltnrun]

Yep, the insult is what I take issue with. It's irrelevant if her dad fixes things for her mom or if anyone else's boyfriend or husband does. There is never an excuse for hurling insults, no matter how badly she wants a guy like her dad or brother or whoever. 

If my husband grunted "make me a sammich, Woman!" he'd be out the door, no matter how many sammiches his mom made for his dad. I'd be "incompatible" with someone who thought it was OK to insult me.