Do the 50/50 of ''who pays on the date ever work out''?

[mhowe]

It's a matter of nomenclature really, as I have two sets of manners.

 

One for a girl I am dating (lady manners), and another for everybody else (people in general manners).

 

The difference being things like opening car doors, pulling out chairs, walking on the street side of the sidewalk, etc.

 

If you start buying dinner for people on the street, you will attract quite a following. Just sayin'

[Thorshammer]

It doesnt matter, i dont care who pays. Women have paid for me, it made no difference in my behavior, only thing that makes a difference is if the woman thinks i am going to keep paying all the time- that automatically paints her as a princess, and she wont last long. I dont expect to pay for every date unless they dont work, or i make so much more- but in return i dont expect her to stay home wearing dresses and being opressed, so its not pick and chose what tradition to keep.

[SarahRose]

It doesnt matter, i dont care who pays. Women have paid for me, it made no difference in my behavior, only thing that makes a difference is if the woman thinks i am going to keep paying all the time- that automatically paints her as a princess, and she wont last long. I dont expect to pay for every date unless they dont work, or i make so much more- but in return i dont expect her to stay home wearing dresses and being opressed, so its not pick and chose what tradition to keep.

 

i keep hearing this argument about women picking and choosing which traditions to keep and acting like a princess and about equality but i hear a bitter underlying tone that says to me, "yeah girlie if you want to be equal i get to treat you like dog poo."

 

that attitude really falls flat. it sounds like men who really don't think women should be equal and are bitter about it.

[SarahRose]

well we need men to grow up and get off the computer and stop escaping into video games.

 

who is going to manage the future? i certainly hope not a bunch of bitter lazy basement dwellers.

 

You are missing the whole point. Contributing to society doesn't just help other people, it helps you too.

 

It sounds like you have the attitude why should i bother doing anything if i get no benefit from it. what's in it for me?

 

That what's in it for me is what is breaking society.

 

when you get out in the world and do a small part to make your community better, it helps you as much as it helps the community. you get to live in a better world.

[FathomFear]

i keep hearing this argument about women picking and choosing which traditions to keep and acting like a princess and about equality but i hear a bitter underlying tone that says to me, "yeah girlie if you want to be equal i get to treat you like dog poo."

 

that attitude really falls flat. it sounds like men who really don't think women should be equal and are bitter about it.

 

I'm not sure I'm following you. How is buying meals for women about equality? The practice is inherently unequal. That's the point. Just as it would be unequal to expect women to stay at home and cook. Same concept, except one tradition is your advantage and one isn't. The point is that people have the tendency of sticking to those traditions which benefit them vs. those that don't, even if they're all based on inequality.

[FathomFear]

well we need men to grow up and get off the computer and stop escaping into video games.

 

For every guy who sits at home watching video games, how many women are walking around shopping malls like zombies? Anyone regardless of gender can lapse into mundane practices. I'm not sure there's any point in singling out men and video games.

[Blue Spiral]

well we need men to grow up and get off the computer and stop escaping into video games.

 

who is going to manage the future? i certainly hope not a bunch of bitter lazy basement dwellers.

 

My vote for who manages the future: women! Sad to say, the last eight thousand or so years of history haven't gone so well, and my gender has been in charge for most of that. I think your gender has more than earned their turn. In all seriousness, men and women are now in charge, so the pool of future-managers has basically doubled. That means I can take a break without feeling guilty.

 

And, just so I understand you correctly: women not wanting to pay for their own meals = not lazy, but men not wanting to pay for someone else's meals = lazy?

 

You are missing the whole point. Contributing to society doesn't just help other people, it helps you too.

 

If I had a cure for some disease, I'd agree with you. But we aren't talking about global problems, here. We're talking about you not being wined and dined. By voting and not being evil, I'm contributing to society...but I don't think that buying you dinner falls in the same "unquestionable moral good" category. Granted, from your perspective, I can see why you'd want to argue that it does.

 

It sounds like you have the attitude why should i bother doing anything if i get no benefit from it. what's in it for me?

 

Some people and groups take the idea of self-interest too far, but, yes, I think it's a reasonable thing to consider when making decisions. I'm a big believer in carefully examining risk and reward. There's a difference between being selfish/evil and saying "I don't really see the appeal in that, and it's pretty risky anyway, so I'm not going to do it."

[Fudgie]

Expecting men to always pay and to always hold doors for you IS unequal. Plus it's not fair to the guy.

 

I love being treated to dinner. I smile when my boyfriend opens a door for me or pulls out my chair. He carries my stuff when I'm pooped. It's polite. But I also do the same for him. I will hold a door for him if I get there first or he's carrying stuff. I help him carry stuff. I pay for half of the dates. It has nothing to do with gender... But everything to do with reciprocation because you love someone and you're partners.

 

You can't ask for equality, then expect special treatment that benefits you. That is called cherry picking.

[The_Seeker]

lol my ex didn't wish my a happy birthday either and didn't take the time on the christmas gift.

 

Now listen you posters i'm not expecting an expensive gift, but if he knew who i was he knew what i like [ i love long romantic letters and chocolate covered strawberries. if he got me that for christmas, i be the happiest woman on earth. but he didn't get me that. -.-; he got me a christmas ornament.]

 

LOL so yeawutever, just offer to pay. If he insists he takes the whole thing, let him.

 

Not only that, if you are interested in him more, show it. Don't mask yourselves.

[yeawutever]

lol my ex didn't wish my a happy birthday either and didn't take the time on the christmas gift.

 

Now listen you posters i'm not expecting an expensive gift, but if he knew who i was he knew what i like [ i love long romantic letters and chocolate covered strawberries. if he got me that for christmas, i be the happiest woman on earth. but he didn't get me that. -.-; he got me a christmas ornament.]

 

LOL so yeawutever, just offer to pay. If he insists he takes the whole thing, let him.

 

Not only that, if you are interested in him more, show it. Don't mask yourselves.

It was pointless with him and in the end I got sick of tired of it (he was like a hard dried rock.... I do my part and he doing little in return). At least you got something.... he gave me nothing. Now that's inconsiderate because I wasn't a stranger at that time but his gf. I felt like I was treated like a casual friend and he didn't value me as a woman nor person at all.

[The_Seeker]

It was pointless with him and in the end I got sick of tired of it (he was like a hard dried rock.... I do my part and he doing little in return). At least you got something.... he gave me nothing. Now that's inconsiderate because I wasn't a stranger at that time but his gf. I felt like I was treated like a casual friend and he didn't value me as a woman nor person at all.

 

I learned my lesson, if I question myself the quality of the relationship, I bailing out. ;]

[yeawutever]

I pay for half of the dates. It has nothing to do with gender.

I would do that once I know the him well and if he's worthy of my trust. Wouldn't mind paying for half of the date... as long as he reciprocates and doesn't turn out to be like my ex.

 

Another part my parents disliked the most about him is the following: At some point my mother and I were undergoing a crisis to the point I had to quit my job (a terrible moment for me). I didn't have enough money by then and had to empty my whole account, went out with my ex for that day only (the last time we went out.... because within the following days I had to go to my country) but he still had the nerve to ask me to bring at least $40. Yet it was his invitation.

 

It was like saying ''Can't you see I'm really struggling at this moment''. He knew my situation very well and still expected 50/50. If the guy had common sense, he would have made an exception and pay for that date esp. if he's the one asking out.

[yeawutever]

I learned my lesson, if I question myself the quality of the relationship, I bailing out. ;]

I know but yet I stayed for so long. By the 3rd or 4th month, I was beginning to question the relationship. Never again. If my gut instinct starts telling me something isn't right then it probably isn't.

[The_Seeker]

I know but yet I stayed for so long. By the 3rd or 4th month, I was beginning to question the relationship. Never again. If my gut instinct starts telling me something isn't right then it probably isn't.

 

I was with my ex from Halloween to May. LOL

 

Same here.

 

;] You'll be fine on the next one.

[Mercurial Girl]

It was like saying ''Can't you see I'm really struggling at this moment''. He knew my situation very well and still expected 50/50. If the guy had common sense, he would have made an exception and pay for that date esp. if he's the one asking out.

 

Can I ask why you didn't bring that up with him?

[yeawutever]

Can I ask why you didn't bring that up with him?

I didn't because at the time I was a very patient, sweet girl who wouldn't say no, always apologized on every single argument even when I wasn't at fault or wouldn't even bring a valid point when I was hurt or upset. In a way I was similar to the so called ''nice guy'' we've all heard of but in female version. I kept on tolerating it till one day I exploded and let it out.

 

I've been way patient than any girl would've been with him.

 

Other than that, at the time I was hoping he would finally value me and do something special for once. Nothing. What I don't get: if according to him I was the best thing that ever happened to him (in his own words) and wasn't a ''stupid girl'' and sweet then why he treated me like that???

He tried calling a couple weeks ago and I hunged up quickly without answering.

[DoGGYtREAts]

Your father is old-fashioned. People who aren't old-fashioned aren't "losers". While I agree that not wishing someone Happy Birthday is pretty bad, especially from your partner, I don't see how this relates to paying 50/50. I think you're likely just obsessing over "why" your relationship failed, and are grasping at straws and making conclusions which don't quite make sense.

 

this. we frequently over-anylize these sorts of things. My wife and i both work, we both get the tab some times.. theres no big thing about it and it has no bearing on the rest of our relationship. who ever has cash on hand at the time of the event pays.. the other gets the next one.. no biggie. We've always done it this way with out any problem. IIRC SHE paid for our first date... And when her birthday came up later in the month i actually sold a few of my own things so i could afford to take her out for her birthday.

 

Bottom line- one does not directly point to the other. The op simply had the misfortune of getting a guy who was both Cheap AND inconsiderate.

[yeawutever]

Bottom line- one does not directly point to the other. The op simply had the misfortune of getting a guy who was both Cheap AND inconsiderate.

Yes unfortunately and it was due to link removed. Being 19 at the time, I was randomly chatting with guys and looking to see if any were interested in me and that's how it started. For some reason I never got hit on too much and if they do, they're not the ones who would be worth being in a relationship with.

[Batya33]

I don't think your tolerance was "patient" or "sweet" but "passive" - it's important to recognize the distinction and not to label it as "nice" - you wanted him to stick around so you tolerated behavior that wasn't up to your standards and justified it by telling yourself you were just being sweet. I'm an old married lady (20 years older than you!) and I still have to learn how to be assertive with my husband in certain situations (ironically he was what you would call "nice" and I would call "passive" many years ago -thank goodness he changed). It's not about simply "confronting and demanding -that doesn't work -it's about finding positive ways to communicate your needs and believing in yourself that you deserve what you're asking for.

[Dusk1983]

Expecting men to always pay and to always hold doors for you IS unequal. Plus it's not fair to the guy.

 

I love being treated to dinner. I smile when my boyfriend opens a door for me or pulls out my chair. He carries my stuff when I'm pooped. It's polite. But I also do the same for him. I will hold a door for him if I get there first or he's carrying stuff. I help him carry stuff. I pay for half of the dates. It has nothing to do with gender... But everything to do with reciprocation because you love someone and you're partners.

 

You can't ask for equality, then expect special treatment that benefits you. That is called cherry picking.

 

You've just saved me a rant. Thank God there are women out there like you - you know, logical, well reasoned and fair.

 

It's a matter of nomenclature really, as I have two sets of manners.

 

One for a girl I am dating (lady manners), and another for everybody else (people in general manners).

 

The difference being things like opening car doors, pulling out chairs, walking on the street side of the sidewalk, etc.

 

In other words, you change your behaviour towards people with something you want (female approval and/or a date and/or sex.) That makes you both obsequious and disingenuous. Bravo.

[yeawutever]

I don't think your tolerance was "patient" or "sweet" but "passive" - it's important to recognize the distinction and not to label it as "nice" - you wanted him to stick around so you tolerated behavior that wasn't up to your standards and justified it by telling yourself you were just being sweet.

Yeah that's pretty how how I felt. At the time, I didn't wanted a break up and since at the same time it was my first it's like I wanted keep him (similar to when you caught a fish, have it and refused to let it off the rod). Looking back, at times it was me begging for a break up not to happen when he threatened to leave twice during an argument. He would make those ''Then let's break up'' threats and in return I was the one apologizing and making peace: my way of preventing him from leaving.

 

One time he hurt me saying if we were to break up or I leave him, he would quickly find another girl. I understand that part but did he had to say that???

In the end: I did the break up. The fun part was when it was him doing the calling and practically begging for another chance (it made me feel in control for that short moment as if saying ''See how I was feeling when I was doing the begging and mixing argument now it's one you''). Stupidly, I went for it again but I had to break up again for good.

[Batya33]

It's when it stops being "fun" to be chased in those circumstances that you'll take a large step towards finding a serious relationship.

[goodfoot]

A lot of guys are coming to the same conclusion. Women are mad about the lack of chivalry and good men, but a lot of that is because most women aren't worth the effort these days. At the end of the day, guys will conform to what women want because, for the most part, men want sex more than women. When a guy needed to court women and get married to get sex, men took on those responsibilities. Now that women can do for themselves and are having sex more freely, a lot of men feel less motivated. They either:

 

a. Are attractive enough that they will get women without any effort

 

or

 

b. Aren't getting attention no matter how much effort they put in

[Thorshammer]

i keep hearing this argument about women picking and choosing which traditions to keep and acting like a princess and about equality but i hear a bitter underlying tone that says to me, "yeah girlie if you want to be equal i get to treat you like dog poo."

 

that attitude really falls flat. it sounds like men who really don't think women should be equal and are bitter about it.

 

And i hear someone who believes they have some entitlement to something just because they are a woman. Its ridiculous to think you are being treated as dog poo because the man refuses to pay, lol. I treat a human fairly when i can, regardless of what they have between their legs- nothing there says anything about mistreatment.

[Coconut Twin]

you're in control to a certain extent. you can't really 'blame' an entire generation of men for your view of the world. that's your view. own it. it's all you see because it's what you've chosen to see.

 

Oh 90 hours I love your posts! Can't rep ya though, have to spread around apparently..