Lisii Posted December 17, 2015 Share Posted December 17, 2015 This last week my eldest (just turned 14yr) has been answering back to a whole new level. He's fantastic one on one and is usually a very cool obliging kid. He just rung me at work moaning that Granddad has advised him that he and his little brother will be working in their garden tomorrow. He said "but I have plans with my friend" and he hung up on me. This is the second time this week he has hung up on me for not getting his way. He tries to barter everything and it's starting to wear thin. He's also bullying his brother a lot more than usual. Does anyone have any constructive suggestions? - they are leaving for their dad's next week and I wont see him for a month. I don't like the idea of being a hard nosed military mom before he leaves... I realise he is pushing boundaries and I'm guess going through a major hormone hit (he's just passed my height at 1.76m, filling out and getting facial fuzz...) Link to comment
mhowe Posted December 17, 2015 Share Posted December 17, 2015 Tell him if he hangs up on you again, he will lose his phone for a week. If he bullies his brother, he (fill in the blank). And that if he doesn't want to be treated as a child, he should stop acting like one. Link to comment
Hollyj Posted December 17, 2015 Share Posted December 17, 2015 Yes. Start taking privileges. Link to comment
Seraphim Posted December 17, 2015 Share Posted December 17, 2015 I would have a discussion with him before hand about what behaviors are going to entail what consequences. And then make sure the consequences stick. I remember around that age my son tried to challenge me for authority while my husband was on a five month deployment. Hahaha, no. You really have to stick to your word though because the minute you back down you're toast. A lot of what you were describing though it's typical teenage behavior. Link to comment
jennylove Posted December 17, 2015 Share Posted December 17, 2015 Of course he's lippy, he's 14. Not yet a man, but not a kid. He's in transition and so are his hormones. His peers are very important to him, and if he made plans with them, it really isn't fair to him that he's being forced to break his plans without any compromise and at a late notice. Put yourself in his shoes here. Please be gentle with him and compromise with him. Read up on Ericksons development criteria and Masliws Hierarchy of Needs Link to comment
shellyf62 Posted December 17, 2015 Share Posted December 17, 2015 My kids tried this with me when they were around that age too. The best one was catching my Daughter out in a huge lie. I drove around with her mobile, the home phone & the internet modem in the boot of my car for a week. She only had contact with her friends during school hours...she learnt a huge lesson. You need to be strict, or things are going to get worse. If you threaten a punishment you have to follow through. Empty threats make you look stupid, and your kids will have no respect for you. I don't like the idea of being a hard nosed military mom before he leaves... I am divorced & raised my children alone. I was always the hard one, my ex let the kids do anything. My kids grew up to be well mannered & good citizens. They treat me with respect. I think I did a good job because I had rules & boundaries. Link to comment
Pixels Posted December 17, 2015 Share Posted December 17, 2015 Don't bother being a hard military mom... Worst case they eventually realize they're physically stronger than you anyways, and you have more emotionally invested in them than they do in you (and some cases, themselves)... Furthermore, society expects more of you as a parent than they do of them as people in general, so you're basically a hostige... To be fair, I'm not a parent... But I've been a child, and I resent the way things were handled... Personally I would suggest offering him incentives to follow organization... I think it's natural that he wants to barter his freedom... So barter it in perspective... What does freedom mean to him at his age? How realistic is that? Where can you afford privileges? Where are you drawing boundaries? Can he sacrifice his decisions now to have greater freedom through trust? At his age freedom was my main goal, because I wanted a different life... I wanted freedom without having someone else watching me or judging my decisions, knowing that they didn't really understand the circumstances... Personally I had no parental guidance... I made the wrong choices, and I pushed my family out of my life. I also feel this is a joint effort between you and his father... It's pointless if one of you undermines the other.... This is why they say having a kid keeps him in your life forever... I think the end of the line is he'll find what he wants regardless of what you do... You can afford him opportunities and priviliges now, but IMHO he wont see the value until he understands where it'll take him, and what freedom it actually affords... Keep in mind that at his age freedom is probably as simple as $600/wk... Since he has no real concept of rent of groceries... So show him your expense books and show him what it costs to live in the real world... You have no reason to be afraid of him or his reactions, because I guarantee whatever he does wont be as nice as living under your rules... So educate him in finances early, let him work where he can find it, and support him as much as you can as long as he's willing to take advantage of it... Link to comment
ParisPaulette Posted December 17, 2015 Share Posted December 17, 2015 Yep, start taking privileges BUT at the same time offer increased freedoms for things done well. A "If you hang up on me again, the phone is mine for a week" followed with an "Look, if you help your grandfather tomorrow this weekend you can do X, Y or Z with your friend." Try that route first. And in a calm moment set him down and ask him where the sudden attitude is coming from, what might be happening. Keep a closer eye on his friends and teachers and anything else that might be adding sudden stress or contributing to his mood and yes, as much as I hate to say it, if he's online all the time maybe it's time to check what or who he's talking to there. It can be a myriad of things including just yeah being a teenager, but a sudden shift and marked behavioral change usually signals some sort of change in his life, not always a good one. It's time to sit him down calmly and just ask him what's going on and let him know that such behaviors are not acceptable, but if anyone or anything is stressing him you're there to talk too. Also take a look at what he's been bargaining about and for, is it a legitimate request OR is it not. How can the two of you work together, so both of you get what you want while still reminding him who is the head of the household. It's a delicate balance and I know I didn't always do it right myself raising three boys, but just sitting them down and really addressing things telling them if they want to be an adult then they need to learn to negotiate and talk out things like an adult might help. Link to comment
mhowe Posted December 17, 2015 Share Posted December 17, 2015 Since 14 is too young for a job or a car, I would guess his plans depend on a ride. Therefore making plans without checking in with you is pretty much a no go too. And that respect he will be learning extends to grandpa as well. Link to comment
Seraphim Posted December 17, 2015 Share Posted December 17, 2015 Being a parent is a really rough job. You have to have the right balance of rules and boundaries and softness and loving and guidance. And know when to use what tool. And every child is different and has different needs. The teen years can be really rough though sometimes. My son is 18 now and he's a pretty good egg! Link to comment
Pixels Posted December 17, 2015 Share Posted December 17, 2015 Since 14 is too young for a job or a car, I would guess his plans depend on a ride. Therefore making plans without checking in with you is pretty much a no go too. And that respect he will be learning extends to grandpa as well. Most places in North American I'm aware of (when children are involved) will allow you to work well before 14 for below minimum wage, as if it was independently earned profit... Paper routes are a solid example of this, which frequently employ underaged labour for par-to-below minimum wages under the guise that they're paid fairly because they're kids, and this is supposed to be beneficial life experience... Since 14 is too young for a job or a car, I would guess his plans depend on a ride. Therefore making plans without checking in with you is pretty much a no go too. And that respect he will be learning extends to grandpa as well. No offense.. But I wouldn't assume that an arbitrary social rule shoves a wrench in his cogs... I'd be more surprised if he WAS depending on someone 'outside' for a vehicle... Even at 14 alcohol was laughably easy to get... Link to comment
mhowe Posted December 17, 2015 Share Posted December 17, 2015 Most places in North American I'm aware of (when children are involved) will allow you to work well before 14 for below minimum wage, as if it was independently earned profit... Paper routes are a solid example of this, which frequently employ underaged labour for par-to-below minimum wages under the guise that they're paid fairly because they're kids, and this is supposed to be beneficial life experience... Beyond the fact that this is immaterial, pre-16 need parent approval to work and are limited to what hours they can work and under what conditions. Link to comment
Pixels Posted December 17, 2015 Share Posted December 17, 2015 Beyond the fact that this is immaterial, pre-16 need parent approval to work and are limited to what hours they can work and under what conditions. In some areas employers manage to get around this... Sometimes parents give sh**ty approval to bad employers. Sometimes parents are just happy to see their kid with a job... Sometimes unsuccessful companies will hire illegal day labour or people with criminal records just to skirt around wage-laws to avoid paying their employees more than minimum wage... I'm not going to argue the feasbility of every option... Point is she's silly to assume her teenaged son literally has no options... The point is at this point I would argue she's better off being supportive.... Point is if you actually think income is age-restricted, I would argue you're at the least unaware.... Or go ahead and play that wage-slave game... Link to comment
mhowe Posted December 17, 2015 Share Posted December 17, 2015 I don't see that the 14 yr old comes to the table with much bargaining power. He has privileges to lose, not freedom to gain. Link to comment
Pixels Posted December 17, 2015 Share Posted December 17, 2015 I don't see that the 14 yr old comes to the table with much bargaining power. He has privileges to lose, not freedom to gain. I agree with this overall.. But you're also assuming a 14 year old has the insight to realize this and the self-discipline to submit to it... They might very well see minimal freedom victories as exponentially more valuable they actually are... Link to comment
mhowe Posted December 17, 2015 Share Posted December 17, 2015 Well, he can read The Art of the Deal. Or he can listen to the options and go with the greatest risk/reward ratio. Link to comment
Capttrae Posted December 17, 2015 Share Posted December 17, 2015 I know what my dad would've done. It's called a belt across the butt. Works wonders Link to comment
mhowe Posted December 17, 2015 Share Posted December 17, 2015 Today's snowflakes want to believe they are equals. It be hooves them to be disproven. Link to comment
Pixels Posted December 17, 2015 Share Posted December 17, 2015 Today's snowflakes want to believe they are equals. It be hooves them to be disproven. There are people below adult age which fall between labour laws that support themselves (though not to any extent I think people would aspire to)... All I'm saying is I don't think the OP benefits from taking a stance that the child in question has no other option but to follow along... Link to comment
mhowe Posted December 17, 2015 Share Posted December 17, 2015 Well, I don't think the kid in question is looking to become an emancipated minor. He simply doesn't want to weed the garden with grandpa. No sense in reinventing the wheel when a simple "you're grounded" will do the trick. Link to comment
Pixels Posted December 17, 2015 Share Posted December 17, 2015 Fair, I think I skewed my advice in proportion to the initial question... Link to comment
shellyf62 Posted December 17, 2015 Share Posted December 17, 2015 I agree with this overall.. But you're also assuming a 14 year old has the insight to realize this and the self-discipline to submit to it... They might very well see minimal freedom victories as exponentially more valuable they actually are... I have raised 2 teenagers into adulthood. There was a little bargaining, but also a lot of rules of mine to be followed by them. If they didn't there was consequences. We all got through it with little damage. At 14 both of my children had insight & self discipline. Link to comment
Lisii Posted December 17, 2015 Author Share Posted December 17, 2015 Hi and wow Thanks everyone for your input! My son is normally a pretty good kid, he's usually quiet helpful (he likes to do the manly chores around the house for me) and yes he has a job - he has been volunteering at one of the local bike shops two days a week for the last two school terms fixing bikes. (I pay him below minimum wage), We have great communication. He's just being absolutely stroppy. I do believe it's hormonal, It's just soooooo tiring the arguing is driving me insane - as well as the antagonistic/agggessive behaviour towards his little bro. I have already taken away his laptop (I found him on it at 1.30am the other morning!) All devices have been in my car while I'm at work so he has been forced to be constructive with his time this week - I have spoken to him this afternoon and if his behaviour doesn't improve I will take his Mountain bike away from him. i do know I cave in sometimes, being alone sometimes I do pick my battles. I am also tired - I guess I'm being a little short with him and high in expectations, emotions etc.. - getting towards summer holidays I am ready to have a break when the kids go to their dads (my parents are too old to babysit for me) - its been a long semester. He gets his freedom, he and his best friends are out in the forest most afternoons mtbking or exploring. He doesn't do drugs, or girls (wants to concentrate on his mtb's) doesn't loiter in town. He's just cranky and aggressive. Link to comment
notalady Posted December 17, 2015 Share Posted December 17, 2015 Any explanation what's he's doing up at 1:30 am? I assume he's on the Internet. Might be worth exploring and setting some rules around that rather than just temporarily take away his laptop. For example, someone I know has a no internet after 10:30 rule, so the parents disconnect the Internet at 10:30. Link to comment
Lisii Posted December 17, 2015 Author Share Posted December 17, 2015 Any explanation what's he's doing up at 1:30 am? I assume he's on the Internet. Might be worth exploring and setting some rules around that rather than just temporarily take away his laptop. For example, someone I know has a no internet after 10:30 rule, so the parents disconnect the Internet at 10:30. Thanks Notalady, Yes, i spoke with him, and I checked the search history there was nothing bad - he wouldn't have had time to delete anything that wasn't meant to be there as I snuck up on him. The laptop was new, and I had miscommunication with my brother - he set it up for my son and I presumed that he had put all the parental locks in place - he didn't, we now have them in place as well as Norton for families (they each get an hour a day and i can monitor) - hence me having it in my car while I'm at work - I don't want him to figure out how to disable it ... not giving him the chance. Link to comment
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