Relationship With X

[shemojo]

"short list" is just that "short" - had I expounded on things then, hence, that would be considered a long list.

 

Just seemed there were numerous re-occurring similarities for reasons of splitting up and numerous references to the "why" we split up Q. It may be this is a slight departure from 'relationship with x' topic, and could become its own topic, or perhaps is already a thread elsewhere?

 

In any case just thought it would be of interest to generate a list of reasons why people split up. The Q of short list versus long list depends upon how specific the responses are - it could go either way. My start-up list was the embracing the idea of a condensed, short list people can contribute to and choose to expound onthings if they wish.

[John Bendix]

Got you, shemojo.

[John Bendix]

Texasdad and omartin,

 

When I got blindsided with divorce papers, I was rerrified that I was going to have to live in a one bedroom apt, only see my kids a couple of times a year, pay out the ying-yang in support, and spend my nights eating Spaghettios of the can.

 

I am sorry either one of you is in the situation that you find yourselves. Hopefully you both can recover (as we all can) from this by gaining acceptance of your circumstances and go from there. It is not what has happened to any of us that causes the pain that we feel but it in the reactions to these events that brings on our suffering.

 

 

Benga,

 

If those are your actions and thoughts, go with them w/o judging yourself or the need to want your actions or thoughts to be different from what they are right now. If you recognize them as just being thoughts and reactions, and not a real part of who you are, how can they do any harm? They are real but fleeting and will dissipate almost as soon as your experience them. Denying, judging them, or yourself for having them, will only keep them re-cycling back into your existence.

[benga]

John / M.E - Let me try explaining my current predicament and some of the dysfucntional behaviours that still continue to baffle me.

 

We have now been living separately for 20 month. We are in regular contact and make it a point to meet Bi-Monthly wherein we do a family lunch, dinner and some fun things for the sake our our 4.5 year old daughter (who I must add only dreams of her parents getting back together). Given that we have been separated for 20 months, most of the "anger", "resentment" & "reactions" have ceased - atleast outwardly. The wife and I have very very civil conversations and are able to spend those 5- 7 hours together without any conflict whatsoever. Very often she throws those statements at me "if I were to come back home, then.....", or "I have said so much about you to everybody, good & bad, I will be a laughing stock of the world if I were to return".... so on and so forth... I collect my daughter each friday and drop her back after dinner on sundays. There has been on interference or roadblocks when it comes to time with my duaghter.. Actually encouraged as well by her

 

Here is the dysfunctional behaviour that baffles me... Each time we meet, when we first say hello, she looks stress as hell.. Really stressed and over the next hour, I see her getting comfortable. We part ways with a hug and a kiss, big smiles and thanks for a wonderful time... Now, here is what happens each time for the 2-3 days after we meet. She shuts down completely.. Doesn't answer my calls, responds to my messages when I check in on how my daughter is doing. After 3 - 4 days she opens up again and gives me an update on how our daughter is doing and some of her daily kindergarten activities... One evening smiles & affection and the next day withdrawn.. A clear pattern, and I don't understand the inner workings of that. I recognise it to by dysfunctional, but don't have any answers on what causes this...

 

She has withdrawn and has slowly loosing contact with all our common friends.. She had latched on to them after we separated, resulting in me backing off.. She gets to work, gets home and does nothing.. I am happy to let the forum know that the group of my our very closest friends, who had initially judged me and in their mind held me responsible for our relationship break down are very much back in my life and not in touch with her.. They claim to try reaching her, but she never responds... Strange!!

 

Thoughts would be really welcome. I am sure you can understand why there are still some foggy doubts in my head and why I am still hovering between trying to accept and seeking answers. By my own admission, I would give a 1000% to try working things out still.

 

Cheers

Benga

[just M.E.]

Benga -

 

I can't find a quick and easy definition in my understanding of what is going on with your wife. I do think she has deep regrets about the family breaking apart and I wonder about her emotional state of mind.

 

Has she been in any kind of therapy throughout this? It is worrisome that she has withdrawn. It would if she is going through a depression and is "punishing" herself in some way. Have you told her that you worry about her?

 

If I were to try and be in her shoes I would imagine she might be racked by guilt and she might not understand her own reasons for leaving. Guessing is a dangerous process though.

[John Bendix]

Benga,

 

I am inclined to agree with ME.

 

When you look at your own emotions and how frazzled they were when you went through this sepertion with your wife, you can think of how distressed her emotional state was and probably still is. Never mind their outward appearance. The wall can cover all of that up.

 

I have a fiend, lives in the same town, who went through the same thing as me a couple of years earlier. He has told me that his X is having problems at work, does not socialize with the friends she had convinced that he was a miserable husband. He has always been sure that his X went through a nervious breakdown and was really depressed though she still denies it.

 

I know that my X was unstable to say the least. Add to this the fact that her kids have not wanted to see much of her for the last 2 1/2 years. I saw her at my son's football game last week, actually she called me out of the blue to ask me how he was doing and should she come over to the game when she got off work(?). After the game she waited for me and began chatting like we were still married. Mind you, a person that I do not speak with, I have not said hello to at all of his games, has wrongly accused me of all kind of Attila The Hun atrosities, etc. She followed me to the stadium exit chatting away and asking me questions. A friend of mine (who she does not know) came up to tell me that my son played great. She immediately introduces herself and says, "I'm Robin Bendix (not real name)".

He just looks at me like, who? She keeps chatting with him about her children like she was still living with them. I was in a time warp. She followed to me to my car asking me if we should wait for our son (?). We ran into a good frined of mine and her mother that my X has known for years, shouts out her name and tries to hug her, The woman is taken back like what's wrong with you.

 

An example of how emotionally distressed the Walkaways were and continue (as predicted by many therapists, counselors and doctors) to be. Their escape proved fruitless in relieving the pain they had accumulated inside for so long and the suffering that follows. Their refusal to accept the fact that their intimate relationship was not the sole cause of their unhappiness, keeps them in an emotionally distraught mode.

 

Has you asked her to go to some form of counseling with you in the guise of being good for your daughter?

[benga]

Their refusal to accept the fact that their intimate relationship was not the sole cause of their unhappiness, keeps them in an emotionally distraught mode.

 

Has you asked her to go to some form of counseling with you in the guise of being good for your daughter?

 

Thanks for the responses John & M.E. Much appreciated. Sure I am concerned for her. I am concerned that she is not being able to be the mother she had always wanted to my daughter. I see her and I am concerned for her. She is not the positive person she used to be when we met. She is always - the glass is half empty now.

 

John - Would the birth of a child (followed by post natal depression), death of her father, death of her favorite grand mother, change of cities, a pay cut for me followed by a period of financial stress - all in 6 months be enough to bring stress into our relationship. I don't think she see's it that way. Everything and all my reactions during this difficult phase was my fault and that I wasn't there for her enough....

 

Update : Like clockwork... Its been 3 days since we met. The first 2 days entirely silent. This morning a very sweet message, thanking me for the other day and a promise to update me on what happens with my daughter today.. This is becoming a repetitive pattern. She will now be open and communicative on email/phone... We meet, then for 2-3 days she withdraws.. This is just what I had posted in my earlier thread. Confusing like hell, and at times preventing me from accepting that it is over... because it isn't entirely....

[lostandhurt]

I read with much interest here quite often for clues for what I might expect from my ex. Mine has changed so much from what she was into someone who is so insecure in regards to my sons love for her. It is the guilt I guess. I have done my best to stay the same and take the high road always. I know he loves me and I never make a big deal out of it. Our bond is so much more than it was for some reason. I look for the positive in all this, when I can find it.....

 

lost

[just M.E.]

John - Would the birth of a child (followed by post natal depression), death of her father, death of her favorite grand mother, change of cities, a pay cut for me followed by a period of financial stress - all in 6 months be enough to bring stress into our relationship. I don't think she see's it that way. Everything and all my reactions during this difficult phase was my fault and that I wasn't there for her enough....

 

 

benga,

 

My immediate reaction is yes, all that is enough stress to send someone into another state of mind, damage a marriage or relationship.

 

I went through a period where 2 women in may family who were also my best friends died within 4 months. I struggled to feel positive and go forward and ironically my ex chose to push me away at that time. (It may have had to do with the affair I suspected he had while I was gone to the funerals). In the end he left me 2 months after that last death, it was a time I needed his friendship but he reacted opposite of you and pushed away from me. It was kind of that "kick you while you're down thing".

 

Maybe in his mind, that stress subconsciously pushed him to leave. I'll never know but I can see what you talk about happening.

 

It is so easy to believe the the problems of the moment are how ones life is defined.

[John Bendix]

Benga,

 

Post Partum Depression is more common than most people think. My cousin's

wife was so whacked out for about six months after the birth of their first child (they are still married and get along fine), he refuses to have another one. His mother, my aunt, does not even speak to her daughter-in-law much bc she was so violent, mean and hostile during this time. The wife had to go to a hospital for evaluation and meds. She has no answer for why she was acting this way. This an extreme case but depression can have nasty influence on realtionships.

[John Bendix]

I hope that this thread has helped even one person gain insight into their relationship problems. Use it as you wish.

 

It is time for me to retire from posting on ENA and concentrate on other facets of my life.

 

If anyone really needs anything from me, surfjon and scornandtorn know how to get in touch with me.

 

Take care,

 

John

[JadedStar]

I hope that this thread has helped even one person gain insight into their relationship problems. Use it as you wish.

 

It is time for me to retire from posting on ENA and concentrate on other facets of my life.

 

If anyone really needs anything from me, surfjon and scornandtorn know how to get in touch with me.

 

Take care,

 

John

 

Take care John. I hope you still come around and I hope everything works out for you in your personal life.

[Fireman Sam]

Hey John,

Concentrate on you and yours mate.

Good luck with the rest of your life.

Fireman

[just M.E.]

John, thanks for all you have given everyone here.

 

Stay in touch.

[scornandtorn]

Thank you John, this place saved me! I think you are "spot on" in the whole walkaway spouse arena. I am sure this thread will not die. Good luck and thank you! I will be in touch, you can count on it.

 

Scorn

[benga]

All the best John... Will miss you around here. Thank you for coming along. Your experience, wisdom & research helped me immensely. In ways I will always be indebted... I think I have your personal email. Will stay in touch.

 

Take care and best wishes for future endevours...

 

Benga

[surfjon]

John,

Sorry to see you go but sometimes a break is what is needed.

 

Take some time for you now, you've poured alot of your time and soul into this thread and deserve some other things in your life as well!!

 

Hope the boys are well and you find some island of peace.

 

Jon

[lostandhurt]

John, I have read your posts, replies and book. You experience and knowledge has helped me beyond words. I feel like I owe you a debt that I can't repay. I wish you all the best as you journey into what you want your life to be. When true love does find you again, she will get one hell of a enlightened man.

Let us all raise our glass to John Bendix this weekend in tribute to a good man and friend.

 

You will be missed.....

 

lost

[whodathunk]

John ... to reiterate what everyone else has said, your wisdom and insight has helped me through this ordeal like you could not know. I truly believed my life had fallen apart inexplicably and uniquely, and the comfort I found here finding other voices who have been through, by rote, the same thing helped me so much through my darkest days. I will miss you posting here, but I understand it completely.

 

Its important to look hard at what happened and try to make sense of it, it is also important to heal and accept... and move forward from that.

[John Bendix]

I am jumping in here to let you know that I was in limited contact with my X for the past 2 months or so. I took the high road and tried to be as nice as possible, meaning I just let her comments go through me that were not true (she has assumed many things erroneously). I kept her abreas of the kid's doings. I even tried to get my youngest to spend time with her but he did not want to.

 

She called one day and I answered it and she was upset that I was being nice to her. I had no agenda, just trying to be civil. Well, her frustration got the best of her again and angerily attacked me and my parenting skills. As in, if I was a better father I would force the kids to go stay with her, they would be better off with her and would have turned out to be better people than they are now(?), etc. I hung up.

 

Since this I have gone no contact. No response to calls, her irate messages of, "Why the hell are you ignoring me?" I take them as being self evident qustions for anyone else. No response to text messages in which the comments are not very rational and accusational. She just does not get it.

 

I also see that N/C is the way to go (but not always) in only situations that arise btween people and just not in intimate relationships. Who needs the drama? Some may, but I do not want any part of it.

[scornandtorn]

John,

 

I agree that NC is the way to go. My ex wife can project her twisted view of things to anyone else she chooses, just NOT ME! I am the only one who knows the actual truth and everyone else is on their own in regards to her lies and deception.

 

She called one day and I answered it and she was upset that I was being nice to her. I had no agenda, just trying to be civil.[end quote].

 

Same here. The nicer I would be the more anger she would display. If I ignored her, the more anger she would display. Truly a no win situation.

[John Bendix]

Scorn,

 

I have gone totally N/C, ignoring text messages and phone calls with messages. I got quite a few saying that I should not be ignoring her and "U need to grow up". This had nothing to do with our minor son and did not need to be replied to.

 

History shows that these will stop coming with the advent of her anger directed at me and believing that SHE is cutting off contact. go ahead and see it that way. It is of no importance.

[John Bendix]

After reading so many posts about the effects of divorce, I decided to call up this thread again to give some futher details on how the walkaway spouse seems to continue to operate.

 

I have cut communication with my X many times, for months at a time, for many reasons. The cause is usually the emotional outbursts that I receive. Even when I have tried to be civil, soon or later I will be angerily accused of all kinds of things.

 

I have tried to get my sons to have more involvement with my X (they choose to live with me and do not interact with her much) but they too get fed up with the blaming and complaining from her no matter how she tries to conceal it with a contrived smile.

 

During our last set of trying to be civil, I was accused of being nice and this bothered her. So much she called me and began yelling at me that I was being nice just to look good to the kids. This continued with how bad a father I have been and then ultimately how bad a husband I was, which forced her to leave. I went NC again.

 

The texts that I got were (for not answering her calls) more of the same. "Do not ignore me!, I do not deserve to be ignored, You are sick, Get some help, you are the worst father, the kids should be with me, You tell the kids to not to bother with me, etc."

 

I asked her to sit down as two rational, ex-spouses with kids, and talk. Of the ten or so times in the last 3 years that I have asked her to do so, she has not been able to respond with a yes or no. Just hangs on the phone saying nothing. In person she just stares into space w/o responding. When asked again, she she just says nothing. It is pretty surreal.

 

The pain I endured during the dissolution of the marriage was far too great to be from the break-up itself. My own unresolved issus were triggered to the surface by this emotionally stimulating period of my life. I was persuaded by this to deal with these issues right then or, as I realized, forced to deal with them over and over again in the years to come.

 

My point is that when you think that the relationship issues you have with your SO are causing you all of this incredible pain and suffering and getting out of the relationship will end them, you might have to think again. Unfortunately for my X, she has simply hardened her own, firmly entrenched coping and defense mechanisms to deal with her pain. It does not seem to be working very well. She has changed her circumstances drastically but not her perspective or reactions to it.

[scornandtorn]

John, have you heard of this (pasted below) through your studies? My X justified her behavior by deamonizing me for her decision to have an affair and ultimatly terminated our marriage. I think this is a good description of what she suffers.

 

Thoughts?

 

Cognitive Dissonance

 

Description

 

This is the feeling of uncomfortable tension which comes from holding two conflicting thoughts in the mind at the same time.

 

Dissonance increases with:

 

* The importance of the subject to us.

* How strongly the dissonant thoughts conflict.

* Our inability to rationalize and explain away the conflict.

 

Dissonance is often strong when we believe something about ourselves and then do something against that belief. If I believe I am good but do something bad, then the discomfort I feel as a result is cognitive dissonance.

 

Cognitive dissonance is a very powerful motivator which will often lead us to change one or other of the conflicting belief or action. The discomfort often feels like a tension between the two opposing thoughts. To release the tension we can take one of three actions:

 

* Change our behavior.

* Justify our behavior by changing the conflicting cognition.

* Justify our behavior by adding new cognitions.

 

Dissonance is most powerful when it is about our self-image. Feelings of foolishness, immorality and so on (including internal projections during decision-making) are dissonance in action.

 

If an action has been completed and cannot be undone, then the after-the-fact dissonance compels us to change our beliefs. If beliefs are moved, then the dissonance appears during decision-making, forcing us to take actions we would not have taken before.

 

Cognitive dissonance appears in virtually all evaluations and decisions and is the central mechanism by which we experience new differences in the world. When we see other people behave differently to our images of them, when we hold any conflicting thoughts, we experience dissonance.

 

Dissonance increases with the importance and impact of the decision, along with the difficulty of reversing it. Discomfort about making the wrong choice of car is bigger than when choosing a lamp.

[John Bendix]

Scorn,

 

Thanks for this article.

 

Yes, I have heard of it but just now you have made me see how it applies to to persons in intimate relationships. This is the irrational aspect of my X's behavior and mindset that has driven the boys and myself insane.

 

I am going to do more research and get back to you.