is not wearing makeup unprofessional?

[Jayar]

I say throw some make up on and get on with it. There are very few women in this world who can get away with the all natural look. Luckily god created make-up for the rest of us so we can fake it!

 

Personally I think women who go all natural look frumpy which to me equals unprofessional. Is this sexist? Of course it is. Society in general in sexist. Men don't need make up so thereforeeee they don't look frumpy without it. Is it fair? No. But hey who ever said life was fair?

 

Agreed! I generally always wear a little make-up. Even just to go for groceries. I mean, how hard is it to throw on a little eyeshadow, mascara, and some lip gloss? It makes a huge difference in your presentation, and it's such a little thing. It doesn't have to be an all or nothing deal either... If you don't need foundation, great! Try a nice light powder if anything at all.

[Sweet Buttabean Jellayroll]

im sure my job would have liked me too wear a fresh pair of undies, even though its none of their concern, but hey i cant wear the same ones(which i need too) and funk up the kitchen right?

 

sometimes we just gotta make due.

[Jayar]

im sure my job would have liked me too wear a fresh pair of undies, even though its none of their concern, but hey i cant wear the same ones(which i need too) and funk up the kitchen right?

 

sometimes we just gotta make due.

 

SBJ, hey you could just solve that problem by going commando!

[Lucy_lou]

Is it sexist? absoloutely.

 

It's a sad, but not inevitable fact that the world still places higher expectations of appearance on women than men. I recommend you go watch some old "I dream of genie" reruns, to get a full taste of the sexist heritage we'er still mired by. Sadly there's often a shortage of professional women who break this expectation and still shine, but they exist.

 

and if you've been asked not to wear jeans on casual fridays when everyone else does, that's just straight up unprofessional of the person who asked you not to. Who were they and did they explain themself? They really need to.

 

the mere fact that your organisation is predominantly men and only the 'secretaries' (administration officers?) are women demonstrates that it's a sexist organisation. yuck! (some people don't tolerate being called "secretaries" anymore). by the way, have you seen the film "the secretary?" it's all about domination and submission.

 

I could never hold my head up high, putting on makeup because some clueless man in a sexist organisation which only has women as 'secretaries' told me to. Don't start wearing makeup for them. It has nothing to do with tidiness. If you're organisation needs you to look more than tidy, but infact attractive (and lets face it, makeup is used to accentuate the eyes, make skin look airbrushed, and lips more luscious, in other words, to make a woman look more sexually attractive.) just because it's common doesn't mean its not sexist. Most women in the professional world don't bother to break out of the archaic ways of the past.

 

(but, on the other hand, if you are someone who doesn't have a great sense of style, perhaps your presentation is a little lacking, and you perhaps should make a little more effort. But not necessarily makeup. And you shouldn't take specific dress code orders. ) I think it's important to look like you are putting in an effort to look presentable. not attractive. I think looking attractive is unprofessional. I used to work in an office with this guy, and on casual fridays, he'd wear these tightish long sleve t-shirts, or floral shirts. It's hard to explain, but I could tell he was trying to make himself look hot and attractive. I found it really hard to take him seriously when he dressed in this way. It really harmed his professionalism in my eyes.

 

 

I think appearance does matter, but never let some guy tell you how to go about it. yuck! yuck! yuck!

[RayKay]

I think it HIGHLY depends on the environment.

 

I have worked in many different careers, some where not wearing makeup was totally cool, and in others where it was required a bit more.

 

I am NOT a big makeup person; though I may glam up more for a night out!

 

Like you I am freckled, and pale, but I have great skin and feel quite comfortable without makeup on. Generally for work though, where I work, the environment is professional and there is client interaction. I do throw on some light makeup - not foundation, hate it...but just a powder, mascara and a light dusting of shadow (and gloss). It really still does not look like I am WEARING it but it does step up the professionalism. I think it would really take away from the rest of my presentation (i.e. if I am wearing a suit) not to, to be honest.

 

I do NOT look "frumpy" in the least without makeup, and find that to be quite the statement! You can still be put together, clean and look good without makeup.

 

As a trade off, I still refuse to do anything to my hair though - it's cut and clean, but I HATE products so I like to leave it loose or in a professional ponytail without products in it - it has a nice wave in it though so it still looks good.

 

I am however totally surprised someone said women "need" makeup and men don't, so we should just live with it....it is not "needed" - we have just been conditioned to believe we do because even the "natural" looking models we see in advertisements are heavily made up and airbrushed. Seeing them nude without makeup or airbrushing - they look just as normal as the rest of us.

 

Man, makeup used to KILL people - it used to be in fashion to be pale, and women used makeup with white lead in it: link removed

 

Women "dying" literally to be beautiful and submit to the "desires" of men and "society". That is BS!

 

As for the jeans, if others are wearing them, I would discuss again with your supervisor and ask why the standard is different for you - is it because you are "frontline"? If there is no reason....well, that is just odd!

[agent1607307371]

link removed

 

I would refer you to this part though, as you might need this line with your supervisor.

 

Harrah's fired Jespersen because of her failure to confirm to sex stereotypes, which is discrimination based on sex and is thereforeeee impermissible under Title VII,.

[kaligrl22]

I do NOT look "frumpy" in the least without makeup, and find that to be quite the statement! You can still be put together, clean and look good without makeup.

 

Okay, okay. So frumpy probably wasn't the best description. I guess it's hard to explain. Wearing professional clothes and no make-up just doesn't seem to go together.

[agent1607307371]

Women wearing professional clothes and no make-up just doesn't seem to go together.

 

 

Make-up on women is a socialised expectation. There's no reason to do it other than that we're women. Which is unacceptable imo.

 

But then, I do like a man in a bit of lippy.

[Jayar]

But then, I do like a man in a bit of lippy.

 

I LOVE a man in lip gloss!!!! Of course, only if it was mine just before it ended up on him.

[Lucy_lou]

Whilst I think makeup is stupid, and makes most women look stupid, I will share something I read on dressing appropriately for work, and it said something along the lines that "to dress conservative is to keep in line with mainstream fashion." so I guess, if mainstream society is wearing makeup, then that's what it takes to conform to conservative fashion. It is unashamedly status quo. I mean, if everyone was wearing stilts, you'd probably have to follow suit. It's stupid, but that's what being conservative is all about. Not challenging the status quo. I guess you just have to decide if you are willing to swallow that and as that above poster said,"grin and bare it"

[jul-els]

I LOVE a man in lip gloss!!!! Of course, only if it was mine just before it ended up on him.

 

The application process is fun. Walking around with lip gloss on your shirt sleeve isn't, but it's a fair exchange.

[Honey Pumpkin]

Lip gloss would make the difference, and you can just smear that on without a difference. I think maybe it's about looking 'polished', and I wear a work make-up. I don't HAVE to, but I just feel I look more together in a smart outfit if I have a bit of lipstick and mascara on.

 

Don't be bullied into anything - but think if this is the thing that you want to make a stand over. Smart/casual is really hard to define, but I would have a look at the others in the office, see waht they are wearing and if you 'fit' in. Corporate life is horrible, but like I say, a bit of lip gloss might just make you look a bit more finished.

 

It's wrong, but think if you want to have a fight about this or not.

 

Good luck.

[TheSmilingTurnip]

Women wearing professional clothes and no make-up just doesn't seem to go together.

 

Make-up on women is a socialised expectation. There's no reason to do it other than that we're women. Which is unacceptable imo.

 

BINGO. My skin is clean and unmarred. My eyebrows are groomed. My teeth are clean and straight.

 

The word makeup does not even appear in our dress code.

[CarnelianButterfly]

 

Man, makeup used to KILL people - it used to be in fashion to be pale, and women used makeup with white lead in it: link removed

 

Women "dying" literally to be beautiful and submit to the "desires" of men and "society". That is BS!

Its not much different today, now instead of white, tan is in, so women are baking themselves to suit. The skin cancer numbers are rising and more women are having botox and surgery to get rid of the wrinkles.

 

Make-up is a nasty substance still, no matter the kind it still causes trouble. Look at eyelashes for instance, women that have been wearing mascara for years generally have short, thin lashes. Non-mascara wearers have more full lashes.

[browneyedgirl36]

This is a hard one...

 

I wear make-up every day because I like it and think it enhances my appearance. I don't wear a ton, but enough that it hides flaws and brightens my face up a bit. However, I don't think an employer really has the right to tell an employee she *has* to wear make-up, and if mine did, I would be upset. If she's appropriately dressed, has good hygiene, and is otherwise well-presented, why should she have to wear make-up? I could see if she was a receptionist at a modeling agency, or if she was in the entertainment industry or in the fashion or beauty industries (i.e. working at a make-up counter, as another poster suggested), but otherwise...I don't know, it just seems really sketchy for a supervisor to tell the OP she needs to wear make-up, particularly for the type of job she has. And, some people look GREAT without it....I wish I was one of those people, but I don't have perfect skin, and I have huge pores!

 

Anyway...to the OP: Is there a Human Resources person you could discuss this with? Or, do you feel comfortable enough with your supervisor to discuss this with him or her in a calm, tactful manner? If the answer is "no" to both of these questions, and if you think your job might be in jeopardy if you don't comply (even though I'm pretty sure that's illegal in most cases), you might just wear the absolute MINIMUM you have to -- some lighter mascara (light brown or something) and some tinted lip balm -- Neutrogena and a few other companies make an almost chapstick-like thing that has a tiny bit of color to it. As Honey Pumpkin said, you have to pick your battles and decide if it's worth it not to comply. Quite frankly, I'm 100% with you that your supervisor's request is inappropriate, and it's tempting to want to refuse to comply just on principle, but....the kind of world we live in sometimes forces us to have to put some of what we believe in on the backburner, unfortunately.

 

Let us know what you decide to do and what the results are.

[RayKay]

Its not much different today, now instead of white, tan is in, so women are baking themselves to suit. The skin cancer numbers are rising and more women are having botox and surgery to get rid of the wrinkles.

 

Make-up is a nasty substance still, no matter the kind it still causes trouble. Look at eyelashes for instance, women that have been wearing mascara for years generally have short, thin lashes. Non-mascara wearers have more full lashes.

 

Ah well, I know that - I just did not comment on it as I am definitely NOT tanned, and botox and the like are not for me!

 

My paleness is evidenced in my avatar...that is me after several days of riding in the summer in Utah....I am a slave to sunblock!

 

And I have always had short and thin (and pale!) lashes - I inherited them that way

[cichlid]

I would say to compromise and wear some makeup, like some lip gloss and mascara.

 

CarnelianButterfly, I think your mascara statistic is flawed. You see, people that have been wearing mascara for years have short, thin eyelashes NATURALLY. There's a reason they use mascara.

 

And as far as make up goes, I personally use 100% mineral makeup (everyday minerals). It's expensive initially, but it lasts you a long time. It's also worth it to buy the kits. I used to use drug store brands and my skin was so disgusting and broke out all the time. I switched to mineral makeup and my skin instantly cleared up and my skin can breathe since it doesn't have all that dyes, fragrances, preservatives that my skin hates.

[CarnelianButterfly]

CarnelianButterfly, I think your mascara statistic is flawed. You see, people that have been wearing mascara for years have short, thin eyelashes NATURALLY. There's a reason they use mascara.

Women I went to school with as children had perfectly fine lashes, they started wearing make-up, by their early 20's it was evident that their lashes had suffered and they require more mascara as time goes on. My own mother has had the same issues. In the past 10 years her lashes have become stubs since she started wearing more and more mascara.

 

Mascara is also a breeding ground for bacteria. Each time you use it, the brush collects bacteria from your lashes, you then store them away in the tube.

[loveistough]

Well men don't wear make-up so how can you compare that?[/gQUOTE]

 

That's not what the OP said.

 

To the OP, not it's not unprofessional to not wear makeup. How can they exclude you from wearing jeans on Fridays yet everyone else is allowed to wear them? I don't think they can do that. As another poster suggested, I would check with your HR person if you have one.

[CaptainPlanet]

Gee ... just wear the make up... who cares.

 

As for the jeans same deal... tough luck, at my work the bosses all take off public holidays while the workers have to go in and work.

 

Just deal with it.

[Jess...]

Look at eyelashes for instance, women that have been wearing mascara for years generally have short, thin lashes. Non-mascara wearers have more full lashes.

 

I've been wearing mascara for years, and I have very long, full lashes.

[Psylocke]

That's crazy! You shouldn't have to wear make-up if you don't want to. Unless there's some sort of dresscode/facecode rule in the companies handbook then I'd say stick to your guns.

 

What if you break out from wearing make up? Will they fire you for a pimple. This just sounds like a bunch of male pigs if you ask me.

[Jeen]

I'm a secretary in a sales and marketing department. 90% of the people in the department are males. All the secretaries are females. Yesterday I was told I can no longer wear jeans on casual Fridays even though they are within the dresscode and others wear them. My jeans are neat, clean, and fit well, neither too tight nor too loose.

 

I was also told today that I should wear makeup.

 

Am I wrong to be incensed and feel that this is sexist?

 

I do a great job for this company and help a lot of people every day. I have added value to this position. Shouldn't that be all that counts? I really feel that if I were a man, this would not be an issue.

 

Well if you stay where I stay I would not wear the makeup until it is in writing ( thinking of a written warning) For a company to make a blander like that will really cost them I can promise you. ( thinking what will the newspapers have to say about it ) And for that reason if you feel that strong not to wear makeup do carry on as before.

[JadedStar]

I'm a secretary in a sales and marketing department. 90% of the people in the department are males. All the secretaries are females. Yesterday I was told I can no longer wear jeans on casual Fridays even though they are within the dresscode and others wear them. My jeans are neat, clean, and fit well, neither too tight nor too loose.

 

I was also told today that I should wear makeup.

 

Am I wrong to be incensed and feel that this is sexist?

 

I do a great job for this company and help a lot of people every day. I have added value to this position. Shouldn't that be all that counts? I really feel that if I were a man, this would not be an issue.

 

It is commonplace for secretaries and/or receptionists to be exempt from casual fridays.

 

Last company i worked for our IT department employees were allowed to wear sandals and shorts even tho it was a corporate office. My department was not. Just because the companies overall dresscode dictates one thing does not mean that managers and dept heads can't enforce their own rules.

 

The make up thing - I dont know. That was strange. Do you go to work a bit frumpy looking? I am not sure why they would ask you to wear makeup unless you maybe have blotchy skin or something that they think looks unprofessional. I have never heard of this....altho i have heard of it for bank tellers. Years ago bank tellers were often asked to attend classes to teach them how to dress, wear makeup and hair to maintain a nice image. For those of you a little bit older you probably remember bank tellers always looked so fancy.....now they are much more casual. Those rules were laxed a great deal.

 

the fact that the staff is predominantly male makes me think they should be more careful singling out the females and asking things like wear makeup. No jeans was perfectly fine, the wear make up rule is a bit more fuzzy and could cause them trouble if someone really pushed it.

 

If i really liked the job i'd likely not rock the boat and comply. Just because something MIGHT be legally pursuable doesn't mean that is the best move for one's career. It can bite you in the behind and not just at that job but word gets out for others too and can blacklist ya.

 

I think some women look great au naturale, but if they are working in a professional setting even if they go sans the make up i would hope they do make the effort to look "polished" in other ways, i.e. their hair and clothing, accessories. I am huge on dressing for the job you want, not even just the one you have. I think women who don't put any effort into their appearance in a professional setting look, well, unprofessional. I think in a professional setting looking polished is the key - I wear only enough make up to obtain the look that I want ....

 

And reality is that some women look fabulous without make up (my daughter is one of those people, she looks funny with it actually) but some women, sorry to say, could really use some enhancement. I like to enhance my features, never drown them out with makeup. Just enhance and look polished.

 

Like Ju-les said, this is definitely one of those "pick your battles" situations. If it is a huge issue for you then challenge it. But definitely weigh out the potential pitfalls that might come up if you go this route. I have been in the workforce quite a while and i really pick my battles because taking things to HR sounds like a decent idea but I can assure you many people blacklisted themselves by becoming complainers about everything they don't agree with. Is it fair? No. Does it happen? You better believe it. They would never fire you over not wearing makeup but if they think you made too big of a stink about it and in their MINDS think you are inflexible then they are likely to be harder on you and if you make a mistake that otherwise might be forgiven you'd be out instead. Plan this out carefully if you intend to go to HR or a superior (if you like the job).

[JadedStar]

Women I went to school with as children had perfectly fine lashes, they started wearing make-up, by their early 20's it was evident that their lashes had suffered and they require more mascara as time goes on. My own mother has had the same issues. In the past 10 years her lashes have become stubs since she started wearing more and more mascara.

 

Mascara is also a breeding ground for bacteria. Each time you use it, the brush collects bacteria from your lashes, you then store them away in the tube.

I agree about it being a breeding ground for bacteria. If you don't toss it every month you will open yourself up to an eye infection. That happened to me once! And it was OLD mascara. Lesson learned!

 

As for the thinning lashes from it, i have to say I have worn mascara for over a decade and they are as thick and long today as they were then. I think if a woman does not properly REMOVE it at night this can happen because it will clump up thru the night and potentially cause breakage. I always take my make up off everynight. And my mascara has a lot of protein enriched ingredients that actually are good for the lashes.

 

Make up today is far superior than make up of yesteryear. All of my makeup has sunscreen and retinol in it which is better for the skin than wearing no makeup at all. It makes my skin feel great. My lipstick has moistuerizers as does my eyeshadow.

 

I always buy over the counter stuff and it is not as expensive today to get the good stuff. Most all of the main brands - Revlon, Loreal, Max Factor - are using the same ingredients that is in the high dollar stuff at the Clinique counter. I never pay too much for anything. The cheap stuff like wet n wild or those other brands that are usually 99 cents for every piece are crap and are better left to the teenagers.