Am I Being Insecure or Is It My Boyfriend's Fault?

[totobear]

I've been with this guy for almost 5 yrs everything about him looks great on paper. Our personality is very compatible in terms of interests, hobbies and life goals. He wants to marry me and lately has bought up the topic about getting married and having kids. I have no doubt he will be a good husband and father in the future. But I have one issue with him that has been bothering me for a long time; I've tried talking nicely to him about it and yelling at him about it. The issue is that he has too many female friends. He would go out to dinners / get drinks with them and sometimes they even call and talk for hours on the phone (he said they were having relationship problems and asked for advices). I know that he has no intention other than friendships, but deep down I am a bit jealous and feel that there is no need to have so many female friends if you are not single. For example, one of his female friends sent him a birthday gift of a coffee mug with a picture of just the two of them hugging together printed on the mug and the caption "Happy birthday! Love ya!" I find it inappropriate that she did that.

 

He is average looking, but he has a very friendly & sociable personality so he easily makes a lot of friends. I would say his friend circle is 60% female and 40% male. But he hangs out with the female friends more often than the male friends. Maybe because he is so easy to talk to and willing to listen, girls see him almost as a "gay" friend that would always be there for advice and to hang out. But still, it bothers me and I feel that to strangers or people that don't know us well, they will think that he is a flirty / cheating person. For instance, on facebook, he has been tagged in a lot of pictures with other girls and not me; some of them are just the two of them together eating or going to concerts or close up selfies of them two. I know he is not cheating since I do know his personality well and he has been cheated on before so he said he would never do that; he also texts me to let me know when he is out with his female friends about what they are doing.

 

I told him that it makes me feel disrespected sometimes when he is so close with so many female friends. And he would argue that I don't trust him and that he only has platonic friendships with them. I have been with guys before him that doesn't have as many female friends or as flamboyant in displaying affectionate friendships and they made me feel secure. Is this boyfriend not right for me if he keeps making me feel insecure? What should I do to stop feeling this way or to have him change his behaviors??

[Dybbuk]

Has he always had many female friends when you first started dating? Are a lot of these female friends long time friends he's had for years?

 

There are some people in this world who just have better relationships with friends of the opposite sex. One of my old roomies had lots and lots of guy friends... and maybe like 2 girlfriends. She just got along with men better than she did with other women. It could also be that your BF gets along with women better than men, so a night out with the "guys" has turned into nights out with the "girls".

 

I feel that if he hasn't given you a reason to suspect anything lewd was happening with these women then you should respect his right to have friends and to have time out with his friends. If he is completely transparent about where he is, what he's doing, then you have no reason to be jealous. Would you have any problem with this if his friends were male?

 

To put your mind at ease, why don't you ask if you can tag along one night to hang out with them. Then you could see how he interacts with all of them and know they really are just friends and you have no reason to feel insecure.

[Tinydance]

Sorry but I don't really think you should be forcing him to give up his female friends. I think you are being insecure, jealous and possessive. I'm a pretty jealous person too so maybe I would feel the same, but I think I would mostly just keep it to myself and not always try to make your boyfriend feel guilty about it. You even say yourself that you're quite sure he's never cheated and he'll never do it and how good your relationship is. He wants to marry you, I'm pretty sure his intentions towards you are very serious because these days people are not as committed to marriage as what they used to be. If he already had most of these female friends before he met you, then I don't think he should just be expected to ditch them just because you're insecure and jealous. I think people should be allowed to have friends (even same gender) aa long as they're committed to your relationship and are not doing anything wrong. The fact that you've yelled at him about it would have really put me off personally if it was me. You have to trust him because after five years he has not done anything with any of these female friends. If women feel so close to him and if he really wanted to, he would have cheated many times by now. I have male friends (though not many) that I hang out with and one of them I've known for eight years. I wouldn't dump him just because my boyfriend doesn't like it. I know it's hard to believe that men and women can be friends but I think some people CAN do it. Do you hang out with your boyfriend and his female friends too sometimes? Maybe you should get to know them?

[ThatwasThen]

Yet you have put up with him and his ways for 5 years now. Are you hoping that writing to this forum will give you some ideas on how to change him to who you want him to be? If after five years of you enabling it, nothing what we say here is going to change him. It's you that has to change and that means making it in your head that what he does is okay with you or failing that, leaving him to his female harem.

 

Personally, if you're found yourself jealous of his way and spoke to him about changing and he hasn't then I wonder why you've stayed. Why didn't you leave him when you first discovered that he wasn't giving up said harem for you?

 

BTW: Insecureity and Jealousy have NOTHING to do with this. Continuing to go on date like activities alone with members of the opposite sex is disrespectful to the primary relationship and anyone who has a good set of relationship boundaries in place would agree.

[DancingFool]

First of all, you can't change him and who he is and how and with who he prefers to interact socially. Either you can accept him as is or you can't. It does sound to me like you are simply not compatible in terms of how you both see relationships and what boundaries need to exist with the opposite sex. Especially since you normally do feel secure in relationships and this is the one where you just don't.

 

The only solution would be for both of you to work on finding some mutual ground that makes you both happy. However, you've been at this for 5 years and it doesn't sound like he has ever been willing to hear you out and instead gets quickly defensive and tells you that you have trust issues. To reach a mutually happy ground, both people have to be willing to hear each other out and to give some ground and make some adjustments mutually.

 

As for the mug gift, you are not crazy. I tend to think that majority of reasonable people would find that kind of a gift inappropriate, unless it's coming from a family member. At the end of the day, what boundaries make you comfortable and how relationships are being conducted is a huge compatibility issue.

[Tinydance]

I agree that it's rare but I do think in some cases a guy CAN have a lot of female friends. If he's never done anything actually inappropriate then I don't think he sees any of them as more than friendship. I think it's actually obvious when someone is flirting with their friends or they with him. Have you seen flirting or any inappropriate messages? If not then I would say that everything is fine. The mug thing is maybe kind of inappropriate but it depends...Is this a very close long-term friend of his? Like, a "bestie" of sorts? Because people that are best friends can do that sometimes. I agree there's a fine line and if he knows it upsets you, maybe ge should be inviting you out with his female friends so that you can be included and get to know them and be friends (or at least acquaintances) with them too. If he's never included you then yeah that's hurtful and disrespectful. But my previous boyfriends have had female friends and I had male friends and we were OK about that as long as we included each other and were really open and honest. If he's being secretive then yeah I'd be worried but if he tells you everything then obviously there's nothing going on.

[mfan]

Hi totobear, just some thoughts.

 

I feel that to strangers or people that don't know us well, they will think . . .

This sounds like an insecure thing to say.

 

I feel like my own personality is also more compatible with women than with men, and I more readily make friends with women. Most of my friends are women. Some are single, but most are married, in relationships, etc. and they are all platonic friends who I care about very much and have no interest in dating. I guess your boyfriend feels that way, too. However, it sounds like his female friends are kind of immature; for example, that mug gift was inappropriate, and I think your boyfriend should have told her that, bc she probably didn't realize that from a single person's perspective it would be a problem. After all, he does have some responsibilities as a man in a committed relationship, and I think there's a certain responsibility to give a mature impression.

 

But actually, maybe it's better that he treats them differently from you? If he treated you the same as one of them, then you would be just one of many, I think that would be a lot worse.

 

As for his hours of talking to them on the phone and hanging out with them without you, do you feel like you two don't spend enough time together? Suppose he didn't spend hours talking to his female friends, but instead spent hours playing video games without talking to anyone, and didn't include you in it. Would you feel fine, or would there still be a big problem? Just wondering if there's an underlying problem that's not really about the female friends.

 

Sounds like your boyfriend really is easy to talk to and a good listener (I assume, to you too?) and those are really special qualities. The only trouble is that being a good listener, he then listens to *everyone*, even immature people who sound needy and want a lot of attention from him. That's an unpleasant side effect, but I think it's worth it because he sounds like a really great guy.

 

I don't have a girlfriend, but if I did, I still wouldn't give up being friends with my female friends no matter what, whether my girlfriend asked me nicely or yelled at me. Maybe you could tell him you'd like your relationship to be more mature and stop having the teenagey Facebook posts, "Love ya" mugs and such. Best of luck.

[totobear]

I am more of an introvert when it comes to social situations and he is more the extrovert that gets people's attention to joke around with them / make them laugh. Sometimes I wonder if I am just jealous that I can't be as personable and likable as him. He has female friends from when he went to school, from his previous job, from friend's friend and from his new job. But he tend to hang out more with those that he met more recently like a year ago or so. I honestly didn't notice this when I first started dating him. But I knew he had a lot of female friends and over the years that started to bother me more and more. I have met some of them a few times with him and they seem ok when I was there. But I couldn't help but feel that some of his female friends are kinda cold to me and seem to be annoyed that I was there.

 

I know he is not a bad person who would cheat to hurt me. But it also makes me feel upset when he tells his friends (both guy and girl) that I get angry at him for hanging with girls and his friends tells him that I am being very bossy / jealous / insecure and I am not the right girl for him blah blah. I yelled at him because I feel like of course your friends will say that about me because they are on your side, you are making a bad reputation and image for me. I wanted him to see that even if he is right and I am wrong, but if it makes me happy then he should consider changing his behavior. But he doesn't see it that way and always tells me that I need to stop caring what others think and just focus on the fact that he loves me and won't cheat. I can deal with him having a moderate number of female friends, just not so much display of affection and doing fun stuff without me. What can I do to help him see how it affects me and to change his behaviors? I would like to find a mutual ground like one of the posters has said, but how? Should I "revenge" and just hang out with lots of guys and post pictures and all that to let him see?

[reinventmyself]

When I met my (ex)H I had alot of male friends. 2 of my best friends were men and I spent a considerable amount of time with them.

Out of the gate my then bf (soon to be H) challenged it but what I pointed out to him was these guys would be just as much friends to him as they were to me.

 

After we were married there were several times they came by the house and hung out with my H when I wasn't home. He had full access to my friends, male or female.

I recall when his brother passed away he got a condolence card from a female that I did not know. . Not an issue initially but the personal nature of the note in it was somewhat suspect and when I asked him about it he mistakenly threw it my face that I had male friends so therefore he could have female.

 

`When is she coming to dinner because I can't wait to meet her' I asked.

 

. . I probably don't need to finish this story. . you can fill in the blank.

 

His friends should be your friends. . problem solved.

[DancingFool]

Forget female or male friends for a moment. From the added details, it seems like the deeper issue is that over the years you are feeling excluded from large parts of his life and activities. Essentially an outsider to his social life and friends and not a part of the group. That is a huge problem and has nothing to do with the gender of his friends. Him painting you in a negative light and pitting you against his friends makes the issue even worse and makes it so that you really can't win and be accepted by his group. If he is badmouthing you, and telling his friends that you are jealous/possessive IS badmouthing you, then no surprise that his friends are not going to like you and be cold to you if not outright nasty towards you.

 

I suspect that your bf keeps you out of his loop because he uses his "friends" to feed his ego of being desirable. Not saying that he is cheating, just that he is playing games that are not so nice.

 

Anyway, in 5 years, you should have grown closer together as a couple and become more involved and stronger together. In this case, it seems like you have drifted and become compartmentalized. I think deep down you know that and you also know that this is not working out and you should walk away even if you haven't admitted it yet. He is talking marriage, you are having serious doubts. That's your gut talking to you and trying to tell you that something stinks here. You are not going to change who he is.

[LC8328]

I agree with this. I get what everyone else is saying, and theoretically I agree, but wrong or right, I have to be honest: I would feel uncomfortable too. And to me it's not just that they're female. If my BF's male friends continuously made me feel left out of the group and gave me the cold shoulder and obviously didn't like me, that would make me feel sad.

 

Of course, friends (regardless of gender) can be catty and maybe they won't like you, but that's life sometimes. Ideally you shouldn't have to tell your BF NOT to have these friends...some friends of mine haven't liked men I've dated but I've never broken up with the man or the friend because of that...it is what it is.

 

I'll backup what one poster said that it might be a good compromise to have your BF ask his friends to cool it a bit with the excessive 'love ya!' stuff and the too-many-FB-tags stuff. Yes, these are all platonic, but objectively, it's still a bit over-the-top and disrespectful to your relationship...depending on whether or not you feel offended by it, which you obviously do. I mean, if it were the other way around and you were in his shoes, would you feel uncomfortable if you had platonic friends doing all this stuff while ignoring your partner? Everyone has different boundaries, and throughout this relationship you have obviously been struggling with it.

 

Maybe in return, you can relent a little bit on the subject. It's not totally fair, no, but first of all you trust him, and secondly, if he puts in some effort by asking his female friends to cool it on the posts and 'love ya!' gifts, you can likewise try to push through some of this.

 

Slightly off-subject...I think what concerns me most about this is the disrespect. When his friends talk about you, how does he reply, I wonder? I really hope, for the sake of your relationship, that he continues to respect you and asks his friends, regardless of their opinion of you, to use some tact. Saying you are not the right one for him is unacceptable. I could never say that to a BFF because that's not for me to decide. idk, IMO, I think a good friend (male or female) should find good things to say about you, and if they disagree with you they should express it in a mature manner. Has ANY of his friends ever said about you, "Oh, your GF? She's nice/pretty/smart. I like her."

[totobear]

** This is response to DancingFool. Sorry not sure how to reply directly to your quote."

 

You touched on precisely some of my concerns. I've always felt somewhat neglected when we are out in a big group or social event. It's like he is the star and he is in the lime light. It's not that I don't like that he is a popular/charming person, but I just feel like there are better ways to socialize while still paying attention to your significant others. For example, sometimes when he is in the midst of an interesting conversation with another person, he can keep talking for a long time. Meanwhile I am just sitting next to him, sipping my drinks and wanting him to include me in the conversation. And it's not that I don't want to participate in the conversation, but sometimes when they are talking about insider jokes at work or about someone that they both know, I have no idea what exactly they are talking about. If it was me, I would always notice if my boyfriend or friend next to me seem bored, then I would try to include that person such as explaining what the joke was about or ask the person what does he/she think about what we said.

 

Anyway, you are right, that is an issue. It makes me feel un-significant and un-important in his eyes. I have tried explaining to him so many times, but he would say "of course you are important, look how much time I am spending with you and all the things that we do together like watching movies at home cuddling." But I want him to behave like that in the public too, I want other people to see that he pays a lot of attention to me and always caring about me. Sigh...I think it's just a case of different perspectives in social interactions. Otherwise our personality really does mesh well, we like the same exact things and enjoy doing the same hobbies; we never get bored talking to each other.

[totobear]

I think some of his guy friends and maybe 1 or 2 female friends have commented that they think I am pretty or nice. I didn't hear that from them in person, he told me that they told him after I've met them. Yes I will try to discuss with him about toning it down. He can have as many female friends as he want. It is the appropriateness and the boundaries of his friendships that trouble me. I also have guy friends, but I set my boundaries clear. For instance, a guy friend once said to me (semi-drunk): "You are so pretty I love you." I immediately made an exaggerated face and said Dude stop being gross. Man your breath stinks hahaha!" Obviously I was joking and we had a good laugh about it. But if a female friend says something similar to my boyfriend, he will prob say "aww, you are so sweet" and then give her a hug. That's my issue with him, he can have 1,000 female friends I don't care, but he needs to behave more appropriately or girls will think he is reciprocating. I just wish he can change this one single thing. Everything else would be perfect if he can change that.

[DancingFool]

Like I said, this one thing is a serious thing and it's not going to change. In a way, your relationship works precisely because you don't take away or compete for his spotlight. The real question is are you really happy and can you really live for the rest of your life feeling like you do, assuming that he is not going to change, which he won't. He might get worse, but he is not going to get better and you can count on that. As a good friend of mine would say, before you marry someone take everything that you hate about them, multiply by a hundredfold and then decide if you can truly live with that because once married, the final brakes they had on their bad behavior will be off for good. She is sadly correct on that. So again, it's not a single small thing and I hope you think long and hard about this.

[totobear]

Yea that's a valid point and I have to agree with your logic. But it's super hard to let go especially when you've known the person for so long. In my initial post, I said that I have dated him for almost 5 years now. But I've actually known him for nearly 10 years (long story - became platonic friends first as "pen pals" we exchange emails over long distance back when we lived in different cities. He moved to my city and we started dating, still live in same city.).

 

In between the 5 years of dating, we actually broke up for about 2 years before getting back together. And during that break up period I've dated someone for about 1.5 years and had other guy friends that were interested in me. That someone that I dated for 1.5 years was someone that I thought about settling down with at the time; but we broke up due to differences in life goals, financial hardships and personalities. Then I went back to the current guy. That's the thing, I feel like no matter who I am with or who I date, I will always go back to this guy. We can talk about anything and not feel bored. 10 years we've known each other and we don't run out of topics to talk about and still enjoy doing the same hobbies. So I guess I am doomed to either leave him and settle for someone I won't love as much or stay with him but endure some insecurity/hurt. Life sucks

[Circe]

You're an introvert but you can't deal with him doing fun social stuff without you - so do you want to be included on this stuff or do you simply want him to stop doing that stuff? I'm guessing the latter (could be wrong).

 

Anyway.. I think his friends aren't being considerate of you when they spend hours on the phone with him or give him mugs with such personal messages like that - sure. But does this stuff actually happen often or is it fairly rare? Surely they aren't breaking up with their bfs and sending gifts every week.

 

I think it's controlling of you to try and get him to spend less time with, or cut off, friends that were in his life well before you two got together - or even friends he meets afterwards. Friends are important and some people bond as well, as friends, with males and females.

 

As for yelling at him about this - and insisting that even if he's right and you are wrong he should change his behaviour to make you happy - that sounds extremely selfish to me. Why don't you change your behaviour to make him happy - even if you're right? Not fair, is it? Not appropriate, is it? Compromises are important in relationships but i don't think this is a situation where he needs to compromise. It doesn't sound like he's not spending enough time with you because he's socialising so much - it sounds like he's a good bf to you - you simply want him to stop having these friendships with females. You don't want him to spend time with them without you. Well, I don't think that's fair. The dynamic between two friends who catch up WITHOUT their significant other attached to the hip is different to when you catch up WITH the significant other. I would absolutely hate it if every time I saw my friends (male or female) my husband had to come - every time. It would change the dynamic completely because the conversation has to be about something all three people want to talk about .. I couldn't stay as close and connected to my friends if we did that every time we caught up.

 

So basically - yes it can be tough having a boyfriend with a lot of female friends, but as long as he is otherwise a good bf to you I think it's something you need to deal with - not try to make him give up friendships.

 

As for him telling his friends about your relationship problems.. do you not tell your friends about your relationship problems? I know that ALL my friends tell me about their relationship problems. I think that's something people do often because they want support and advice and they need to talk. Also - I think their advice is pretty spot on. You are bossy, jealous and insecure if you are telling someone who has never treated you badly and never given you reason to think he is a cheater - that they have to give up their friends or stop spending as much time with them just because they are female. And if this is a guy with a lot of female friends, who bonds well with females and enjoys the company of females as friends - then yeah, perhaps you aren't the girl for him.

[Circe]

This is what I'm talking about. If your SO is with you in a get together with YOUR friend or a group of YOUR friends - you either have to exclude them in order to have the kind of conversations and closeness you would usually have with your friends - or you have to have, quite frankly, an unsatisfying conversation that includes everyone just so no-one feels excluded. That's why sometimes its good to catch up with YOUR friends on your own.

 

I don't agree that your friends should always be your SO's friends. Yes you should all know each other and there should be occasions when you do all get together but I think it's normal, healthy and appropriate to also spend time with Your friends on your own.

 

You're unhappy because you want people to see him paying lots of attention to you in a social gathering? Honestly, that sounds so immature to me. If he's absorbed in a conversation with his friend and you feel bored - get up and go speak to someone else. Strike up a conversation with someone else. Or - don't go to these events if you think you'll have a terrible time. Instead, to expect him to not talk with his friends and focus on you so you can feel good and feel that other people see he adores you.. it just seems childish and unfair to me.

 

Clearly this guy is not someone who ignores you and doesn't spend time with you in general. You have said yourself that he's a good partner and he's there for you. You just want him to be that way all the time - and that's not going to gel with his personality. He's a social person and socialising the way he does is a part of what gives him energy and happiness. Notwithstanding what others have said to you - I think it's uncaring and unloving of you to not recognise this in his personality, not recognise that this is important for his happiness - and try to deal with what appears to be unwarranted jealousy on your part.

[ThatwasThen]

So I guess I am doomed to either leave him and settle for someone I won't love as much or stay with him but endure some insecurity/hurt. Life sucks

That's the thing though. If you were to break up with him and consider him to be not good life material for you because you can't stand the "competition" so to speak then you would indeed get over him and you would then be open in heart and mind enough to find someone who you would "love as much" and probably differently but much better because that "competition" wouldn't be there for you to worry over.

 

Anyway. Decide can you or can you not adjust to accept that he will always be who he currently is.

[Snny]

He has NO boundaries with these girls and he has been like this for five years. You need to drop him.

 

It is ok if:

Hehad female friends, is tagged in their pictures or goes out for a casual lunch with them once in a blue moon by himself.

 

What was not ok:

Him talking about his relationship problems with them instead of you (strike one)

Talking in the phone for HOURS.

Talking about relationship problems (that is a dangerous slope to be on that will backfire and pull you into an emotional affair)

A girl giving him that mug -- very inappropriate for a friend to do

When knowing someone is in a committed relationship.

Him hanging out with them regularly without you.

 

You both need to act like a united force when establishing boundaries with people outside of your relationship. There will be people who will try to cause friction in your marriage throughout your life- it doesn't stop. If he is going to be a doormat and just do it for eho purposes, then he isn't grown up enough for a committed adult relationship. He is acting as the enabler of their behavior.