Daughter feels trapped

[Sweet Sue]

Hi guys, it's been almost a year since my last post. It's been a challenging year on so many levels.

My daughter is turning 40 soon and has two children, no job and no husband or partner. She lives with her father who is 70 and in bad health. She sees the need to find work to support herself and her two children (at the present time she receives no financial support from her ex-husband or the boyfriend- father of her 3 year old. 

She told me that her father wants her to stay at home and care for him. He will not go into an assisted living facility or even allow her to hire someone to come into the home and care for him. Currently, he only has Medicare Part A and not B. A home health nurse comes to the house a few times a week to check vitals and that is all. She has to bathe him which is nearly impossible since he weighs over 300 lbs. He threatens to cut her off financially and has hidden important documents such as POA (Power of Attorney) and his living will. He's selfish and is holding her back. My fear is that he will pass away and where does that leave her and her children. They argue all the time about this and she sees no way out. He allows family members to stay at the house ( he owns the house), and she has to give up her bed and bathroom to them. He holds the power and has no say in who is allowed to stay the night or a few weeks. 

I could go on but I think you get the idea.

I don't know how to help her. I live 3 1/2 hours away. What should she do?

Are there resources that she can contact that could help her? 

 

 

[Cherylyn]

She can't go on like this forever.  With all due respect, sooner or later, your ex will pass away.  Your daughter could very well uproot and end up living with you.  Would you be willing to help her financially and help care for your grandchildren while she is enrolled in vocational trade school or college?  Can she lean on you financially until she can get back on her feet economically? 

[Sweet Sue]

Cherylyn, she graduated with a bachelor's degree in communications 4 years ago. I don't have any doubt she will bounce back on her feet, once her father passes away, the issue is what should she do or what can she do, in the meantime. Apparently, she is on gov't assistance and receiving food stamps - and her father's other means of resources. 

[Kwothe28]

Your daughter is feeling trapped because she is trapped. By her own life choices. 2 kids from 2 deadbeat dads and now taking care of her own father. She isnt entilted to her father home or belongings, even if he doesnt leave her anything, that is fine. She should be able to take care of herself and kids.

If she is not a legal guardian(and by the looks of things she isnt, that would require a legal contract as far as I know and he couldnt just cut her off then), she can freely, you know, get a job, move out and be done with it. But then that would mean she would have to stop rellying on her dad house and money and had to work a proper job. As well as a good possibility that the father maybe leaves that house to other family members. 

What I am trying to say is, unless you want to be somebody your daughter "leeches" from now on, you cant do anything about this. She on the other hand, can do something about this. She just wont. Because free housing and the possibility of free home in the future is preferable to making your own money and going under rent.

[Wiseman2]

3 hours ago, Sweet Sue said:

she is on gov't assistance and receiving food stamps - and her father's other means of resources. 

Unfortunately many caregivers suffer from burnout and it seems like she's venting to you. She has chosen to be a full time caregiver in exchange for living there. She's already doing something about her circumstances regarding getting government assistance for herself and her child.

Your ex husband is also getting home visits and some assistance. All you can do is let her vent once in a while. If she wants to help her father get better medical and household care she can confer with him or his healthcare providers.

 

[Batya33]

This is anecdotal but I know someone who is unemployed in his 50s and lives with his father and is his  father's caregiver -his father is elderly, not mobile, many health conditions.  It's a 24/7 endeavor.  He's not in the medical field.  A few years ago -and I'm not sure of the process- he qualified to be paid (by the government) to be his father's caregiver.  I mean I'm not sure how much, and I would think he'd need at least CPR/first aid type training?? but maybe your daughter can look into that for income.  I'm sorry she is struggling.

[boltnrun]

Why hasn't she gone to court to get child support from each of her children's fathers? She could get free or very low cost legal help from Legal Aid. Once she starts receiving child support she would have better financial security to look into options for work and child care. 

 

[Sweet Sue]

Boltnrun....she is 'finally' going after her oldest child's father (he is almost 12), for child support. The father of her almost 3 year old, bolted as soon as he found out he was going to be a father, and they were engaged. He wants no part of the child and not knowing all the legalities of the law, she has stated to me that if he pays child support, that would mean he would get visitation and she doesn't want him to have anything to do with her - and he evidently, hasn't seen or spoken to his daughter in over a year. I will ask her about the Legal Aid. 

Batya33....I'll ask her about that, thank you. 

Kwothe33...... I did not mention her health issues and the cost of her insulin and other medications she takes on a regular basis. She stated that she is able to afford her medications under Medicaid and fears that becoming gainfully employed with health coverage, may not give her the discounts she is receiving now. I don't know if this is true. What are your thoughts....

Wiseman....Home Health visits twice a week. They only take vitals, and nothing else. They cannot bathe him because he doesn't have Part B. So, her relies on her to help him with bathing, which is hard on her. He will not allow anyone to come into the home to bathe, clean, meal preparation etc., so she can pursue a career. He threatens her and is verbally abusive. It will be very hard for her to start a career after not working for 14. She's in a tough spot.

 

[Cherylyn]

14 hours ago, Sweet Sue said:

Cherylyn, she graduated with a bachelor's degree in communications 4 years ago. I don't have any doubt she will bounce back on her feet, once her father passes away, the issue is what should she do or what can she do, in the meantime. Apparently, she is on gov't assistance and receiving food stamps - and her father's other means of resources. 

@Sweet SueIt's good news that she has a bachelor's degree and can do something with it regarding her livelihood.  In the meantime, she's in a quandary because she's saddled  with caregiver duties, tending to her 3 children and doing what she can to survive. 

Once her father passes away, would it be possible for your daughter and grandchildren to live with you if she's on the job hunt and in limbo which could very well take awhile?  Does she have you to fall back economically interim when the time comes?  Would this be possible?  It is a way for her to get back on her feet if she's temporarily unemployed. 

[boltnrun]

He doesn't have to have visitation just because he pays child support. He can sign away his parental rights, but he would still be required to financially support his child.

I seem to recall you strongly warned your daughter about getting involved with that man and sadly she and her kids are now suffering. 

Having both of the fathers provide financially for their children would help a lot. She would have more freedom to make choices about what to do next. 

[Sweet Sue]

Boltnrun....you stated that even if he gives up parental rights, he can still be made to pay child support, was not what she told me. 

You have a good memory. I warned her about both guys, but she didn't listen. She never does.

Then those that love and care about her are the ones who listen to her complain about how her life is going., and feel powerless to be of help. 

I don't always, but sometimes I do give her advice, and that's because my grandchildren are directly affected by her actions. Otherwise, I don't say anything. 

[boltnrun]

Yes, giving up his parental rights does not excuse him from paying child support. It just means he doesn't want and won't get visitation. An attorney (which she can consult for free or at very low cost from Legal Aid) can give her more details. 

[Wiseman2]

On 2/16/2023 at 1:04 AM, Sweet Sue said:

she is on gov't assistance and receiving food stamps - and her father's other means of resources. 

She is a full time caregiver in exchange for housing. So at the moment she has no documentable income. In order for her to continue to be eligible for government assistance for herself and her children, she has to meet certain requirements.

If her father is uncooperative about allowing home health aides or won't apply or pay for that, she'll have to negotiate with him or try to find more resources for him.

[Batya33]

1 hour ago, Wiseman2 said:

She is a full time caregiver in exchange for housing. So at the moment she has no documentable income. In order for her to continue to be eligible for government assistance for herself and her children, she has to meet certain requirements.

If her father is uncooperative about allowing home health aides or won't apply or pay for that, she'll have to negotiate with him or try to find more resources for him.

As I wrote above she can look into being paid for what she does as caregiver.  My friend who lives with and cares for his father got paid until recently (father is now in a rehab center unfortunately after a fall).

[Lambert]

You asked for resources she can seek.  Do you mean government assistance?  She might qualify.  I think it goes by state.  So she can start with her state's website.  There might be charities that help women.  But here's the problem, she is being helped (regardless of the family dynamic and father's manipulation) that may make it hard for her to qualify.  

It sounds like in spite of all the good things you mention, she doesn't make the best choices and she's got herself into this situation.  It's really hard to stand up to a bully when they pay your way.  I feel for the situation.  The only true option is for her to take her kids and move in with someone else that can help her while she finds a job and starts saving to get her own place. 

The dad may be making promises, but won't it be a kick in the teeth, if he dies and leaves her nothing.  At that point she will be out on the street.  I understand you are concerned, but at hours away, what can you really do?  Are you willing to have them come be with you?

[Sweet Sue]

Batya33 - she did tell me that she looked into get paid as her father's caregiver, but didn't qualify. 

Lambert - No, she doesn't make the best choices. She told me that her father took out a life insurance policy $300,000. In addition to that, he gives her his annual bonus every year. I don't recall the amount, but it's a nice chunck of change. Despite this and her father's annual income (which is around $120,000), they both have bad credit and spend money like there's no tomorrow. He's a gambler and she throws lavish parties, for all occasions. I try to talk to her about the importance of saving, but it goes over the top. I had to help her pay her moving expenses because between the two of them, they couldn't come up with the money to pay the moving company. I did get reimbursed.

I have discussed with her on numerous occasions, to seek out resources (federal assistance) or even some churches have outreach ministries that might be able to help to some degree. She always has a ready excuse why she can't or won't do that. 

She won't be able to negotiate with him. He's stubborn as a mule and then they get into it and have shouting matches - with the children present. This disturbs me greatly, what they have to live with on a daily basis. 

[Tinydance]

Well look I hate to say it but I don't think your ex, her father is 100% a villain. He does sound mean in some ways but this also is his house and your daughter isn't contributing financially. Not only that but her father is financially supporting her and her two children. So I assume he's spending a lot of money on them? He's financially supporting three extra people and children are expensive. Even nappies for a toddler cost a fortune because you run through them so fast.

So in a sense he's asking your daughter for something in exchange, which is that she take care of him. Some people who can't get a job actually resort to things like cleaning toilets, garbage collection and personal care for the elderly or people with disabilities. I actually did support work for people with disabilities and for some of them I had to help them in the toilet, shower them, feed them. In my case I got paid relatively well for it and I did it purely by my own choice. But after ten years of working within that field I noticed there seemed to be a number of people who did that work and didn't seem to enjoy it or care. They were usually people with no education or who had just arrived from another country and had no experience, didn't speak much English, etc. So it seemed they were doing the work out of necessity.

I guess what I'm trying to say is yes your daughter's situation sounds very unfortunate. And it's not completely her fault that her children's fathers don't help out financially or in any way really. But due to the fact that she's in this position, she is doing the best for herself and her children so that they have a roof over their head and something to eat. 

In terms of how you can help her or she can help herself, I'm actually not completely sure. That's because I'm not sure what kind of government help or options is available I'm your country (I'm guessing the US?). Here in Australia people have more options because the government assistance is quite good and there is a lot of help available. For example, any person who is unemployed or single parent can get a government allowance until their child is 8 years old. Also they can receive a government allowance per each child. Childcare like kindergarten is actually heavily subsidised for all citizens but the subsidy is even higher for someone low income. So this allows the parent to put their children into childcare and get a job. We also have not-for-profit organisations that can help single parents with assistance payments. For example my best friend works for a non profit family organisation and they can access something like $3000 for various things for a family.

My suggestion for your daughter would be to access as much government and charity assistance as possible. Or could she move in with you and she could go to work and you could watch the children? 

I think it's not really realistic to think that parents will always financially help their child. Unfortunately that child needs to take care of themselves in some cases. For example I'm an only child but my Dad has stage 4 cancer and he's really sick and can't work. He was the only one working basically and my Mum only worked a low paid job a few hours a week for ten years just to help out a bit. Now they applied for income protection through my Dad's superannuation but he can only get that for two years. My parents spent a lot of out of pocket money for the cancer treatments and the money is starting to run out as Dad hasn't been working. So if I needed their help financially they couldn't help me. I'd need to work and put my son in childcare if I was a single mother. 

[Tinydance]

5 hours ago, Sweet Sue said:

Batya33 - she did tell me that she looked into get paid as her father's caregiver, but didn't qualify. 

Lambert - No, she doesn't make the best choices. She told me that her father took out a life insurance policy $300,000. In addition to that, he gives her his annual bonus every year. I don't recall the amount, but it's a nice chunck of change. Despite this and her father's annual income (which is around $120,000), they both have bad credit and spend money like there's no tomorrow. He's a gambler and she throws lavish parties, for all occasions. I try to talk to her about the importance of saving, but it goes over the top. I had to help her pay her moving expenses because between the two of them, they couldn't come up with the money to pay the moving company. I did get reimbursed.

I have discussed with her on numerous occasions, to seek out resources (federal assistance) or even some churches have outreach ministries that might be able to help to some degree. She always has a ready excuse why she can't or won't do that. 

She won't be able to negotiate with him. He's stubborn as a mule and then they get into it and have shouting matches - with the children present. This disturbs me greatly, what they have to live with on a daily basis. 

Sorry didn't read this comment. Well again I don't feel that sorry for your daughter because she doesn't live within her means. I suggested charity but if she doesn't want to use it then what options does she think she has?

[Cherylyn]

Be prepared because she and your grandchildren could very well end up living with you albeit temporarily until she can get back on her feet.  As a mother, you don't want to see your daughter and grandchildren on the streets so at least she has you to fall back on regarding survival. 

[boltnrun]

A life insurance policy is an important thing to have, but the unfortunate thing about it is the beneficiary doesn't see a penny until the policy holder dies. 

[Sweet Sue]

boltnrun - I am well aware of that and so is she. My hope is that she uses this money wisely and doesn't go on a spending spree. 

Paying off the creditors and her college debt would be the best place to start. 

She tends to live beyond her means and doesn't save money. 

It's so sad, really.

[MissCanuck]

It's sad, but she has made this bed. 

She is trapped largely by her own poor decisions over a period of time. Her only real options are to pursue child support from her children's fathers, and get a job. 

[catfeeder]

On 2/17/2023 at 12:21 PM, Sweet Sue said:

She always has a ready excuse why she can't or won't do that. 

Unfortunately, this is your answer. Daughter wants to complain, but she won't (not can't) do what it takes to save the money to change her situation.

The next time she vents to you, recognize that she'll feel better, you'll feel worse, and nothing changes. So instead of indulging her with sympathy, I'd respond with the question, "What would you like to do about that?" and see if she'll engage the problem-solving part of her brain to come up with any steps she would like to take on her own behalf.

If not, then once again, that is your answer, and I'm sorry.

[boltnrun]

13 hours ago, Sweet Sue said:

My hope is that she uses this money wisely and doesn't go on a spending spree. 

But this doesn't help her situation now.  If she's counting on her dad dying and then getting the money, well, that could be a decade from now or even much longer.

If she's not willing to come up with some kind of plan other than "wait for Dad to die so I can get his life insurance", there's not much anyone can do.

I do hope she follows through with pursuing child support from both of her kids' fathers.  THAT would be a viable plan.

[Cherylyn]

It's her life and her choices.  Only time will tell what will happen in her and her children's future.  It's a wait and see scenario.