Ex is really mad at me and I can't figure out why...

[Batya33]

32 minutes ago, Cynder said:

I would have said all this to her face if given the opportunity.  I've already blown it with her even as a friend, so I guess it doesn't really matter if I text emotional things.  I have nothing left to lose as far as she's concerned.  I could have gone to the gas station and walked straight up to her and said everything I said in text, but that would be considered harassment since I went to her place of work specifically to do it. 

I just don't think very many people call her out for these things.  I wanted to stand up for myself and call her out for how ridiculous she's being.  Who the hell blows up at someone over nothing, then apologizes and barely even lets the other person answer before blocking them?  She's obviously unstable and I can't change that.  So why not at least tell her what I think? 

To me the choice in this situation you describe is either in person (or talking on phone) or not at all. 

I know you feel angry and I'm referring to how you've chosen to react to it.  Especially since you've complained a lot about bad treatment you've received from others.  Your approach -if meant to stand up to her -- doesn't do that but does vent and does show IMO instability on your part - your behavior not you personally.  Not what you say you wanted.  

[Cynder]

20 minutes ago, Batya33 said:

To me the choice in this situation you describe is either in person (or talking on phone) or not at all.  What you did in this way did not meet what you wrote your goal was (putting aside my opinion on your goal -irrelevant) because of how you did it.  Way of communicating, tone, timing, context -- is so much of appropriate and effective communication IMO. 

Yes in my marriage I practice what I preach -often I am irritated and want to text/email my husband right then for instant gratification.  90% of the time I stop myself -either because I know I need to cool down or because even though I will speak exactly what I would write I know that my timing and method are not a mature, responsible, appropriate way of dealing with it and all of that will come across loud and clear to my husband -and basically obliterate the underlying message.  Just sharing my opinion. 

I know you feel angry and I'm referring to how you've chosen to react to it.  Especially since you've complained a lot about bad treatment you've received from others.  Your approach -if meant to stand up to her -- doesn't do that but does vent and does show IMO instability on your part - your behavior not you personally.  Not what you say you wanted.  

Ive' tried to call her multiple times and she won't pick up the phone. 

Yea, maybe it is unstable of me.  But now she's got something to think about.  She wants to talk about all the works she's done to confront her issues.  Well, I haven't seen much manifestation of all that. Almost every time I talk to her she's either drunk or stoned.  Is she really working on all this stuff or just escaping it?

[catfeeder]

4 hours ago, Cynder said:

I would have said all this to her face if given the opportunity.  I've already blown it with her even as a friend, so I guess it doesn't really matter if I text emotional things.  I have nothing left to lose as far as she's concerned.  I could have gone to the gas station and walked straight up to her and said everything I said in text, but that would be considered harassment since I went to her place of work specifically to do it. 

I just don't think very many people call her out for these things.  I wanted to stand up for myself and call her out for how ridiculous she's being.  Who the hell blows up at someone over nothing, then apologizes and barely even lets the other person answer before blocking them?  She's obviously unstable and I can't change that.  So why not at least tell her what I think? 

Yep, I'm glad you stuck up for yourself, and it's true that you had nothing to lose by doing that.

You've observed that people cater to her, and I'm glad you had the self respect to not do that.

We see a lot of people asking how to go about 'getting' closure, but I think you've demonstrated how to give it to your Self.

Head high.

[MissCanuck]

At what point do you say enough and just leave her in your dust, Cynder?

 

[Cynder]

55 minutes ago, MissCanuck said:

At what point do you say enough and just leave her in your dust, Cynder?

 

Well that was kinda what I did today when I sent those texts.  

[MissCanuck]

1 hour ago, Cynder said:

Well that was kinda what I did today when I sent those texts.  

Do you think you'll be able to resist if she messages you again? 

[Wiseman2]

Tiptoe away from this and give your mind a rest.

[Batya33]

9 hours ago, Cynder said:

Ive' tried to call her multiple times and she won't pick up the phone. 

Yea, maybe it is unstable of me.  But now she's got something to think about.  She wants to talk about all the works she's done to confront her issues.  Well, I haven't seen much manifestation of all that. Almost every time I talk to her she's either drunk or stoned.  Is she really working on all this stuff or just escaping it?

I can see both sides.  I hope you can walk away now.

[Cynder]

2 hours ago, MissCanuck said:

Do you think you'll be able to resist if she messages you again? 

To be 100% honest, I don't know.  I guess a lot of it would depend on what she says.  I know people will probably judge me for this.  But at least I'm being honest with myself. 

[Cynder]

13 minutes ago, Batya33 said:

I can see both sides.  I hope you can walk away now.

I got home from work a little bit ago and checked the mail.  No one got it on Saturday so it was still in the box.  I got another one of her W2 forms.  Wow... it's like the Universe is just taunting me at this point.

[Batya33]

3 minutes ago, Cynder said:

To be 100% honest, I don't know.  I guess a lot of it would depend on what she says.  I know people will probably judge me for this.  But at least I'm being honest with myself. 

Be honest and then choose a different reaction - you can control your choices.  You don't have to impulsively hug or the equivalent.  We all have to do that whether it's resisting the temptation of a person or food or both, etc.

[Batya33]

1 minute ago, Cynder said:

I got home from work a little bit ago and checked the mail.  No one got it on Saturday so it was still in the box.  I got another one of her W2 forms.  Wow... it's like the Universe is just taunting me at this point.

No -you are taunting yourself- it's like people who read into inaminate objects as "signs".  Now  you know that she bites if you see her in person so figure out another way.  There are other ways as you know.

[Cynder]

4 minutes ago, Batya33 said:

No -you are taunting yourself- it's like people who read into inaminate objects as "signs".  Now  you know that she bites if you see her in person so figure out another way.  There are other ways as you know.

Yea, I know.  I will be honest, part of me just wanted to throw it away and let her deal with the inconvenience of having to get a new one.  This one was from the Taxi company.  They are a family owned, poorly organized business and I know they don't have stuff like that available online.  So getting another one would be a royal pain in her ass.  But I won't do that.  I'm not that petty. 

I also considered just going up to the gas station and handing it to her without even saying anything.  Like, walk up to the counter.  Set it down in front of her.  And leave.  But I won't actually do any of this. 

[MissCanuck]

3 minutes ago, Cynder said:

 also considered just going up to the gas station and handing it to her without even saying anything.  Like, walk up to the counter.  Set it down in front of her.  And leave.  But I won't actually do any of this. 

So, what are you going to do?

 

[Batya33]

7 minutes ago, Cynder said:

Yea, I know.  I will be honest, part of me just wanted to throw it away and let her deal with the inconvenience of having to get a new one.  This one was from the Taxi company.  They are a family owned, poorly organized business and I know they don't have stuff like that available online.  So getting another one would be a royal pain in her ass.  But I won't do that.  I'm not that petty. 

I also considered just going up to the gas station and handing it to her without even saying anything.  Like, walk up to the counter.  Set it down in front of her.  And leave.  But I won't actually do any of this. 

Then that's your choice to continue the unhealthful cycle.  Without a rabies shot.

[1a1a]

On 2/6/2022 at 1:46 PM, Cynder said:

I don't want to "show up to another relationship." What's the point?  Relationships cause nothing but pain and misery.  And so far the worst has been true with just about everyone I've been involved with.  So I might as well just prepare for that going in instead of thinking things might be better.  

Most people are only with their current because no one "better" has shown up.  Most people would drop the person they are with in a heartbeat for a "better" option.  Most people aren't faithful.  Actually out of everyone, my ex who is the subject of this thread is the only person who has ever been faithful to me and didn't screw around.  And a lot of the people in my past have screwed around on me with my own friends.  There is no loyalty anywhere anymore.  Most people are liars.  I actually just found out recently that after my ex (the one this thread is about) and I broke up, a good male friend of mine tried to hook up with her.  He's not my friend anymore. 

My ex husband and I were married for 8 years.  He was constantly looking for the better option.  I was only around because I was a convenience to him.

The good news is most of the women in my family don't live to be very old because of cancer.  So I only have about 10 years left, statistically speaking. 

Sounds like you’ve been trapped in a pattern of dating the same wrong person for a long time. And being single is waaaay better than repeating that mistake, I could not agree more!

Still, there are rad people out there who could compliment your life but don’t catch your eye at the moment and will never if you can’t work out why you stay with the painful ones. There’s a book called ‘He’s Scared She’s Scared’ by Steven Carter and Julia Sokol, 11 out of 10 good read, I do recommend it (speaking as a person who has also despaired) 

[Jibralta]

8 hours ago, Cynder said:

Who the hell blows up at someone over nothing, then apologizes and barely even lets the other person answer before blocking them?

My mom lol.

Although, my mom doesn't actually apologize. She shouts "Well, I'm SORRY! I must be a TERRIBLE mother!" But I consider that to be more of an attack than an apology. Especially since she never stops doing the things she's supposedly 'sorry' for. Oh, she might stop for a month or two. Or even a couple of years if she really feels self-conscious about it. But she always reverts to her old ways. So, I don't believe that she's actually sorry.

Since she's 75 years old, she uses the old-fashioned approach to 'blocking,' a.k.a. The Silent Treatment, for days at a time.

Growing up in that house was like living in a minefield, always wondering what my mom's mood was, always wondering what small movement would set off her abusive tirade and subsequent silent treatment. I learned that I cannot trust my mom to behave rationally or consistently under certain circumstances. I can't trust her not to lash out and be abusive.

When I reached my mid thirties, I realized that my mom probably has some kind of mental illness. But that doesn't make her behavior acceptable. It doesn't mean that I have to offer up myself up as a sacrifice, or stand there and take her abuse. 

11 hours ago, Cynder said:

She wasn't constantly lying and screwing around.  I actually could trust her which was a huge step up from anyone else.

Perhaps you can trust Z not to screw around or to overtly lie to your face. But there is more to trust than loyalty and honesty. Can you trust her to take care of you, to perhaps put herself second, when you need help? Can you trust her to be fair to you, to listen to your side of things? Can you trust her not to project her own problems onto you? Can you trust her not use you as a punching bag when she's angry? 

These are all important forms of trust.

[Cynder]

43 minutes ago, MissCanuck said:

So, what are you going to do?

 

I don't know.  I just came off an overnight shift.  First time back to work since I pulled my left lat muscle.  I could probably make a better decision after getting some sleep.  I won't lie...  I want to hand it to her and not say anything.  That way she has to look me in the face.  But that won't get me anywhere.  She bites.  If someone told me, hey stay away from my dog, he bites.  Would I go near the dog, thinking he won't bite me?  No.  So why do I want to go near her? 

Sorry... I'm just being honest with you all and honest with myself. 

[Cynder]

40 minutes ago, 1a1a said:

Sounds like you’ve been trapped in a pattern of dating the same wrong person for a long time. And being single is waaaay better than repeating that mistake, I could not agree more!

Still, there are rad people out there who could compliment your life but don’t catch your eye at the moment and will never if you can’t work out why you stay with the painful ones. There’s a book called ‘He’s Scared She’s Scared’ by Steven Carter and Julia Sokol, 11 out of 10 good read, I do recommend it (speaking as a person who has also despaired) 

See... I hate when people say this stuff... "Oh you've just dated the wrong people..."  The "wrong people" are really good at acting like the right people.  My ex who I dated before her... He was intelligent.  He was accomplished, multiple college degrees.  He was also good looking and came from a really nice family.  And he was really charming and friendly and warm.  Ok... who wouldn't want to date him?  It wasn't until about a year in that he really started showing who he was underneath all that.  And toxic people also have a way of making their victim think everything is their fault.  This man had groupies.  He had a lot of people who loved him and thought he was this amazing person.  On his Facebook business page he has reviewers writing about what a beautiful soul he is, etc.  About 18 months into dating him I'm here scratching my head wondering why the hell no one else sees what I see? 

People who have bad luck in relationships are blamed in our society.  Oh, Suzy always dates the wrong men.  It's her fault she keeps getting screwed.  Oh, John always falls for the wrong girls.  It's no wonder he's in a bad situation again...  No one stops to consider that there are a lot of really dysfunctional people out there who are really good at being exactly what someone needs them to be when it's convenient. 

No, I don't believe there are many "rad people" out there.  I've just seen too much in my life to trust anyone.  She was the last person I trusted and I won't make that mistake again. 

[Cynder]

37 minutes ago, Jibralta said:

My mom lol.

Although, my mom doesn't actually apologize. She shouts "Well, I'm SORRY! I must be a TERRIBLE mother!" But I consider that to be more of an attack than an apology. Especially since she never stops doing the things she's supposedly 'sorry' for. Oh, she might stop for a month or two. Or even a couple of years if she really feels self-conscious about it. But she always reverts to her old ways. So, I don't believe that she's actually sorry.

Since she's 75 years old, she uses the old-fashioned approach to 'blocking,' a.k.a. The Silent Treatment, for days at a time.

Growing up in that house was like living in a minefield, always wondering what my mom's mood was, always wondering what small movement would set off her abusive tirade and subsequent silent treatment. I learned that I cannot trust my mom to behave rationally or consistently under certain circumstances. I can't trust her not to lash out and be abusive.

When I reached my mid thirties, I realized that my mom probably has some kind of mental illness. But that doesn't make her behavior acceptable. It doesn't mean that I have to offer up myself up as a sacrifice, or stand there and take her abuse. 

Perhaps you can trust Z not to screw around or to overtly lie to your face. But there is more to trust than loyalty and honesty. Can you trust her to take care of you, to perhaps put herself second, when you need help? Can you trust her to be fair to you, to listen to your side of things? Can you trust her not to project her own problems onto you? Can you trust her not use you as a punching bag when she's angry? 

These are all important forms of trust.

Both of my parents were like this.  My Dad was a freaking monster.  He just HATED me.  He legit thought I destroyed his life, etc. 

When we were together, yes I could have trusted her in all those ways. 

Loyalty and honesty are two big things for me though since I've never really gotten them from anyone else. 

[maritalbliss86]

2 hours ago, Jibralta said:

She shouts "Well, I'm SORRY! I must be a TERRIBLE mother!" But I consider that to be more of an attack than an apology. Especially since she never stops doing the things she's supposedly 'sorry' for.

Yes... that's like my mom sometimes (she's gotten a lot better with age).  

It's also exactly what my husband's dad does.  He doesn't actually ever apologize though, that statement above is just sarcasm imo.

[maritalbliss86]

1 hour ago, Cynder said:

About 18 months into dating him I'm here scratching my head wondering why the hell no one else sees what I see? 

I thought I remembered you saying that there were a lot of other people who warned you about his behavior... other artists in his work environment I thought?  Maybe I'm remembering wrong....

[Jibralta]

4 hours ago, Cynder said:

The "wrong people" are really good at acting like the right people.

Hell yeah, they are!!

They are THE BEST chameleons. But the charade can only last so long, as you've seen yourself:

4 hours ago, Cynder said:

It wasn't until about a year in that he really started showing who he was underneath all that.

4 hours ago, Cynder said:

When we were together, yes I could have trusted her in all those ways. 

It does seem like you are becoming more aware, though. These things don't get fixed all at once, unfortunately.

Have you ever heard of the poem, "Autobiography in Five Chapters" by Portia Nelson? I think it's an excellent description of this process:

Quote

I

I walk down the street.
There is a deep hole in the sidewalk
I fall in.
I am lost ... I am helpless.
It isn't my fault.
It takes me forever to find a way out.

II

I walk down the same street.
There is a deep hole in the sidewalk.
I pretend I don't see it.
I fall in again.
I can't believe I am in the same place
but, it isn't my fault.
It still takes a long time to get out.

III

I walk down the same street.
There is a deep hole in the sidewalk.
I see it is there.
I still fall in ... it's a habit.
my eyes are open
I know where I am.
It is my fault.
I get out immediately.

IV

I walk down the same street.
There is a deep hole in the sidewalk.
I walk around it.

V

I walk down another street.

 

[DancingFool]

On 2/5/2022 at 1:44 AM, Cynder said:

Well< it seems like she already ejected me from hers. 

I al legitimately worried for her.  She's obviously not getting help.  Or she's off her meds or something.  The way she's been acting isn't who she is.  Is it bad that I am considering messaging either her Mom or her brother tomorrow and just telling them I'm worried about her?  I won't do it because I know it will just cause problems.  But the thought crossed my mind. 

At some point you have to start accepting that this IS who she is and stop making excuses for her. There are no two people there, just one and at her core, she is abusive.

You say that she is different from your previous relationships and family, but looking in from the outside, she is exactly the same. She may seem different when she shows a different aspect of her personality, but again, ALL of the aspects of her personality are all her all the time.

 

 

[Cynder]

6 hours ago, maritalbliss86 said:

I thought I remembered you saying that there were a lot of other people who warned you about his behavior... other artists in his work environment I thought?  Maybe I'm remembering wrong....

Yep, you're remembering it way wrong.  It was after we broke up that people started coming out of the woodwork telling me what a nasty person he is.  A bunch of other vendors all had a pretty nasty nickname for him that they all called him behind his back.  A lot of the vendors who live in my area are friends and get together outside of work.  Some of them told me they always wanted to invite me to their parties and stuff but never did because they didn't want him there, etc. 

I think in that case a lot of people thought I was already dating him when I started showing up at festivals.  When I first started on that scene he took me under his wing.  A lot of people didn't know me.  So I think people probably thought I already came in with him, so there was no point in trying to tell me he was bad news, if that makes sense.