PLEASE - some advice!

[Hope75]

Wow STB.

 

To be honest I am quite surprised that you are still in the house, still putting up with this kind of treatment.

 

I can understand the thought of divorce is scary and difficult, but is it really worse than what you and the children have endured over the last few months? This is not a healthy situation for any of you.

 

I think the mediator is a good idea, it's really time to get this divorce going- so that the children can have both their parents back and not have to watch and feel you ripping each other apart in the same house. Then you too will have a chance to heal and move on with your life too.

[Dubb]

I know books are not magic but have you read Homer McDonald's book Stop your Divorce? It's a great book and maybe you can find some help there. Even if it don't work you might gain some insight which never hurts.

[Beec]

Wow STB.

 

To be honest I am quite surprised that you are still in the house, still putting up with this kind of treatment.

 

I can understand the thought of divorce is scary and difficult, but is it really worse than what you and the children have endured over the last few months? This is not a healthy situation for any of you.

 

I think the mediator is a good idea, it's really time to get this divorce going- so that the children can have both their parents back and not have to watch and feel you ripping each other apart in the same house. Then you too will have a chance to heal and move on with your life too.

 

I very with Hope on the why are you still there comments? If she is still doing what she was doing, then she's still kind of walking all over you. That needs to end.

 

It's fine to be agreeing and doing as she wants when you first find things getting out of control, but it needs to end.

[Soon_tobex]

Rough weekend. Glad it's Monday and I can go to work.

 

The more I read, the more convinced I am that she suffers from OCPD. Thanks to you guys, I finally have that 'diagnosis' as the reason to cling to for her actions.

 

It doesn't justify her actions, but at least I understand them.

 

Over the past 20 years, the woman that I still love has gone from 90% what I wanted (I was and am ok with 90%. Heck I'm not 90%!), to 10%. I believe it is consuming her slowly. A couple of months ago we were watching a family videos from 15 years ago... she was so warm and loving then.

 

Now, she rarely smiles.

 

She blames me for what she is. Yesterday she said she wants to sell the house and move far away (from me, with the kids).

 

Today we may be making an appointment with a divorce mediator.

 

Cheers,

 

soon

[Hope75]

 

Today we may be making an appointment with a divorce mediator.

 

 

I am glad to see that this is finally happening for you- it is something that is long overdue.

 

I hope you will continue with the proceedings, difficult as they may be, as the starting point for your new life with your children.

[David H]

.... just like my wife blames ME for her unhappiness. It's so twisted.

 

You are not responsible for your wife's feelings....

 

My wife has said many times that she raised her brothers. Her mom never did anything and my wife 'lost' her childhood because her mom forced the younger siblings upon her.

 

Classic codependent situation. See later

 

that she is always required to think of everything, that all the responsibility is hers and that I don't ever help. The truth (my view) is I do more than the average guy and that my wife has such a ridiculously high expectation level of what should be done in life, of what level of performance we all should live to - that there is NO WAY I, or any man (or woman) could meet that level.

 

Classic codependent....

 

If i can understand it, maybe I can fix it???

 

You can only fix yourself.

 

Could your husband fix you??

 

No.

 

Start here for more insight:

 

Codependency:

link removed

 

Learn to love yourself:

 

"Real love is based in a universal truth that NO ONE can love you, respect you, cherish, or adore you at a level greater than you do these things for yourself. That the amount that you do love, respect, cherish and adore yourself is exactly the level that another will love, respect, cherish and adore you."

link removed

 

link removed

 

link removed

 

Do you recognise this ("Blowing hot and cold") in your relationship? (Mine was like this!)

 

"The way the dynamic in a dysfunctional relationship works is in a "come here" - "go away" cycle. When one person is available the other tends to pull away. If the first person becomes unavailable the other comes back and pleads to be let back in. When the first becomes available again then the other eventually starts pulling away again. It happens because our relationship with self is not healed. As long as I do not love myself then there must be something wrong with someone who loves me - and if someone doesn't love me than I have to prove I am worthy by winning that person back."

link removed

 

David

[HazelEyes1607307562]

I just wanted to thank you for stating it the way you did....You love your husband, its the life you hate. I never thought of it like that.....I thought I hated my husband.

[dada]

Hey Man, all I can say is...people lie. We can only deal with what people tell us. There is more to what's wrong with your wife than what you are seeing or what you've been told.

 

Ultimately, our happiness depends on us as individuals and our perspectives of life. This problem is two fold. One, we are responsible for our own happiness. Two, others can cause us to be unhappy. If your wife doesn't want to be married. Let her go! Harbor no anamosity or rancor and wish her well.

 

Trust this, it isn't healthy to be in a marriage to someone who doesn't want to be married. If she won't make love to you, that about say's it all, considering making love is one of the most important bonding experiences a husband & wife can have. It isn't the most important, but one of the most important.

 

The title of my reply "my several ex's" is for a reason. Each and everyone of my wives were tremendous lovers and passionate in the dating and engagement phase of our relationships. After we were married a while, approximately three years I began to see them for who they really were and not their advocate. They all presented them selves to be mature, hardworking, frugal, loving, understanding and responsible women. Nothing could have been further from the truth.

 

I will not list their individual faults, but I will tell you how I reacted and every case. With the exception of my current incarcaration. I CHEATED. That was the worse thing I could have done because I became someone I never wanted to be. My Father.

 

After I came to grips with my behavior pattern, I decided my happiness was within my grasp and under my control and not in my "loins." At that moment I decided I wouldn't depend on anyone else to make me happy or cause me unhappiness. At the same time I will not knowingly cause anyone discomfort. I wouldn't "cheat" anymore because I found myself in an unbearable relationship.

 

My current marriage is bad for pretty much the same reasons you've described. The only difference is I'm the one who doesn't want to be married. I'm 51and I own a growing business. My wife refuses to work and help the family. I don't know if you've ever owned a business, but there are good months and there are slow months. Need I say more.

 

The only advice I can give you is to be honest with yourself and be a great father to your kids. Listen to them when they need you to listen and talk to them when they need talking to. Plan for their college and stay in their lives at every opportunity. For the wife. Let her go! Life is to short and don't look for the right wife, Instead, become the right husband for someone else.

 

 

I've Been There

[ncnc]

Hey there. So what is the Latest? Any improvement?

 

Update!!!!!!

[moonbeam111]

Hello and sorry you are going through this when the kids are involved.

 

You may want to visit this site link removed

Their forum is great and they have good tools you can use to improve your marriage and even make it great.

 

 

I saw people recovering their marriage on a brink of actual divorce when a detached spouse suddenly woke up.

 

How about this:

 

 

DOs

 

1. Act Happy

 

2. Get a life (new activities, etc.)

 

3. repeat over and over..."I will make it"

 

4. Actively LISTEN....keep conversations at "to the point...small talk" ...don't blow it up beyond the detached spouse current comfort zone

 

5. Tend to Agree (Thank you for your truthfulness, It seems that way, you have a point)

 

6. Expand your social relationships (Being especially aware of your own vulnerability and keeping sharing and time with opposite sex relationships to an absolute minimum)

 

7. Get sexy (gym, new clothes, etc)

 

8. Focus on your strengths and Positives...don't put yourself down verbally or constantly go over what you did wrong

 

9. Accept Uncertainty (Do your best today and let God take care of tomorrow)

 

DON'Ts

 

1. Repeatedly say "I love you"

 

2. Ask questions that don't have answers yet

 

3. Criticize, complain, whine or nag

 

4. Say, "I've changed"....allow your spouse to simply judge your actions

 

5. Argue, Reason or Plead

 

6. Don't get family or friends overly involved in recovery

 

7. Act helpless or depressed.

 

8. Discuss morality, invoke God or Dr. Laura type babble

 

9. Suggest marital counseling (must be the detached spouse' idea)

 

10. Tell them continually "we need to work on the relationship"

 

11. GIVE UP

 

Good luck!

[Soon_tobex]

Hey all... I know I've gone offline for a while. Nothing really different except that I have to make a decision. But that's not really different, is it?

[Hope75]

Hi Soon to Be,

 

Yes, you need to make a decision. You realize that you started this thread 4 months ago and nothing has changed.

 

What are you waiting for?

[Soon_tobex]

I'm so tired.

 

My eyes hurt.

 

I'm done.

 

I've got some meetings on Monday and Tuesday, so, on Wednesday, I'm going to offer to move out. This is going to be the hardest thing I've ever done. We've got such great kids and they are going to be crushed. I'm pretty sure they'll make it through - they are smart, good kids and hopefully old enough to manage this. I'm a lot older and I'm not sure I can manage it!

 

We are just hurting each other and there is no realistic hope here. She has no intention on being introspective, no desire to seek outside help and says over and over that I'm 100% to blame. I can't live with this. I can forgive; she never will.

 

In 17 years we've never been out alone, never a dinner alone, a weekend away. She won't. Says: "we could have done that when we were younger, but you were too busy" I say: "I was busy working and going to school and we were busy making a family and why can't we go NOW?" And she says: "I have no desire"

 

Too much collateral damage.

[Hope75]

Yes, it takes two people to make a marriage work and she gave up a long time ago.

 

Your kids are not stupid- they see and feel the tension and hurt and anger that you and your wife share. You have been sleeping in separate bedrooms for months now. Do you not think that hurts your children? It does.

 

Trust me, being good parents to your kids does not mean you have to live together. In fact, sometimes it means living apart, so you can set an example of the fact that accepting less and living in an unhealthy relationship is not OK.

 

Both you and your children deserve better.

[Soon_tobex]

Me again. I've successfully made things even worse. Help.

 

After 6 months of the Mrs. and I not talking much and her sleeping in the spare room on and off and both of us seeing lawyers and lots of stress... we had a very cleansing conversation about 3 weeks ago. She never said she was sorry, but in her own way she did say it. The last 3 weeks have been very good. Actually had sex 3 times. Wow. That is more than we'd had in the prior 2 years. As much as I know our relationship has issues, there is a tremendous amount of good stuff... I don't want a divorce. I love her. I love our kids. I love what we've accomplished.

 

Here's the problem: back in late Dec/Jan, I hired a consultant (yes a woman). Didn't meet her (she lives 3 hours away). She and I spoke many times on the phone and exchanged emails ... all business. A few months ago, as the project was wrapping up, we scheduled a meeting. Through very innocent conversation we both learned that each was struggling w/ their marriages. Over the ensuing weeks, our conversations got more frequent, personal, and 'inappropriate'. I met her one other time. Nothing physical happened. But we clearly both would have liked it to have.

 

After my wife and I had our conversation, I told this other woman that I couldn't talk with her anymore. Trouble is her husband found out she was talking to someone... and has threatened to call my wife unless this woman and I discontinue conversation - which we have. But he's also threatened to call my wife if his wife leaves him. And she probably will. Theirs is a long story (involving alleged adultery on his part). So if she leaves simply to move on with her life, my life may get destroyed.

 

I want to tell my wife. I owe her the truth. Given my wife's extreme view on 'the rules' and what is right, I'm not sure how she'll take this news. I'd like to think she'll ultimately appreciate the truth... but I fear it will be 'the last straw'.

 

Do I tell her?

[benga]

are you being able to trust her yet?

 

you will need to be truthful. Timing is key! As things stand today, now is not the good time... But you will have to tell her...

[Hope75]

You didn't actually do anything so no I wouldn't tell your wife anything. The worst thing you did was talk to another women when your wife was not acting the capacity of a wife anyway.

 

Drop the past and focus on the future.

 

Is your wife talking about wanting to repair this marriage?

 

Is she back in your bedroom?

[Soon_tobex]

The pendulum has swung back towards "our normal" state. She is back in the bedroom (and we've even, you know .... lolol). I haven't (and don't intend) to tell her about 'the other woman'. I didn't 'do' anything and I agree with Hope above.

 

Our situation has gotten 'ok'. We aren't working on anything, cause she doesn't 'work' on such things.

 

I've decided on this strategy: I'm going to do what makes me happy within the marriage. I'm not going to be a jerk, but if I want to go places and she doesn't, then I'm going without her. I will focus on 'us' doing stuff, but I'm not going to be bound by her way-too-stringent view of the world. My youngest will be in college in 5 years. I'm going to stay the course till then at which point I'll evaluate my life and my relationship.

 

I'll live life to the fullest over the ensuing 5 years and decide in 5 years if the rest of my life can be fulfilling with her. I'm not sure she will become somebody different but 'something' will happen when the kids are gone cause she will have then lost her only real purpose in life - taking care of the children.

 

I'm tired of worrying about her. I'm going to start taking care of me. The current 'new normal' state, is very acceptable. It's calm. It's productive. It's stable. Hell, I'm even having sex. It's NOT warm, loving, and overly joyous - but it's never been. And if history is any indicator, we will have severe episodes over the next 5 years.

 

I am going to stay for the kids. I think it's best for them to have me buffer their mom as necessary.

 

Not sure if this is a success story! But none of us in this family are ready for a divorce - which maybe is a sign that all of us are willing to make it better.

 

No Longer Soon To Be Ex

[Beec]

That sounds very good.

 

It also sounds like this attitude of you doing what you want to do is maybe somehow working to make her want to do IT with you. Do what works, do what works for you, and if you can do what works on her.

 

Good luck.

[Soon_tobex]

Just writing. It helps.

 

Been less than a month since my ENA entry and I'm sad and ashamed at how naive was my last post.

 

Nothing is different in our relationship. Nothing is better. I can slog through 5 more years, but I really don't want to.

 

She will never be a fun, charming, spontaneous, happy, loving, intimate woman. She never will.

 

We just got back from a week visiting her parents (I refuse to call it a vacation). She is exactly, EXACTLY like her mother and I am staring down the barrel of my future. Her parents live alone, far away, NO friends, NO social life, NO fun, NEVER do anything all because her mother is not a fun, charming, spontaneous, happy, loving, intimate woman. She never was. And her father is pathetic (my opinion) for putting up with it.

 

For a week I watched her parents and I saw VERY brief flashes of mutual happiness almost completely obscured by illogical, irrational, and unbelievable friction all because her mother is the epitome of glass-half-empty.

 

And through it all my wife said time and again that, while she loves her mom and dad, she couldn't wait to get home and get away them. All I could think was: She has NO insight that she is just like her mother and that we are just like her parents and going home only makes it even more painfully obvious (to ME) that after 24 years of knowing my wife, I should know she'll never change. Nor will I.

 

Like I said..just writing. It helps.

[Hope75]

Hey STB,

 

I'm sorry that things did not continue to work out as you had hoped.

 

I'm curious what your plan of action is now, with this new insight?

[Soon_tobex]

Don't know. I'm thinking that I'm going to have some fun for the rest of the summer with the kids. Then when they go back: I'm having a chat with the Mrs. Something along the lines of "I love you very deeply but this ain't workin for me"

 

She'll never believe she has any fault in our relationship (that in and of itself is reason enough for me to say to heck with this "relationship"). When I pull that pin from the grenade, it can't be replaced.

 

It really boils down to: do I pull the pin now, or wait the 5 years until my youngest is in college and then pull the pin. I've heard so many opinions on which is better. It just wracks my gut to imagine my kids doing their homework without me. I'm much better able to imagine them in college and "on their own" and then us divorcing.

 

Advice is always welcome.

[tgt]

Unless things improve for you, I dont think its worth waiting. You aren't getting what you want from this relationship - so you are open to other things like infidelity whether you know it or not. End it respectably because its best for both of you. Don't do like many others do and wait, risk finding someone else and hurt her and your family even more. I'd say you need to get out while you are focused and be happy on your own.

[Hope75]

You seem to forget that seperating from your wife does not equate abandoning your kids. You can still very effectively co-parent the kids and share joint custody and be available for support and to help with their homework.

 

Staying in a bad marriage is not helping your family. Whether you want to believe it or not, your kids feel that stress and it impacts them negatively.

[The_pursuit_of_happiness]

No offence but your wife comes accross a bit like a sulking child that would continue to sulk and throw tantrums as long as you keep paying her so much attention when she does. I think the bottom line is that she is not happy but I think she owes it to you to at least talk things through with you.

 

Like you said, i think you should take some time and have fun with your kids; as far as I see, they are the only ones giving you any form of happiness in your relationship at the moment. If she is not willing to take part then just go on without her. It would not be easy cos its clear you love her so much but it takes two to make a marriage work.

 

Also, I don’t think you can continue to ignore the fact that she has indeed asked for a divorce which means she is not willing to try to make things work. The question thereforeeee is can you turn it around and if you do, how long will it last?! Do you think you could trully be happy or would you be walking on eggshells for the rest of your life?