violated last night

[imsuperman]

link removed

 

Interpretation of article by wikipedia:

 

"In any allegation of rape, the absence of consent to sexual intercourse on the part of the victim is critical.[4] Consent need not be expressed, and may be implied from the context and from the relationship of the parties, but the absence of objection does not of itself constitute consent. Lack of consent may result from either forcible compulsion by the perpetrator or an incapacity to consent on the part of the victim (such as persons who are asleep, intoxicated or otherwise mentally helpless).[4][24] The law can also invalidate consent in the case of sexual intercourse with a person below the age at which they can legally consent to such relations with older persons. (See age of consent.) Such cases are sometimes called statutory rape or "unlawful sexual intercourse", regardless of whether it was consensual or not, as people who are under a certain age in relation to the perpetrator are deemed legally incapable of consenting to sex.[4] Consent can always be withdrawn at any time, so that any further sexual activity after the withdrawal of consent constitutes rape."

[DylanNotorious]

Sorry but if I was sitting on jury listening to this case - I would have to agree with GrowingIn that this is not rape.

 

It is something, but it's not full on rape.

[OptomisticGirl]

10 years old or 26 years old, the fear is the same. Your line of thinking is why a huge portion of rapes aren't reported because women think they should have done more, should have fought back, should have screamed - in that instance you know whats going to happen and can't stop. Every woman whose clothes is being ripped off knows what's about to happen to them - does that mean it isnt rape if you know what's happening? Please. I was sexually assualted in a living room while my mom slept in the next room, does thi@ mean it was my fault or I was being submissve because i didn't cry out?

 

You get sexually assualted and then come back and tell me you still follow that line of crap.

[peanutbutterandjelly]

i made that post really fast and didnt include as many details as I could have. I just wanted to post it up and tell some and get advice. so let me clarify some things...

[GrowingIn]

And if my husband did the same thing to me it would be rape. Even if I would choose on another day to have sex with him, I might not another day. And if he dragged me downstairs and stuck his penis in my mouth when I said no and tried to pull away, that would be rape.

 

And none of that was described in this story. Please, I ask you to point it out where she claimed she was "dragged" because I would be right along with you in that case. But I'm not, because once again, this is what the OP said happened:

"he basically pick me up off the couch by putting his hands under my arms and walked me down the stairs. "

 

and this

 

"so he brings me down stairs, and long story short, he shoves his penis in my mouth and hold my mouth open. then he had sex with me for like 2 seconds without a condom before he came. "

 

Realize that the rest of those things: "dragged", "forced", "screamed no", etc....is your interpretation. It's your imagination of this incident. Not what the OP stated. And once again, yes, I agree there is a lot of room for interpretation because it is all so vague.

 

And if we're just going to talk about what "we would do" well in that case if I was a man or woman and someone tried to force their penis into my mouth, personally, even if I didn't want to wake anyone up I'd at the very least, the very least, say "you stick that thing in my mouth I'm going to bite it". The way I see it, she could have easily been one loud enough "NO" away from putting a stop from everything and she didn't even have to explain to anyone else what she was saying "NO" to. Something she admittedly chose NOT to do.

 

The only thing that is clear in this story to me, is that, by her own admission, she chose to not put a stop to it.

[OptomisticGirl]

If my husband were lifting me up by my arms and walking me down the stairs, I would probably not scream out because my children are home with us. It would be pretty humiliating for me to know my sons would know my husband was trying to get his penis inside me against my will. Yes, I could yell and say help, your father is raping me. But I wouldn't do that.

 

So you see? It can be embarrassing to be RAPED when you are in a house full of people.

 

Exactly. Same reason a person who is assaulted again and again doesn't come right out and tell anyone - it's embarrassing. You are humiliated. You feel like Tyne lowest scum on the rung. In the words of Miss F, if you don't want to kiss a guy, why in the world would you screw him?

[Miss Firecracker]

GrowingIn, I hope you did read the definition of rape as posted on this thread.

[Miss Firecracker]

Exactly. Same reason a person who is assaulted again and again doesn't come right out and tell anyone - it's embarrassing. You are humiliated. You feel like Tyne lowest scum on the rung. In the words of Miss F, if you don't want to kiss a guy, why in the world would you screw him?

 

Yes, you feel if someone thinks you are scummy enough to push around like that, then everyone probably does.

 

I have been raped and it makes you feel like pond scum.

[OptomisticGirl]

GrowingIn, I hope you did read the definition of rape as posted on this thread.

 

Rape is apparently only classified as rape when you are kicking and screaming for you life. It's like that absurd argument that if a woman orgasms during rape she really wanted it - baffles my mind how in this century we still think like this.

[Miss Firecracker]

I think this man walked her down the stairs about as easily as I could a 7 year old child too.

[Applewhite]

Growingin, what part of she said NO and she was intoxicated did you not understand?

[GrowingIn]

And yes I did Miss Firecracker. It's quite easy to see how from that definition, either case can be made. Lack of objection does not constitute consent, but her submission to the events following the kissing can easily argued as "expressed consent". Especially when one admits going along with it and knowing there were things she could have done to stop it. Also I will add, that prior sexual relationship and admitting desire to continue sexual relations with this man if this didn't happen doesn't help her case.

 

But the most glaring problem in this story is the fact they were two adults, acting quietly enough not to wake up a house full of other adults. Again I asked earlier if she was drugged. That's the only way I can see this sticking. But nowhere did she indicate she was incapacitated.

[Applewhite]

And yes I did Miss Firecracker. It's quite easy to see how from that definition, either case can be made. Lack of objection does not constitute consent, but her submission to the events following the kissing can easily argued as "expressed consent". Especially when one admits going along with it and knowing there were things she could have done to stop it. Also I will add, that prior sexual relationship and admitting desire to continue sexual relations with this man if this didn't happen doesn't help her case.

 

But the most glaring problem in this story is the fact they were two adults, acting quietly enough not to wake up a house full of other adults. Again I asked earlier if she was drugged. That's the only way I can see this sticking. But nowhere did she indicate she was incapacitated.

 

Clearly you are biased and not so 'objective' as you put it. I suggest re-reading the definition until you actually understand it.

[imsuperman]

Milkandhoney,

 

How are you feeling today? Have you made any decisions on what you're going to do?

[OptomisticGirl]

And yes I did Miss Firecracker. It's quite easy to see how from that definition, either case can be made. Lack of objection does not constitute consent, but her submission to the events following the kissing can easily argued as "expressed consent". Especially when one admits going along with it and knowing there were things she could have done to stop it. Also I will add, that prior sexual relationship and admitting desire to continue sexual relations with this man if this didn't happen doesn't help her case.

 

But the most glaring problem in this story is the fact they were two adults, acting quietly enough not to wake up a house full of other adults. Again I asked earlier if she was drugged. That's the only way I can see this sticking. But nowhere did she indicate she was incapacitated.

 

Prior sexual history has nothing to do with it. You can have sex with someone 10 times and the 11th time say no and if they continue. It's assualt. Nothing to be confused about.

 

And again, until you are assualted in a house full of people, dont assume what a victim should do. It's very different to have lived what they go through.

[GrowingIn]

Growingin, what part of she said NO and she was intoxicated did you not understand?

 

Ok I can see I'm at a point where I just keep repeating myself so I will stop after this. I already stated she has him for kissing without consent. I stated that in the first reply. I also stated everything beyond that looks like submission.

 

Let me ask you this....what part of the OP's statements: "i feel so stupid because i could have screamed or put up more of a fight and that wouldnt have happened to me" and "But I didnt want my friends to know he was doing it to me, i didnt want to make a big deal out of it and felt like he was going to do it anyways and it was just easier at the time just to let him do what he wanted."

 

did you not understand?

 

She didn't want at first, she gave in, and then she feels guilty about giving in. If this is the story she takes to the authorities, I guarantee you this is how it's going to be seen. While there's certainly bias going on here, it's not coming from me. I'm stating facts. Simple as that. It's calling an orange an orange.

 

If she so once made the statement in bold to any police officer her case would be shot to hell. End of story. Let's not even factor in the location, age, other adults.

[Applewhite]

duplicate post

[Applewhite]

Unfortunately on your end repeating yourself does no good when what you are saying makes no sense Growingin!

 

Milkandhoney, a lot of rape victims blame themselves after the event. I am sorry this happened to you. If you feel the need to keep this all private and forget it I am sure we would all understand this. IF however you feel the need to share it, report it etc please know that not many people will view this the way Growingin 'objecctively' views it, and people will tell you the same thing I'm telling you: It is NOT your fault.

[GrowingIn]

Prior sexual history has nothing to do with it. You can have sex with someone 10 times and the 11th time say no and if they continue. It's assualt. Nothing to be confused about.

 

And again, until you are assualted in a house full of people, dont assume what a victim should do. It's very different to have lived what they go through.

 

OptomisticGirl, please do not make any assumptions on whether or not I was a victim of sexual abuse and so wrongly continue to insinuate victims of prior sexual abuse are better at judging and understanding these types of situations. That is NOT true. In fact you should read up on jury questioning and screening before you continue to carry a belief that is quite frankly, misinformed. Victims of sexual abuse are tightly scrutinized and questioned before ever being allowed to serve on a jury on a sexual assault case precisely because of the innate bias they tend to carry in their perceptions.

 

In other words, in the eyes of the law, if you were a victim of sexual abuse, you are less likely to be able to remain objective in such matters than a person who has not been a victim of sexual abuse. So your argument, that you "know better" because you were a victim is in reality not just flawed, but quite possibly, counter-intuitive. You're more likely to view this hole event with a biased perspective than people who have not been abused.

[peanutbutterandjelly]

as how he got me down the stairs, he was basically holding on and pushing me. I was holding onto the side of the walls, making sure that I wouldn't fall and he had his arms under my arms. I was mostly just thinking about trying not to fall. It was pitch black in the basement and I couldnt see a thing. He didnt push me so fast that I was falling but I was tripping on steps down the stairs. He would hold me up when I tripped. I think that was the easiest way for him to get me down there. We both could have fallen pretty easil. this all really happened in seconds though. ive never gone down a staircase so dark so fast before.

 

He put me on the couch and I was just lying there. He ripped off his pants then he got on top of me and shoved his penis in my mouth. i was lying flat on my back and he was trying to push it in and out of my mouth but i was at a bad angle. so thats when he sat me up on the couch, held my mouth open, shoved his penis into it and then basically raped my mouth. then after that, he ripped off my pj bottoms, shoved it into me, thrusted in me a few times and then he pulled out and came.

 

i really didnt say or do much that whole time. I just let him do what he wanted. I dont think it was an act of submission i just think i froze with fear, was drunk, was tired, embarassment, and basically not really knowing what decision to make. this all happened in under 5 minutes.

 

i feel like it was almost a play dead situation. im more of a flight not fight person. for whatever reason,i thought that lying there and getting it over with was the best way to handle it. i definitely didnt consent to any of the things that he did to me.

 

one thing that bothers me was that he definitely wasnt as drunk as I was.

[DylanNotorious]

Then why don't you report it?

 

It most certainly is, a different version than the first one you reported. If that's in actual fact what happened. People are just going to have to take your word on it.

 

But the thing that makes me skeptical is that you repeatedly had written threads about how you let people walk all over you. Especially guys. If this is indeed how it really did happen then you would report it.

[OptomisticGirl]

I never said prior victims of abuse have better judgement - but you keep saying she did nothing, she didn't stop him, she didn't scream, and I am telling you as a prior victim you can not BEGIN to comprehend that fear that paralyzes you into doing nothing until you have been sexually assualted. No one can.

[Miss Firecracker]

Then why don't you report it?

 

It most certainly is, a different version than the first one you reported. If that's in actual fact what happened. People are just going to have to take your word on it.

 

But the thing that makes me skeptical is that you repeatedly had written threads about how you let people walk all over you. Especially guys. If this is indeed how it really did happen then you would report it.

 

Are you saying she's telling us a lie?

[Seraphim]

I am sorry you had to go through this. I have been raped myself. I would certainly report this so he can not do this to anyone else. I know your intrepidation about doing that believe me. The thing is that is how these scum get away with it because no one reports them. If more rapes were reported these people would be taken off the streets.

[OptomisticGirl]

Then why don't you report it?

 

It most certainly is, a different version than the first one you reported. If that's in actual fact what happened. People are just going to have to take your word on it.

 

But the thing that makes me skeptical is that you repeatedly had written threads about how you let people walk all over you. Especially guys. If this is indeed how it really did happen then you would report it.

 

It's not always that easy DYlan. I let myself be sexually assaulted for three years because I was humiliated, embarrassed, a whole slew of things. I still don't know what gave me the courage to tell someone something was going on but it took THREE years of constant abuse for me to do it. I think people under estimate the power of humiliation when it comes to this, really.

 

My first response will always be to report a assault or rape but I know how hard that in fact is to do.